|
Thread Number: 26246
Do modern European dishwashers have cold water input only, or both hot and cold water lines? |
[Down to Last] |  |
|
| Post# 403014 , Reply# 1 12/31/2009 at 12:53 (5,223 days old) by bertrum () | ||
|
In a nutshell all European dishwashers and washing machines are now cold fill to comply with the Kyoto agreement. The US refused to sign the Kyoto agreement so you guys can continue to have hot and cold fill and give two fingers up to the environment!. | ||
Post# 403030 , Reply# 2 12/31/2009 at 14:21 (5,223 days old) by logixx  (Germany) |
||
In Germany...
Bosch/Siemens released a dishwasher that has both cold and hot water intakes. The three EcoStar models range from $1120 to $1900. They can be programmed to hot & cold or just cold fill - internal water heating cannot be switched off, though. I'm guessing they use the hot water fill for the wash cycles and cold water for the condensation drying cycle - as all other BSH dishwashers do. Consumption is 1.8 gal and 0.7 kWh on the ECO cycle with a hot water connection. These models also have the water management system, which, as I just figured out by looking at the exploded view of one of these machines, stores water in a separate tank and reuses it. I'm guessing it might save the rinse water to use it for the pre-wash on the next cycle... 
| ||
|
Post# 403033 , Reply# 3 12/31/2009 at 14:38 (5,223 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land) |
||
 I had NO IDEA that dishwashers could have, or do have BOTH hot AND cold fill connections! All of the US dishwashers I have ever seen (not that I've seen them all) only had one water supply line and that was connected to HOT. I guess I need to research this KYOTO agreement because I don't see how filling a dishwasher with cold water and heating it internally (and running the pump at the same time?) could possibly save energy! | ||
|
Post# 403047 , Reply# 4 12/31/2009 at 17:08 (5,223 days old) by appnut (TX) |
||
Here again the "problem" with U.S. is our standard outlets run 110 volt power and only two or three outlets in a house, at the most, have 220/240 volt power ratings. I've heard the explanation before, but don't remember all the techincal jargon. It would cost a fortune for all U.S. buildings to upgrade power brought in to the building, as well as having wiring placed throughout which could support the 220/240 type of power common in Europe. 110 volt just simply can't be easily done. Most people on here ocmplain about front loaders taking a long time here in the U.S. because water is heated so slowly. Having cold fills for both washer & dishwasher utilizing 110 volt power would take hours and hours to do one load. That's probably the biggest reason for the U.S. not endorsing this Kyoto agreement.
| ||
|
Post# 403050 , Reply# 5 12/31/2009 at 17:16 (5,223 days old) by dadoes (TX, U.S. of A.) |
||
 | ||
| Post# 403058 , Reply# 6 12/31/2009 at 18:07 (5,223 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA) | ||
Agreed | ||
|
Post# 403074 , Reply# 7 12/31/2009 at 19:06 (5,223 days old) by appnut (TX) |
||
|
Yeah but, ... | ||
|
Post# 403433 , Reply# 8 1/2/2010 at 17:29 (5,221 days old) by dadoes (TX, U.S. of A.) |
||
|
Per a Normal Eco load run Fri night: Input temp: ~65°F or less. Supply line not initially purged. Water heater set on 100°F, reported input of 50°F. Kitchen faucet ran 65°F at end of dry period. Target temps: 125°F main wash, 125°F final rinse Initial estimated time: 88 mins Actual time: 101 mins (started 10:01 PM, ended 11:42 PM) | ||
| Post# 403514 , Reply# 11 1/3/2010 at 06:23 (5,220 days old) by l86810 (Southend, UK) | ||
As far as I was aware the reason the hot fill tap was removed from washing machines in the UK and probably Europe was primarily for two reasons. The first being that Enzymes have become much more an integral part of modern detergents and Enzymes de-activate above 40oC... rendering them completely useless in removing stains. Since they are such brilliant stain removers, it doesn't make any sense to 'kill them off' before they've even hit the drum. By filling with cold water the machine can heat up to 37oC and hold it for 8-10 minutes before continuing to heat. The second reason being that the huge drops in water consumption, mean that when the machine fills for the wash, the hot water barely reaches the machine (depending on where you water heater is), meaning most machines ended up heating from 30oC - 40oC anyway. From what I believe Enzymes rally came into their own about the same time the huge drops in water consumption came about, and shortly after we had an increasing amount of cold fill only machines. The whole hot water / no hot water valve, maybe based on washing habits and what your detergent is made up of in your country. I don't believe its necessarily TOL washers that are beginning to offer hot and cold fill again, just 'ECO models' for people who do have an energy efficient hot water system located close to their machine. However it does surprise me after reading through the thread that there are dishwashers which are hot fill only. As far as I knew the majority (if not all) of the dishwashers sold in the UK were cold fill only. What happens if your incoming hot water supply is 65-70oC and you've selected a 'Delicate/Glasscare' prog. And surly it comes back to the whole Enzyme thing as well, as they are used to breakdown fats/grease and other food deposits. | ||
| Forum Index: |
| Other Forums: |
|
|
|
|
|
Comes to the Rescue!
