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Thread Number: 31754
Frigidaire |
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| Post# 478947 12/2/2010 at 11:12 (4,886 days old) by scooter76 () | ||
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Did they really make this laudry pair? I have the stove (RXE-39P) in my kitchen, but have never seen the "High Fashion" laundry pair outside of this ad. CLICK HERE TO GO TO scooter76's LINK | ||
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| Post# 478965 , Reply# 1 12/2/2010 at 12:12 (4,886 days old) by laundromat (Hilo, Hawaii) | ||
I had the actual electric dryer and was hoping to find the matching washer but never did. The style was awesome and the dryer actually,like that one I have now,had 2 tumble speeds.The washer had "infinite speed" agitation and spin controls that allowed you to "tune in" whatever you desired from soak to 350 BPMs and from a mere 75 RPM spin speed to a whopping 1050 RPM Rapidry spin. I did have their step down model that was the same w/out the storage.It worked fine but had some serious clutch issues and,after three replacements of that expensive part($150 way back in the early 80's)I had to strip the unit for parts.I laughed every time I saw the new models on display at Reed's Refrigeration because the agitator cap on them had a silver (aluminum) emblem instead of the blue plastic one on the lower end models.It would drive me bananas when i would go to any "Coin Clean" commercial Frigidaire Laundromats and see the customers using the Deep Action Agitator caps for ash trays!!! I would always get them off machines at the junk yards and super glue them on to the commercial machines to keep them from being destroyed.
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Post# 478974 , Reply# 3 12/2/2010 at 13:41 (4,886 days old) by joelippard  (Hickory) |
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I assume | ||
| Post# 479025 , Reply# 4 12/2/2010 at 18:27 (4,886 days old) by cornutt (Huntsville, AL USA) | ||
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Huh, I wonder if it had a DC motor... that's the only electronic way I can think of that infinitely variable speed could have been implemented at that time. | ||
| Post# 479034 , Reply# 5 12/2/2010 at 19:01 (4,886 days old) by supremewhirlpol () | ||
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I wonder if some sort of electromagnetic clutch was used, but was electrically attached to a potentiometer. | ||
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Post# 479068 , Reply# 6 12/2/2010 at 21:33 (4,886 days old) by turquoisedude (.) |
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WOW! | ||
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Post# 479069 , Reply# 7 12/2/2010 at 21:36 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Huh, I wonder if it had a DC motor...
Unfortunately, one of the few Frigidaire washer manuals I am missing is the 1967 Tech Talk Supplement (Vol 67, No. 11) that covers the late release L series WXL washer. The WXL was released for sale much later in the 1967 model year, requiring a separate parts sheet and Tech Talk article to be published for the new variable speed washer. It should also be noted that the N series washer service manual also covers the variable speed clutch.
GM made a total of 4 varriable speed machines from 1967 till the release of the 1-18 washers in 1970: WXL (1967), WXN (1968), WCDXN (1968), WXP (1969 model year). These were TOL/Custom Imperial machines with the exception of the WCDXN Custom Deluxe. I guess the marketing folks figured that if they had an optional rapid-dry CD machine, they may as well stretch the cost across as many models as possible. Years ago I stumbled upon the late 68/early 69 Tech Talk supplement for the WXP, WCDXN, and WXN washers. Fascinating what GM attempted with a magnetic clutch, a few transistors, and a low voltage transformer. The washer does indeed utilize the familiar 120v motor found in other Roller-matics. While the supplement below does not cover how the clutch works, a service tip is described, indicating that if you remove the control module circuit between the control coil and apply straight 12v to the control coil from an external source, the machine should spin/agitate at full speed. It appears the motor shaft slides through the center shaft of the clutch assembly, and attaches to the clutch driver plate. The clutching action happens between the lining and the driven plate. The driven plate has notches evenly spaced on the parameter of the pate, providing an on/off signal to the speed sensor. I'm not electronics/electronic clutch expert, but I suspect the control module reads this signal and appropriately adjusts a pulse to the clutch coil until the preset resistance is similar between the speed control from the control panel and the speed sensor. That still doesn't account as to why full 12v at the sensor would provide full speed unless a fully charged coil allows the clutch to spin freely and a varied voltage would cause the magnet to drag the clutch for lower speeds. LOL, now I'm thinking out-loud! Mag clutch experts - please correct me as I'm much more versed in standard mechanical clutches. I've included a few scans below. If Robert would like I did scan the whooping 16 page manual in case there is interest to have it posted in the service manual section of the site. I'd love to find and tear into a WXL or WXN someday, or see one in person. 
This post was last edited 12/02/2010 at 22:01 | ||
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Post# 479070 , Reply# 8 12/2/2010 at 21:37 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479071 , Reply# 9 12/2/2010 at 21:38 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479073 , Reply# 10 12/2/2010 at 21:39 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479074 , Reply# 11 12/2/2010 at 21:39 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479075 , Reply# 12 12/2/2010 at 21:40 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479076 , Reply# 13 12/2/2010 at 21:41 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479077 , Reply# 14 12/2/2010 at 21:41 (4,886 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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Post# 479079 , Reply# 15 12/2/2010 at 21:42 (4,885 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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| Post# 479081 , Reply# 16 12/2/2010 at 21:49 (4,885 days old) by cfz2882 (Belle Fourche,SD) | ||
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Thanks for that-i was wondering how that varible speed worked! | ||
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Post# 479101 , Reply# 17 12/3/2010 at 00:15 (4,885 days old) by peteski50 (New York) |
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Frigidaire!
Thanks for posting such great stuff. If anyone is interested please feel free to join my GM Frigidaire group.
Peter groups.google.com/group/gm-frigid... | ||
| Post# 479137 , Reply# 18 12/3/2010 at 05:51 (4,885 days old) by supremewhirlpol () | ||
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Does anyone have one of these? | ||
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Post# 479152 , Reply# 19 12/3/2010 at 07:58 (4,885 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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VARIABLE SPEED WASHER CLUTCHES
Thanks for posting all the information about the frigidare washers Ben, I haven't looked at these manuals in a long while. In the late 1960s when the appliance engineers figured out they could build variable speed washer drive systems five companies did so. Only Maytag and Speed Queen had the good sense to stay away from what I consider the most costly and useless feature ever added to automatic washers. The feature only sold at all because it was added to TOL models that a percentage of consumers always buy but in reality added no real benefit over the already available three speed motors in other TOL models. Three companies used a GE built variable speed induction motor on thier machines, they were the KM, solid tub Hotpoint and Norge there was also an Easy version of the HP and a MW version of the Norge. But both GE and Frigidare decided to build a variable speed clutch for thier washers instead. Basically both clutches had a field coil that when energized the clutch would grip and cause the to drive the machine at full speed like the most basic one speed washer. The clutch is similar to what is used on your cars AC compressor. When any thing but full speed is selected the control would simply pulse the coil on & off very rapidly and simply allow the clutch to slip { think of trying to control the speed of your car by driving with your left foot on the clutch ] it was certainly not a very durable way to build a washer drive. I always though it ironic that GE one of the largest builders of electric motors in the world even used the two, three-four and variable speed clutches in thier FF washers instead of multi speed motors. The clutches in GE FF washers were not only complicated and costly to make but also one of the most troublesome major parts of the machine. I have never actually seen a GE or Frigidare washer where this feature still worked. On the GEs the clutch would just be replaced with a one speed clutch. I sure the fate of the Frigidares with this feature was not good. Any of these machines would be very rare today, even our collection has none of these machines in it.
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Post# 479158 , Reply# 20 12/3/2010 at 08:37 (4,885 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA) |
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John -
You bring up a fantastic point about the extreme expense these machines were on the books for GE/GM and the others. Not only were there new parts needed for the clutches, but different machine tooling processes would be required to fabracate the new clutches at a very low output in compairsion to the masses of parts being made for standard machines. I doubt they ever made a profit on them. I expect that, due to the sheer size of GM and GE, they had the bank roll to attempt anything of this magnatitude on a production machine. Knowing how conservative GM was at the time, it blows me away that the executitves even let this washer slip through engineering in Dayton, as the 2 and 4 speed Rollermatics were all the buying public would ever need. Early product testing should have shown that the mag clutches would have a terrible service life - tainting some buyers perception of their product. Especially since 3 of the 4 models were the top of the line, top dollar, machines. But, hey - it was the late 60's. Is that honestly any different from today; rushing a product out before fully understanding what the service life of the machine is? Warranty expenses must have been a pain. You are right John - there is a reason why no one has one of these in their collection as I'm sure the majority of them were traded in within 5 years. I had no idea Norge or Hotpoint also attempted the varriable speed front - thanks for the information. Maytag learned their lesson on crazy designs with the Combo, and with it being a smaller company like Speed Queen, probably would not have had the cash to attempt something like this in a production machine. The shell of the WXL/WXN would make a fantiastic platform for a 3 phase freq drive machine... :D Ben | ||
| Post# 479175 , Reply# 22 12/3/2010 at 10:29 (4,885 days old) by scooter76 () | ||
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Btw, what the heck is a "Lint-Away Lamp"? | ||
| Post# 479178 , Reply# 23 12/3/2010 at 10:58 (4,885 days old) by PeterH770 (Marietta, GA) | ||
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Post# 479182 , Reply# 24 12/3/2010 at 11:36 (4,885 days old) by joelippard (Hickory) |
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PeterH | ||
| Post# 479199 , Reply# 25 12/3/2010 at 12:42 (4,885 days old) by scooter76 () | ||
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I wonder if the clutch lining was something more rubust or at least thicker than the standard clutch, or if they just expected that the clutch would require replacement at more frequent intervals due to the slippage? | ||
| Post# 479204 , Reply# 26 12/3/2010 at 13:10 (4,885 days old) by mickeyd (Hamburg NY) | ||
Why I drool !
This stuff is fabulous, Ben and gentlemen. Thank you Ben for this gourmet reading.
A handsome machine, indeed. It'll be great when someone finds a picture. The one above it is a looker too, reminds me of the POD Hotpoint we all love with the similar 6 dials. Interesting that they reduced the noise level of the fill. Have always cherished the distinctive waterfall fill sound. Even more interesting that they used a pressure control on the TOL models for water level control, instead of cutting the time in half as formerly on the timer motor. Ah, what we all missed in not being filthy rich. Wondering if GM has a secret museum where models of these Holy Grail machines have been preserved. Just a thought! Ya never know. | ||
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Post# 479223 , Reply# 28 12/3/2010 at 16:26 (4,885 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!) |
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Ahhhh, the X-Files of Frigidaire! | ||
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Post# 479224 , Reply# 29 12/3/2010 at 16:29 (4,885 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!) |
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Post# 479227 , Reply# 30 12/3/2010 at 17:23 (4,885 days old) by appnut (TX) |
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"Lint Away Lamp" | ||
| Post# 479248 , Reply# 33 12/3/2010 at 19:41 (4,885 days old) by supremewhirlpol () | ||
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Do you think an eddy current drive would have been a better solution? | ||
| Post# 479331 , Reply# 35 12/4/2010 at 12:22 (4,884 days old) by mickeyd (Hamburg NY) | ||
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Scooter, thanks for the effort
We say Frigidaire so often, we can forget the blended word's origin, frigid+air. When I was very young, some of the wonderful seniors in my life called the refrigerator, a frigidaire, and my ears would perk up thinking they were talking about what was for me the very best topic, washers.
Your link reminded me, when I saw the sitting lady. When I type automatic washers, or rollermatics etc. in the search, I strike out. Would you tell me how to access the materials. Thanks again. | ||
| Post# 479336 , Reply# 36 12/4/2010 at 12:38 (4,884 days old) by mickeyd (Hamburg NY) | ||
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PS: There were pleny of filty rich in 1968
I went school and was friends with many of them. If only I had asked to see their washing machines ;-> Perhaps I would have encountered a cherished X-file. "The truth is out there." At that time we enjoyed a 66 Coppertone Custom Deluxe. That's as far up the Frigidaire hierarchy we ever got. Had I known about these wonders back then, there's no telling.....
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