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Thread Number: 32058
Habitat ReStore Find 12/21/10 -- What do you all think? |
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| Post# 483347 12/22/2010 at 05:59 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483348 , Reply# 1 12/22/2010 at 06:01 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483349 , Reply# 2 12/22/2010 at 06:03 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483351 , Reply# 3 12/22/2010 at 06:07 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483352 , Reply# 4 12/22/2010 at 06:10 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483356 , Reply# 5 12/22/2010 at 06:14 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483357 , Reply# 6 12/22/2010 at 06:17 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483358 , Reply# 7 12/22/2010 at 06:19 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483360 , Reply# 8 12/22/2010 at 06:24 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483361 , Reply# 9 12/22/2010 at 06:26 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483363 , Reply# 10 12/22/2010 at 06:29 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483365 , Reply# 11 12/22/2010 at 06:32 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483366 , Reply# 12 12/22/2010 at 06:35 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483368 , Reply# 13 12/22/2010 at 06:38 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Post# 483369 , Reply# 14 12/22/2010 at 06:39 (4,872 days old) by combo52  (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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KA KD-23 DW | ||
| Post# 483370 , Reply# 15 12/22/2010 at 06:49 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Small food particle strainer is in perfect condition. Seems to be a larger space devoted to water straining than in my sister's Kenmore from 1996. I thought I'd offer it to her for a Christmas present after I restore it. I've never had one of these beasties apart before. Kinda lookin' forward to it. The wash arm support is as smooth as can be and there's no play between the arm and the support.
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| Post# 483371 , Reply# 16 12/22/2010 at 06:52 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483374 , Reply# 17 12/22/2010 at 06:57 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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| Post# 483380 , Reply# 18 12/22/2010 at 07:08 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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The back side of the kick plate. I guess a person could do this to some of the older models for sound insulation.
Well, that's it guys. What do you think? What am I likely to run into inside of that pump? I can see I'm gonna run into torx screws. Or are those star screws. Is there a difference. I've got it so I'm gonna have to do something with it. Thanks for looking. 
This post was last edited 12/22/2010 at 10:00 | ||
| Post# 483382 , Reply# 19 12/22/2010 at 07:11 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Slinger | ||
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Post# 483385 , Reply# 20 12/22/2010 at 07:20 (4,872 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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KD-23 MOTOR AND PUMP
There is an impeller and seal rebuild kit for this pump, it is the same as the WP power-clean pumps use. Unless you are into doing extra { quite possibly unnecessary work I would just see if thier are any problems with the pump ] as these were pretty trouble free and not as easy to disassemble and reassemble as the older Hobart pumps.
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Post# 483400 , Reply# 21 12/22/2010 at 08:31 (4,872 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada) |
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I've always wondered, what is the purpose of having selection buttons for pots/pans, normal, light and then having the same thing on the selector dial? I've seen this on several makes/models. The buttons seem redundant. What happens if the pots/pans button is selected but light is chosen on the dial?
Gary | ||
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Post# 483402 , Reply# 22 12/22/2010 at 08:42 (4,872 days old) by bajaespuma (Connecticut) |
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| Post# 483411 , Reply# 23 12/22/2010 at 09:40 (4,872 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Cycle/Dial
I think it just bypasses those cycles and starts where you set it. It's the little extra things it does that the buttons determine. I don't know, but if you press "Light/China" I'm guessing that it doesn't do any thing until you get to the "Light/China" mark on the dial. Since lightly soiled dishes don't need extra washes with heated soaks it would seem stupid for it to come on before then. I have a Kenmore Ultra Wash II machine that has a "Water Miser" cycle on it, but when the "Water Miser" button is pressed and the door is closed and the dial advanced, the machine will come on when you get to the "Normal Wash" section on the dial. Go figure.
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Post# 483571 , Reply# 24 12/22/2010 at 18:09 (4,872 days old) by appnut (TX) |
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cycle Dial/button Redundancy
Gary, I can only conjecture that the Pots/Pans cycle may do some of the auto water heating differently than the other two cycles--maybe have it slow down the timer for water heating earlier in the wash phase vs. the other two. John L might have detailed inside knowledge. I'd be kind of disappointed if there really wasn't any difference between the 3 except for simply allowing the start-up of the machine at different point on the dial.
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Post# 483647 , Reply# 25 12/22/2010 at 23:05 (4,871 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay) |
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Timer Knob vs. Buttons
Based on 18 years of using my KDI-21 with the same buttons and timer knob arrangement, I'm afraid Bob will be disappointed to learn that Brian's theory is, in my experience, correct.
If any button other than "Pots/Pans" is depressed after the door has been latched, the machine will not start until the timer advances to the corresponding point on the dial. The knob can be manually advanced if the user prefers not to wait. I presume this was meant to afford the user a Superba-like experience of starting the machine with the touch of a button and never having to fool with the timer knob if they didn't want to, but since it's not a rapid advance timer the knob was provided to give the user the option to advance it manually. Kind of cheesy, I agree. It appears this system carried over into the 23 series. My Thermador's buttons and timer knob work the same way. | ||
| Post# 483668 , Reply# 26 12/23/2010 at 01:09 (4,871 days old) by roto204 (Tucson, AZ) | ||
Think of it as delay start
Our KUDI-22 was the same. You could either advance the knob to the cycle you wanted, latch the door, and press the button to immediately start the cycle, or just press the button, and the timer would advance using the standard motor until it (eventually) reached that cycle position, and the machine would then start.
Think of it as a rapid-advance, minus the rapid part. | ||
| Post# 483674 , Reply# 27 12/23/2010 at 01:49 (4,871 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Machine Operation
Ralph or Anyone else who wants to chime in,
I don't have any manual for this machine. Can someone tell me how it operates. Like washes, rinses, heating times, pauses, etc. Which cups do I fill for which cycle. Does it pause and heat while it runs. Combo52 says rebuilding the pump isn't as easy on these as the older Hobart machines. What's it like? I hope I don't have to but if I do, what am I in for? Thanks. Brian | ||
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Post# 483678 , Reply# 28 12/23/2010 at 02:46 (4,871 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay) |
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Operation
It looks like Nate has validated my statements above, and I was tempted to call it a hokey delayed start feature but you don't ever get to delay Pots/Pans. The delay is shortest for Normal, longer for Light, and even longer for Rinse/Hold. This is one of the things that aggravates me about my Thermador's sequencing on partial cycles. The water is no longer hot if I wait for the timer to advance on its own before the first fill.
I don't know if the 23 series shares the same cycling with the 21 series. If it does, I have a PDF of the 21's instructions (thanks Bob!) complete with a matrix of washes and rinses associated with each push button, and can shoot you a copy. IIRC, for the Pots/Pans and Normal cycles you can fill both cups if desired. If you only want to fill one, it should be the "main wash" cup, which is the one with the cover, and you should close the cover. For the Light cycle, you never fill both cups; fill only the main wash cup and close the cover. I think that starting with the 21 series, there was no longer a heating delay. I'm guessing here, but I think the older models (series 20 and earlier) that have the heating element down in the recessed area by the filter are the ones with heating delays. To answer Gary's question about selecting the Pots/Pans button but setting the dial to "Light," there are two possible scenarios based on the sequence of events. Scenario 1: Turn the dial to Light and latch the door (or you can reverse that order, presuming all buttons are popped out as a result of door having been open). Push Pots/Pans button. Machine will start and will execute the Light cycle regardless of Pots/Pans having been selected. Scenario 2: Latch the door. Push the Pots/Pans button. Machine will start. Advance dial manually to Light cycle. You'll hear the machine stuttering its way through split- second wash, drain and fill actions as you move the knob around. Not recommended. Had the user selected the "Light" button, none of that stuttering would have taken place. The "Normal," "Light," and "Rinse/Hold" buttons do nothing more than disable the timer and prevent functions that would normally occur ahead of them if any of the buttons to their respective left had been selected instead. | ||
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Post# 483691 , Reply# 29 12/23/2010 at 05:43 (4,871 days old) by appnut (TX) |
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Ralph, send Brian a copy of the charts from the 23 manual. The sequence and times aren't much different between the 21 & 23. Brian, water heating is only done during the main wash phase. Water circulation continues. On the 23 series it specifically states the main wash could be extended by up to 15 minutes for heating the water. I've not found that same statement in the 21 or 22 series manuals. Maybe John L (combo52) can shed some light on that subject.
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Post# 483717 , Reply# 30 12/23/2010 at 09:07 (4,871 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada) |
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Post# 483730 , Reply# 31 12/23/2010 at 10:04 (4,871 days old) by neptunebob (Pittsburgh, PA) |
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Post# 483834 , Reply# 32 12/23/2010 at 17:28 (4,871 days old) by appnut (TX) |
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Post# 483842 , Reply# 33 12/23/2010 at 18:31 (4,871 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay) |
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Post# 483889 , Reply# 35 12/23/2010 at 22:05 (4,871 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay) |
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Operating Instructions
Brian, here is a link to a PDF file with the KDI-23 Operating Instructions
CLICK HERE TO GO TO rp2813's LINK | ||
| Post# 483905 , Reply# 36 12/23/2010 at 23:23 (4,870 days old) by magic clean () | ||
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Seem to recall that the KD21 machines had been around several years before any Whirlpool involvement in 1986. | ||
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Post# 483976 , Reply# 37 12/24/2010 at 07:56 (4,870 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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KD -21 DISHWASHERS
Yes that is correct the 21s were completely a Hobart design they were out before WP had anything to due with the design of them. One must keep in mind that KA was having lots of problems in the early 1980s with excessive warranty claims and damage claims alone on chipped inner doors and tanks were killing them. We used to get so many new racks and pump and motor assemblies from all the brand new machines that were constantly being scrapped due to shipping damage. KA was in a weakened position and ripe to being sold off. IF anything WP improved the product in many ways with the improvements of the 22s & 23s and then made the leap to SS tanks, as a result KA is still one of the most respected dishwasher brands today. Much the same can be said of the demise of dependable care Maytag washers WP had little to due with killing these great machines off. Maytags bad management did all this for them by wasting all kinds of money selling Amanatags and Norgetags instead improving and updating a much better machine. Welcome to corporate America.
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Post# 483996 , Reply# 38 12/24/2010 at 09:20 (4,870 days old) by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD) |
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And was not that shipping damage a result or partial result of their abandoning a full steel frame for their machines? Penny wise and pound foolish. | ||
| Post# 484030 , Reply# 39 12/24/2010 at 11:09 (4,870 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Thanks Guys
Your information has be invaluable to me, here(away from home). I'm placing a little flash drive with all kinds of pictures of the machine on it an putting it in an envelope with my sisters and b/in laws there names on it. There's no hint as to what's on the drive. They'll just have to look at it to find out. Stupid me. I took all kinds of pictures of the machine except the ones we need to identify it conclusively.
Oh well. It'll all work out in the wash. lol. Merry Christmas, everyone. Brian | ||
| Post# 485161 , Reply# 40 12/30/2010 at 05:07 (4,864 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Model Number | ||
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Post# 485229 , Reply# 41 12/30/2010 at 12:48 (4,864 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay) |
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| Post# 485406 , Reply# 42 12/31/2010 at 00:59 (4,863 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO) | ||
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Centering Tool
I notice in a KUD23 pump rebuild kit that uses the WP Power-clean pump that there is a centering tool included to install something, like a seal or maybe an impeller. Does a person have to have this tool to do one of these rebuilds. Didn't want to tear into one of these things w/o the right tools.
I've seen where centering tools were called for before on other models and they really weren't necessary. | ||
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