Thread Number: 41269
Kitchenaid Superba
[Down to Last]

automaticwasher.org's exclusive eBay Watch:
scroll >>> for more items --- [As an eBay Partner, eBay may compensate automaticwasher.org if you make a purchase using any link to eBay on this page]
Post# 610098   7/13/2012 at 19:01 (4,276 days old) by pulltostart (Mobile, AL)        

pulltostart's profile picture



Post# 610101 , Reply# 1   7/13/2012 at 19:48 (4,276 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay)        
Monterey!

rp2813's profile picture

If that were near me, I'd grab it.


Post# 612076 , Reply# 2   7/24/2012 at 17:10 (4,265 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
I bought it about 45 minutes ago!

I have been along time lurker of this great site and finally broke down and got me an old dishwasher and joined up! I always love looking around and when I saw the link to this machine I decided to jump in! I hope I have not screwed up buying this particular dishwasher because no where does it say "Hobart". I hope this is not a Whirlpool built unit, but it sure looks like a Hobart made machine. If anyone could validate if it is indeed Hobart that would be awesome. The model number is KUDS21MS1 and the serial number is 83062059.

I am planning on testing it out Friday and will take some photos if anyone is interested.

Thank you all so much!!
Mitch


Post# 612088 , Reply# 3   7/24/2012 at 17:49 (4,265 days old) by stevet (West Melbourne, FL)        
Whirlpool!

Here is the easy way of knowing who built the machine!
KitchenAid by Hobart used the simpler model designations like KDS and KDM.
The data plate would also have said Kitchenaid Division of Hobart Corporation, Troy, Ohio.

Your machine is a Hobart design built by Whirlpool(probably by ISE but that's another story) And it uses the Whirlpool designation of K"UD" signifying Kitchenaid Undercounter Dishwasher. Your data plate should read, Kitchenaid, St. Joseph, MO.
They still use the same system today.

It is nearly identical to the Hobart design and Whirlpool kept the same tank design thru the 23 series but with changes in some smaller details of the tanks in the 23's. The major difference came on the 23 series with the change to the Whirlpool Power Module pump system. The hole in the tank sump is smaller on the 23's so you can't swap out the pumps but many of the other mechanical parts will swap out.

My Monterrey is a Hobart built machine and is especially quiet compared to any other Hobart machine I ever had because the whole tank, top sides, back and bottom is covered with a layer of bituminous rubber as well as an addtional layer of foil covered fiberglass. The rubber coating really tanks the "ring" out of the steel as the water hits the inner walls. I have a Whirlpool built Superba 22 that only has the rubber halfway up the sides and back and across the top and it is noticeably noisier. I would like to know what they did on your unit.

You will love the Monterrey,so start collecting spare parts like racks and pump parts while there are still many of them around as most parts are no longer available and you can get lots of help from everyone on here too.


Post# 612093 , Reply# 4   7/24/2012 at 18:13 (4,265 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay)        
Welcome Mitch!

rp2813's profile picture

You did fine.  As Steve said above, it's still a Hobart design.  Your machine probably works fine too.  My guess is that it was replaced as part of a total kitchen remodel, not because it had any operational issues.

 

Looking forward to pictures!

 

Ralph


Post# 612096 , Reply# 5   7/24/2012 at 18:20 (4,265 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        

Thank you so much! As you said, it does have all of the foil wrap insulation as well as the rubber membrane as I just checked. The bonus with this dishwasher is the house had two of these side by side. One unit had a rust hole in the tub so the owner had it scrapped. They elected to replace both units with new ones to keep everything matched. The bonus part was the owner removed all the baskets and racks from the unit that was scrapped and included them in the sale. The sad thing was the unit that was scrapped was still working and not leaking.

Again thank you for the information. Oh, and on second look the rubber starts about a 1/4 of the way up the sides from the bottom. I promise I will post pics :). I am off Friday and plan on playing with it then-- she will get my full attention!


Post# 613270 , Reply# 6   7/29/2012 at 18:33 (4,260 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Pretty much plug & play

I spent most of the day Friday playing with the dishwasher--I got power to it as well as hot water--blessed with a washer dryer hook-up off the carport that we do not use...yet :). I did soak the tub with a bucket full of hot tap water first to make sure there were no leaks and to let the seals get wet. I ran her through a normal cycle and had no issues! I continued to mess with it the remainder of the weekend and I did have one leak appear. It had a very slight drip from the left front corner, beneath the door. Not much though--I cleaned the gasket and that seems to have stopped it for now.

She is a sweetie! All cycles seem to function like they should--I love the heated air dryer! Very quiet--of course I love hearing the big old pump run with the lower access panel off :). I have found no rust on this machine!


Post# 613280 , Reply# 7   7/29/2012 at 19:06 (4,260 days old) by machinehead ()        
Beauty!

Nice find! Ok, so what year is it, approximately? I know KA was "absorbed" by Whirl-tag-more-pool in or around '86, so is this model one of the transition models?

Post# 613287 , Reply# 8   7/29/2012 at 19:20 (4,260 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Thank you!

I "think" it is an 83 model and ths is totally an assumption as the first two digits of the serial number start with "83"--I may be totally off base though! The full serial number is 83062D59. From what Steve said though this is not quite a Hobart though :(

I literally just washed a good challenge load from dinner and it did great! Dinner plates, flat wear, two muffin pans with baked on crud as well as mixing bowls that had muffin mix sort of solidified as well as stemware and glasses. It did as well as the current Kenmore Elite purchased in 1992ish. I used the Cascade Complete gel pack---I also topped off the rinse aid dispenser.

I have wanted an older Kitchen Aid for a long time!


Post# 613312 , Reply# 9   7/29/2012 at 20:33 (4,259 days old) by STEVET (West Melbourne, FL)        
Age of unit???

Take a look on the front crossmember on the frame and see if there is a small stick on label with a date code on it.. e.g. 163083 or something like that. They used to put a date code on there to show the exact date of production.

If it is there, the first numbers denote the numerical day of the year and the final numbers indicated the year or vice versa.


Post# 613318 , Reply# 10   7/29/2012 at 21:17 (4,259 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Found the sticker!

It was to the left of the solenoid mounting screws. Unfortuantely it has faded out--I can make out the first two digits--27--but nothing else. Darn!! Thanks for pointing this out though! Great info!!


Mitch


Post# 613376 , Reply# 11   7/30/2012 at 05:29 (4,259 days old) by chachp (North Little Rock, AR)        
I have that exact machine and I love it....

chachp's profile picture

The link below is a video of it washing after I replaced the Wash Arm Support (thanks SteveT).   Mine was badly worn, cracked and the filter was essentially gone.   It wasn't moving much water before but look at it now!!

 

This is one really nice machine and I have run a few dirty Bob Loads through with stunning results.  Not a bit of YIBBLES on the glasses up top.  I'll post the Bob Load pics separately.

 

Very nice machine and that one looks like a great find!!  I love it when we save these older machines.



CLICK HERE TO GO TO chachp's LINK

Post# 613378 , Reply# 12   7/30/2012 at 05:41 (4,259 days old) by chachp (North Little Rock, AR)        
Here is one pic..

chachp's profile picture

On one of the loads I purposely let some coffee grinds get in there, I had some oatmeal bowls with a bit of stuff left on and all kinds of other stuff.  I was eager to see what would be left on the top of the dishes.  Before the filter was replaced there was a lot of stuff left up there.  Now that I have the new filter (part of Wash Arm Support) you can see it doing its job.  There is an indent in that part of my coffeemaker so I set in such that it would collect the water and as you can see that water is perfectly clear.


Post# 613419 , Reply# 13   7/30/2012 at 09:21 (4,259 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Wow!

That is so cool--enjoyed your video! You also answered a question in my mind--where the silverware basket is suppose to ride! When I got the machine, it was on the right side of the lower basket and every dishwasher I have had since had it on the right side. I noticed in the Superba that with it being on the right side of the basket, it seemed to block some of the tines for loading. I felt like this was not correct. It does ride better in the front of the rack like in your video!

BTW, the only thing I have found that this machine needs is a one replacement clip for the upper wash arm guard--and they are listed on repair clinic as being available for .79 cents :)

Thank you so much!!


Post# 613424 , Reply# 14   7/30/2012 at 09:32 (4,259 days old) by chachp (North Little Rock, AR)        
That's what I love about this site!

chachp's profile picture
There is always someone out there to help. I can't tell you how much help these folks have been to me over the years!!

Post# 613562 , Reply# 15   7/30/2012 at 19:54 (4,259 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Not an 83

I was on the Kitchen Aid site and lo & behold was able to download the documentation on her. It was copyrighted 1988, so it is newer than I was guessing. Not sure if that is good or bad.

You all are so awesome and helpful!!

Thanks


Post# 613594 , Reply# 16   7/30/2012 at 22:42 (4,258 days old) by STEVET (West Melbourne, FL)        
The dating game!

I don't want to rain on your parade, but the copyright date means nothing as far as when your machine was actually built. The manuals were originally copyrighted by Hobart prior to the sale of KA to Whirlpool,so it would stand to reason that once WP had all the documentation, they revised and copyrighted the materials as belonging to them. They made the 21's for a long time and they were still being made in and around '86 or so..I forget the exact dates but I am sure someone here will post them so you can be reasonably sure of its approximate age. Of course, you can just call or email whirlpool with the serial number and they can tell you exactly when it was built.


Post# 613596 , Reply# 17   7/30/2012 at 22:55 (4,258 days old) by STEVET (West Melbourne, FL)        
Same old grind, Raplh!

Ralph, it is funny you mentioned the coffee grinds test! Many years ago we had a KDS15 and then a KDSS16 in my M om's house and we always had the yibbles to deal with. Less so in the 16 with the Constant Rinse but definitely in the 15.
I was able to get a Custom 21 from the local Kitchenaid distributor that was a warranty exchange and installed that in the place of the 16.
I was immediately impressed with the disposer and filtering system in the 21's and decided to run a test on it myself using the coffee grinds too.

Only my test involved nearly 8 scoops of used grinds that were still in their basket and I put it in the front of the top rack in the center row and filled the rest of the dishwasher with the dishes that were ready to go in after breakfast and only did a rinse and hold cycle to see how well the machine would deal with the mess I was feeding it.

Much to my surprise, with only the rinse and hold being run, I removed the basket when the cycle was done and there was not a single grind in it and there weren't any appreciable signs of them in the machine itself anywhere! Even the tops of the cups were clean on the top rack.I removed the wash arm and you could still see a few grinds on the underside of the fine mesh filter in the soil chamber but they were all gone with the next full cycle.
I would say that it was a good testament to the design of that washing system.

I guess I should try it with my current daily driver and see what happens with the tall tub pump and food disposer it has in it. In fact I will and will take the pictures to post here too.


Post# 613759 , Reply# 18   7/31/2012 at 14:32 (4,258 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Good advice Steve

I eamiled Kitchen Aid support with the model & serial number asking the manufacture date. Fingers crossed they will reply back with something.

You guys have me way curious about some more "challenge" loads :) Coffee grinds, eh? I can certainly provide those!

Thanks!!


Post# 614426 , Reply# 19   8/3/2012 at 11:11 (4,255 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
Heard back from Kitchen Aid

my machine was made in July of 1988 --she just had her 24th birthday! Thanks to Steve for pointing me to this method of dating it!

This unit may go to my mother's house temporarily. Her newer KA is acting up and I may swap these dishwashers around--long enough to see what is wrong with her current KA and if I can fix it.


Post# 614436 , Reply# 20   8/3/2012 at 12:34 (4,255 days old) by chachp (North Little Rock, AR)        
The cake test...

chachp's profile picture

I may try the cake test.  We've all seen the ad where they dump the entire two layer cake in the machine and let it go.  That should be interesting as well.


Post# 614441 , Reply# 21   8/3/2012 at 12:56 (4,255 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
cake test

I had forgotten about that one! I did grab a load of dirty dishes yesterday afternoon and loaded them up in the KA--one of which was a 9X13 Pyrex dish that had been used to bake a chicken casserole in. A pretty good challenge test--it came out crystal clear! I used the normal cycle and a Cascade Gel Pack. I did buy a box of Cascade powder last night at the drug store--I kept thinking what a waste with the intial wash cycle with the extra heated water--and that would be a good use of using all detergent cups. I almost added some coffee grinds in for good measure, but chickened out.

Everybody in the family thinks I have lost my mind with "that old dishwasher". I just tell them that it needed to be rescued and come to a good home :). It does look a little, ahem, red-neck with the dishwasher sitting in the carport and hoses and cords all over the place. Plus, my lawn chair I sit in to observe the dishwasher working--it is almost theraputic! Guess I am going to have do something with it to get the carport back to rights though!


Post# 614443 , Reply# 22   8/3/2012 at 13:07 (4,255 days old) by rp2813 (Sannazay)        
"That old dishwasher"

rp2813's profile picture

They'll all eat those words when they see how much better and faster it cleans than a modern machine.


Post# 614444 , Reply# 23   8/3/2012 at 13:20 (4,255 days old) by appnut (TX)        
Cake test

appnut's profile picture

Just remember, that cake test was done with a Whirlpoool PowerClean dishwasher--a machine that has the largest "capability" to handle that type of "bulk" refusse.  Actually cake crumbs (what it eventually all becomes) are very soft and disintegrate in the water fairly easily.  What would be a great test is to see how something like a lot of pasta or rice is handled.  I know my Kenmore Elite tall tub handle about 1/2 cup of cooked rtice quite well.  But it's not something I'd do on a regular basis to the machine, yet alone any machine. 


Post# 614585 , Reply# 24   8/4/2012 at 06:07 (4,254 days old) by chachp (North Little Rock, AR)        
Ah, let them think you're nuts.........

chachp's profile picture

My friends thought I lost my mind when I yanked out a practically new Tall Tub SS dishwasher.  It was  Kenmore Elite made by Bosch.  A very nice machine.  It was not cheap to put in but I really wanted my old Kitchenaid as my daily driver so I took out the new one and replaced it with the old.  When they see how fast the cycles are compared to the newer machines, and they see how clean the dishes are they get it.    I have an old Kitchenaid in my utility room as well.  They just shake their heads and decide it's what makes me who I am.  BTW I put the KE on Craigslist and sold it for a pretty good price so I think I did OK with that too.

 

I have been jokingly told my by friends that I need therapy for two reasons:

  1. My dog.  She is like my child and the day she goes I will likely fall apart.  They say I should start therapy now to be prepared for the day.  I get upset just thinking about it.
  2. My obsession with these old dishwashers.  They think I should have my head examined for having this hobby.  I tell them it doesn't harm anybody and keeps another old machine out of the landfill while at the same time providing me with some entertainment.  It's a win for everyone.

Post# 614605 , Reply# 25   8/4/2012 at 09:35 (4,254 days old) by mitch (Atlanta)        
It has been nice having two

dishwashers! I grilled chicken breasts last night and had several nasty dishes that I had marinated the chicken in and having the KA close to the deck so I could just load those dishes into was great! I also could put the utensils in the machine as I completed steps in cooking. Of course it did fantastic!! I used some of the Cascade powder I bought for the KA.

Ralph--my brother has a dog that is up there in age and we may have to put him in therapy when the time comes!

The teasing over my old dishwasher does not bother me--the more I am teased, the more I ham it up. I had forgotten how darned fast these babies can do a load of dished too--and do a darned fine job of it!

Thanks--you guys made me smile!



Post# 614628 , Reply# 26   8/4/2012 at 12:38 (4,254 days old) by chachp (North Little Rock, AR)        
Sad part is mine is only 7!

chachp's profile picture

She has a long way to go we hope.


Post# 614928 , Reply# 27   8/5/2012 at 15:54 (4,253 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
The Kitchenaid Cake Test

combo52's profile picture

As Bob stated I never saw KA do this until the SS tanked WP pump 24 series machines, which used the same pump and motor as the KM Ultra-Wash and WP Power-Clean DWs. On any [ Real ] KA DWs the cake particles could clog the filter and they may or may not wash off enough to allow the cycle to finish properly.

 

On my KDSS-20 when I put the blender container and a 1/2 dozen glasses that are all covered with residue from making fruit smoothies, often the filter will completely clog during the first water circulation and the machine will not recover and the whole load will have to be rewashed. Usually I stand around and if the water action dies I just stop the DW and pull out the wash arm then remove the filter and clean it. Sometimes I even have to do this twice to get a load to finish properly.



Forum Index:       Other Forums:                      



Comes to the Rescue!

The Discuss-o-Mat has stopped, buzzer is sounding!!!
If you would like to reply to this thread please log-in...

Discuss-O-MAT Log-In



New Members
Click Here To Sign Up.



                     


automaticwasher.org home
Discuss-o-Mat Forums
Vintage Brochures, Service and Owners Manuals
Fun Vintage Washer Ephemera
See It Wash!
Video Downloads
Audio Downloads
Picture of the Day
Patent of the Day
Photos of our Collections
The Old Aberdeen Farm
Vintage Service Manuals
Vintage washer/dryer/dishwasher to sell?
Technical/service questions?
Looking for Parts?
Website related questions?
Digital Millennium Copyright Act Policy
Our Privacy Policy