Thread Number: 41415
Let's look at an EXCELLENT Craigslist ad for a change! |
[Down to Last] |
Post# 611809   7/23/2012 at 17:11 (4,292 days old) by Kenmoreguy64 (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
I hope I put this in the proper forum!
I really liked seeing this ad in Charlotte's Craigslist today. I was thinking of posting something very similar, as I hate what the mandatory scrapping of so many haul-offs is doing to the used appliance business and the waste of parts and machines that it is causing. The big-box stores and manufacturers want to say that it is "green" that they force the machines to be recycled, but it is not like everything in the past was relegated to rot outside. I mean, the Aberdeen farm was unusual enough that it still has notoriety here. What was really going on is some machines were left outside, and there probably still will be, but others were taken into small shops, including mine at times, repaired and/or rebuilt, and re-sold for further use. That's what I consider green. In turn, the parts used in these services were good for parts manufacturers and they provided jobs to people making the parts. The prices of the used machines were good for consumers who could not or chose not to pay for new machines. I can't see any reason to insist that haul-offs be destroyed - its just plain wrong and I will think twice about doing future business with companies that insist on maintaining this policy. Something like this ad should be placed in all Craigslist cities! Gordon |
|
Post# 611812 , Reply# 1   7/23/2012 at 17:39 (4,292 days old) by goatfarmer (South Bend, home of Champions)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
1    
|
Post# 611818 , Reply# 2   7/23/2012 at 18:10 (4,292 days old) by beekeyknee (Columbia, MO)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
1    
What an excellent ad. I agree, Gordon. I wish this was everywhere. Not only have we given our jobs to foreign countries, but we send them our raw materials and get crap products back. What kind of green is that! I hate big corporate and our government.
If everybody started doing this big corporate might set up an take notice. They need to clean up their act. It's time for corporate law to be changed. This is starting to sound like "Dirty Laundry" material. Better drop it. |
Post# 611860 , Reply# 3   7/23/2012 at 21:51 (4,292 days old) by perc-o-prince (Southboro, Mass)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
3    
Great idea, but I'd be more behind them if they used correct spelling, grammar and punctuation. In this day and age there's no excuse for any ad or sign (how many times have you seen "collectables" on a sign?) being written improperly. Chuck |
Post# 611863 , Reply# 4   7/23/2012 at 22:02 (4,292 days old) by KenmoreGuy64 (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
1    
|
Post# 611867 , Reply# 5   7/23/2012 at 22:09 (4,292 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
i think that this would be useful because i think that most appliance pre 1990 to 1950 deserve a second life and would help alot of familys in needs like for exemple a set like this one that would be useful to family that for exemple lost everything in a fire but do not have the money for new applioance it would be another way to recycle older appliance that could be repaired by proffesinal tech and then sent to charety place or donated to familys in need or resold as refurbish second hand sets that still have life in them unless the parts are no longer avalable.
|
Post# 611917 , Reply# 7   7/23/2012 at 23:24 (4,292 days old) by PhilR (Quebec Canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
I like the idea too. How many good appliances end in scrap yards because their owners just want to change them? Unfortunately, I think many have been conditioned to do so by campaigns about energy savings or just to follow trends. Some remodel their home or buy a new one and their old appliances need to go out because they don't fit too well in the new place. Stores take them back and recycle them to avoid loosing clients who might be satisfied by these low cost appliances instead of new ones bought on credit.
The same could be said about cars. I saw low mileage cars in very good condition sent to scrap yards (and sitting in scrap yards) as their owners traded them for new ones and government pays with our money to get rid of them. Then, they aren't allowed to be back on the road (but the nicest ones are sometimes shipped overseas where some people will continue using them). And at the same time, those who can't afford buying a new car often ride in unsafe, high mileage, collision damaged cars and they need to pay to get theirs fixed with the money they don't have to pass e-tests and sometimes just to keep them running... Often, the poor scrap yard employees who see them sent to the crusher wish they could just switch these cars with theirs that are in much worse shape but they can't... It seems our government would rather see them leasing an inexpensive Korean car than driving a good used car that they could fix themselves for much less with money spent locally. |
Post# 611958 , Reply# 9   7/24/2012 at 06:07 (4,292 days old) by goatfarmer (South Bend, home of Champions)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
4    
Fact is, folks, YOU CAN'T SAVE THEM ALL! I have a backroom full of appliances, 15+ years old. Any older than that, and most people don't want them. They aren't as energy efficient as a 5 YO one. And parts availability get's iffy. And there are only so many landlords out there. The other thing is, I'm not going to put $75.00 in parts, + an hour of my time, to fix a ,say refrigerator, that I might sell for $100.00. Plus, how many people around here keep talking about wanting vintage appliances, but when one shows up 200 miles and 3 hours away, they say "if it were only closer"..... They want a fully operational machine delivered to their basement. For next to nothing. |
Post# 611988 , Reply# 10   7/24/2012 at 08:57 (4,292 days old) by Kenmoreguy64 (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
1    
And even if we were, we can't save any if we don't try...
The point of the thread for me however was to point out the fact that we have an industry deliberately trying (and succeeding) to weed out MANY appliances from the previously normal regeneration process, which is in turn limiting the availability of used and lower price equipment and parts to people who need them. In the past, as many of us well know, a haul-off old appliance which fit the scheme you mention above would have found its way to the crusher anyway --- just as you said, a machine of that nature was not typically worth the time of a refurbisher. It could almost be described as "natural selection" for the appliance industry. BUT, the haul offs that are going to the shredders from Home Depot, Lowes, Sears, etc. are not just 30 year old Maytags, far from it. There are 2000-era front loaders in there, there are MANY white panel late model WP and KM DD washers from the 90s and 2000s, and other equipment which seems to be in short supply and easy to re-sell or would be useful as a parts donor. I am NOT sayig that some of this stuff doesn't belong in the dump - some of it surely does. But, there have always been prematurely retired appliances that find their way back into circulation once they become a haul-off, and refurbishers were looking for these all the time --- still are. That's where the waste is. With all that said, it's not even the waste of machines that is my issue, because they are getting recycled, but its the apparent mentality of the retailers that bothers me. They want our money as consumers, and they court us to shop in their stores by how they can help us, but at the same time they seek to harm the same collective group of consumers by preventing useful materials and machines from being re-used as they would have naturally in the past. This is done in a front of goodwill for the planet, but I think it up for debate if they are doing good or harm overall, and what the retailer's intentions truly are. The same situation would occur if the car manufacturers forced most dealers to crush every trade in they got. The effect would cripple the used car industry. We know that some trade ins are done, used up, and belong off the road. But many don't. If the appliance haul-back situation is even partly similar to the used car scenario, then we have waste going on, which isn't green.... Gordon This post was last edited 07/24/2012 at 09:14 |
Post# 612009 , Reply# 13   7/24/2012 at 11:01 (4,291 days old) by goatfarmer (South Bend, home of Champions)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
The retailers take the path of least resistance.
If a large business approaches Lowes, and says "I'll put a trailer out back for your trade ins, they will be unseen and out of the way, we'll empty the trailer once a week, you have to do nothing but put the trades in the trailer", why wouldn't Lowes take that option, over leaving them out back, where they become unsightly, where people strip off the aluminum, and copper, and leave the rest, where someone might get hurt trying to load a washer in the back of a SUV, and sues Lowes, etc.
I know several of the Lowes, Sears, etc, around here have been burned by people thinking selling used appliances is a walk in the park. You plug it in, it works, you sell it. It don't work that way. A good Lowes store can generate 20-25 or more trades a week. Mr Little Guy can't keep up with that many, so he starts picking the best, and leaving the rest. That's less of a problem these days, with scrap prices being up.
I know of at least one place, in Indianapolis, who has the contract to pick up trade ins at Lowes, BestBuy, etc. They refurbish what is worth refurbishing, but they will also sell you what they get in, before they go through it. So not all the used ones go to the scrapyard.
Also, BestBuy, Lowes, etc, will make more money selling you a new washer off the floor, VS selling you a 10YO washer out back, in unknown condition. How much should they charge for say, a 2003 model washer, in unknown condition? It might need a minor lid switch, it might need a major transmission repair. No way to know, until you buy it. |
Post# 612027 , Reply# 14   7/24/2012 at 12:49 (4,291 days old) by Kenmoreguy64 (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Kenny,
That's not exactly how it was or is in Charlotte. Maybe things are different here, hence the reason that person/company put the ad on Craigslist, but the situation was different in the 1990s and is equally different today. When I was originally taking in BDs for refurb, we had the following primary sellers of new appliances in Charlotte: Sears, Queen City Appliance and TV, Plaza Appliance, Circuit City, and to a lesser degree, Lowes. With the exception of Sears, all the major sellers had independent haulers come by their loading docks daily, usually at the end of the day, who would haul off EVERYTHING brought in that day from the deliveries. The haulers could do what they wanted with it all once they were off store property - sell piece by piece to the mom and pop shops, take it all to the landfill or recycling center, or drop the entire load at one of the larger used appliance places, or any combination thereof. None of those new retailers would sell you one piece off the dock, nor would they have private individuals back there picking through stuff. There were the same liability issues then as today. Until I got involved with my buddy, Sears until 1990 was putting everything they got into a compactor. Our deal with Sears was similar to the others - my buddy had to haul off everthing, every day, and he could do what he wanted to with it. Today, Lowes dictates that EVERY piece hauled back by the contract delivery company is accounted for, is present and accounted for at dock return, and is loaded in the scrap trailer. All the scrap trailers around here seem to be destined for West Virginia. If a piece cannot be accounted for, delivery person's jobs could be on the line. Store employees are not allowed to even consider taking home a nice piece. It seems almost as important as the connection of an airline passenger being on the plane with his checked luggage (which is a huge deal, for those who don't know). This might be part of the deal with the scrap hauler, but if a machine escapes the clutches of that system, its a big deal. I understand from a manager friend at Home Depot that this system is even occasionally audited! This is the situation which spawned the ad I posted. I think the only machines now available to used appliance shops here are ones they source themselves in whatever manner, or machines that have come from the smaller, non big-box stores. Their volume unfortunately is dwindling. I believe Home Depot and Sears have much the same haul-back provisions, and in some cases they use the same delivery agents (GE Appliance delivery, which is a division of General Electric). I don't think Plaza and Queen City have much of a measurable market share these days here. It is mostly Sears, Lowes, Home Depot, and HH Gregg. This may be why Charlotte's used market is more constrained than that in your area Kenny? |
Post# 612038 , Reply# 15   7/24/2012 at 13:29 (4,291 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 612039 , Reply# 16   7/24/2012 at 13:35 (4,291 days old) by goatfarmer (South Bend, home of Champions)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
It's possibly why, we have Lowes, Sears(to a lesser degree) BestBuy, HHGregg, Menards as the big appliance retailers. I know Menards places their trade ins in their outside sales lot, where they can be purchased. The rest either have a trailer, or they are kept inside. HHGregg uses the business from Indy, I'm not sure who Lowes is using, the trailer says NOVA services. I would like to be able to buy trades from Lowes, Sears, etc. But at least around here, they won't deal with individuals, for the above mentioned reasons. Right now I have 2 smaller retailers I get my trades from. One is over an hour away. In both cases, these Mom and Pop retailers sell trade ins, too. They sell me what they can't use. The one place hates GE, so I get everything that's made by the General. I also get the older pieces they can't use. I've been dealing with them for over 20 years now, have a good relationship established. But I'm sure they are approached all the time by people wanting their trade ins. Very competetive these days! |
Post# 612144 , Reply# 18   7/24/2012 at 23:22 (4,291 days old) by qualin (Canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Hey Perc... The $100 or less implies that you can find a used or refurb motor and put it in yourself, or get a spare from a junker. My father still uses a motor from a 1960's era GE as a polisher on his bench. :) |
Post# 612170 , Reply# 19   7/25/2012 at 05:50 (4,291 days old) by goatfarmer (South Bend, home of Champions)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
That's just it. Mrs Average Housewife probably couldn't diagnose a bad motor, let alone change it. So she calls ZZZ repair, who charges $59.00 just to show up, and diagnoses the motor. With retail on the motor being probably at least $100.00, and an hour labor to change it, you're easily looking at over $200.00, on a 20 YO machine. Do you fix it? And hope the outer tub isn't ready to give out? |