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Thread Number: 45875
Kitchenaid KDS18 problem |
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| Post# 670809 , Reply# 1 4/6/2013 at 07:45 (4,031 days old) by barcoboy (Canada) | ||
Sounds like either a weak or broken spring, or more apt to be detergent/water mineral deposits built up where the shafts go through the door. Could also be dried out o-rings on these shafts that need replacing. Can you see any evidence of water that has leaked around the bi-metals? When working properly, the bi-metals heat from the current passing through them to the motor and flex, allowing the spring to snap the door fully open. I would recommend replacing the o-rings since it is very inexpensive and fairly easy to do. Have a look at my recent post about me replacing them on my KDS-58 (the portable version of the KDS-18).
CLICK HERE TO GO TO barcoboy's LINK | ||
Post# 670829 , Reply# 3 4/6/2013 at 09:35 (4,031 days old) by Kenmore71  (Minneapolis, MN) |
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KD-18 Service Manual
Scroll down the page. 4th from the bottom. $3.08 is a steal for this information.
CLICK HERE TO GO TO Kenmore71's LINK | ||
| Post# 670836 , Reply# 4 4/6/2013 at 10:17 (4,031 days old) by ryanstruse () | ||
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Thanks for the link. I purchased the manual and read what I could. It doesn't show what the current draw should be at the bimetals. I suppose I could replace them both and see what happens. Seems a little risky since now neither one works now...... | ||
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Post# 670842 , Reply# 5 4/6/2013 at 10:47 (4,031 days old) by Kenmore71 (Minneapolis, MN) |
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To be honest the situation you describe is somewhat baffling. I honestly don't know what the current draw should be at the bi-metals. One thing you might try is reversing the leads of the bimetals at the detergent cup and see of the wash side opens at the pre-wash time and/or the wash side opens at the prewash. That would give you an indication if the problem was with the bi-metals themselves or if there is an issue with a wiring connection at the timer, or motor.
The fact that the prewash side WAS opening correctly would indicate to me that this ISN'T a water lever (and therefore a motor amperage draw) issue. The other thing to check would be to check the current draw through the pre-wash bi-metals when they are engaged and the see if it is the same through the wash bi-metals. They should be very close to the same if things are working correctly. | ||
| Post# 670865 , Reply# 6 4/6/2013 at 13:35 (4,031 days old) by barcoboy (Canada) | ||
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I'm not so sure the problem is with the bi-metal. They are not responsible for how much the door opens; they only hold the door in the fully closed position. Once the timer sends power down through them, they heat, which causes them to flex a tiny bit, and this flexing releases the catch of the detergent door allowing the spring to snap the door fully open. You should see this happen with the prewash bi-metal soon after the third prewash fill stops, and the snap is fairly loud-sometimes it would startle me. If the bi-metal was not working (ie: open circuit or broken wire), the motor would stop once the timer tried to send power down through it, so as long as the motor continues to run and the bi-metal flexes, it is good.
Can you snap a close up picture of the dispenser and post it here so we can see? | ||
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Post# 671299 , Reply# 8 4/8/2013 at 07:39 (4,029 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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Detergent Dispenser Problems All good suggestions Steve, other common reasons that these things do not open reliably are related to the amp draw of the motor which can be lower than normal because of,
Lower water level than normal, usually a bad inlet valve. Clogged main wash filter. Loose post for lower wash arm, [ wash-arm support ] Water in DW foaming during the time the dispenser should be opening.
Building a DW with the Bi-Metals in series with the main motor was far from an ideal way to build a DW. Hobart did it this way because when they went to BM operated dispensers on the 17 and later series DWs most of their DWs did not even have a water heating element to use for the ballast for the det disps BM [ every other DW manufacturer used the water heating element ] the water heating element provides a much more consistent load than a pump motor. This was one of the improvements that WP did on the 22 series of KA DWs as problems with DDs not opening was always a big problem for KA. | ||
| Post# 671345 , Reply# 9 4/8/2013 at 11:36 (4,029 days old) by barcoboy (Canada) | ||
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I hate to disagree with you stevet and combo52, but I don't think the problem is either low water level or the bi-metals... here's why.
Let's say that a standard mouse trap is one side of the detergent dispenser, and my finger is the bi-metal. I pull the trap back to set it and hold it open with my finger, thus simulating the door being held closed by the bi-metal. Now, it doesn't matter if I move my finger slowly or quickly to let go of the trap... once my finger is clear of the trap, the spring snaps the trap back to the closed position. The same is true with the bi-metal... as long as it moves enough to release the catch of the detergent door, it is the spring that causes the door to fly open. So if the bi-metal was at fault, or if the motor wasn't drawing enough amperage to heat the bi-metal enough due to a low water level, the door would still be closed at the end of the cycle. Also, if the problem was a low water level, it would show itself with both prewash and main wash dispensers, since in a "Normal" cycle, both the third prewash and main wash sections have a high fill, so they would be filling up to the same spot. This can be verified by opening the door after the third prewash fill or main wash fill has completed and comparing how high the water is in the dishwasher. The only reason that the levels would not be the same would be a problem with the timer for some reason stopping the fill prematurely at the wash fill and working normally at the prewash section. A bad inlet valve would be bad at both sections of the cycle, the same goes for a clogged main wash filter, wash arm support, or foaming... the doors either open or they don't. If you look up at the first post, ryanstruse specifically says that "the main detergent door would not open all the way"... this to me indicates that the detergent door spring is either weak, not installed correctly, or something foreign is preventing it from snapping the door open. | ||
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Post# 671461 , Reply# 10 4/8/2013 at 21:34 (4,029 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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Detergent Dispenser Problems Barcoboy, yes you raise some good points as the poster did say the det door opens partially, so it is likely a DD problem, stiff shaft or the like. I was explaining some of the many reasons that KA DW DD have been well known to not open properly.
Barcoboy, fill out your profile or at least make up a name for yourself as I really seldom address people by silly profile names, you should address me by my name John, thanks. | ||
| Post# 671473 , Reply# 11 4/8/2013 at 22:06 (4,029 days old) by barcoboy (Canada) | ||
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| Post# 672110 , Reply# 13 4/11/2013 at 22:12 (4,026 days old) by barcoboy (Canada) | ||
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