Thread Number: 57866  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
I'm starting to hate this Maytag Bravos
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Post# 803095   1/9/2015 at 15:17 (3,366 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

murando531's profile picture
Not necessarily because of its performance. I'd prefer that it used a bit more water for rinsing, but other than that, the results are fine. No, it's the quality and design of the parts that is starting to anger me. First it was the drain pump, with its horrible loud buzzing racket that it made, and after having not two but THREE new pumps put on the thing, I've decided to tune it out. There is now a cut square of excess carpet from when the house was being built put under it to muffle the sound being echoed off the stone tile floors, and some insulation foam wedged under the front edge just to help the noise. That I can deal with as long as it drains properly and doesn't burn out for a long time despite a sound that makes me think that SOMETHING is rubbing or vibrating against something else that isn't supposed to be.

To add to that, I had started a load of darks, what this machine would consider a medium load, and I was in the kitchen when I heard what sounded like someone knocking rhythmically on a wooden desk. I thought it was my boyfriend because he was in the office, which is next to the laundry room, and when I walked in I realized it was the WASHER. I stood and watched as it was in the sensing/pretreating phase, and the tub began speeding up, with a sound that was like someone thumping thick hollow plastic, until it got up to a certain speed and the sound went away. I stopped it and hand turned the tub and it would "thump" at the same position every time, sometimes making smaller pops in addition to the big pop at around the 5 o'clock position. I started it again to see what it would do, and the sound went away for a time. The the agitation started, and I could hear that same popping; not the thud that these inverter drives make when switching direction, no, it's like a pop mid-stroke coming from underneath the washer that happens intermittently. I stopped it and reached down to manually turn the agitator and it's something within the drive system because at that point the tub is floating and completely disengaged.

What's strange is that you'll hear it loudly sometimes, sometimes quietly, and sometimes not at all, and once it reaches a certain speed it goes away. It can spin full speed without a single noise. It's not until it slows down to a stop that you can hear a knock-knock-knocking towards the end of the spindown. I took the agitator out last night to make sure nothing had gotten jammed underneath or in the bearing that locks the tub in place, and everything was clean. I've even run the machine through three clean cycles to make sure nothing is between the tubs, but everything is spotless underneath. The motor and pumps are all rock solid and tight, and I can't find a single thing that would be loose or rattling.

I'm at the point of just wanting the machine returned and putting the Whirlpool back in. I'm sure between Home Depot and Whirlpool/Maytag all I'm going to get is a "too bad, you're past the return policy" response and I'm just stuck with it. I can be a perfectionist with things, because I expect my appliances and machines to work as they were intended, and I know that washers are going to make funny noises now and then, but I know good and well from all the years of my life that I have been analyzing and dissecting and attuning myself with every sound and characteristic of different motor and drive systems of washers and dishwashers, the noises that this thing is making are NOT what it should be doing. On top of that, I would have thought that while scouring user reviews on Maytag, CR, Home Depot and Lowe's, and nearly every appliance site I could think of, that these issues would have come up at least somewhere.





Post# 803104 , Reply# 1   1/9/2015 at 16:06 (3,366 days old) by Mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Motor contact

mrb627's profile picture
Perhaps the motor is making contact with the carpeting underneath?

Malcolm


Post# 803107 , Reply# 2   1/9/2015 at 16:34 (3,366 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
WP DD T Lers with F&P motors

combo52's profile picture
We have had a lot of these in the shop for main bearings and other problems. And while they work well these not not machines for washer experts who like washers.

Hi Andrew, I was surprised when you spent good money on this machine, if you ever get the urge to buy an expensive appliance like this again feel free to call me first, good luck with returning it.


Post# 803110 , Reply# 3   1/9/2015 at 16:40 (3,366 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

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I've already made sure it hasn't. Even when the tub is completely filled with water and the tub itself is as low as it can possibly go, there's still an inch and a half of clearance between the lowest point, which is the center bolt on the rotor, and the top of the carpet fibers. It's pretty low-pile carpet. It's also adhered to the floor with double sided tape. I've been checking often actually by looking under with a flash light every load just to make sure it's not touching anything. During the spin the everything is probably close to 3 inches above the floor.

It's had me depressed honestly. I don't even want to go into the laundry room anymore. Everytime I ever try to embrace new technology and try things the "modern" way, it somehow screws me over. I now either have to attempt to battle Whirlpool over the phone and try to get the entire machine replaced and give it one more chance, or just use it like normal and try and ignore the problems until it literally just falls apart, and at that point just take the time it should have lasted as a loss.


Post# 803143 , Reply# 4   1/9/2015 at 20:05 (3,366 days old) by logixx (Germany)        

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You mean like in this video at around 4:15? I think that's the basket disengaging. 






Post# 803163 , Reply# 5   1/9/2015 at 21:58 (3,366 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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The basket floats (disengages from the drive cog) at 4:58.

The thumping noise starting at 4:15 is the drive motor pulsing to test (via inertia) for when the basket has disengaged.  My IWL12 does that but on a different pattern that's less noticeable.


Post# 803170 , Reply# 6   1/9/2015 at 22:52 (3,366 days old) by Murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

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It isn't during the engagement test. As it stands right now, empty, I can gently turn the tub by hand and it will make a thumping sound at the same point. Tonight I took the back panel off to watch while it's running, and I can't see anything at all that would cause the noise. It sounds like it's coming from inside honestly. It has never made a sound like this before now, because I've either been standing and watching the machine while running, or have been within earshot of it to monitor and make sure the drain pump doesn't suddenly start gushing water.

What's more is that I can fill the tub to the point that the tub is floating completely, and the agitator is almost submerged, and I can turn the agitator by hand while holding the tub, and it will still pop. If I allow it to agitate on its own, you can hear the popping, almost crackling sound while it's working.


Post# 803198 , Reply# 7   1/10/2015 at 01:19 (3,366 days old) by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

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Something non washer-heads have going for them is they just press START and walk away. We tend to listen and pay attention to our washers, which can be a curse.

My advice is to press START and walk away. Ignore any "construction zone" noises coming from your laundry room.


Post# 803203 , Reply# 8   1/10/2015 at 02:21 (3,365 days old) by Mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Wash plate?

mrb627's profile picture
Can you remove the wash plate to see what is under it?

Malcolm


Post# 803209 , Reply# 9   1/10/2015 at 03:48 (3,365 days old) by electron1100 (England)        
modern machines

electron1100's profile picture
Hello Andrew
If it is any consolation I too tried to embrace modern technology, I went through 3 "A" rated Eco machines and found them all wanting in terms of there washing/rinsing performance and of course they all had awful build quality compared to old machines, In the end I went back to a Hoover automatic made in 1981 that has no gimmicks or fancy displays and it uses sensible amounts of water, it outperforms the three other machines in all respects.
So good luck

Gary


Post# 803212 , Reply# 10   1/10/2015 at 05:46 (3,365 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

I can't help but thinking of a bra wire or a broken spider on a FL.
If it actually is comming from the inside, I would guess on either bearings, drive shaft\drum support, motor being of center or the stuck bra wire.


Post# 803220 , Reply# 11   1/10/2015 at 07:33 (3,365 days old) by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture

Andrew--  If you're not dead set against owning a front-loader, you might want to consider that option if you're trying for replacement.  Tumble action is far more amenable to HE requirements.  I'm just not a fan of impeller-based washers.  If a Speed Queen top-loader isn't a practical alternative, go with a front-loader in the brand of your choice.  

 

Sorry this experience has only deepened your mistrust of/dissatisfaction with new technology.  Don't know if I'm just lucky, but all my new-tech stuff behaves well (knock wood). 

 

 




This post was last edited 01/10/2015 at 08:37
Post# 803257 , Reply# 12   1/10/2015 at 12:55 (3,365 days old) by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

I agree with Eugene (Frigilux).  I've had good luck with my new technology stuff.  And my front loader with supplemental heater and true hot washes outperforms any top loader I've ever used and that goes all the way back to 1956 GE. 


Post# 803260 , Reply# 13   1/10/2015 at 13:43 (3,365 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

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I just have bad luck honestly. I always have haha. It even happened when I got the PowerClean exactly the way I wanted it. Pristine, hummed like a beautiful new car and shined like new money, and then the control panel went crazy, turning itself on and locking up wash cycles. My strain of bad luck is most severe whenever I buy something new; the more expensive it is, the more hell it will put me through. Oh well.

I'm running a load of sheets right now, and I'm sitting in the office listening to it. So far its only "popped" a few times while slowly turning the basket, but hasn't acted as badly as it was. Maybe it was a fluke, but I'm mainly worried that if it is in fact a bearing or something, ignoring it may prove to be a nightmare down the road, most specifically after the 1-year is up. I did buy a Protection Plan from HD, but I have my reservations about the way they handle business in that situation. I've heard too many horror stories...

Like I said, it isn't a normal sound. Yes there are thumps and knocks when its pulsing to sense when the tub is engaged/disengaged, and there are creaks and pops from the suspension system, but those are all to be expected. This has been while it is steadily turning at 25 rpm while the recirculation pump is running, and also occasionally while its agitating mid stroke. The worst has been when it's slowing the tub to a stop; the sound was like someone knocking on a wooden desk. Still, I can't see a thing that would be causing it. I extensively check pockets, button up pants and zippers, and we have no bobby-pins or bra fasteners in the house at all. I would think if something were caught, it would be making a horrible sound anytime the basket moves, and it surely could not spin at max speed with no problem like it is now. It only "knocks" at lower speeds...


Post# 803263 , Reply# 14   1/10/2015 at 13:52 (3,365 days old) by Mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Video

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Can you post a video of it making the noise?

Malcolm


Post# 803265 , Reply# 15   1/10/2015 at 14:30 (3,365 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
The more you talk about it...

I'm pretty much not familar with the drum support system of the Cabrio design (well, not exactly Cabrio, but the floating system), but I really think that any part of it might have broken.
If it is not noticible during high speeds, what ever is causing that noise is probably moved by the g-forces in a manner that prevents the noise.
Really puzzeled and sorry for you.


Post# 803336 , Reply# 16   1/10/2015 at 21:38 (3,365 days old) by alr2903 (TN)        

Is this machine direct drive or is there a belt. Is it possible there is a worn or defective area on the belt?


Post# 803339 , Reply# 17   1/10/2015 at 22:03 (3,365 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

murando531's profile picture
@Malcolm - I took the washplate out the other night; spotless, and couldn't see or feel anything out of place. I made sure to bolt it back down nice and tight. I've also been listening to it with the washing done today. It did it a few times but nothing I could catch on video in time. I stood there with my camera in hand filming it for a while, and of course nothing.

@alr2903 - It's a Direct Drive, Fisher&Paykel SmartDrive clone. Which is what is so puzzling. There should be less to malfunction, but this has me stumped.

From what it was doing, it was almost the same type of sound as when your ankle pops when you walk. When it does do it, its at the same point while it rotates, same point when it agitates, and while agitating it sometimes makes multiple crackles and pops. Then it will go away and sound perfect. My biggest concern is when it has done it while spinning down, because at that point it is disturbingly loud.

Who knows. It could be just a machine "mood-swing" and it could be nothing. Having a brand new machine knock like that in ways I've never heard a Cabrio machine sound isn't something I really want to hear after spending that much money and also immediately getting the run-around on the drain pump (which, by the way, seems to have calmed down for now). I'm just going to use it and keep an eye on it, but I'm also going to just not care so much. If it blows up, so be it. That's why the Whirlpool is sitting out in the garage covered up, lol.


Post# 823227 , Reply# 18   5/13/2015 at 10:54 (3,242 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
I know you're not the only one...

How I love main stream music ;)

Though I hate bringing up old threads, I just had to post this. Just jump to 0:40. Anyone familiar with that sound?



I guess, it is\was not only your problem, Andrew...


Post# 823230 , Reply# 19   5/13/2015 at 11:23 (3,242 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

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Oh wow. It did have a similar tone to what mine did but much more rapid. I wonder how often his makes that sound?

I still to this day wonder what was actually going on with mine. I've analyzed parts diagrams and repair videos and photos to the point that I could draw pictures of it in my sleep. My strongest theory is in line with what one of the techs said: could have been a slightly bent drive shaft, or even a microscopically deformed bearing ring. Those are the only things other than the rotor/stator that could have made a sound in rhythm with the rotation of the basket. All I know is that it sounded horrible towards the end there.

I'm so in love with my new Bravos though, and it hasn't made a sound out of line since it was replaced!


Post# 823237 , Reply# 20   5/13/2015 at 13:12 (3,242 days old) by cuffs054 (MONTICELLO, GA)        

I really want to be a hip-with it- kind of dude but an hour and 40 min for a load of towels? I'm retired and don't have that much free time. How much overall energy/water am I saving by having the machine going as long as that. Then I watched the LG putz around more than 5 minutes before doing anything useful and that action can't be kind to fabrics. I'm just sayin...

Post# 823285 , Reply# 21   5/13/2015 at 18:54 (3,242 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
Gosh

mark_wpduet's profile picture
This is gonna drive you mad if you don't figure it out soon. So far I've had pretty good luck with new stuff (KNOCK ON WOOD!!!) EXCEPT for my 2004 Trane all electric heat pump!! The past five years or so have been trouble free, but the years before that something was always going wrong.

Post# 823288 , Reply# 22   5/13/2015 at 18:58 (3,242 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        

mark_wpduet's profile picture
so paging down I see you got a new machine on the other thread. I forgot all about posting on the other thread where you were sent a new machine but I had never read this thread until just now....

Glad the new machine is working as it should :D


Post# 823304 , Reply# 23   5/13/2015 at 20:43 (3,242 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Knocking Maytag Bravos

combo52's profile picture

That washer clearly had a bearing or shaft issue, this was an easy one hour fix for a good tech.

 

It is too bad that WP will not invest money in decent serving for their appliances, so I guess that they can try to advertise their way out of problem appliances and take the financial lost on returns and bad publicity, LOL.


Post# 823338 , Reply# 24   5/14/2015 at 04:55 (3,241 days old) by washer111 ()        

Given that washer motors use very little energy compared to the cost of a two full tubs, plus spray rinses of water, I think the time issue is pretty invalid.
There are always faster cycles, else you just have to alter the way you do laundry so you don't run out of stuff as quick and therefore need clothes "right now."

Some of these newer machines seem to spend a lot of time "stuffing around and doing nothing." Case in point was our previous Simpson/Electrolux TL machine. The first 15 minutes were wasted "auto-sensing" the water level, even with a manual level selected. Then after wash/rinse drain phases, it would lock the lid and spin very slowly for another 5-10minutes, IIRC. It did another auto-sensing procedure during the rinse.
Overall an aggravating experience listening to that thing.



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