Thread Number: 59734  /  Tag: Modern Dishwashers
Who in the world thought of tiered upper racks??
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Post# 823645   5/15/2015 at 23:17 (3,239 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        

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I caught the bug again. The bug that comes around every 6 months or so that makes me want to switch dishwashers. Since the water inlet, drain, and power are set up and positioned for both the PowerClean and the Voyager-Maytag, all I have to do is disconnect, unbolt from the countertop, and slide out-slide in. The reason for this latest bug I suppose comes from having the "itch" for newer things, since my washer and dryer are now up to modern HE status. I ADORE the PowerClean, but with detergents now requiring more time to effectively work, I just have this feeling that the short main wash time just isn't enough unless I add options or use a heavier cycle, which adds energy use as well as wear and tear. Not to mention that I like the sleek styling of the Maytag MDB4709, with its slate colored interior and dark racks. It's also much quieter than the PC, though I'd never dare to say that the PC is intrusively noisy.

However, after being so accustomed to the PowerClean and its beautifully versatile loading/racking style, I can't bring myself to get used to the tiered upper rack in this Maytag. I've expressed how I feel about it before, but it seems like now it's just unbearable. I can only place short glasses, which are rarely used by the way, on the higher-left side, but because of the way the rack "steps" down from left to right, it also makes it difficult to place any glassware because if it isn't sitting on a flat part, it will tip or awkwardly wobble. This results in wasted gaps that would have otherwise proven useful in the PC's one level racking. It's also annoying that the "gained" space above the lower rack is nothing but useless head room because I never load tall pans or baking sheets in. Even with a full load of tall plates and stemware, there seems to be a mile of open air between the tops of the dishes in the bottom, and the underside of the upper washarm.

That said, I've gone on a vicious search for any info and parts I can find to try and convert to a more sensible setup. I tried taking the racks out of the PowerClean, since the upper rack in it is identical to the racks still being used in Whirlpool's current dishwashers as well as the Voyager machines that don't feature the adjustable levels (the lower rack is also identical to the Maytag's except in color). However, because the roller wheels are mounted almost in the middle of the rack, it places it too low in the Maytag, with the supply tube harness only meeting with the lower supply port at the back, which is molded sealed since my machine didn't have adjustable racks of course.

My options, it seems now, are to either buy the rack that was available to the model up from mine, the MDB8959SBS which user jkbff owns, that is the "deluxe" adjustable rack, but that also entails buying the parts that will make it compatible; rollers, the entire supply tube that runs up the back of the tub, and the supply manifold for the upper arm, along with the mounting brackets. I also have the option of scouring Craigslist and other sources for a used Whirlpool/Kenmore/Maytag dishwasher with that rack and matching color, and swap parts, and perhaps sell the harvested machine after restoring it a bit. Or just put the PowerClean back in and just make sure to buy quick dissolving loosely packed pods such as Cascade, because the Finish PowerBalls are just too densely compacted for me to be comfortable using them in a 14 minute main wash cycle. (That being the Normal cycle of course; if I add the Power Scour option, it usually turns out to be 25 minutes or so because of the thermal hold. This also adds a full extra rinse. Again, more energy, more water, and more wear on the machine.)

It's running right now with what I feel is a half load compared to what the PC would hold, despite there being no empty spots, but after it is finished I'll grab some up close photos of the rack and the inside of the machine, in case anyone has suggestions they want to share. I'll certainly be most grateful.





Post# 823680 , Reply# 1   5/16/2015 at 06:34 (3,239 days old) by joeypete (Concord, NH)        

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Have you tried using STPP with your current detergent? I just ordered some to use with my laundry mostly. I use Finish powder and haven't had any issues at all with it not cleaning or build up.

I really like my dishwasher (Frigidaire Gallery) but I know what you mean about the bug! haha Mine has an adjustable top rack with folding tines. I love it. It's all the same height though, except for a few small dips in the center. I have had no problems washing my water bottle in it. Though I just got a new one and it's too tall even with the rack lowered. :(


Post# 823716 , Reply# 2   5/16/2015 at 11:06 (3,239 days old) by logixx (Germany)        

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I loved the hight-adjustable tiered upper rack on our German AEG - that dishwasher held pizza plates and the tallest stemware in one load. Too bad the racks were the only great thing about the dishwasher.

Besides the already mentioned products, I find Quantum to be fast dissolving as well. Alternatively, I break my tabs up and put them in the dispenser in two or four pieces. You can usually break them up in the wrapped already.

And yes: post pictures!


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Post# 823840 , Reply# 3   5/17/2015 at 09:23 (3,238 days old) by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

Tiered upper racks give some of the loading flexibility of an adjustable upper rack to a dishwasher with the less expensive fixed upper rack. There are places under the shallowest tier for tall things like broiler pans and racks and on the other side of the machine, there is room on the deeper side of the upper rack for tall items that need to be washed in the upper rack like glasses, bowls etc.

Post# 824018 , Reply# 4   5/18/2015 at 13:02 (3,237 days old) by murando531 (Augusta, Georgia - US)        
Finally, some pictures.

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Sorry to take so long. Got caught up with busy-ness. Anywho, here are pictures of the dishwasher thus far.

Like I said, Point Voyager design through and through, except that blasted upper rack. Notice the mile of space above the lower rack, and the lack of head room for any tall dishware on the left side of the upper? A small animal could reside in that space! For people that frequently load their pots and pans and tall sheets and such, this would be a godsend, but because I hand wash all my cookware, it just ends up being a headache. I can fit more dishes into the PowerClean just because of its flexibility compared to this one.

I'm hoping I'll find something to harvest racks from soon. Lowe's actually had the previous gen TOL Maytag in their clearance section. A few hundred dollars less, and I would have carried it home on the spot. It has the hidden controls, with the deluxe ball bearing racks, but the exact same wash arms and Voyager pump system.

You may ask "why didn't you just buy a dishwasher that had everything you wanted"? I would have, but at the time we were buying the house, Whirlpool's filter-style dishwashers were fairly new, and though I wanted so badly to have the in-door silverware basket and the standard racks that I've always loved and been used to, I was more afraid of the terrible wash system, and wanted something with an actual motor and disposer system. That's why I went on the hunt for the PowerClean and worked so hard to restore it to what it is now, but at the same time, it's about 12-13 years old now, and detergents just aren't designed for older machines like that anymore.

A part of me has my eye on the newest WP dishwashers, with the silverware shower bar. They look so sleek and clean, and from what I've been hearing, they're not half bad anymore. Apparently they've improved the pump and the draining system so that the filter is self-cleaning for the most part. I noticed that the manual changed from instructing to clean the filter every day if you don't prerinse, to cleaning it every few months. And most of the negative I hear comes from people that don't know how to properly use a dishwasher in the first place. I heard nothing but negatives about the Cabrio/Oasis washers, but upon having one I've come to adore it because I took the time to learn how to properly use it.



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Post# 824021 , Reply# 5   5/18/2015 at 13:29 (3,237 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

Everytime I come across this post I just have to think about Mieles upper rack again. It's the only one you can height adjust independent on both sides I came across yet. Means you have a slanted rack if you want to, or you don't. You can have it slanted left or right, only one or 2 levels apart, and you could even slant it in 2 different heights (so, only apart and on a lower or higher setting).
I had the joy to use one at a friends home for 3 days and actually loved the racking. And almost everything came lean first go. Funny enough, it was a lightly soiled pan that did not come clean. The heavy soiled raclette dishes came clean first go.
I still got pictures on my phone that I'll have to post soon.


Post# 824030 , Reply# 6   5/18/2015 at 16:14 (3,236 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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I swapped out the upper rack of my maytag for an adjustable one......

kind of the best of both worlds......the staggered section allows for tall and short items, and the adjustments allow for customizing of certain loads....the tilt alone allows for a lot of benefit to loading top and bottom...

both ports in the back were available, so it was a simple swap, two clips, one out, one in, clips back in place....ready to go!.....



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