Thread Number: 60424  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Newest Whirlpool duet explosion found....
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Post# 830804   7/5/2015 at 10:00 (3,189 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        

Now I'm afraid to have my WFW72HEDW in my house. Im surprised however the computer is still alive.... Its scary to see that it managed to break the tub clips free...

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Post# 830805 , Reply# 1   7/5/2015 at 10:04 (3,189 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        

By the knob though, i can tell its the older model duet. I haven't seen any of the newer duets/maximas do this. Which I hope is a good sign..

Post# 830840 , Reply# 2   7/5/2015 at 12:45 (3,189 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Interesting...

mrb627's profile picture
... That the video has been categorized as comedy.
It's really not all that funny.

Malcolm


Post# 830880 , Reply# 3   7/5/2015 at 17:27 (3,188 days old) by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        
Pretty neat picture

Was this caused by something breaking loose during a spin more than by an actual explosion which is often thought of as bursting violently as a result of pressure within? I guess though, that if an explosion is defined as a release of internal energy, this would qualify as an explosion because it sure looks like the result of a release of energy.

I'm going to have to check here more often.


Post# 831090 , Reply# 4   7/7/2015 at 03:21 (3,187 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Spin-sploded-the drum flew apart from high centrinfical forces.Did the user load something in the machine it couldn't properly balance to spin?Did the user select the right cycle?Never heard of a Duet "exploding".A fellow that used to work at the plant with me had a Duet set and he had nothing but praise for it.

Post# 831145 , Reply# 5   7/7/2015 at 07:07 (3,187 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

gansky1's profile picture
Are there other examples of this out there on the interwebs? I've not seen them and like Rex said, I've never even heard mention of this problem before.

There is no need to machine wash concrete blocks, they're best done by hand :-)


Post# 831159 , Reply# 6   7/7/2015 at 07:48 (3,187 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)        
thank goodness i will be buying a topload when my duet break

pierreandreply4's profile picture
not funny at all i may have the 2004 duet model generation 1 but thats clearly a fright and show we should never leave with the washer working.

Post# 831175 , Reply# 7   7/7/2015 at 09:43 (3,187 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        

The strange thing is, all the spin-splodes that have happend to whirlpool units are with the old drum designs and not with the new drums. Also I'm seeing so far that all the spin splodes that have happend weather it be maxima or duet, have happend to the older models and the models that spun at 1400rpm.

Post# 831283 , Reply# 8   7/7/2015 at 19:25 (3,186 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        

combo52's profile picture

Can you say Broken Spider and I wash all my clothing in cold water and NEVER use bleach, LOL. You can tell just from looking at the moldy broken parts what probably lead up to this event.

 

I really think many days that many people should just go to the laundromat, and not be allowed to have DWs as well. The stuff we see everyday in homes is pretty scary. The interesting thing is a washer like this could be used in a laundromat for ever and never suffer a broken spider.

 

John L.

 


Post# 831309 , Reply# 9   7/7/2015 at 23:20 (3,186 days old) by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room)        

lordkenmore's profile picture
>I really think many days that many people should just go to the laundromat, and not be allowed to have DWs as well.

Laundromat repair people might not agree. LOL I remember going to one where the owner was busy fixing washers, and he was grumbling loudly about the extra work generated by the idiots, er, users. That same place had signs about overloading that said roughly: "If you overload and the machine breaks we will NOT refund your $2!"

Perhaps we should just issue scrub boards to everyone unless they pass a special test. LOL

However, to be fair, a lot of people out there are working with flawed information. Cold water washing environmental "advantages" are pushed so hard now, and yet one seldom hears anything else.


Post# 831310 , Reply# 10   7/7/2015 at 23:21 (3,186 days old) by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room)        
and yet one seldom hears anything else.

lordkenmore's profile picture
Except here, of course.

Post# 831326 , Reply# 11   7/8/2015 at 04:33 (3,186 days old) by washer111 ()        
Very True, LordKenmore

Someone I know called me an idiot for telling her that cold water washing doesn't work.

"Ever heard of Cold Power, DUMBASS?"

Yet today, I proved to myself again why I love warm and hot water. Completed an overnight soak with that started hot and ended cold, and used the Miele's Delicate cycle with a little detergent to scrub stuff out, and some bleach* to whiten everything that last little bit. Delicates uses a high water level for washing/rinsing, so the machine would get a cleanout too!

Results were beautiful. I coulda sworn that those blasted "pit-stains" started to shift for the first time in forever...

*This is despite their recommendation against, but I figured if US machines (even cheap ones) allow it, then why can't I?


Post# 831331 , Reply# 12   7/8/2015 at 05:59 (3,186 days old) by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        
Pit Stains

If you are having trouble with pit stains, see if the aerosol version of Shout is available in your area or if you can buy it online. I turn the undershirts inside out and spray the underarm areas with that product, give them a resting period of maybe 15 minutes followed by a good hot wash and those stains are removed because what you are seeing is not so much a stain as a deposit of mineral salts from the antiperspirant/deodorant and sweat plus a waxy film from the roll on or smear on product base. The mineral salts inhibit the detergent from attacking the wax and you get the buildup. The aerosol version of this type of pre-treater has solvents that the stuff in the plastic spray bottle does not contain and it will really knock out stubborn stains.

Post# 831346 , Reply# 13   7/8/2015 at 07:18 (3,186 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
Oh

mark_wpduet's profile picture
first time I ever heard of this too. My 2005 Duet has been awesome, even though I think the rmp is 1000. But you're right, you can see the parts are nasty....

Post# 831366 , Reply# 14   7/8/2015 at 10:30 (3,186 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        

I also noticed when you watch the video on HD, well...the first thing you see is that those black clip looking things, are detergent pods. Second, i typed in the model of this washer and looked the the control panel tryed to match up the lit options and cycle. What a coincidence, the washer *seems* to be on either bulky items or heavy duty and set on extra high for the spin speed. Hmmmmm.............

Post# 831374 , Reply# 15   7/8/2015 at 12:18 (3,186 days old) by Logixx (Germany)        

logixx's profile picture
Antiperspirant is best removed with acid. Detergents (surfactants) can actually stick to the build-up and make it worse - this is what Henkel said.



Post# 831522 , Reply# 16   7/9/2015 at 11:41 (3,185 days old) by retro-man (- boston,ma)        

I use oxy-clean super stain spray remover on my shirts. I keep a bottle near the laundry basket and when I take a shirt off in side out spray the area and leave it till laundry time. Sometime a week or more. Run through a hot wash with detergent and oxy-clean powder. I have removed stains that were there for a couple of years. White shirts seem to release the stains faster and better than colored shirts. Multiple wearings and washings are getting them all out.

Jon


Post# 831653 , Reply# 17   7/10/2015 at 09:16 (3,184 days old) by Jetcone (Schenectady-Home of Calrods,Monitor Tops,Toroid Transformers)        
Wow

jetcone's profile picture

we never had washer drama like this in the 50's 

 

Hand wash concrete bricks ______LOLOLOL


Post# 831656 , Reply# 18   7/10/2015 at 09:29 (3,184 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
So...

mrb627's profile picture


Are we taking the position that this is somehow a user error?
All the fuzzy logic in these machines is supposed to prevent things like this from happening.

Malcolm


Post# 831658 , Reply# 19   7/10/2015 at 09:49 (3,184 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

Funny enough, the original fuzzy logic system is rather slow in terms of reaction time. If something happens north of 400rpm, those bords react most likely to late if they ever have the change to do so.

As I wrote this, a sentence from a German book popped into my head. It's about a family visiting their grandparents. On the way there, they are hit by a nuclear blast. WW3 started.
As it turned out, the grandparents were shopping in the nearby city (Fulda) as the explosion went off.
The doughter is then quoted with the sentence "Hopefully, they just instantly evaporated".
Don't know how my head drew that connection.


Post# 831883 , Reply# 20   7/11/2015 at 17:11 (3,182 days old) by Combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Fuzzy logic

combo52's profile picture
Is not designed to detect a broken spider there's a certain limit to technology. For fuzzy logic to detect and correct the problem like this would be like expecting stability control on a new car to keep the car from going off the road if a wheel falls off.

Post# 831895 , Reply# 21   7/11/2015 at 20:09 (3,182 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Best thing for getting at underarm stains on shirts

launderess's profile picture
That kills the whiff has been a good vintage bar soap. I say vintage because most are no longer produced, well at least not in their original form.

Kirkman's Borax and Fels Naptha work wonders on clearing out nasty yellowing and whiffy underarms.


When fresh perspiration is pH neutral to mildly acidic. However if the stuff is allowed to sit it will become alkaline. This explains the old advice to use alkaline substances on fresh whiff stains and acid on older ones. You want to use the opposite of what the stain is to neutralize.

Best way to protect against perspiration stains is to wear undergarments or use shields. Oh and launder items shortly after they have been worn if exposed to sweat. Chucking things into a hamper and allowing them to marinate for several days (or weeks) is going to make the problem worse.


Post# 839700 , Reply# 22   9/5/2015 at 13:19 (3,127 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        
Sigh....

You have got to be kidding me, I dont understand why this is being handled so lightly. It's only a matter of time before someone gets badly injured because of this.

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Post# 839702 , Reply# 23   9/5/2015 at 13:26 (3,127 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        
And again....

But this time with a Maytag unit. Whirlpool needs to bring out an answer for this, I think its quite obvious why this happens and they still take it lightly....wonderful.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO washerdude's LINK


Post# 839704 , Reply# 24   9/5/2015 at 13:40 (3,127 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

You know, here in Germany, we had Candy do this in a Consumer Reports test field. Consequence: A Europe wide action. Reducing spin speeds, redesigning, exchanging of parts.
And why? Consumer Reports lab conditions. They have standard loads, even loading is regulated. Thus, it was basicly taken as scientificly proofen to be a design flaw.

However, there are cases of pretty much any manufacturer haveing such fatal faults. I know that Indesit\Hotpoint had such failures, I know of a video where the "biggest" collector of washers from Germany had a case where an AEG had a fatal bearing failure during a spin, causing the machine to flip on its side.

And as we concluded here often enough: Most cases, it is directly relatable to consumers user errors. Waterproof items, plain wrong loading, using machines that had obviously not been set up correctly or used even though they were broken.

And on top, seeing that maybe 100-1000 cases are known of something like this happpening in the US, while several million washers are out there, it is not actually such a big deal.
Now, take into account how likely it is for a consumer to be in the same room as the washer is running, and on top this kind of damage only can happen during high speed spins, it will take a long time to anyhow affect a customer in its personal health.


Post# 839706 , Reply# 25   9/5/2015 at 13:46 (3,127 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)        
yet more reason to be sticking to topload washers

pierreandreply4's profile picture
well this clearly gives me more reason to go back to a top load washer once my duet washer breaks

Post# 839707 , Reply# 26   9/5/2015 at 14:00 (3,127 days old) by A440 ()        

There has got to be some type of sensor that is not working correctly in these washers.  Take for instance my first generation HE3T washer.  If a load was severely off balance and could not be redistributed the washer would only spin as slowly as it could handle the load or actually not spin at all and give an error code.  This is on a 15 year old washer with the technology that was known back then.  Spring forward 15 years and we have units that are smarter with even better safety controls.?

 

On these machines it actually looks like everything was balanced and the controls proved it was okay to go into max spin.  It seems as though something failed on the lines of the suspension, bearings, spider, etc.  Not the computer.

 

Have there been any reports of LG or Samsung front loaders having this type of catastrophic failure?

 

 


Post# 839709 , Reply# 27   9/5/2015 at 14:11 (3,127 days old) by Combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Destroyed washing Machine

combo52's profile picture
For a washer to sustain this type of damage it had to be going near full speed and there is no sensor on any washer that will suddenly stop a washer under that condition if something catastrophicly fails or the load quickly becomes unbalanced such as a mattress cover with a plastic cover where the water is released suddenly when the plastic cover ruptures.

Post# 839723 , Reply# 28   9/5/2015 at 16:40 (3,126 days old) by lotsosudz (Sacramento, CA)        
Hmmmm

lotsosudz's profile picture
I have not heard of any of these machines doing this. However, I agree with Malcolm, if you aren't supposed to use a high speed spin on a bulky cycle, maybe the machine should have a overide to a lower spin speed. It seems to me, if you use a bulky cycle, you would want a high speed spin to get the items as dry as possible. Just sayin!

Post# 839750 , Reply# 29   9/5/2015 at 19:43 (3,126 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Spin Speed On Bulky Cycle

combo52's profile picture

On our 11 YO Duet you can't use the two highest spin speeds when using the bulky cycle, the problem is that most people always use the normal cycle and usually use the fastest spin speed no matter what they are washing.


Post# 839754 , Reply# 30   9/5/2015 at 20:24 (3,126 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        

On our Duet, I really don't see much of a difference on the medium spin setting on the normal cycle. It sounds like it only spins 50 rpm less or so from its full 1200rpm when using the medium spin speed on normal. You can only select high, "medium" and no spin. Slow is not an option for some reason though.

Post# 839755 , Reply# 31   9/5/2015 at 20:31 (3,126 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
you would want a high speed spin to get the items as dry as

launderess's profile picture
Well in theory yes, but actual practice is another matter.

High spin speeds place great stress on parts of a H-Axis washer. These are multiplied if the load is unbalanced and or very heavy. End result is almost always the same; shortened lifespan of the machine as rear bearings, shock absorbers/suspension system and or other parts such as drum spider simply become worn out.

It is totally possible to build/design H-Axis washer to withstand high G-force spins and keep in keeping on; lord knows commercial units have done so for ages, this however costs money.

Even Miele washers from certain build series are not immune to the stress of frequent high speed final spins. If you search the Internet there are plenty of reports of 1900 series units with failed rear bearings and other such problems. In particular the 1918 series which IIRC had final spin speeds up to 1600rpms.

Miele seems to have learned from that mistake and future washers stopped at 1400 rpms spins IIRC. Indeed it does seem even in Europe final spin speeds of 1600, 1800 fell out of favor. The stress placed upon the washer versus returns in terms of extra moisture removed just isn't worth bothering with.

Largest difference in terms of water extraction comes when going from say 800rpms to 1000rpms or up to 1400rpms. After that the moisture extracted really isn't much. That is the one percent or so (maybe less) increase in moisture removal has nil to no impact in (machine) drying times.


Post# 839761 , Reply# 32   9/5/2015 at 21:17 (3,126 days old) by ea56 (Cotati, Calif.)        

ea56's profile picture
I use the Bulky Cycle on my LG FL for heavy items like rugs, king comforters, king bedspeads, ect. The spin speed is limited to med., the default spin speed, or low. When the heavy load is done, I run a spin only on ex. high of high for extra extraction, There is never a problem with the machine spinning at the the higher speed once the majority of the water weight is gone after the med. spin. This really helps to reduce the dry times and only takes a few mins. extra time.

Post# 839770 , Reply# 33   9/5/2015 at 22:20 (3,126 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        
Some more insight into this

My question is now, if the concrete blocks are holding the machine down, then why not bolt them down to the bottom of the unit insted?

CLICK HERE TO GO TO washerdude's LINK


Post# 839774 , Reply# 34   9/5/2015 at 22:55 (3,126 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Basic laws of physics

launderess's profile picture
Concrete weights are on top to exert downward pressure/weight to counter the upwards forces generated by the suds container.


Concrete is actually the cheap way out, better machines such as Miele and some other European brands used or still use cast iron. This accounts for the bulk/weight of these machines.

Concrete blocks can and often breakdown. That and or one good "bang" from an out of balanced load will cause them to break.

There are two schools of design when it comes to front loaders and counter weights. The older model which used heavy materials such as cast iron thus affording protection allowing washers to spin a badly unbalanced load without damage (much) and remain relatively stable.

The other school which you see more and more of today with modern machines is to have electronics control the machine to minimize unbalanced load and thus any potential damage while keeping things stable.

My older Miele washer has only a set number of attempts to balance/distribute a load. When the timer says "lets roll" it will spin regardless, banging, clanging and vibrating away. This was pretty much the same for all older front loaders even those with concrete counter weights.

Now my more modern Oko-Lavamat uses sensors and computers to control drum movements. If it is determined a load isn't balanced enough to spin properly either it won't or will do so slowly. That or it will stop and attempt to redistribute the load into something that can be handled.

These new out of balance controls are a response to front loaders that spun badly unbalanced loads an in the process not only damaged themselves but often anything around them. The problem is depending upon how the things are programmed they can be too sensitive to unbalanced loads. Thus you hear complaints about machines taking ages to rev up to spin speeds and or simply giving up and not spinning at all.


Post# 839777 , Reply# 35   9/5/2015 at 23:02 (3,126 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

foraloysius's profile picture
"Indeed it does seem even in Europe final spin speeds of 1600, 1800 fell out of favor."

That is true for the 1800 spin speed. But 1600 is very common. 26 of the in total 34 Miele frontloaders on the German website spin with 1600rpm. The others with 1400rpm.


Post# 839789 , Reply# 36   9/6/2015 at 00:22 (3,126 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Spin Sploding washers AGAIN??I would think the washer builders would have better safety sense in their machines to STOP them and give and audible and visible alert(the washers display LCD screen)that the load is unbalanced.Even if the user chooses the wrong cycle the machine should be able to protect itself and the user and his property.It should shut down if the load becomes too unbalanced.These machines are starting to resemble aircraft engines on test stands!Engine builders do whatever they can to PREVENT Spin Sploding engines!!!It would seem if science and man can build aircraft engines with fan assemblies spinning at 4,000 RPM and weighing close to half a ton in weight we can do it with washers.And these engines have cowlings designed to withstand a thrown fan blade.Guess we can line washers with Kevlar as in those airplane engines!
And as John says--DO NOT wash waterproof matteress covers or other objects in high speed spin washers.This is a an application for older design TL washers.


Post# 839819 , Reply# 37   9/6/2015 at 08:35 (3,126 days old) by Combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Spin Sploding Washers

combo52's profile picture
We don't know what happened here.

If you put a plastic covered mattress pad in any washer ever built and the machine balances properly and gets up to full speed and then the plastic covers ruptures and the load suddenly becomes unbalanced the washer can be destroyed. This is like throwing a cinder block in a machine while spinning at full speed.

Speed Queen FL washers do use only cast iron counter balance weighs,this is part of the reason they can out between 3 or more regular FL washers.


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Post# 839824 , Reply# 38   9/6/2015 at 09:15 (3,126 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        
Impressive....

Looks like we got it happening on video! But its a samsung unit this time..not Whirlpool.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO washerdude's LINK


Post# 839828 , Reply# 39   9/6/2015 at 09:40 (3,126 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

Commercial use, thus no chance he will get anything back.

Any this being the only washer, in a Spa, doing towels for 4 whole years, that was probably a bearing\spider failure.

Best case of somebody using a washer to its physical death.


Post# 839829 , Reply# 40   9/6/2015 at 09:47 (3,126 days old) by A440 ()        

Although I am just guessing...I shudder to think of a nail salon washing their towels in cold water! 

Yuck!

Want to punish me for life?  Make me work in a nail salon dealing with nasty toes and nails day in and out.

 


Post# 839835 , Reply# 41   9/6/2015 at 11:37 (3,126 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)        
more proof that companys should stick to making top load onl

pierreandreply4's profile picture
well to me its more proof that comapnys like whirlpool ge maytag and speed queen should stick to making topload washers and fully discontinu making front load because seeing the last vid proves to me that i am making a wise choices going back to a top load washer when my duet set breaks

Post# 839836 , Reply# 42   9/6/2015 at 11:49 (3,126 days old) by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        
stick to making top load only

kb0nes's profile picture
Top load machines have had catastrophic failures too.

Part of the reason that we occasionally see this problem today is because modern machines make an actual attempt to spin out the water from the load. Except for a very odd mechanical failure due to a defect, all these spinsplosions are due to improper use of the machine in some way.

Pretty sure a rock in a stream has never had a catastrophic failure either. Perhaps we should all go back to this advanced form of laundry...


Post# 839907 , Reply# 43   9/7/2015 at 00:39 (3,125 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

The Combo link doesn't work-but can get what we are saying about matteress covers and such.If water is trapped in it and the washer balances and gets up to speed-then the water in the cover shifts---SPIN-SPLODE!!!So--don't wash these sort of things in a FL machine.then times I have washed tarps,shower curtains,Stop the machine justafter it drains and shake out water pockets in the item-then let the machine continue to spin.After rinse-shake out the item again after the drain.If its a SC-just put it back up at that point-skip the last spin.In my area-wash Shower curtains frequently to avoid mildew.When I visit Best Buy and Lowes-now see warnings on Samsung and LG washers-both FL&TL about washing such things.
Sort of sad about the nail salon using essentually a residentual-household machine for commercial use.The warantees would be invalid in that case.Best Buy pointed that out to the owners.I can also agree with KB0nes about waterproof items in the wash-if you have the ultra high speed spin FL or TL washer-don't do those things in them.It is fortunate no kids or washer spectators have been hurt from these.Both would like to watch the machine working.Think I will stick with older TL machines.Don't want to turn my laundry area into an engine test stand.


Post# 839908 , Reply# 44   9/7/2015 at 00:41 (3,125 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

TL washers-new high speed ones fail too-many episodes of that on YouTube-yes--mostly due to user abuse.They need to read the owners manual and warning labels posted on the machine!Samsung,LG.

Post# 839940 , Reply# 45   9/7/2015 at 05:05 (3,125 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Plastic Toys

mrb627's profile picture
Plastic is for toys. Steel is for washing machines.

Did they confess to washing anything other than towels in this machine at the times of failure?

How is this incident operator error?

Malcolm


Post# 839946 , Reply# 46   9/7/2015 at 06:02 (3,125 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

I do't like the plastic sneaking into these machines,either esp for any critical load bearing parts.Funny,in all of these Spin-splode incidents there isn't any mention of what was being washed.Did the operators select the proper cycles for the loads?Too much now in question.

Post# 839967 , Reply# 47   9/7/2015 at 07:41 (3,125 days old) by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture

We're worried about the occasional exploding washer when this is happening?!

#killersawblades


Post# 839984 , Reply# 48   9/7/2015 at 09:41 (3,125 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
@Malcolm

If this Spa is somewhat logicly set up, they have one place to wash theit towels.

This would be where the Samsung was placed. But, there only was 1 washer in this place.

Now, a Spa has an extraordinary high throughput of towels.

You put a washer, designed for household use, which means 1 load per day on average, maybe 2, in a commercial use, which means 4-5 loads per day approx. Then, you operate it for 4 years straight this way.

And, given my basic knowledge of physics and washers, such catastrophic failures only occur on such standard loads like towels if the system was somehow weakend before.
This means any suspension part (spider, bearings, absorbers etc.) had to be damaged. And give these parts barley ever fail at once, and if something breaks, its rather easy recognized, the user most likely had to recognize it and just operated the machine on, without doing something about it.


Post# 839990 , Reply# 49   9/7/2015 at 10:19 (3,125 days old) by stricklybojack (South Hams Devon UK)        
Hmm..

stricklybojack's profile picture
.
my two cents says even if they didn't choose the "proper" settings the machine should not explode.
Call me crazy but that's the way i see it.



*You probably do to but i couldn't resist the opportunity


Post# 840168 , Reply# 50   9/8/2015 at 04:43 (3,124 days old) by qualin (Canada)        

I think a lot of these spin sploding problems could be solved with some decent amounts of engineering. Maybe I don't see the whole picture but:

1. They could use a steel outer tub with foam cushions on the cabinet so it could absorb the impact of the outer tub smacking into the cabinet.
2. They could use a heavier gauge steel to withstand the outer tub smacking into the cabinet. Also, heavier bolts to hold the machine together.
3. Sturdy steel braces held in with bolts on each corner of the cabinet.
4. They could put accelerometers on the outer tub to determine if and when a collision event is happening.
5. A high tension tub brake that can bring the inner tub to a quick stop (ie. As in, less than two full rotations) in the event of a collision.

Of course, all of this would mean more cost to the consumer.. Am I missing something here? Is this just a pipe dream?

Just some ideas...

One thing I can't understand is how Fridgidaire was able to design a washer which had a spin speed of over 1000 RPM back in the 1950's and they didn't have any spin sploding issues? (Maybe nobody washed plastic mattress covers back then?)


Post# 840177 , Reply# 51   9/8/2015 at 06:55 (3,124 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Spin Sploding Washers

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Hi Bud, most of the things you list are much too expensive to install on automatic washers, also SSWs are not a big problem, probably less than than one-in-a-million will ever suffer such a failure and to my knowledge no one has ever been injured by a washer SS.

 

Even if a brake was applied as the washer went out of control it would still be totaled almost instantly, and if a 1957 Unimatic Frigidaire washer suddenly went out of balance at full speed it would severely damage itself if not destroy itself.


Post# 840231 , Reply# 52   9/8/2015 at 11:01 (3,124 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Spin Sploding Washers

combo52's profile picture

Hi Bud, most of the things you list are much too expensive to install on automatic washers, also SSWs are not a big problem, probably less than than one-in-a-million will ever suffer such a failure and to my knowledge no one has ever been injured by a washer SSing.

 

Even if a brake was applied as the washer went out of control it would still be totaled almost instantly, and if a 1957 Unimatic Frigidaire washer suddenly went out of balance at full speed it would severely damage itself if not destroy itself.

 

Even though automobiles are designed to crash they still get destroyed in the process, in the very rare and unlikely event a washer crashes it is just not something that is practical to try to design around, IMEO.


Post# 840268 , Reply# 53   9/8/2015 at 15:50 (3,123 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Every now and then contemplate purchasing a larger

launderess's profile picture
Capacity front loader, and maybe will do so one of these days if and or when Big Bertha finally goes...

But quite honeslty our local laundromat recently went through a refit with all new SQ electonically controlled front loaders. They spin between wash and all rinses with the largest holding 50lbs or so. For about $8 and change (chosing certain cycles increases cost by $.25/ea.) can do large loads that would take several hours if done either in the Miele or Oko-Lavamat. Best of all am not putting either machine through long cycle duty hours.

Just as with the machines show in the above vid can cram the drum on these machines full of at least five, six or more full sets of bed linen (two sheets and four pillow slips each) and things will still compact down to the drum being barely half full once wet. Bed linen is rarely markedto the point of needing advances cycles for stain removal. If there are any marks a bit of pre-treating before things are sent to the wash solves that problem.

At $8/ea. use it would take ages for me to equal the cost of a SQ or (when it was around) Miele 4000 series washer. Best of all don't have to worry about the service and maintenance issues. Yes, one gives up some comfort in having to go out; and if one lived in a more rural or suburban area probably would feel differently. But the laundormat is just down the street and round corner. Can load up machine, start, and go home only to return when things are done.


Post# 840427 , Reply# 54   9/9/2015 at 15:11 (3,122 days old) by Stricklybojack (South Hams Devon UK)        
Plus...

stricklybojack's profile picture
.
landromats have super high speed dedicated extractors that cut drying time way down for big items.


Post# 840458 , Reply# 55   9/9/2015 at 18:50 (3,122 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Extractors Have Long Gone From Most NYC Laundromats

launderess's profile picture
At least. Cannot recall the last time one has seen one.

Apparently there is/was a huge liability issue which meant often mat owners couldn't obtain insurance if an extractor was on premises. This was for coin operated laundries, not sure about other commercial sorts.

Mat owners either love or hate the things....www.coinwash.com/mb/showthread.ph...

Now if one could lay hands on a Montex extractor (hint a member has one....) like Martha Stewart has at Skylands that would be another story.....

www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/T...


Post# 840515 , Reply# 56   9/10/2015 at 00:54 (3,122 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

I remember a laundramat in Florida that had a coin operated Bock spinner.When I used it-followed its instructions printed on the machine label-and had no problems-was even fun to use.A woman tried to use it-but didn't follow the instructions-it shredded her clothes and she was running around the laundramat steaming mad!We made jokes about her----"Woman chokes to death from flying washcloth!" now I guess that wouldn't e so funny.Haven't seen extractors in laundry places in a very long time-the one I used was like almost 50 yrs ago!Back in the days when folks weren't blaming each other for things and folks operated machines properly.Yes,as pointed out--laundry places can no longer afford the liability insurance for a spinner-extractor.

Post# 840585 , Reply# 57   9/10/2015 at 13:49 (3,122 days old) by suburbanmd (Maryland, USA)        
Extractor vs FL washer

Per the coinwash thread, a 35 lb. Bock extractor generated 800G. Undoubtedly a huge improvement over laundromat machines, especially hard mount. But not that much more than a "high performance" home FL. My Miele W4840 at 1400 RPM generates 600G according to calculations I made a while ago. If it spun at 1600 RPM it would generate 800G, probably a small improvement over 600G extraction-wise.

Post# 840612 , Reply# 58   9/10/2015 at 15:45 (3,121 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
We also must not forget drum diameter

launderess's profile picture
When calculating extraction results.

Amount of moisture extracted is directly related in proportion to not only speed of spin but size of drum.

For instance once you get past say 20lb capacity or so you stop seeing spin speeds >1400 rpms or so. Not only is the need for such speed reduced by the larger drum diameter allowing same extraction at lower speeds, but there is a great danger of having large to uber sized machines spinning at very high speeds.

Contrary to popular belief once you get above a certain weight class for commercial H-axis washers most are soft mounted, not hard. This is because of the forces generated during extraction are transmitted down though the machine to the floors and throughout the building. With a hard-mount it is said you can stand anywhere in a building and tell when machines are spinning. Indeed at local laundromat when the 50lb SQ coin-op machines are spinning a large and unbalanced load you can feel the vibrations even when standing several feet away.

Extractors made sense first back in the day when washers did just that, washed and rinsed. You moved laundry to another machine (the extractor) to remove water. That or used a wringer I suppose.

For Laundromats when top loaders dominated again there was a need for extractors to cut drying time as early units had very low spin speeds. Indeed so did many front loaders.

Today many coin operated and even OPL front loaders have realized the value of high "G-force" extraction so the value of a Bock or similar machine is often nil.



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