Thread Number: 71826  /  Tag: Other Home Products or Autos
Crazy New Discover Card
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Post# 950138   7/26/2017 at 11:58 by KB0NES (Burnsville, MN)        

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Just got a new Discover Card today. I almost chucked it thinking it was one of those false promotional offers! Looks like they have finally thrown the idea of manual imprinting out the window.

Now, pretty please get rid of the DAMN magnetic stripe ASAP!!!

PS I dare anyone to read my chip from the photo lol

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Post# 950139 , Reply# 1   7/26/2017 at 12:06 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        

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How will the retailer know who is using the card?
No name on it.


Post# 950140 , Reply# 2   7/26/2017 at 12:08 by ea56 (Sonoma Co.,CA)        

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My Discover card has been like this for almost 18 mo., the acct. number and cardholder name is on the back.

Post# 950141 , Reply# 3   7/26/2017 at 12:09 by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Name and othe data on the other side is my guess having similar cards.

Post# 950142 , Reply# 4   7/26/2017 at 12:19 by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor)        

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My Discover also has the name and acct. number on the back. Now if they could figure out a way to speed up the chip readers. The swipe was so much faster.

Post# 950143 , Reply# 5   7/26/2017 at 12:26 by rp2813 (The Big Blue Bubble)        

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A lot of the chip readers around here have sped up significantly since first introduced.  


On the flip side, there are many small businesses where you still have to swipe the card through.


I also heard a story on NPR recently that reported on the arrival of new more pleasing "remove card" noises instead of the "wrong answer" or "busy signal" sound of the current prompt.

Post# 950147 , Reply# 6   7/26/2017 at 13:23 by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room)        

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My credit card and debit also have account number and name on the back of the card. This means there will be nothing on the front to distract attention from the credit union logo. LOL


These cards have the chips. According to my credit union, the decision to move the number and name to the back were influenced by some new guideline from Visa.


Also my cards no longer have raised numbers. That's not totally surprising, since it's been years since I even saw one of those old mechanical credit card machines that used the carbon paper type slips.

Post# 950148 , Reply# 7   7/26/2017 at 13:24 by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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Yep the info is on the rear in case someone has to manually key the information or make a card not present transaction. This is the first card I have seen like this, but I don't work in retail anymore.

About a year ago I got a notice from my bank that my card was used for a "card present" transaction in Los Angeles. I found this interesting seeing as how my card was in my wallet in my pocket which was in Minnesota at the time!! Apparently I swiped my magnetic strip (likely at a gas pump) where a skimmer read my credentials. These were recorded on a different card which was swiped through a terminal in a Victoria's Secret store in LA. It is high time that the magnetic strips are removed, they are too easy to duplicate. Seems like the processors and banks would be willing to foot the bill, fraud costs them tons as it is.

I was able to make the use of a PIN mandatory on my one card. With this added security measure I shouldn't have to face the possibility of fraudulent activity on that card again. I highly recommend setting up a mandatory PIN if possible.

The photo here is my old card that got skimmed. It was my first chip card and it happened shortly after I received it. I had to dissect it to see the chip inside! You can clearly see the Silicon chip and the individual lead wires that connect out to the front terminal pads. It is encapsulated in a small dot of clear resin sandwiched in the layers of the card itself.

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Post# 950149 , Reply# 8   7/26/2017 at 14:12 by turquoisedude (Ogden & St-Liboire (where??), QC, Canada)        

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Wow... we've had chip cards in Canada for a few years now.  The bank debit cards were the first to go this route to counteract the number of cards that got cloned by doctored ATM machines.  The banks were losing millions, so they picked this solution to reduce fraud losses.  Your PIN is registered in the chip, apparently, so that even if someone can build a duplicate card, it won't work because it will have the wrong combination of account and PIN numbers. 


On a typical card here, you still have your name and account number in relief, as well as a magnetic stripe. 


Also, for most purchases, you simply wave the card.  For purchases greater than $100, however, you have to insert the card and type in the PIN. 

Post# 950150 , Reply# 9   7/26/2017 at 14:23 by RevvinKevin (Between Mickey Mouse & the Queen Mary (So. Cal.)        
Credit card, e-mail and online banking security

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I highly recommend EVERYONE add as many layers of security to your cards, accounts and e-mail as possible!


Nearly a year ago someone hacked into my e-mail and found a link to my online banking, which unfortunately allowed them access.  They went into my e-mail settings and set it so ANY e-mail that came from my bank, went directly into the trash (or junk?) folder.  They then got into my bank account and transferred the majority of the funds out of it!!   Fortunately my banks security and fraud department was paying attention and called me that afternoon to confirm if I made the transfer or not.  FORTUNATELY they were able to trace where the money went (some account in Florida) and get it all back within a week!  WHEW!!!


Like most people I'm sure, I was complacent, or simply didn't think about the possibilities.


Since then I changed both the user names & passwords for email and online banking, making them both much more complex.  IF anyone tries to get into my e-mail with the wrong password, I get an e-mail notifying me.  Also, if I try to log in to e-mail or online baking from device I don't normally use, I get a text with a code I have to enter in order to continue.  This should stop, or at least slow down anyone who tries to get into my accounts. 


I also contacted my credit card providers and set up notifications so anytime there's a charge over a specified amount, in this case $0.50 on either of my cards, I'll get both a text & e-mail letting me know a charge is being processed on that card and for how much.  This way I know instantly and if I didn't authorize the charge, I can immediately contact credit card security to let them know, rather than when my statement arrives weeks later.


The one thing I don't like (but have never had a problem with) is some(?) many(?) credit cards have the proximity chip(?) so at certain businesses you only need to wave your card (or wallet or purse) by a sensor to complete your transaction.  Of course many of the high tech thieves have a scanner where they only need to get within 12-14 inches of your card, where ever it may be, and they suddenly have everything they need to make charges on your card.  I'm guessing that's what Phil referred to as being "skimmed" above.   



Post# 950152 , Reply# 10   7/26/2017 at 14:30 by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room)        
Wow... we've had chip cards in Canada for a few years no

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US technology has apparently lagged.


I recall one incident when there was some problem with accounts getting compromised. It hit major media, and some experts commented that we should expect more such stories. Our system was hopelessly behind the times compared to other countries... And so criminals looking to go shopping using someone else's credit card account would likely head to a country where the system was easier to compromise...


So far, I haven't seen any "wave the card" systems...but then I use my cards at a very limited number of stores. It's always insert the card into the reader.

Post# 950154 , Reply# 11   7/26/2017 at 15:27 by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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Kevin, the skimmers are reading the magnetic stripe on the card. They are most often installed on non-attended card readers such as those on gas pumps or independent ATM's. They actually just read the info and save it into a file. The number can then simply be recorded onto a different card for use. This is one of the reasons why some retailers will actually look at the stamped number on the card after swiping to see that it matches the last 4 of the mag stripe data.

The RFID or proximity cards are few and far between here in the US from what I have seen. People get all wigged out about these because they can be read remotely leading to profiteers selling all kinds of RFID protecting wallets and sleeves. If you card is remotely readable it will clearly state it is, most here in the states aren't. In any case you are way more likely to be compromised with a mag stripe skimmer then an RFID reader. ApplePay and other electronic proximity payment systems are MUCH more secure and have basically leap-frogged the RFID credit cards.

The electronically read chip in the card is a good system because when it is read the retailers system has to use your card's data to get a single use 'token' from the bank. Even if had the data in the chip it can't be replicated for a future transaction. The chip system works well, although it is a couple seconds slower.

The bad part with the chip read cards is they still can't stop lost or stolen card fraud. Anyone that has your card can insert it and use it (we all know most retailers don't check ID etc.). So in this regard the chip is no better then the mag stripe. Add the required PIN and the two-factor authentication makes the card nearly fraud proof.

I agree with Kevin with signing up for text notifications, it is a great way to stay on top what is happening with your accounts!!

Post# 950157 , Reply# 12   7/26/2017 at 16:19 by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

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Both our debit cards and credit cards have chips in them but also require a 4 digit pin number to be used.

Post# 950225 , Reply# 13   7/27/2017 at 06:33 by Rolls_rapide (Scotland, UK)        

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Our cards have the magnetic strip, and the chip + PIN, and the built in RFID aerial.

I am not a fan of contactless. There were some cases of London buses debiting money from the wrong card in peoples bags and wallets. Similarly, there was a case of a woman customer shopping in a department store (possibly Marks & Spencer), and the wrong card in her purse/wallet was accessed.

Furthermore, I would never even DREAM of paying by waving an iPhone over a terminal. That's just asking for trouble.

Post# 950405 , Reply# 14   7/28/2017 at 02:42 by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

I'm addicted to technology. I use contactless for everything, both on my Samsung Galaxy S8+ Smartphone or the Samsung Gear S3 Frontier Smartwatch.

The only issue I have, sometimes is that Samsung's security system goes off and it's a PITA to turn off, other than that, never had an issue, except Wells Fargo always trying to make a "mistake to steal my money.

Post# 950798 , Reply# 15   7/30/2017 at 14:45 by fan-of-fans (Florida)        

My banks have all sent me the new cards with the chips on them. The chips must have been around longer though, I remember reading about credit cards years ago having a chip in them, and I always thought the magnetic strip had a chip inside, but I was wrong!

So far only one gas station here has the chip reading gas pumps, and I have had a difficult time figuring out how the card is supposed to go in, it's really not clear from the symbols on there.

One station here used to have lots of problems with the scammers on their pumps to where they had to issue their own gas cards that you could use instead if you wanted to. I stopped going to that station because of it, but I think it has since stopped.

Post# 950801 , Reply# 16   7/30/2017 at 15:05 by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden)        

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I had a series of fraudulent transactions on my old American Express/Costco card. Amex alerted me via email to suspect transactions, and in each case I determined they were not legit. I suspect a local Valero gas station was the culprit: Contrary to my usual practice, I went in and handed them my card and went out to pump gas. When I came back in there was an unusual delay in getting my card back - it was no longer at the front counter by someone in back was fooling with it. It was a few weeks after that I started getting the bad transactions.

As I recall Amex issued a new card, and within a year Costco switched to Visa and I let the Amex account wither on the vine.

On the rare occasion where I find myself at the suspect gas station again, I use cash at one of the kiosks instead of plastic. Usually it's when I'm in too much of a hurry to drive out to Costco to use their pumps, which is not very often. I have never confronted the gas station with my suspicions... I figure it wouldn't do any good anyway.

Post# 950816 , Reply# 17   7/30/2017 at 18:02 by KB0NES (Burnsville, MN)        

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Just stopped at a gas station the other day and I saw they have a holographic sticker over the card reader to try to inspire confidence that it hasn't been hacked.

The mag strip on my most used hard has been getting finicky, makes me more aware of how many places are still swiping cards. I also have been noticing how carelessly some employees handle the card. It is time to do away with the mag stripe!

I think I will look into starting to use Apple Pay but I like my 2% cash back of the current card I use. Perhaps I can pay Apple with the card and get the increased security with my 2% still.

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Post# 950818 , Reply# 18   7/30/2017 at 18:14 by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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A couple convenience gas stations here have had pump scanners hacked recently.  One is a restaurant/store on the freeway, which is a prime location for hacking when unattended.  The store I use is in town, brightly-lit, open/attended 24/7, and frequented by local police so hopefully is more secure.

Post# 950848 , Reply# 19   7/30/2017 at 23:35 by earthling177 (Boston, MA)        


Please forgive me the stupid question, but did you try to add the card you use and like (w/ cash back) to the iPhone (ApplePay)? Is there any reason why it shouldn't work, say the bank and Apple do not have an agreement?

I have several of my cards on the iPhone and flip among them according to use, but I don't have a cash back card yet. I'm using ApplePay more and more, my goal is to only use a physical card in places that do not accept ApplePay.

It's true that the chip makes the card more resistant to cloning, but it's not foolproof. If what I heard is true, one of the reasons that acceptance of the chip has been slow in US is that the banks in some countries thought the chip was so safe that they removed the protections we take for granted in case of card theft (because you were supposed to type a PIN) and they took their sweet time to acknowledge that it was possible (although hard) to commit fraud with the new cards. Naturally, people in US complained we didn't care *what* technology they use, we do not want to have to pay more than 50 bucks in case of fraud or theft, just like we're used to. For now it seems that the banks have caved and preserved the protections.

I figure it doesn't hurt to add another layer and have phones use tokens for each transaction. Not every business is a fan, but I've been using the ones that let me pay with the phone more often than the others. It's my way to rebel against a system that mostly doesn't care about the users, only the investors. ;-)

   -- Paulo.

Post# 950954 , Reply# 20   7/31/2017 at 19:31 by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

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In April I drove to Kansas City, MO. The car was running low on fuel so I stopped at the first gas station (don't remember the name) I came across in MI. I inserted my credit card with chip into the fuel pump and it would not recognize the card. I went inside the small store and the clerk told me that their pumps were not equipped to handle credit cards with chip. In order to get gas I either had to pay up front for a specific dollar amount or if I wanted to fill the tank not knowing what the amount would be, I would have to leave my driver's license with her, she would turn on the pump so I could fill the tank and then go back inside and pay with my credit card inside where the credit card machine was capable of handling a chip card. The car needed fuel so that's what I had to do.

I also came across gas pumps that required me to enter my zip code. I am from Canada...we don't have zip codes...we use Postal Codes which are in the format there is no way to enter that into the pump. Good thing I had called my credit card company before I left Canada to tell them that I was going on a trip to the USA. They warned me that I might come across fuel pumps requiring a zip code and told me to enter 00 and then the 3 numeric digits from my postal code. Fortunately this fake zip code worked.


Post# 950956 , Reply# 21   7/31/2017 at 19:43 by iej (Ireland)        
In Europe for quite a while (25 years in France)

Chip and PIN was a European, initially French, project rolled out as globally accepted standard called EMV.

They've been in use in European countries for well over a decade in the EMV format and they've been in France since 1992!

And yeah, I've has the same problem in the US with Irish credit cards.
The postal codes here are A12 A1A2 format (unique code for every address)
In theory, just my postal code should be able to get me. It certainly will find me on Google Maps or when ordering a pizza.

Post# 950957 , Reply# 22   7/31/2017 at 20:12 by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor)        

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No way I give my zip code away, like a Social Security number or enter anything else as its NONE of their business. Take my Discover swipe and charge me for it or loose my business. Period. I monitor every transaction so there is never problems.

Post# 951106 , Reply# 23   8/1/2017 at 14:00 by iej (Ireland)        

It just works by simply sticking your card in and entering your PIN. Or, for small transactions by contactless, or by Apple Pay / Android Pay with your fingerprint etc

You don't have to verify anything with personal information.

Increasingly the card reader does not require the whole card in. Just stuck in the top 1/3 of the card.

Post# 951126 , Reply# 24   8/1/2017 at 15:10 by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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I love the processors that ask for my ZipCode, I'd gladly give them that extra tidbit of info to help prevent fraud. This is another trick to help beat the magnetic stripe skimmers. Sure you can copy the magnetic data but you probably don't have the ZipCode so if all processors required it fraud would plummet.

Of course adding the PIN to the card is even better since a ZipCode could be guessed from the location where the card data was skimmed initially.

Post# 951162 , Reply# 25   8/1/2017 at 18:40 by turquoisedude (Ogden & St-Liboire (where??), QC, Canada)        
Canadian 'zip code'

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Gary, thanks for that tip!  I have run across this a few times myself - at first I entered the zip code of my PO Box in Vermont but after a while that stopped working.  I guess there is a tie-in to the card information and the billing address of the cardholder.  

Post# 951164 , Reply# 26   8/1/2017 at 19:05 by Rolls_rapide (Scotland, UK)        

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Our postcodes are in the form of 'AB12 3CD'. Several houses share the postcode, differentiated by house number or name.

Post# 951172 , Reply# 27   8/1/2017 at 21:11 by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

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You're welcome Paul!

Post# 960655 , Reply# 28   10/4/2017 at 20:42 by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

One thing i noticed.....

I use Samsung Pay and several places they say "sorry, we don't have the reader".

Then I say "May I try? AFAIK it doesn't need an specific hardware."

Only to have the clerk looking at me amazed... and saying "Wow, your watch is cool! how can you do that? My manager told me this Apple thing doesn't work with our system because our hardware is too obsolete".

Darling, it's not Apple. It's something that was made to work, not to pretend it is cool. That's the difference between Apple and Samsung.

(Running before Kevin picks his machete... LOL)

Post# 960660 , Reply# 29   10/4/2017 at 21:20 by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        

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Apple Rules---- Samsung Explodes or catches fire, LOL

Post# 960669 , Reply# 30   10/4/2017 at 22:48 by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

I knew somebody would say something like that... hahahaha

Post# 961043 , Reply# 31   10/7/2017 at 01:58 by fan-of-fans (Florida)        

All of the gas stations here require zip codes to be entered if you pay at the pump.

As far as paying at a store or restaurant I'm not sure what the maximum dollar amount is before a signature is required. However, Goodwill has ALWAYS required a signature if I pay by card, even if the purchase is only a few dollars.

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