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Post# 950356   7/27/2017 at 18:57 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

Our older Kenmore Elite dryer keeps blowing the thermal fuse. I have taken apart and reset fuse (slam into floor) 10 times in the past two months. Done with it. Will try and make it to Labor Day (for sales) and then pulling the trigger on something new. Maybe something like...

SQ FL w/matching dryer (something like AFNE9BSP113TW01)
LG FL w/matching dryer (something like the WM4370HWA)

Heater vs no heater, built to last forever vs 8 yr disposable, new school vs old school, etc, etc. Need help deciding. My wife already said she didn't care...just "pick the best". As if it's that easy! I do have a tendency to overthink things, so any advice to steer me in right direction is much appreciated.








Post# 950389 , Reply# 1   7/27/2017 at 22:48 by MattL (Flushing, MI)        

I'm sure the Sq chorus will start soon, but I'd be hard pressed to justify buying a SQ.  I've been quite happy with my Duets, and if I was buying today it'd be LG.  I think it has the best bang for the buck.


Post# 950392 , Reply# 2   7/27/2017 at 23:17 by washerdude (Canada )        
Wash Performance Wise

I'll let you decide!

I'm surprised how long the SQ took when all along I thought one of the things SQ was boosted for was quick cycles.

SQ Front Load (Normal Cycle):



LG Front Load (Normal Cycle):




One thing I will state is make sure, if you choose to go the LG route, you pick a model with TurboWash.


Post# 950416 , Reply# 3   7/28/2017 at 05:05 by brucelucenta ()        
On another note

Do you know what might be possibly making the thermal fuse go out? I have bypassed these before and never had another issue. You might consider that unless you just want to buy new ones. As far as what to get, I personally have a set of Kenmore Elite's made by LG. The front load washer holds a tremendous load and dryer also. The run time is much longer for the washer, but the results are far better than I have ever experienced before. It has the "steam treat" options for both. I have heard different members here rave on and on about speed queen lasting 30 years, but have seen no evidence of that or any indication that they are far superior to anything else out there. In fact there have been members here who have had significant problems with both the front load and top load speed queen washers. They also have a somewhat smaller capacity too. So I think it is really just the luck of the draw mostly. I would at least look at what consumer reports says about reliability and try to go with a brand that is in the upper region of the ratings. I feel lucky so far with the machines I have and have been very pleased with them. They are over 4 years old now with no issues and are used several times a week. Good luck with your decision.



This post was last edited 07/28/2017 at 04:21
Post# 950420 , Reply# 4   7/28/2017 at 05:33 by Easyspindry (Winston-Salem, NC)        
People who have LG . . .

. . . seem to be very pleased with them.

At the Beltsville convention this past August, I came home with a SQ FL. I love it!!! The capacity is great. I don't hear it unless I'm standing there watching it. Years ago I had a Duet set. When the washer went into the final spin, it could be heard next door. This SQ does the fast spin and, if I am in another room, I don't hear a peep out of it. It cleans beautifully. I am very pleased with my purchase.

The regular wash cycle takes 50 minutes which includes wash and 2 rinses. The controls are easy to use and one can get 3 or 4 rinses out of a cycle if needed.

Good luck with your choice.

Jerry Gay


Post# 950421 , Reply# 5   7/28/2017 at 05:43 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture
Another winner you might consider: The Maytag Maxima series. I had the 8100 pair and absolutely loved them. Excellent washing performance, internal heater, steam feature for stain removal, sanitize cycle for boosted wash temps when washing heavily stained kitchen whites. 4.5 cu. ft. capacity in a 27" wide cabinet. Model 5500 (also with internal water heater, steam and sanitize features) can be found for around $800 and receives a rating of Excellent by Consumer Reports. Mine were on pedestals. Loading and unloading was incredibly easy. Really liked the styling, as well; especially in the gray color. (See photo)

I sold the pair with my house (too deep for current installation in apartment) and spent some time looking into SQ.

If you're looking for longterm durability and ease of service, SQ is your machine. While it lacks an internal heater, it has great options like soak, prewash and up to 4 extra rinses. The washer would sit about 6 inches from my water heater, so I wasn't worried about unintended cold fills.

Ultimately, I went with a SQ top-loader in my situation, but may replace it with a SQ front-loader at some point in the future. I prefer a FL format, but cost and a couple of other factors came into play.

I used to steer friends toward LG (all of whom are happy with them) but I think the Maytag Maxima series is the gold standard in performance and features. If you're looking for something that will last 25 years and is easily serviced, SQ is hard to beat.

Good luck with your purchase, but definitely check out the Maytag Maxima series.





Post# 950444 , Reply# 6   7/28/2017 at 11:11 by golittlesport (California)        
recommend a heater

I would recommend a machine that will heat the water, unless you only wash in luke-warm or cold water. Front loaders don't use enough water to clear the line of cold water before hot water enters the drum, resulting in warm water when you select "hot."

On my old front loader (Frigidaire) without a heater, I'd fill the machine on the "hot" setting, then pause and drain the tub. This would purge the water line of cold water. I'd still only get water as hot as the water heater was set. If your water heater is not next to the washing machine, you may have to do this routine more than once to get a hot water wash. PITA

I like the option of the machine heating the water to deep clean whites and sanitize when needed. Would you want a dishwasher that didn't heat the water?

That's just my opinion, but I would not want a machine that didn't heat the water, especially a front loader.

That rant over, I'll share that I now have an LG front loader with turbo wash and LOVE it. I know SQ is said to be well-built, but the lack of a water heater disqualifies it in my book. As far as longevity, you could buy two LG's for about the same price as one SQ, so you'd spend the same amount of money over time.

Good luck either way.


Post# 950686 , Reply# 7   7/29/2017 at 20:26 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

Thanks for all the info and suggestions. For LG fans, which model do you normally recommend....3000 series (WM3770HWA), 4000 series (WM4370HWA), or 5000 (WM5000HWA).

I'll have to do some reading/googling on the Maxima.

And the SQ front loader still definitely in the running, but no heater does gives me pause....as our water heater is on the other side of the house from the washer.

@Bruce...how do you bypass the fuse? Any change of fire...as our washer is right next to our 20 month old's room??? Thanks.


Post# 950749 , Reply# 8   7/30/2017 at 08:11 by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

Have you checked the dryer's vent line and blower housing? If either is suffering from lint buildup, your thermal fuse could be trying to save you from a dryer vent fire or it could just be bad. If you use dryer sheets, the blower and lint screen could be caked with greasy lint to the point where the lint screen is almost as waterproof as a submarine. It sounds like you want a new matching set. Nothing wrong with that, but would definitely recommend a heater in a front loader unless your water heater is set at a minimum of 140F, positioned very close to the washer and you are willing to or have the ability to purge the lines of cold water before you start the machine.


Post# 950763 , Reply# 9   7/30/2017 at 09:26 by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

I still purge nearby lines of cold water even though mine has a heater. 


Post# 950768 , Reply# 10   7/30/2017 at 10:10 by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

Nothing wrong with efficiency in the use of energy, right?


Post# 950770 , Reply# 11   7/30/2017 at 10:35 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

@tomturbo

I love to save money, and have done all I know to do save the dryer. I have taken the dryer almost completely apart, checked and cleaned spotless. Dryer in middle of house, and had a somewhat long venting run to a soffit vent. I had an excellent handy man run a brand new venting run shorter and straight up and out the roof. Still, the thermal fuse continues to randomly blow every week.

I thought of making do with an older used dryer for now. But almost to the point where I do not want to have any repairs on a washer/dryer for some time....and that has led me to consider a new matching set.


Post# 950771 , Reply# 12   7/30/2017 at 10:40 by brucelucenta ()        
fuse

Well, I was making an assumption that you were talking about the fuse that is on the back of the dryer in the area that there are thermostats also. I have bypassed these many times before and had no issue at all. The dryer already has several different thermostats to control the heat. There is an operating thermostat and a high limit thermostat also. The ONLY way you might have a problem is if BOTH of those failed and then the heating element would run as long as the dryer was running. I personally have never seen an electric dryer catch on fire before. I have however seen gas dryers catch on fire from a failed gas valve that did not shut off or from a lot of lint build up around the dryer and vent. I suppose that is possible with an electric, but I have not personally seen it before. To me the thermal fuse seems to be just another of many "safeguards" that are made with the intention of something else to go out and encourage the owner to buy a new dryer. Since dryers NEVER used to have those until the last couple of decades, I question how necessary they are. combo52 would probably be able to give you much more insight to that since he has been doing it most of his life and still is. Oh, I also agree that the Maytag you were discussing would be a good choice too. My water heater is a ways away from my washer too and with the steam treat option it gets good and hot without worrying about the hot water supply. With a child, I would think that would be invaluable to you for getting things nice and clean.

Post# 950775 , Reply# 13   7/30/2017 at 11:16 by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture
 
Thermal fuses by definition are not resetable when they blow, they must be replaced.  The part of question may be a thermostat, not a fuse, if it works again (temporarily) after whacking it on the floor, as you say.  Have you considered replacing the offending part instead of whacking it?


Post# 950796 , Reply# 14   7/30/2017 at 14:29 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

Well, now I'm not sure :( On the Kenmore Elite, it is the third one back (see pic). Also, I did buy a new one after breaking off a prong during a "reset". It is the silver one on the eBay link.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-280148-W...


  View Full Size
Post# 950873 , Reply# 15   7/31/2017 at 06:01 by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

Roof vents usually have a mesh or hardware cloth type grid to prevent animals from entering and they clog regularly. Friends in FL had them and the dryers would begin to take FOREVER and they knew that was a sign to clean the roof vent grid.  Once one of these things have tripped a time or two, the overheating weakens them and they trip more easily.


Post# 950884 , Reply# 16   7/31/2017 at 08:45 by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture
 
Rubaducky, one of those is a non-resetable thermal fuse, the other is a high-limit thermostat.  The thermostat trips if airflow through the element is obstructed, resets when it cools.  The fuse functions as a failsafe for the thermostat and blows if the thermostat fails, or if the element shorts to ground and doesn't stop heating.  The proper replacement "kit" includes both on the premise that the thermostat may be bad if the fuse blows.  The dryer usually will still run if this fuse blows but it won't heat.

Air temperature in the drum is controlled by a thermostat on the blower housing, and another thermal fuse probably is there.  The dryer usually goes dead if this other fuse blows.


Post# 950906 , Reply# 17   7/31/2017 at 11:24 by golittlesport (California)        
LG model

I have the LG 3570. I chose it for the turbo wash and steam features. The turbo wash recirculates the water during wash and deep rinses via two spray jets. It also features a spin spray rinse which is rare in a front loader. The steam feature heats the wash water to about 150 degrees to sanitize and deep clean.

  View Full Size
Post# 950913 , Reply# 18   7/31/2017 at 12:10 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

@DADoES -- Just so I understand, which one is the thermal fuse? I am referencing the fuse at the top of the picture (or the left silver one of the ebay link).

The item at top of pic (third from bottom) is the one that keeps tripping, and dryer stops heating. I "reset it" by throwing on floor....continuity returns, confirmed by multimeter...and dryer is good to go until it trips again.

While drying, I have check air temps directly out the back of dryer (with a Thermapen)...and the temps are spot on in normal range. The vents are new and clean.

So are you saying I should replace the thermostat...as it could be causing the thermal fuse to trip? Or maybe the appliance has something sagging somewhere...and is shorting out?? Appreciate any advice...as I have worked on a solution for this for quite some time.


Post# 950936 , Reply# 19   7/31/2017 at 15:18 by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture
 
Yes, the third "silver" piece is the thermal fuse.

The internal fuse linkage basically melts when it blows (at 352°F).  This business about slamming it to the floor for a reset blow my mind.  I suppose a sharp impact could make the melted ends of the linkage touch but it can't possibly function properly.

The high limit thermostat triggers at 295°F, resets when it drops by 80°F (I think). Thus, the high limit thermostat normally prevents the element from getting too hot, if airflow is obstructed or for whatever reason.  The thermal fuse doesn't come into play unless the high limit thermostat fails to shut off the element at the "normal" overheat point.


Post# 950987 , Reply# 20   7/31/2017 at 21:51 by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
TF Keeps Triping On A 27" WP Built Dryer

combo52's profile picture

Yes you must replace the TF if it trips, and replacing the hi-limit heater box thromostat is a good idea as well.

 

I would also take the heater element out of its can and see if the center plate is cracked or badly warped, if so the element may be shorting to the can and this will trip the TF.


Post# 950989 , Reply# 21   7/31/2017 at 21:59 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

LOL...well, I've been slamming it into the floor for months (7 times total). Continuity comes right back. Runs fine for about two weeks, then trips again. At first though vent clogged, then thought my wife perhaps opening the dryer door to check clothes was the culprit. But now, not sure what was/is the cause.

Anyway, as I said, on the last "reset", broke off a prong, so ordered a new one (eBay link). New one has been in place for about 4 days, and is running fine. Maybe I should wait and make sure the new fuse didn't fix my problem?

Man, keep reading Frigilux's thread. Maybe should just get the old tried and true top loading SQueen set!?


Post# 950992 , Reply# 22   7/31/2017 at 22:30 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

@Combo. Posted reply #21 as you were posting. Thanks for the suggestions. Will take another look inside and see if any cracks, etc.

Post# 951017 , Reply# 23   8/1/2017 at 05:42 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture

Bill-- I've been reading your thread, too, mostly because your fix for the referenced dryer part was to slam it on the floor. Now that's ingenuity! 👏 

 

Anyway, if you are considering a Speed Queen purchase, I'd definitely go for the front-loader rather than the TL.  John (combo52) and The Other Eugene® (Lorainfurniture) give it their stamp of approval for reliability and (when needed) ease of service.  The reason I chose the top-loader had to do with the depth of the machine (only 28") and, primarily, the potential for noisy spins when a FL is installed on a wood floor.  I've been a staunch proponent of the FL format since 1987.  A revolving door of top-loaders (KitchenAid, Frigidaire, Frigidaire Immersion Care, SQ AWN542) also graced my laundry room as second machines for fun, but the daily driver was always a front-loader.

 

A GE front-load pair sits next to the SQs in the common laundry area and I've heard it in action a couple of times.  The owner always chooses the lowest spin speed, so it hasn't caused much of an uproar, but it's definitely louder during spins than my SQ TL.  Having said that, a FL SQ is probably in my future. The lack of an internal water heater---always a deal breaker for me in the past---is a moot point as the washer is, literally, connected to the hot water pipe leading out of the gas water heater. Water entering the washer is 150 degrees instantly. The SQ FL is only a bit deeper than the TL, so it shouldn't cramp the narrow passageway through the laundry area shown in the other thread.

 

If depth wasn't such an issue and if overhead cabinets didn't preclude putting them on pedestals, I'd get a Maytag Maxima 8200 set in a heartbeat. But since I already have a SQ dryer, superhot water is literally only a couple of inches away, and machine's depth (30-1/2") is acceptable, it only makes sense to go with a rear-control SQ FL...when the time comes.

 

 




This post was last edited 08/01/2017 at 06:17
Post# 951018 , Reply# 24   8/1/2017 at 05:54 by brucelucenta ()        
Rubaducky

Now that I see what thermostat you are having to reset, it seems to me that you are having some kind of air flow problem causing this to kick off the thermostatic protector. Before going to the expense of buying new machines, try cleaning every bit of lint and build up from your dryer and the duct work that goes outside. It would almost HAVE to be restricted in some way for that to keep happening. Even if it is restricted partially it can cause this to happen. 99% of the time when a dryer is either slow in drying or has this kind of issue, it is because of air flow restriction. The type of dryer you have really is the best kind of dryer ever made.

Post# 951089 , Reply# 25   8/1/2017 at 12:38 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

@Frigilux. Thanks. Will definitely lean heavily toward the front loader side. Also, plan to research the maxima when time permits.

@Bruce. We purchased a new house last year and dryer was left in house. Can't speak to how it was maintained. I will say badly...as I removed 70 coins from the dryer during my first cleaning (sigh). But now, vent is new and clear. Dryer is spotless (no lint or buildup). Something must be shorting it out? I will check again probably this weekend, per combo's suggestions.

Thanks.


Post# 951099 , Reply# 26   8/1/2017 at 13:14 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

@Frigilux. Just curious, why hands down the maxima over top of line LG, or even the SQ FL....since your water heater connection makes the SQ lack of heater a nonissue? Thanks.

Post# 951100 , Reply# 27   8/1/2017 at 13:33 by brucelucenta ()        

Well, you didn't really ask me, but I will tell you anyway. Consumer reports does rate LG top in the way of reliability for front loaders. But that is not to say that the Whirlpool made Maytag front loader might not be better. They are good machines these days too. I tend to go with whatever I get the best deal on myself. As far as the dryer, it sounds like something is wrong with it, just don't know exactly what. From the symptoms it sounded like a blockage of air flow.

Post# 951161 , Reply# 28   8/1/2017 at 18:37 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture
Why I'm a fan of the Maytag Maxima (model 8200 replaces 8100):

1) Capacity: 4.5 cu. ft. drum in a standard 27" wide footprint. Best bang for your footprint dollar.

2) Steam option boosts stain removal for large loads of heavily-stained kitchen whites.

3) 'Profile wash' when using Sanitize cycle. Water is gradually heated from warm to very hot, optimizing stain removal. Less prone to set protein-based stains than filling washer with very hot water right off the bat.

4) Very effective Power Wash cycle cleans the spots off a leopard.

5) Very effective Cold Wash cycle that mimics a vintage Kelvinator's 'Magic Minute.'

6) Quiet operation even at 1400 rpm spin speed (Note: New 8200 model has 1200 rpm max. spin speed.)

7) Automatically doses detergent (via refillable cartridge) tailored to water hardness, cycle, soil level selection.

8) Interior light on model 8100/8200 makes watching a well-lit event!

9) Styling. Love, love, love the look of the Maxima in dark gray color. No spongy control pads to press. Control panel is solid. A light touch against a solid surface activates selection.




Post# 951399 , Reply# 29   8/3/2017 at 07:34 by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        

mark_wpduet's profile picture
What is the magic minute on the Kelvinator?
Also, doesn't the TOL Maxima have recirculation, while the model/s below don't?


Post# 951403 , Reply# 30   8/3/2017 at 08:28 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture

1. Kelvinator's Magic Minute: The tub filled about 2/3 full and began its concentric agitation for a minute or so; agitation continued as the tub finished filling. The rationale was that detergent was more concentrated during the Magic Minute and helped remove stains. I don't really buy it, but it was a selling point for the company. The concentration of detergent in today's HE washers (especially front-loaders) is far greater for the entire wash portion of the cycle.  

 

Maytag's Cold Wash cycle wets the clothing with a spray of detergent-laden water.  Then it tumbles at varying speeds, sometimes fast enough to plaster the load to the sides of the drum, essentially pulling the super-concentrated detergent through fibers.  The rest of the water and (some additional detergent) is added after about 15 minutes and the cycle continues.  I found cleaning very effective---but I'm not one to wash everything in cold.

 




 

2.  No Maytag has recirculation, as did my TOL 2010 Frigidaire.  Water for the wash and 1st rinse is sprayed in a fan-like formation if you use the auto-dosing detergent cartridge.  It looks like recirculation in photos, but it is not.




This post was last edited 08/03/2017 at 09:39
Post# 951404 , Reply# 31   8/3/2017 at 08:29 by henene4 (Germany)        

The Kelvinator washed with all detergent, yet half load of water for the first minute or two, and then filled to the max level. Same principal as F&Ps Eco Active wash, or the pretreatment stage on some WP HE TLs.

And no, no current WP build FL has a true recirculation system. The machines with the automatic dispensing have a spray nozzle that sprays the detergent water mixture directly onto the load while filling, but that really is just water line pressure.


Post# 951427 , Reply# 32   8/3/2017 at 11:59 by brucelucenta ()        
LG

But LG has re circulation on the heavy duty cycle.

Post# 951445 , Reply# 33   8/3/2017 at 14:35 by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
LG has recirculation

mark_wpduet's profile picture
on almost all cycles if turbo wash is on.....from what I gather....and it also does a legit spray rinse....
I swear I thought the TOL Maxima had re-circulation based on the pictures. Good to know it doesn't.....The cold wash cycle you described sounds similar to the way the rinses work on my duet....after each spin, the washer slows but keeps a slow spin as it fills pulling water through the clothes and sloshing it all over while the clothes are still plastered to the drum. I think it REALLY helps with rinsing. Even though I don't like using COLD either, I'll bet it's a cool cycle to watch.
I'm personally still so torn on getting an LG with turbowash or a Maxima when my washer dies. I may get the Maxima simply because it will fit my old school duet pedestals..


Post# 951497 , Reply# 34   8/3/2017 at 21:22 by Rubaducky (Texas)        

Thanks for all the well-expressed explanations and replies.

My new thermal fuse tripped again today. Made it five days. Wife was doing a mid-sized load of towels. Could more weight (towels) cause the drum to "sag", maybe causing the drum/tub to touch something that is tripping the fuse?

Anyway, back to the to old "slam it into the concrete floor" and we're up and running again. Hoping to make it to Labor Day...and catch some good sales. Mark's post got me thinking if the pedestals on my Kenmore Elites will fit the Maytag Maximas?


Post# 951584 , Reply# 35   8/4/2017 at 13:00 by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
they might

mark_wpduet's profile picture
I had much trouble finding this out...and I still don't know for sure because of the different answers I got...Calling Whirlpool, giving them details on my machine....one person said no, the next 2 said yes....they linked me to the pedestals and they look exactly like mine in the picture - they even asked me if those looked like the ones on my current duet.....At any rate, I'm semi-confident my 2005 pedestals will fit current WP or Maytag FL's.

As for Kenmore - who knows? I know WP makes Kenmore (or they used to), I think its LG now. But Kenmore likes to to design changes so who knows.

At any rate - pedestals are a huge expense but they are so nice to have. It would be a major waste if they did not fit and if they don't, I'm not so sure I would buy more.....because I don't think a FL washer sitting on the floor is any worse than a regular dryer...they are at the same level, but people seem to complain about bending down to unload the washer, yet that was never EVER a problem with a dryer - but it's the same thing.


Post# 951593 , Reply# 36   8/4/2017 at 14:41 by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        
Mark

iheartmaytag's profile picture

I am fairly sure the pedestals will fit the newer models.  All you really need is the size (footprint) and the leg mounts to match up.

 

Where you will notice they are from a different version is the styling is slightly different, so you may not have  chrome stripe where the newer pedestals would have.

 

And you are correct about them being an expense.  I paid $250 each for mine, but I got a $400 rebate card back, so I figured they only cost me $100 in the end.





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