Thread Number: 73107  /  Tag: Recipes, Cooking Accessories
Non-Stick Skillet
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Post# 965676   11/2/2017 at 21:13 by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Having become thoroughly miffed at the typical non-stick skillet offerings (coatings nick and flake even when used only with a wooden spoon and handwashing, thin material warps under heat, etc.), I splurged this afternoon on a Zwilling J.A. Henckels Spirit-line stainless steel ceramic-coated 12" specimen, bought at a local kitchen products store.  They also carry Swiss Diamond but I was leery of the shallow profile.

Anyone have comments and/or first-hand experience with Zwilling Spirit?  It's labeled dishwasher safe but does it really hold up well?  The salesgirl advised/agreed handwashing is less risk.

Post# 965679 , Reply# 1   11/2/2017 at 21:58 by earthling177 (Boston, MA)        

Sorry, no comment on the particular brand you bought because I've got no experience with it whatsoever. By which I mean, of course, pots and pans -- their knives are excellent and I'd expect their other products to be at least as good.

That having been said, I have a few pots/pans by Bialetti (with the "ceramic" non-stick) that specifically say they should not be machine washed, they are about 4 years old and have not been hand washed, always go in the dishwasher and they are OK.

The Circulon pots/pans are a more traditional non-stick and seem to be doing well too, also always washed by machine.

I've noticed that teflon-like materials started lasting longer in my home after the dishwasher detergents dropped chlorine bleach and went with enzymes. No scientific explanation, in fact that is just another anecdotal evidence thing, and until way more research and serious scientific research gets done, we won't know.

The other thing we seem to do differently in my home is we *never* follow the cooking instructions to put an empty pot/pan on the burner to pre-heat for any extended length of time whatsoever.

In our home, if the burner is on, the pot/pan has at least some water, butter or oil in it to limit the temperature the pot can reach and also give some visual indication of how hot it is. I can't understand instructions to preheat for several minutes when less than one minute gets the pots over 400F. Teflon and other non-stick materials get a "continuous duty" of about 400-450F (depending on specific formulas etc) and start to degrade very quickly once it gets to 500-550F. Anyone with one of those "laser" infra-red thermometers can tell you it doesn't take very long for an empty pot to reach those temps and ruin the coating.

Good luck!

Post# 965680 , Reply# 2   11/2/2017 at 21:58 by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor)        

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No, I use my ancient cast iron skillets and none of those new fangled pans. Finish your cooking, fill with hot water, let soak and take a nylon scubbie to it. Nothing peels off and very little ever sticks. Not interested in that loudmouth hawking her copper crap pans, but wait, theres more. I dont think so and I dont want 2 (just pay a handling fee). NOPE

Post# 965693 , Reply# 3   11/2/2017 at 22:49 by norgeway (mocksville n c )        
I think

The OLD ORIGINAL T Fal was superior to all others, I use some of everything, cast iron,aluminum and stainless, but only have a few non stick and only use them for one or 2 things.

Post# 965694 , Reply# 4   11/2/2017 at 22:52 by norgeway (mocksville n c )        
RE ancient cast iron

is the ONLY cast iron, this new Lodge stuff isn't worth carrying home, all mine is old and smooth on the inside, mostly Griswold and Wagner, Lodge is rough on the inside.

Post# 965699 , Reply# 5   11/2/2017 at 23:36 by Dustin92 (Jackson, MI)        

Honestly, if I was going to buy non stick cookware, I'd look at the green/copper/ceramic/flavor of the week/as seen on TV. I've used the green pan nonstick, along with the copper version, and they do work as well as they claim to. NOTHING sticks. Not even eggs with melted cheese. I can't say a lot for durability since I don't own them, but my Grandma has one of the green pans and loves it, it does have some minor scratches but she uses metal utensils. My Girlfriend's Mom has a full set of the copper nonstick and loves them, hers are fairly new though. I don't usually follow the newest and greatest as seen on TV products, but these have some promise, at least the way I see it. I don't particularly care for nonstick otherwise, I tend to use metal utensils without even thinking and have scraped off some pretty good pieces. Or used a mixer to mash potatoes and after mashing thought... Hmm, I don't remember adding black pepper... Give me stainless or aluminum any day.

Post# 965701 , Reply# 6   11/2/2017 at 23:55 by agiflow2 (iselin, nj)        

I just recently purchased several pieces of cookware from All-Clad and two of them are the ceramic nonstick skillets and they have been excellent so far.

Also have a large cast iron skillet that I hardly use simply because it is heavy and unwieldy, but sometimes I want that good sear that cast iron gives. Also love my Le Cruiset Dutch oven. Now that the cooler weather is coming it will get plenty of use.

Post# 965728 , Reply# 7   11/3/2017 at 06:51 by polkanut (Wausau, WI )        

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We have an old GE electric skillet, and a West Bend Country Kettle, both w/ the 1st generation of Teflon.  It's very durable, and cleans up like a dream.  Today's stuff seems to be barely there at all. 

Post# 965747 , Reply# 8   11/3/2017 at 09:16 by panthera (Rocky Mountains)        
The only reliable non-stick

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Is well seasoned cast iron. Everything else, and I do mean everything else is a compromise.

Post# 965753 , Reply# 9   11/3/2017 at 09:33 by vacerator (Macomb, Michigan)        
PTFE coatings

are not for life. Wear, and high heat above 375 f. breaks it down, and I had a T-Fal set in the 90's I out in the dishwasher, and it eventually wore off.
I have not had a ceramic non stick pan yet.
I bought two Calphalon black anodized pans because they were a deep discount. I use silicon tools on them.
I have one stainless steel ordinary Scan Pan from Sur Le Table' made in Denmark for searing, or I use my enameled cast iron dutch oven. Nice gift card from last Christmas.

Post# 965754 , Reply# 10   11/3/2017 at 09:41 by PassatDoc (Orange County, California)        

I have an All-Clad stainless steel omelet pan with non-stick ceramic coating. Performance is superb. I hand wash it, to protect the ceramic coating. Most of my cookware is Cuisinart Stainless Multiclad-Pro and all of it goes in the dishwasher. Multicolor hard water spots, which develop in time when pans are washed in the DW, are easily removed with a wet cloth and Barkeeper's Friend.

I also have two pans from Staub (10" skillet, 12" grill pan) which are cast iron with enamel coating, and the interior of the pans is ceramic. Not as nonstick as the omelet pan, but I season with a bit of oil and ramp up the heat very slowly, as it's cast iron. sometimes the pans require soaking in hot sudsy water after they cool.

Post# 965756 , Reply# 11   11/3/2017 at 09:47 by appnut (TX)        

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I have 2 to 3 pieces of cast iron and use them for searing, frying (which is almost never).  Oth3erwise I have my Cuisinart Multi-Clad Pro, like Jim, which I got last May with my new induction range.  My biggest concern was scrambled eggs.  After researching online I discovered the proper way to scramble eggs with SS.  And it worked.  When I put the eggs on a plate, the pan was almost perfectly clean.  Even I was amazed.  But I use my cast iron skillets for frying turkey burgers, pancakes, grilled cheese sandwiches.   

Post# 965760 , Reply# 12   11/3/2017 at 10:11 by joeypete (Concord, NH)        

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I've not used that brand either. I had a Macy's brand nonstick set for about 6 years and it held up pretty well. Always washed in the dishwasher.

Last Christmas I bought an All Clad 11" stainless nonstick french skillet and it's an awesome pan. Somehow I missed where it said not to put it in the dishwasher (oops). So after a couple of months the nonstick coating was literally peeling off. Being the great company they are, All Clad replaced it free of charge.

Post# 965761 , Reply# 13   11/3/2017 at 10:12 by henene4 (Germany)        
Without knowing that brand

At home, we had a huge 28cm Silit deep pan and a 26cm flatter WMF skillet type pan, both with dark ceramic coatings.

Both were in basicly daily use on a cheap induction cooker from Ikea. Washed by hand with hot soapy water and some concentrated vinegar. Every o so often if something was burned in, we used a DW tablet in them and boiled that up with some water.

The non-stick effect worked pretty damn well on both for something like 3 or 4 years. Then the once shiny surface begann to dull and first the bigger one (which was used more), then the smaller one lost their non-stick propertys.

They are still in use as the coating dosen't flake of like in teflon pans, but you now have to use a considerable amount of oil to keep things from sticking.
Overall really nice pans, but they are not eternal.

Post# 965764 , Reply# 14   11/3/2017 at 10:22 by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        

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I have a few pieces of "throw-away" pans, with non-stick coatings, for eggs,and such. One is a Everware ceramic fry pan. I have had it about 10 years, I do always hand wash, use plastic or wooden utensils and am careful not to overheat.

That pan is just now starting to stick, but only in the middle. I am just aware when I buy a non-stick that it won't be an heirloom, and will more than likely find it's way to the aluminum recycle plant, or break the handle off and it becomes the dog's outdoor water pan after a few years of usage.

I have Calphalon Three ply stainless for my other cooking. I do have some good cast iron, but don't use on my smooth top, but do use it on the induction portable burner. Also can't beat a cast iron skillet for cornbread.

Post# 965768 , Reply# 15   11/3/2017 at 10:43 by ea56 (Sonoma Co.,CA)        

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I have a Cuisinart 10” non stick skillet that I bought at Linens and Things over 20 years ago. I use it primarily for omelets, but I also glaze carrots in it and sauté mushrooms. It sometimes goes in the dishwasher, and the finish looks used, but it isn’t abraded and it still doesn’t stick and makes a great omelet. My other frying pans are a covered 10” Farberware, also 20 years old, a 10” cast iron pan that I inherited when I moved into an apartment in 1972 and the former tenant left it for me, it is the best of all of them and a 12” Lodge cast iron frying pan about 15 yrs old.

My pans are like old friends, I know just what they can and can’t do well and combined they met all my culinary requirements. You don’t have to spend a lot of money to have perfectly fine and functional cookware.

Post# 965769 , Reply# 16   11/3/2017 at 10:44 by ea56 (Sonoma Co.,CA)        

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I have a Cuisinart 10” non stick skillet that I bought at Linens and Things over 20 years ago. I use it primarily for omelets, but I also glaze carrots in it and sauté mushrooms. It sometimes goes in the dishwasher, and the finish looks used, but it isn’t abraded and it still doesn’t stick and makes a great omelet. My other frying pans are a covered 10” Farberware, also 20 years old, a 10” cast iron pan that I inherited when I moved into an apartment in 1972 and the former tenant left it for me, it is the best of all of them and a 12” Lodge cast iron frying pan about 15 yrs old.

My pans are like old friends, I know just what they can and can’t do well and combined they met all my culinary requirements. You don’t have to spend a lot of money to have perfectly fine and functional cookware.

Post# 965771 , Reply# 17   11/3/2017 at 10:49 by firedome (Binghamton NY & Lake Champlain VT)        
IMO there's no point...

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in buying any pricey non-stick pan, no matter the brand they all start to wear out after a couple of years. We buy WINCO commercial non-stick pans in 8", 10" and 12" sizes. Built for commercial use, they perform very well, cost $10-14 each, then get re-cycled when they start to lose their mojo, which all pans will eventually. Otherwise we use our Lustre-Craft (hi-end Wear-Ever, lifetime guarantee) set that we bought in 1971, or occasionally a well seasoned cast iron Wagner pan, but we rarely use that anymore as the non-stick pans work so much better for most tasks.

Post# 965776 , Reply# 18   11/3/2017 at 11:09 by johnrk (Houston)        

The Opti-Cook with the red thermo-spot in the middle. My first one lasted for years and went through the d/w hundreds of times. It never did start losing its coating, but a little less slick than when new, so I replaced it about a year ago. It's the large one for about $65 on Amazon and it has a glass lid and straight, tall sides almost like my old Magnalite chicken fryer (whatever happened to chicken fryer pans?). I have s.s. for the few pots I keep. I own an Instant Pot (I-Pot) which has a s.s. insert and heavy bottom suitable for cooking on my range, and I've deep fried in it on occasion and of course sear in it. Plus, I own a half dozen stovetop pc's sized from 1.5L to 22L, and the two All-American canners which are very suitable for pc-ing very large quantities.

I made a big pan of Velveeta/Ro-Tel cheese dip the other day on the spur of the moment for some unexpected guests for card playing. This big T-Fal is great for that: just dump 3 cans of Ro-Tels in, tear up a big brick of Velveeta in there, and put on low with the glass lid on. Without this, I'd have nuked it all and had to do several rounds with stirring and it'd probably still foam up.

I agree with Pepin, every kitchen needs one non-stick pan for eggs. I really don't like cast iron; the concept of not cleaning with soapy water has never appealed to me, and I prefer my cornbread in an 8x8 Pyrex, with my own fresh-ground cornmeal.

Post# 965777 , Reply# 19   11/3/2017 at 11:16 by Kindalazy (toronto)        

I'm not sure about the U.S. but in Canada we have a product called The Rock (the 2nd pic). It's nonstick, but it's clad onto stainless steel, not a coating so nothing to wear off. It's also good for high heat, but it's only used for eggs, which I've not mastered on the All Clad or Le Crueset, everything else I make on the AC or LC rarely sticks, and when it does, it's my fault for flipping or removing the food before it's ready. The Dutch ovens are fantastic. The larger one weighs more than I do. I also use the dutch ovens for making bread. Calphalon anodized was a HUGE mistake for me. I put them in the dishwasher once, and they developed a haze, a sort of chalky film which never went away.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 3         View Full Size
Post# 965787 , Reply# 20   11/3/2017 at 12:06 by RevvinKevin (Between Mickey Mouse & the Queen Mary (So. Cal.)        
Calphalon hard anodized cookware

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From Calphalon's website (and use & care booklet): Hand wash only – not dishwasher safe. NEVER place cookware in an automatic dishwasher, or use abrasive cleaning pads or cleansers that can damage the pan and void the warranty.

Post# 965793 , Reply# 21   11/3/2017 at 12:34 by Kindalazy (toronto)        

RevvinKevin, thanks, I knew it when I bought the set. It was totally my fault. It was New Years, we had a party, I may have had 1 glass too much of wine. I can't go to bed with a dirty kitchen, in the KitchenAid they went. I learnt a lesson, useless cookware, and a BIG hole in my bank account. I looked at several types of All Clad, and my 1st consideration was it has to into the dishwasher. I wanted the copper set, needless to say... You see what I had to settle on. But I totally LOVE the set I have, take good care of them, and am fortunate to have them.

Post# 965824 , Reply# 22   11/3/2017 at 16:06 by CircleW (NE Cincinnati OH area)        

I have two non-stick pans, one a Vollrath 10" fry pan, and the other a WearEver 5 qt. saucepan. Both are OK, but the fry pan has a few scratches from metal utensils.

Post# 965827 , Reply# 23   11/3/2017 at 16:26 by rp2813 (The Big Blue Bubble)        

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I bought a set of three Henkel non-stick skillets a few years ago because the major selling point was that they're dishwasher safe and BB&B had a really good deal on them.  When I got them home and read the bit of literature that came with them, it did state that they were machine washable, but that to maintain the best appearance they should be hand washed. 


I've pretty much exclusively run all three through the dishwasher since I've had them, and their cooking surfaces look as good as the day I bought them.  Sometimes there will be a bit of hard water spotting, but it's very minimal and wipes right off.


I found one of those "Orgreenic" pans unused with original sticker at a thrift store a while back.  It's good for eggs, but requires plastic utensils, which is no big deal.  However, just nesting it with other pans (with a paper towel to protect it) seems to be enough to remove the non-stick coating from areas near the rim.  Super cheap, and it would already be junk if I used it on a daily basis.


I don't trust any of that copper infomercial stuff and won't entertain a purchase.  Besides, dealing with that square shape for stove-top cooking would drive me crazy.



Post# 965907 , Reply# 24   11/4/2017 at 01:43 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

I have two WearEver Commercial non-stick fry pans that have lasted over 20Yrs.Still use them!If you take care and use proper cleaning and utensils in the pans-they can last DECADES!Same with some AllClad saucepans I have-again 20Yrs old and still going strong!These can last FOREVER with proper use and care!

Post# 965918 , Reply# 25   11/4/2017 at 06:08 by joeypete (Concord, NH)        

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Poor Glenn. This turned into "What nonstick pan do you have?" Post. LOL

Post# 965934 , Reply# 26   11/4/2017 at 07:58 by DaveAMKrayoGuy (Oak Park, MI)        

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Here is my Handy-Dandy, Daily User, Wonder Skillet:

All-Purpose? You bet!

Non-Stick? And how!

-- Dave

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Post# 965947 , Reply# 27   11/4/2017 at 08:45 by vacerator (Macomb, Michigan)        
KindaLazy Toronto,

we have Rock ware here also. Is it Australian marketed? I also keep my cast iron ware in a drawer. Saves lifting from a bottom cabinet.

Above photo is just how PTFE coating wears away.

Post# 965949 , Reply# 28   11/4/2017 at 08:55 by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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I don't have any cast iron pieces.

I used the new pan last night.  Very nice performance.

J.A. Henckels' "Zwilling" brand is supposedly one of the oldest known trademarks, dating to 1731.

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Post# 965977 , Reply# 29   11/4/2017 at 12:39 by brucelucenta (xyz)        

If it can't go in the dishwasher, who needs it?

Post# 965994 , Reply# 30   11/4/2017 at 14:31 by rp2813 (The Big Blue Bubble)        
This turned into "What nonstick pan do you have?"

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No it didn't. 


People have shared their experiences with machine washing cookware that claims it can be.  This is what the OP wanted to know.  Manufacturers may be different, but results should be similar.

Post# 966157 , Reply# 31   11/5/2017 at 09:06 by DaveAMKrayoGuy (Oak Park, MI)        

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Oh, that's what I forgot to mention:


-- Dave

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