Thread Number: 73696  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Finally the full wash video of the new 2018 Speed Queen washer
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Post# 973283   12/12/2017 at 18:30 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        

As promised. I will do a few more with various laundry and levels. This load was a full laundry basket full of cotton wash towels, a few colorful microfiber towels so you can get a good idea of roll over.






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Post# 973285 , Reply# 1   12/12/2017 at 18:41 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
inner workings and colorful loads

I'd like to see a full load of colors with a premium HE laundry detergent and fabric softener. I'd also would like to see the inner workings of this machine running. What is the model number of this machine?

Post# 973290 , Reply# 2   12/12/2017 at 19:06 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Well that was 43 minutes of my life I'll never get back. The most exciting cycle was spin and that's not saying much. 

 

I tried to keep an open mind but I'm pretty sure I hate this new machine. 

 

Thanks for the video though! More thoughts to come later... 


Post# 973293 , Reply# 3   12/12/2017 at 19:39 by Imperial70 (******)        

Speed Queen is so clever. They achieve agitation by rotating the tub back in forth rapid enough such that the clothes are stationary with respect to the agitation so you get the same agitation effect of a stationary tub/moving agitator. It's turnover is slower. But it seems to be a great idea. Should be extremely reliable too.

Way to go. I may have to get one.


Post# 973294 , Reply# 4   12/12/2017 at 19:51 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        

maytag85's profile picture
The wash action is pretty anemic compared to the Speed Queens with a transmission.

Post# 973297 , Reply# 5   12/12/2017 at 19:59 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
Give Speed Queen a chance!

I think we should give Speed Queen a chance. I know, I hate what the EPA/DOE has done, but at least Speed Queen had the the customers' wants and needs in mind. This might just as good, if not better than the old method of washing clothes despite the gentle splaching noise. If you think about it, the wash action is turbulent underwater. I'm not happy about what the EPA/DOE has done as moch as I want to rant, however.

Post# 973299 , Reply# 6   12/12/2017 at 20:06 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
correction

Correction... much

Post# 973300 , Reply# 7   12/12/2017 at 20:07 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        

maytag85's profile picture
I would definitely EOL this machine like Shango066 EOLs newer televisions!!!

Post# 973301 , Reply# 8   12/12/2017 at 20:14 by joeypete (Concord, NH)        

joeypete's profile picture
It's like the Frigidaire Immersion care with an agitator, LOL. It will probably clean just fine, really.

I just don't understand why with that much water, they couldn't stick with a normal agitation? I was expecting it to use like a lot less water for all the redesign they did.


Post# 973304 , Reply# 9   12/12/2017 at 20:21 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

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Sloshy and twisty but also lethargic.† Doesn't seem suitable for knits and woolens, presumably Delicate is much less twisty?† Wash time seems short, what was the selected soil level?† Needs a hefty dose of premium enzyme detergent.


Post# 973307 , Reply# 10   12/12/2017 at 20:33 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        

maytag85's profile picture
This could lead to Speed Queen's demise, and I'll laugh when people stop buying Speed Queen washers.

Post# 973308 , Reply# 11   12/12/2017 at 20:33 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        

maytag85's profile picture
This could lead to Speed Queen's demise, and I'll laugh when people stop buying Speed Queen washers and dryers.

Post# 973309 , Reply# 12   12/12/2017 at 20:36 by nmassman44 (Boston North Shore Massachusetts)        

nmassman44's profile picture
I was thinking...I wonder if the current FlexVane agitator would fit in this washer and how much more water and load movement would be created....itís funny how something that was tried back in the 70ís by Frigidaire GM comes back in this incarnation. I am looking forward to see what CU has to say about this washer design.

Post# 973310 , Reply# 13   12/12/2017 at 20:38 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
new 2018 speed queen

Speed Queen must've really done their homework despite all the feedback from the environmentalists. They've decided to make their machines more tough, but more gentle and more energy efficient. Less parts to go wrong. I'd bet everything I own that these electronics that they use are built to tough military specs. Who can say that about their washers? Nobody can! I'd use Tide pods original laundry detergent, Downy April fresh liquid fabric softener, and Clorox bleach packs when washing whites. I'd use the heavy-duty cycle with the heaviest soil level at all times and leave the machine at auto fill. The only thing that changes is the temperature. I hope people will give these machines a chance. I know Maytag85 feels. As much as I hate the change, I'm willing to wait and give it a chance. Give Speed Queen a chance! They've been doing laundry for over a century - come a century and a decade!

Post# 973313 , Reply# 14   12/12/2017 at 20:51 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        
GELaundry4ever

maytag85's profile picture
I would definitely do a variac overload on the 2018 Speed Queen washer!! I would make EOL videos and put them on YouTube like Shango066 does!!!

Post# 973315 , Reply# 15   12/12/2017 at 20:51 by Gyrafoam (Roanoke, VA)        

It sounds like it's in pain. Certainly is different.
I'm thinking fabric softener will not be too evenly distributed. Would hate to have to use dryer sheets!
Thanks Eugene for providing the show!


Post# 973316 , Reply# 16   12/12/2017 at 20:54 by cfz2882 (Belle Fourche,SD)        
hydrowave like

the agitation reminds me a lot of my GE hydrowave.

Post# 973320 , Reply# 17   12/12/2017 at 21:13 by washerdude (Canada )        

Give me an old SQ any day over this.

Post# 973324 , Reply# 18   12/12/2017 at 21:24 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Too early to pass judgement

So I only did 3 loads so far, one empty, one with a few items, and this full load. I was impressed how well it was able to circulate the clothing. Iíll video a few more loads tomorrow, maybe a side by side comparison and an internal view.

Those towels were already washed before I put them in and the new queen managed to squeeze more dirt out of them. That was very impressive to me.

Itís going to be a busy week but Iíll try and post more thorough videos and ultimately my review.

So far though I like it, and I think it will do well.


Post# 973327 , Reply# 19   12/12/2017 at 21:31 by lakewebsterkid (Dayton, Ohio)        
Ehh

I am left feeling underwhelmed considering the following this has had for months. I do feel, however, that the "current" 2017 agitator would create a very aggressive and effective wash action. Lets just hope that can be swapped in. I almost feel like a slightly lower water level would have helped a bit as well, but I might be completely wrong.

Post# 973328 , Reply# 20   12/12/2017 at 21:39 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

Yes, first and foremost, many thanks Eugene for taking the time to make a complete-cycle video! It's obviously something we've all been chomping at the bit to see.

Now...who's going to take one for the team and purchase one of these so we can get extensive tests in all possible situations?

I want to see it take on a full capacity load using auto-fill and the Normal Eco cycle. That and probably the Delicate cycle.

Frankly, I think the biggest problem will be this: Many people loved Speed Queen because their top-loader was, for all intents and purposes, like a washer from the 1950s-70s. Will they continue to love SQ now that it is no longer reminiscent of that time period?


Post# 973331 , Reply# 21   12/12/2017 at 22:01 by Mrsalvo (New Braunfels Texas)        

edited: no comment.

"Hello? Maytag?"


Post# 973335 , Reply# 22   12/12/2017 at 22:17 by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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Who will be the first to graft a dual-action agitator into one?

If there was enough water drag to get it to ratchet, it might work.


Post# 973337 , Reply# 23   12/12/2017 at 22:39 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

My pants would be on fire if I said anything other than my only attraction to SQ was the rugged old school machine that this new one is replacing. I love all the sounds a 210į arc machine makes (the old helical Maytags & BD Whirlpools too), and the feeling of something doing only what you tell it to, not a computer having to go through a "thinking process" and possibly trying to outsmart you.

So yeah, now that Alliance has joined everyone else in the world of machines that must "think" about what they're doing and do all sorts of turns and motions in order to operate I will certainly consider all options if I had to do it again soon. I will also rethink SQ as my go to recommendation to others as well. That F&P with the agitator is looking more appealing at this point.

I think in the end for me if I can't have my old school TLer, I'll just go with a nice FLer. Never been a fan of any kind of HE TLer or TLer without a transmission.
FLer's are without a doubt superior to transmission-less top loaders IMO.


Post# 973344 , Reply# 24   12/12/2017 at 23:16 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

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I also want to add my thanks to Eugene for making and posting the video!

 

It doesn't seem like it could be nearly as effective as the Maytag MVWP575GW, at least in the same amount of time.

 

Given the choice I would take the Maytag from what I've seen so far.

 

 


Post# 973349 , Reply# 25   12/12/2017 at 23:33 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Compared to my new 432,

I think this would satisfy me equally well. I haven't rigged the lid as I get no sexual thrill from watching the agitator.

I really liked the design shown in the videos by Rivas, saved those to a hard drive. I like the simplicity, even though I'm not a washer repairman. I like simple durability.

How many on here piss and moan because their vehicles have electronics driving them now? How many on here have replaced their fuel injection systems with carburetors? How many on here remember exactly how much fun those carburetors were to deal with, in the 1970's with tightening emission standards?

I just got rid of my Frigidaire Affinity FL two months ago while it was still running because no repairman could figure out how to make it consistently run through its whole cycles without stopping 50% of the time before the final rinse and spin. And yes, it had every damn circuit board replaced more than once.

Like dishwashers, electronics seem almost a contradiction in terms when one views the heat and wet environment in which they must live. However, weird nostalgia doesn't butter the toast. The issue these days seems to be, again, how much electronic construction is necessary, as opposed to toys for the younger generation.

I still question whether my beloved 1977 Filter-Flo set in avocado didn't wash as well as this new SQ 432 that I bought in October; I don't think so, it certainly got my whites white and cleaned beautifully all the clothing from a very outdoor/camping/athletic lifestyle. I don't think this new SQ dryer does a whit better than that GE BOL dryer, either. I'd love to have them back, single speed and all. But then, I'd love to have my 1951 Lincoln back that I drove in high school; I'd love to have my 1959 Isetta that I also owned then. I'd love to have the 1965 Olds 98 convertible that I owned in college, or the 1972 Buick GS convertible, or certainly the 1965 VW Beetle in white with red interior that I bought in the mid 70's with only 30K miles on it (sister totaled it in Austin on an icy street when I loaned it to her).

What still disappoints me about this site is that so many people on here are so damned pessimistic. Frankly, I avoid people who are downers in my daily life 'cause they have no real basis for it. Study after study has shown that in situations where there are good and bad outcomes, that the good outcome generally occurs around 55% of the time. So why the whining?

These people at Alliance, according to the Rivas videos, spent 3 years designing this machine. I believe they didn't design it to not wash as well. I believe they wouldn't be introducing it if it didn't, and certainly not with a 7-year warranty. They could've just kept the old machine, ditched the mech timer setup, and modified what was left to accommodate the new standards. I see no evidence that anything was done to make it cheaper to produce or less durable--which appears the case with most of its competitors.

So again--why the long face? Just 'cause it isn't the one that June Cleaver used?


Post# 973354 , Reply# 26   12/12/2017 at 23:51 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

I don't like when electronics don't do exactly what I tell them to when I tell them to. I'm actually quite a tech person but a firm believer in the KISS principle. I like my car that is all computer controlled, it does what I want it to when I tell it to. OTOH I didn't like my mothers Passat with the throttle program that was always trying to outsmart me like a crafty German would (in the name of fuel economy???), but even a crafty German engineer can't outsmart this bitch.

When the redesigned for 2015 models came out I actually jumped right in and got the electronic model, I think I was the first on AW with an AWNE model. I have zero regrets choosing the electronic model.

I can already see from the video most of what I love about my SQ is now gone in the newer model. Not to say that it won't be a good machine but the things I liked about them are just gone now. Which would leave me looking everywhere again, if I were in the market anytime soon.


Post# 973358 , Reply# 27   12/13/2017 at 00:57 by rp2813 (The Big Blue Bubble)        

rp2813's profile picture

Yeah, I'll pass.  This thing is pathetic.  The first thought that came to mind as I eyed the colored towels was the Bob and Ray routine, "Slow Talkers of America."  I scrolled down while the clip was running, and as I read through the replies, I'd go back up and check on the action.   The same two microfiber towels were lazing around on the top every time I checked.   This isn't a washer, it's a soaker.

 

I am not a dyed in the wool old-school or no-school washer aficionado.  My daily driver is a 2008 Affinity FL.  I'm open to new concepts, but this one strikes me as an epic fail.  And that moaning and groaning would drive me nuts, although it would sound great turned up loud in a Halloween haunted house scene.  This machine does give neutral drain fans something to cheer about, but the notoriously stingy spray rinse remains. 

 

Can you say "No sale?"  I knew you could.

 

Oh yeah, and that pump is waaay louder than the Chinese one I just installed on the Affinity. 


Post# 973360 , Reply# 28   12/13/2017 at 00:59 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Your Money,

your choice. It would do a fine job on my laundry and I'd really like to have that 7-year warranty. But then, I don't have a house full of oil field workers or little kids...

Post# 973368 , Reply# 29   12/13/2017 at 01:43 by chetlaham (United States)        

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Why do I have a feeling this will tangle sheets and other bulk items like no tomorrow?





Post# 973373 , Reply# 30   12/13/2017 at 02:29 by chetlaham (United States)        
Nut cases...

chetlaham's profile picture
In response to a you tube comment: I highly doubt combo52, a tech with 40+ years of extensive experience and incredibly gifted in his understanding of the industry is one of those nut case for saying that these do not match up to SQ's current production. 1/4 of a sales loss it not a baseless prediction. These might do well with loose rags, but I can't see this cleaning when packed full of towels or jeans or bedding for that matter.

Post# 973374 , Reply# 31   12/13/2017 at 02:34 by MattL (Flushing, MI)        

I'm wondering what's the point?  Why is SQ trying to reinvent the wheel?  The wash action is poor from what I can see - just swishing the clothes around in some water, nothing like the older models. 

 

I'd never give up my FL for that.  It would take 2, 3 or 4 times the detergent to get the same concentration I have in my FL  Sorry, not for me.


Post# 973379 , Reply# 32   12/13/2017 at 02:47 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

After seeing the video not really impressed.The agitation seems VERY lame.However this SQ machine would be BETTER than any impellor machine.At least the is SOME water in there.I don't feel this is going to be a good replacement for the traditional "old school" SQ TL washers.Just wonder when these come into the wild if customers will return them and insist on a real agitator washer.And SQ discontinuing their FL residential machines may end up being an "EOL" for SQ unless they stay with commercial-industrial equipment.
Remember a Shango066 video clip of him using an older Maytag washer(Shame on him)to "spin" a TV fastrned to the washer drum.As the tub and TV spun he threw rocks at the TV until the CRT went.Unusual EOL for a TV!


Post# 973380 , Reply# 33   12/13/2017 at 02:48 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Oh yes,would like to see the mechanism shots-this may be better than what goes on up top!

Post# 973387 , Reply# 34   12/13/2017 at 03:37 by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

I can say only one thing: hahahahahah

and I say more..... Hahahahahah
and also... Hahahahahah

Thank you so much Speed Queen!

Thanks to you, dear Speed Queen, in 8 months from now I will be able to say with all the words "I've designed the only full size top load washing machine in the US that uses a decent old school water level, a decent old school temperature selector where hot means as hot as the water heater is set plus the internal heater, cold means cold with a touch of hot if the cold water is too cold, and warm means warm a bit more to the hot side, a decent agitator that simply agitates the clothes as an agitator should agitate."

And I am proud to say I give a F-word to what the efficiency tests or Bullshit Reports say about the project Long Beach.


And also saving space and being much more than a square box.

(and with a build in suds saver to make the Eco Nazi happy.)

It is big, but not a monster. You can't wash an elephant or three California King Size duvets in one load. But it can easily wash 7 pairs of XL jeans WITH A DECENT ROLLOVER.


Post# 973391 , Reply# 35   12/13/2017 at 04:02 by norgeway (mocksville n c )        
I would

Just as soon have a ingrown toenail....I could get rid of that!

Post# 973394 , Reply# 36   12/13/2017 at 04:23 by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, the Netherlands)        

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Hans,

This is the modern forum. You're trespassing! lol


Post# 973395 , Reply# 37   12/13/2017 at 04:26 by chetlaham (United States)        
SQ's competitors got it right

chetlaham's profile picture
At least GE uses a ribbed basket on their Agi tubs :P








Post# 973401 , Reply# 38   12/13/2017 at 05:40 by mtn1584 (USA)        
Question please...

It looks like the agitator is moving independently of the tub, as if the circulations of the wash tub enable the agitator to turn on it's own.
I personally do not think the wash action is that bad,
it's just different. The clothes are moving back and forth through the water, while they may not turn over as in a traditional top load washer, I think the that laundry would come out of this machine clean. How could it not? You've got a full tub of water and detergent and the clothes are moving, how much more wash action could you get from this/
I think it will be ok, like I said just different, I am curious about the agitator moving when the tub is oscillating, the agitator must disengage from the tub!
Mike


Post# 973402 , Reply# 39   12/13/2017 at 05:47 by johnrk (BP TX)        
A Bunch of People

appear to be nostalgic for the Shredmore. Me, I'd love to have that beating-the-crap action of my old GE's. My mother, God rest her soul, always missed her Frigidaire with the Jet Action.

Nostalgia is so much fun--but then the sun comes up, the world keeps moving as it always has.


Post# 973408 , Reply# 40   12/13/2017 at 07:00 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        
New SQ

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I've seen more effective action with my Maytag on slow whilst overloaded. I'm not impressed. I don't care if this washer lasts 50 years if it won't wash well, and I cannot see it performing well at all. HE TL machines seem to bank on the enzymes to, in effect, soak out dirt instead of forcing water through the clothes to clean, while it uses a full tub, it really is only doing just that. I cannot recommend this machine to anyone, I am now officially in the WP/MT VMW camp now. I have a new appreciation for WCI "Angel-Wing" indexing tub machines, at least the agitator creates water movement and there is a little turnover. This kind of reminds me of the 1970s GE portable, why even include the agitator, it isn't creating much water movement.

If this and the new MT water hog can pass the efficiency tests, why couldn't the 432?


Post# 973409 , Reply# 41   12/13/2017 at 07:17 by Gyrafoam (Roanoke, VA)        

It probably does well for removing "office dust", so may be fine for many people.
People who toil in blue-collar jobs may not get a very clean load.Roofers, asphalt spreaders, sewer workers, field hands, landscapers,factory workers, etc.

My early-sixties Norge is the electric version of beating clothes on a rock.
It does a great job on really dirty clothes.


Post# 973414 , Reply# 42   12/13/2017 at 07:44 by mayken4now (Panama City, Florida)        
Thanks

mayken4now's profile picture
For posting the show Eugene. Much appreciated.

Post# 973422 , Reply# 43   12/13/2017 at 08:42 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

mtn1584:† It looks like the agitator is moving independently of the tub, as if the circulations of the wash tub enable the agitator to turn on it's own.
No, the agitator and basket are affixed together and rotate as a unit.† The agitator cannot oscillate independently.


Post# 973437 , Reply# 44   12/13/2017 at 10:02 by johnb300m (Chicago)        

johnb300m's profile picture
Well, this is about the level of judgement I was expecting.

I honestly don't see the issue with this machine. Those items are definitely moving through the water with good force. There's both back/forth and rotational turnover, in a very deep tub of water.
I'm not so crazy about the vertical agitator vanes twisting everything up in the center. But it's not a show stopper.

Honestly, what does the agitation style MATTER if everything comes out clean at the end of the cycle? Isn't that the point? If this can do it? Then 'mission accomplished.'

AND....HOW.....has nobody commented on the fact that it still does a (slow) spin drain?! Did y'all see that?
The spray (slow) spin looked pretty good too IMO.

I'm by NO means a SQ fan. But jeez, give these things a chance.
It's also very common for companies/engineers to make running production changes and tweaks to things as they get more research and market feedback in.


Post# 973459 , Reply# 45   12/13/2017 at 12:04 by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
I like the old SQ

mark_wpduet's profile picture
better - I also prefer spin drains to neutral drains. I read someone above post there are neutral drain fans out there. Could someone explain to me how anyone would prefer a neutral drain over a spin drain? Just wondering. Thanks

I do think this would get clothes clean - but it's doing it very boringly. Nothing exciting going on.

I'm sure it's built to last and it does use a good amount of water. I've just gotten so used to FL washers I don't think I could stand going back to a TL. I could try though.


Post# 973460 , Reply# 46   12/13/2017 at 12:11 by Infusor (Usa)        

"Same two microfiber lazing around the top every time i looked" really???? You must be blind, you clearly did not watch the same video i did, i saw the microfiber turning over TONS of times. The ignorance is amazing.

Post# 973461 , Reply# 47   12/13/2017 at 12:24 by murando531 (Huntsville, AL)        

murando531's profile picture
That Frigidaire Immersion Care contraption had more zest than this thing. I'd rather have a Cabrio to be honest. At least the clothes move uniformly and I'm not wasting 50 gallons of water a load.

Post# 973462 , Reply# 48   12/13/2017 at 12:29 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

I watched the wash period again at a faster speed.† There is some rollover but it's reverse ... the yellow, green, and blue cloths come up the center at the agitator and go down the outside.† Several times, I wouldn't say "tons" of times.† It is an interesting action.† A huge platform change for SQ!


Post# 973463 , Reply# 49   12/13/2017 at 12:30 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Specialty Cycles?

mrb627's profile picture
Didn't the training video mention Specialty Cycles?
What are they?

Malcolm


Post# 973465 , Reply# 50   12/13/2017 at 13:26 by cfz2882 (Belle Fourche,SD)        
looking better with more veiwings...

several different agitation profiles can be seen-some decently aggressive and again,similar to a hydrowave.Looks like the short stroke program is ~210* If this was a 1955 washer we would like it :)

Post# 973469 , Reply# 51   12/13/2017 at 13:46 by wishwash (Illinois)        

On the plus side, this machine is very quiet like the GE Hydrowave and has a well executed load sensing setup. It should also be very durable since the motor is directly connected to the tub solely by a pulley and driveshaft and therefore easy to repair. My praise ends there.

If Whirlpool came up with a machine with this anemic of wash action there would be no mercy. This particular machine says Speed Queen on it so it's a different story. As others have said, this is basically a Frigidaire immersion care with an agitator. No thanks, I'll stick to my VMW and enjoy clean clothes. It uses the same amount of water and washes the same amount of clothes better. They are also dirt cheap on Craigslist whenever I need a replacement.


Post# 973480 , Reply# 52   12/13/2017 at 14:27 by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room)        

lordkenmore's profile picture

On the plus side, this machine is very quiet like the GE Hydrowave

 

I suppose that would be a selling point for some. Indeed, that is the major sales tool a clerk at the local Home Depot always used. "Well, this Admiral [WP DD] works, but this machine over here [at 2x the cost] is much quieter!"

 

But I'd miss the entertaining sound of operation. Plus I'm just plain used to noisy washers, what with having grown up with a KM BD, and having had WP DD machines most of the last 20 years...




This post was last edited 12/13/2017 at 15:52
Post# 973525 , Reply# 53   12/13/2017 at 19:43 by thefisch (Florida)        

I can't really compare what I see in this video to other washers since I have only owned 3 in my life so far, but I can compare this to my 2017 SQ TL which this replaces.

Fill - the auto fill seems to add about a minute or so for the sensors to spin and sense the load and add more water at various points. In the end, this ends up at about the top water level after 6 minutes which is a good sign that it used the most water for what looked like a pretty large load when placed in the basket. At least the auto fill is not trying to wash with less water than the load appears to need. Another positive is that it remembered the water level for the rinse cycle and took less time, about 5 minutes to fill, skipping the sensing spins. Strange how long this takes to fill though since my 2017 can fill the tub to the top in about 3-4 minutes.

Wash cycle - this seemed long at about 14 minutes but perhaps given the slower turnover it needed the extra few minutes compared to the 2017 models. The turnover was not impressive but perhaps it is adequate in real life. Will be interested to see how well it does with bulky or heavier items like jeans or heavy soiled items. Will see how others review this but my eyebrow is raised.

Rinse cycle - it seems to use a mix of two spray rinses and a fill rinse although I could have been looking away. The fill rinse agitation seemed short at about 3 minute. Again, turnover seems too sluggish with the mix of short and long rotations.

Spin cycle - I like the idea of a neutral drain for removing sediment before the spin begins. However, almost all the water drains before the spin begins leaving all the towels at the bottom bunching them together during the spin. I would think that leads to less extraction. My 2017 drains while it spins which keeps the load suspended resulting in clothes all the way the basket wall, not all laying at the bottom. I would think the 2017 allows for more extraction but again more reviews will tell that story.


Overall time seems about 10 minutes longer than heavy duty, large load on my 2017 8 series. 10 minutes isn't a big deal, but that is about 33% longer which sounds like a lot by comparison.


Post# 973548 , Reply# 54   12/13/2017 at 21:40 by Helicaldrive (St. Louis)        
Who knows

Itís not what weíre used to seeing but I wouldnít be surprised if tests would prove that it gets clothes cleaner than the old TL design. Thereís much more, and stronger, water turbulence in this new model than in the old design. When the tub reverses direction those clothes are getting hit with a very forceful wall of water. And if you look you can see that the wash water got visibly dirty very quickly.

Even so Iíd rather have a FL. I think FLs provide more wash action and get clothes cleaner than either the old or new TL designs. However I must admit when HE FLs came out I was totally skeptical and vowed Iíd never have one. But I was wrong. They are very effective if loaded properly and dosed with detergent properly.

So for that reason Iím going to keep an open mind about this new design.


Post# 973559 , Reply# 55   12/13/2017 at 22:41 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

Thanks, thefisch, for your detailed observations.  I enjoyed reading everyone else's comments as well.

 

I replaced a good old 1980s Kenmore DD with a Neptune FL back in 2006.  I liked it right off the bat. I thought it cleaned better and I liked being able to wash blankets and comforters. My partner at the time despised it immediately and never warmed up to it for one simple reason...the longer cycle times.  He was a "one load at a time" kind of guy and in his opinion whatever advantages the FL had didn't make up for it taking twice as long.

 

His opinion was just as valid as mine and there are millions of Americans that feel the same way.  So for them, the end of the conventional SQ TL line is the end of buying a new machine with the design they prefer.  Not surprised there are so many displeased people on this forum!

 

In one of the SQ sales presentation videos they say that they were forced to add load sensing to comply with new water regulations - and that may be true.  However if the machines are still allowed to use this much water (as does the new Maytag MVWP575GW) then why could it have not used the traditional agitation system?

 

It seems to me that this wash mechanism change was more of marketing/cost decision (i.e. simpler design gave them the opportunity to offer 7-year warranty.)  And that's fine, it's a strategic move that may pay off, but I don't like the fact that they sort of implied that government regulations made them do it.  Looking at the Maytag machine I don't see how that could truly be the case.

 

Interesting times for laundry machines, great fun to see the innovations, like them or not!

 

 

 

 


Post# 973560 , Reply# 56   12/13/2017 at 22:52 by henene4 (Germany)        
Why are you so focused on turnover?

Even if there was turn over, it would do nothing to clean the clothes in this design.


On the old design with the agitator moving quickly back and forth indpendently of tub, laundry and water, the side to side motion of the agitator moved the laundry up and down through the water.
As the tub was mostly motionless, the laundry was moved in a circle like motion up and down, being beaten by the agitator and rubbbing against the static tub.
The water moved in one direction alongside the laundry at mostly the exact same speed, thus more flowing with the items then through the fibres and items.

This is what you guys know as "roll over".



On this design, the tub, agitator and laundry move in unison. In relation to each other, there is barely any movement, thus barely any friction.
The agitator dosen't beat the clothes clean, they don't rub against the drum at high forces, thus, they get the incredible improvement in terms of gentleness that they claim to have achieved.

The wash action here that actually clean the clothes 95% based on water flow.
As laundry, tub and agiator move in unison in one direction, the water begins to flow with the motion of the laundry like on the old system.
As long as the water flows with the laundry at about the same speed, there is barely any friction between tub, agitator and laundry and the water once again dosen't flow through the laundry, but with it. There are close to no forces of friction or simmilar acting between laundry, tub/agitator and water.

Now, however, the drum and agitator suddenly and verry decisivley reverse.
So, agitator and tub now basicly instantly move in the opposite direction of laundry and water.
At this point, just after the reversing, there will be some friction between the laundry next to the tub walls and right next to the agitator. The majority of the load however which has no contact to the agitator or tub don't experience much friction or cleaning at all. Yet.
These pieces of laundry now begin to reverse their direction of movement and start to move again along side the agitator and tub.
Through some friction, the whole bunch that is the load of laundry pretty quickly begins to reverse as well and to flow - now again - together with all the other laundry, tub and agitator into the same direction.
That little bit of friction between the items here will contribute to cleaning, too.

However, only now the main cleaning action of an agitation stroke in this washer starts.
How?
The entire mass of these 20+gal of hot water mixed with detergent was moving in the same direction as everything else just a moment ago.
Now, even though tub, agitator and laundry have reversed their direction of movement, the water will still move and flow in the old direction.
As the water has a lot of inertia, it takes a decent amount of time for it to start to flow in unison with the laundry and wash unit again.
This means, while the water moves into one direction, the laundry is forced into the exact opposite direction.
It's like 2 cars driving behind each other, and the front car suddenly reverses out of thin air: The resulting collison has a lot of force.
As water and laundry now move exactly opposite to each other, the water is forced through the load, while the load is forced through the water. The pressure of this actions streams water through and arround every fibre, through every non-waterproof item, with it the detergents. That water movement carrys out soils gently and effectivley.


Before, the agitation moved the laundry through the water. But the water was baled to move along.
Now, the water is moved through the load.
Each time the agitub reverses, a powerfull flow of water is sent through every item in the load, just like a tidal wave on the beach that you run into, or - like I said - 2 cars hitting each other head on.

They took the typical step from thinking non-HE-washing to HE-washing:
Non-HE-washers were about moving laundry through water. Thus, laundry had to float, and had to move at a rather fast pace.
HE-washers (and that is true for TLs and FLs) are about moving water through the laundry. That is what recirculation pumps, spin-spray pretreatments and low profile agitators are about. People say "Oh, but the laundry dosen't move!" Yeah it moves less - visibly.
What counts is relative movement, relative movement of every part (laundry, water, tub, agitator, etc.) to each other.
If you pull the items through the water or isntead pull the water through the items DOES NOT MAKE A DIFFERENCE!
The pre-2018 SQ TLs pulled laundry through the water, these 2018 models pull water through the laundry.




To solidify my view, I'll make a prediction right now that I am almost entirely sure about that it will come true:

People who will use to high waterlevels for to small loads will be EXTREMLY underwhelmed by the cleaning. If the laundry can just float around in the water, the agitub movement will not be abled to create that sudden reversing effect of the laundry in relation to the wash water and the laundry and water instead will move as one item, simply because there is to little friction between the load and the moving parts. Then, there is no reverse waterflow in relation to the items being washed, and barely any water wiil be moved through the fabrics.

This washer will deliver the best results with the just-about-loosely-filled-up type of loads (in relation to the selected water level, of course).
To little laundry for the water level will mean that that agitub can't effectivley "grip onto" the washload and can't move it efgectivley back and forth.
Too much laundry will be to much resitance to the waterflow and thus the reversing periods won't be enough to force water and detergent solution through every layer of the overly densly packed load.






Really, after the first few agiation moves I thought everybody had to realize that they did that switch-up of what is moving in relation to what now.
But apparently verry few people actually give thought to what that water that they o-so desire in ridiculous amounts does.


Post# 973563 , Reply# 57   12/13/2017 at 23:10 by Infusor (Usa)        

They were forced to add load sensing, they only had to on one the normal eco cycle which does a spray rinse instead of a deep fill, the commercial vmw maytag also does load sensing and a spray rinse on their normal cycle, kirks video even demonstrates it, he did a load with only 7 shirts on the maytag and it did only fill the tub half way.

Post# 973575 , Reply# 58   12/14/2017 at 03:21 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        

speedqueen's profile picture
If the addition of auto load sensing would have solved the water usage issue, why couldn't it have been added to the old design? There are other ways to manipulate the DOE test too, though. The could have had an extra pressure hose to a fixed switch only in circuit on Normal/ECO set to a half fill. All other cycles would use the usual rotary knob pressure switch.

The existing 432 Normal/ECO cycle isn't much of a water saver anyway, having stood by the machine and paid more attention to it today, I realized that the Normal/ECO cycle must have at least a 4 minute spray rinse overall, that has to equate to at least a 1/2 fill. If they directed their fill flume better so it hit clothes at the top of the basket too, they could probably achieve better results with 1/2 the spray rinse time. If you wash in the Mini load size you probably would use more water going with Normal/ECO than letting the machine fill to Mini again.



Post# 973578 , Reply# 59   12/14/2017 at 05:11 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Load Sensing

mrb627's profile picture
Through a transmission wouldn't have been possible. The transmission and older motor design had to be replaced to achieve load sensing.

Malcolm


Post# 973586 , Reply# 60   12/14/2017 at 06:39 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
Malcom, didn't Whirlpool have a load sense washer that also had a transmission?

I think the issue here is that the new regs force so little water on the Normal Eco that the conventional design is just to inadequate. Agitating a full load of clothes with only 1/14th of a tub (even on low) puts to much drag on the motor and transmission IMO.


Post# 973634 , Reply# 61   12/14/2017 at 11:15 by wishwash (Illinois)        

If the focus is forcing water through the clothes rather than pulling the clothes through the water, what is the point of an agitub? A one piece impeller/basket like the immersion care system would offer the same effectiveness while likely using less water.

I think the designers of this machine tried to satisfy too many crowds. On one hand they're trying to retain their legacy customers that turned to them for a traditional top load washer and on the other they are trying to compete directly with Whirlpool on the gentle and eco-friendly front. The machine that covers both of these bases is the now defunct Cabrio with an agitator.

I honestly don't foresee top loaders being on the market too much longer. The only real 'traditional' options are either a bare bones VMW (acceptable), F&P WashSmart ($$$), or a GE Agipeller model (meh). Honestly I'd just buy a used direct drive if this were what I wanted.

The likes of Whirlpool Cabrio are getting better but simply cannot handle a large load with the effectiveness of a front loader. I could talk all day about how Whirlpool should bring something similar to the Calypso to the market but at the end of the day, front loaders are advantageous.

I think I read on here that Speed Queen is also refreshing its front loader lineup. I hope they offer an up to date machine that can actually compete with the big brands.


Post# 973672 , Reply# 62   12/14/2017 at 17:00 by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room)        

lordkenmore's profile picture

I was frankly underwhelmed by what I saw with the agitation in this video... I finally have found a top loader that makes the agitation of a WCI Frigidaire look great. I'd never have thought I'd live to see this day.

 

That said...I'll reserve judgment on this machine. I just won't be one of the first ones buying it, and I won't be recommending it. But then...no matter how good the agitation looks, I'd be cautious about recommending any product that is pretty much 100% all new, unproven...

 

It does occur to me that this washer might be good enough for a lot of people in today's world. My laundry is mostly about freshening, and so it might in theory work for me day to day. Then, again, it may be better having too much performance. It may not be needed day to day, but when needed, it will be appreciated.

 

The other thought, too, is that at least with long cycle times (which I think I'd heard they are using) will give enzymes in detergent time to work.

 

We'll see what happens, I guess...


Post# 973673 , Reply# 63   12/14/2017 at 17:04 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Top loaders will remain in production for as long as people demand them.  And I don't think that demand will wane until people that have used top loaders all their lives and will ONLY user a top loader, die off. 

 

I personally don't see any reason not to go with a front loader with the demise of the last traditional agitator washer with a transmission. The VFD belt drive machines everyone makes just seem like a cheap way to pacify the people that will only use a top load machine while also satisfying DOE regulations. As far as I'm concerned, top loaders died with the outgoing SQ's. 

 

 


Post# 973678 , Reply# 64   12/14/2017 at 17:35 by Supersurgilator (Indiana)        

Several interesting things going on in this video, and I must say I was impressed. This machine moved the load around a lot better than I thought it would. I was expecting the actual agitation to be faster than what it is, but like someone else said, the majority of the cleaning in taking place underwater where we can't see it. I'm not sure if it was just the camera or not but man alive that pump was loud! It also seemed to have a very nice and balanced spin.

I will say for it to continue to do a full wash and rinse in that time frame is impressive. My 2 year old GE takes an hour when I select the deep rinse. I also like how the tub turns as it is filling to evenly wet everything down

That analyzation earlier hit the nail on the head, thinking of the water current and the ocean. Waves are STRONG forces and water is powerful. I'm optimistic that this design will work out in their favor, and people will have to get used to "change" even although I'm not the best at it myself.


Post# 973692 , Reply# 65   12/14/2017 at 19:14 by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
New SQ TL Washer Full Cycle

combo52's profile picture

Thanks For taking the time to post this Eugene.

 

This is exactly what I had already seen and expected in the SQ videos that I have seen, Basically it washes about 1/2 the load of the current machine and washes it about 1/2 as well, the amount of water being used to power soak laundry is obscene.

 

When we get one of these machines in out test shop next year we will do a SXS comparison of cleaning with identical loads, detergent and water temperature and post the results.

 

As I have said before this new machine is actually an improvement for gentleness and clothing care, BUT it uses far more water and detergent and can not possibility clean really dirty clothing as well.

 

Overall SQ did a good job, but we will now be selling these machines to a different customer, I am sure we will get far less complaints about lint with the neutral drain ,less damage complaints, less noise complaints and less out of balance and walking complaints.

 

John L.


Post# 973695 , Reply# 66   12/14/2017 at 20:07 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
More videos coming

I already washed clothes in it, Iíll be doing a blanket wash too.

Post# 973696 , Reply# 67   12/14/2017 at 20:22 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

Thank you again for your efforts Eugene!  Really looking forward to seeing them.


Post# 973702 , Reply# 68   12/14/2017 at 21:23 by Supersurgilator (Indiana)        

Could you please post a video on the highest water level without clothes? I'm curious the movement in the water from this machine when empty.

Post# 973754 , Reply# 69   12/15/2017 at 08:08 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

Thank you for posting the video Eugene and I liked your little self-advertisement when you put in the t-shirt with your business logo.

It is immediately apparent that the wash action is different. The spinning tub does not create the vigorous toroidal movement of a traditional back and forth agitator. In this machine the clothes appear to move around randomly and out from the center. They are certainly not stationary and there is turnover, but it is clearly less dynamic. Regular agitation creates much stronger currents, especially at the bottom of the tub.

With this new low profile agitator and smooth tub walls there is little resistance against the flow of the water and clothes. Everything is pretty much moving in the same direction. If you fill a plain round bucket with water, put in a couple of rags and spin it in opposing directions, not much happens. SQ might want to re-think the tub and agitator design to put a bit more umpf in the wash.




This post was last edited 12/15/2017 at 09:30
Post# 973780 , Reply# 70   12/15/2017 at 11:12 by duttyb11 (Mountain City)        
It seems loud

I really can't stand the sounds it makes....i know its not as loud but god it sounds terrible. The drain is so loud.....i won't be getting one of these now....the fins on the bottom of the agitator are a deal breaker for me. i feel bad for people who have to sell this.

Post# 973809 , Reply# 71   12/15/2017 at 14:17 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Itís not loud

This test was done in my noisy service room, with the front cover off. The go pro is suction cupped to the frame, and the vibration really amplified it. The washer is very, very quiet.

Post# 973810 , Reply# 72   12/15/2017 at 14:18 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Hopefully

3 more videos to watch.

Post# 973817 , Reply# 73   12/15/2017 at 14:49 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

Awesome, Eugene. Thanks!

Post# 973823 , Reply# 74   12/15/2017 at 15:36 by ryanm (New York)        

Eugene, thanks for the clarification the 'noise' level during the video of the new 2018 SQ as I thought too that it was a very noisy sound and annoying so I'm glad you say it is quiet as I am going to need to replace my current washer and need to decide if I want to take the chance on the new model SQ being the design is brand new. Can you tell me how is the extraction on this machine with heavier items like jeans? My current SQ was never really good at extraction so I was thinking of going with a washer that has a higher spin speed. Since this design is brand new and not 'proven' in many homes yet I am very shy about spending that type of money for an entirely new design. Thank you again for all the information as I have 'stalled' getting a new machine until I learn more about this one.

Post# 973844 , Reply# 75   12/15/2017 at 17:36 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Spin speed

Bumped up to 820 rpm. Is good. Clothes come out feeling about as dry as any HE top loader.

The video (1 today, sorry) I uploaded was my worst experience so far with the new queen. Long story short, I believe it was kind of a fluke thing. My pants are lined, and during full, the washer added too much water ( if you can even believe it). My pants ended up kind of linking together due to how I loaded it. The eventually just floated to the top and didnít get much wash action.

Due to my pants being lined, they kind of create air pockets and donít submerge. This isnít normally a problem on my direct drive as the corkscrew agitator pulls them down, and pushes the bubbles out.

I did the same load again on a smaller water level and it did pretty good.

My initial thoughts is that this machine isnít as great as the last version, but itís better than most of the competition out there. I have to do more laundry.


Post# 973845 , Reply# 76   12/15/2017 at 17:36 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
new video






CLICK HERE TO GO TO Lorainfurniture's LINK


Post# 973849 , Reply# 77   12/15/2017 at 17:46 by ryanm (New York)        

After seeing this demo I am not impressed at all with the wash action on this machine, the grey shorts never went anywhere. Thank you for posting this video! It has helped me make up my mind not to get the new SQ, will probably go with the Maytag or GE top load instead. I really liked my current SQ which is now shot, but would not pay that kind of money for a washer that cannot circulate a large load. Just my opinion but I would bet many here on our site will be disappointed to see this as well. I am not adverse to 'new' ways of washing clothes, I do like the LG top load and if a front load was an option for me which it is not, there are several that look good too, but to me I am very disappointed to see this poor wash action from SQ.

Post# 973850 , Reply# 78   12/15/2017 at 17:56 by Imperial70 (******)        

I don't think the clothes were loaded in an optimum fashion. Would it help to load the clothes in quadrants? Perhaps it was overloaded too. I mean no disrespect, just observations.

Post# 973852 , Reply# 79   12/15/2017 at 18:03 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Looks Fine To Me

I wouldn't have any problem with this, but I usually don't do loads that full anyway. And Lord knows it's quieter than this 432 I just bought. In fact, what I like least is all the damn buttons. I do like dials.

But, as someone pointed out, this might not be the machine for those who create truly filthy clothing; I seldom have more than "office dust" (sic) and this would work for me with the added benefit of silence and greater reliability.

But I'm certainly not replacing a 2-month-old machine anyway...and I do appreciate this gentleman's effort to give us a test run.


Post# 973853 , Reply# 80   12/15/2017 at 18:03 by Norgeway (mocksville n c )        
I'm more convinced than before

I will not own anything new. If that qualifies as a washer I'm a brain surgeon

Post# 973855 , Reply# 81   12/15/2017 at 18:09 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Welcome To Brain Surgery!

It definitely qualifies. I'd make a bet if it were possible to stage, that if you placed this machine side by side with your preferred, used the same supplies and dried the same, that you wouldn't be able to pick out which was which. Oh, it might not be very dramatic, but after all, this is an appliance.

Post# 973858 , Reply# 82   12/15/2017 at 18:19 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        
Ditto Hans,

speedqueen's profile picture
I'm not impressed. Might be good at soaking out stains with the longer cycles for enzymes to work, then again, a wash tub and wringer could do that for less money with more cycle variability, too! The agitation isn't worth anything in my opinion.

Post# 973860 , Reply# 83   12/15/2017 at 18:24 by Supersurgilator (Indiana)        

Unfortunately, I also was not impressed with this last vid. I also noticed that gray shirt just floating around on top not going anywhere. I have a feeling that once this machine comes out and they get some feedback from people, they will make some tweaks to this model.

Ryan, I would highly suggest the new Maytag model for you. I have had the GE460 for 2 years now. It's ok but I'm not a fan. Clothes do come clean in it but there is no movement at all, everything just sits there no matter what you do. The loads always come out twisted and wrinkled as well, far worse than any other washer I have used. I do like the redesign of the Maytag and I'm so curious to see what Whirlpool is gonna do to its lineup next year.


Post# 973863 , Reply# 84   12/15/2017 at 18:31 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

LorainFurniture:† I did the same load again on a smaller water level and it did pretty good.
I expect overfilling for the load size has an adverse effect on the wash action.


Post# 973865 , Reply# 85   12/15/2017 at 18:56 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

Another great video. Thank you Eugene.

My 20 cents worth - there is nothing wrong with the size of the load or how the clothes were put in the washer. It does confirm what many have already stated, the agitation is not powerful enough to turn over a regular mixed load. Everything pretty much remained where it had been placed at the start. My washer would have constantly moved this load from the top to the bottom of the agitator and without trouble. Eugene stated that his trousers are fleece lined, which makes them pretty bulky. Perhaps the bulky cycle might have been more appropriate for this load of washing. I reckon SQ do need to modify this tub to create better movement of the wash load. Being spun from left to right does not really create enough friction and agitation, nor would it force water through denser fabrics. Gentle, however, this is.

The speed and complete turns of the wash tub appear to vary throughout the wash cycle. Most of the time rotation seems to be rather slow and unable to create enough force to turn over the wash load. In the first of Eugene's videos the load of towels was lighter and movement more vigorous.

Now, how did Eugene rate the cleaning of this last load of clothes? Were smells and stains removed?




This post was last edited 12/15/2017 at 21:54
Post# 973866 , Reply# 86   12/15/2017 at 19:05 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

My previous assessment still stands. The old one could've handled that load much better, not to mention one does not have to load it in any certain fashion other than to not overload it to the point where you must smash the clothes down to get them in the tub. If one has to load a machine a special way other than to drop clothes in and not overload it, then the engineers have failed. I won't conclude to that just yet just from one demo but I think evidence is pointing to this being an issue on the new design.

Aside from the questionable wash action I honestly don't mind just about every other aspect of this new machine, the load sensing and dance it does to go into spin are far less annoying than every other "modern" machine I've seen so far. While I love the sounds the outgoing machine makes, the silence of the new machine can be just as great where noise levels are a concern. For me personally, if it can't sound like music to my ears then I'd rather it be as quiet as possible.


Post# 973878 , Reply# 87   12/15/2017 at 20:54 by Imperial70 (******)        

Unrealistic expectations. Speedqueen gives training, early shipments to stores and they get stabbed in the back. Not cool.

Post# 973879 , Reply# 88   12/15/2017 at 20:58 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Hey guys

I almost didnít post this video because of so many errors that are not the fault of the machine. Yes, I definitely overloaded it. Towards the end you can see Iím shoving the clothes in there to make it fit. Definitely not the machineís fault. I also wrapped the clothes around the tub, not in a quadrant fashion.

That coupled with my floating pants gave me a not so good wash.

The clothes when done were definitely cleaner than when put in, but not clean by aw.org standards. I think the average person would have found them to be acceptable. That soap that Iím using is very fragrant, and the smell was almost imperceptible after the wash. It definitely is a good rinser.

I posted this video because Iím trying to be as objective as possible while testing. I wonít sell a washer out of my store that doesnít perform well. Itís serious business for me.

If I put the same load in a speed queen ďold skoolĒ it probably would have fell flat on its face too. Heck, I donít even think the direct drive could have turned over a load that compressed.


Iíll tell you this, blanket wash went pretty darn well. The results surprised me.


Post# 973884 , Reply# 89   12/15/2017 at 21:20 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        
Overloaded,

speedqueen's profile picture
That makes it more like what an actual consumer would do. Makes for a better test in my opinion.

Post# 973887 , Reply# 90   12/15/2017 at 21:28 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Eugene I appreciate you posting that, I was curious how it handled that type of load. It definitely appears as JL said, that the new design doesn't handle extra large loads as well as the old one. Not that the old one had much turnover when it's overloaded but that machine surprises me how much you can stuff in there and still get turnover.

Post# 973898 , Reply# 91   12/15/2017 at 22:06 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

Thanks Eugene!    Maybe it was a little overloaded, but I think you loaded this washer just as most regular households would.   This seems more like automatic soaker  than an automatic washer.  Hope further tests prove me wrong.    


Post# 973900 , Reply# 92   12/15/2017 at 22:42 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
laundry detergent and fabric softener and bleach recommendat

Hey Eugene, If I were you, I'd highly recommend Tide pods in the original scent. I'd also recommend Downy April Fresh as an additive which I use everytime I wash clothes. I'd also recommend Clorox bleach packes. Try Tide and see how it works. It may be the detergent you're using. I'd like to see a load with fabric softener by the way. When you do a load of whites, I'd love to see it with bleach in there. I'd also like to see the heavy duty cycle with max soil level selected.
This washer needs a second chance before we condemn its wash action just because of a fluke. I'd try some pods. That's what I use.
Jerome


Post# 973902 , Reply# 93   12/15/2017 at 22:46 by peteski50 (New York)        
Speed Queen 2018 top load!

peteski50's profile picture
Eugene thank you for posting! -- The wash action to wash a full load of dirty laundry is rather poor! You would definitely need to do a prewash / soak plus a extended wash time to get a clean load. But even with all that with poor turnover it just isn't going to work! I am not that opposed to this adjtub principal but SP could have made a better agitator and even fins around the tub itself to get more cleaning power. I think they are going to get complaints and will loose business on these 2018 models! I kind of remember the GM adjtub did a better job washing and their was some European old videos on youtube that used this same principle that did a better job washing!
Peter



Post# 973903 , Reply# 94   12/15/2017 at 23:10 by peteski50 (New York)        
Speed Queen 2018 top load comparison to skinny mini!

peteski50's profile picture
Here is one example of a better wash
Hey speed queen why didn't you do some research before you redesigned!


CLICK HERE TO GO TO peteski50's LINK


Post# 973906 , Reply# 95   12/15/2017 at 23:50 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        

maytag85's profile picture
This could definitely be the beginning of the end of Speed Queen...

Post# 973910 , Reply# 96   12/16/2017 at 00:48 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Watched the second video-NOT impressed at all.WILL NOT buy one of these.I can see them being returned in favor of other washers-and some of these end up in the appliance swap shops.

Post# 973911 , Reply# 97   12/16/2017 at 00:54 by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
Thanks for making the video

mark_wpduet's profile picture
Well, at least we all know that this machine can't be overloaded. I don't see how bulky would have helped. I could be wrong, I wonder what it does differently? Maybe bulky spins with water in it more to try to force the load down more? I don't know. That underwear got a bit of a soak staying on the top, but they never really got washed, only rinsed and spun.

Post# 973914 , Reply# 98   12/16/2017 at 01:21 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Tell Me Something-

Since I only joined this site a couple of months ago, does this site usually go through all the hysterics I've seen on here about this Speed Queen? Do all the brands get slammed like this? It appears rather pitiful, but then, the eccentric people (including me) who would belong to this forum aren't the public who will greatly influence the success or failure of these machines anyway. In fact, I think most of the public would just find the dialogue on here to be nutty.



Post# 973918 , Reply# 99   12/16/2017 at 01:43 by Maytag85 (Sean 1986 YouTube. )        

maytag85's profile picture
The clothes in the second video of the new 2018 Speed Queen barly moved around at all, and they were just moving back and forth and not rolling over. I don't think a lot of people are going to like the new Speed Queen design, and a lot of people may return them for something else. Local appliance dealers might loose business due to the fact that Speed Queen no longer offers a traditional top load design, and local appliance dealers were the only ones that sold a traditional top load design.

Post# 973919 , Reply# 100   12/16/2017 at 01:56 by man114 (Buffalo)        

The way around this. Import/produce washers that use as much water as you want. Provide them only to members of a specific membership club. You just can't import/make a ton and you can't sell them in a traditional retail fashion, only provide them to club members. Based on the DOE law and the way it is written this would pretty much skirt the law.

Post# 973932 , Reply# 101   12/16/2017 at 05:46 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Training video

mrb627's profile picture
Remember in the training video, they said the programming was still being tweaked. Maybe waiting for a second gen machine is best. Here are some observations...

1. There appears to be only three distinct water levels on the machine. Auto sensingjust picks one or ups to the next.

2. Presoak is now labelled Soak. Is it no longer a prewashing bath?

3. The second video was left at medium soil. Perhaps, like the WP Gentle Wash system, the agitation profile slows down towards the end of the wash phase. A longer wash phase may have started with a more aggressive profile.


Does the owners manual give any tips to loading?

Malcolm



Post# 973933 , Reply# 102   12/16/2017 at 06:25 by chetlaham (United States)        
Slamming brands

chetlaham's profile picture
It is completely normal. Yes we have passion- but you need passion in order to get progress in anything. You need to feel what those millions of others will feel when it goes right or wrong. View us as professional washer critics, much like there are professional food critics.


Granted the public is the ultimate force behind any product, but I know for a fact appliance makers read AW.org. Further several members on here are actual engineers or designers of appliances while several others are very experienced service techs. All which show tremendous passion.


All in all I love being one of the many, many pro judges! :)


Post# 973934 , Reply# 103   12/16/2017 at 06:28 by chetlaham (United States)        
Dismantling video

chetlaham's profile picture
Hey Loraine, if Speed Queen lets you, post the tech sheet. Curious about the electrical/logic/cycle aspect.

Post# 973935 , Reply# 104   12/16/2017 at 06:38 by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod)        

toploader55's profile picture
Thanks for spending the time to make these videos.

On the water level... It makes sense that a lower level may work better for this machine as the Beloved Frigidaire 1-18 has a better turnover with a lower water level in some cases.


Post# 973947 , Reply# 105   12/16/2017 at 08:18 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

The impassioned, emotional, informative/educational, occasionally irrational posts†are what makes AW the only online forum I bother with. †I've checked out†other (often heavily moderated) sites and found them to be dry as dust and boring as all get-out. †Unlike many other topic-based websites, AW allows, through the various forums, discussion on virtually†every†aspect of life. †

I'm an anomaly here. †Although I appreciate vintage appliances, I will never own one. †I don't have a collection. I have never and will never so much as change a belt on a washer, much less painstakingly restore a broken down vintage rust bucket to showroom-quality gleam. †The wealth of experience, knowledge and expertise here concerning appliances among the membership is unparalleled.†

While I love watching video footage of gatherings, wash-ins and conventions, I will never attend one. †I drive past†webmaster Robert's house when visiting friends in Minneapolis who live near him. It would†never occur to me to stop by to meet him and see his collection. Yet having said all that†I have been a regular for many years and can't imagine not visiting the site several times each day. †In fact, AW is the only forum-based website I participate in.

I've grown to appreciate (or at least tolerate) everyone's eccentricities and idiosyncrasies, just as others †tolerate mine (see the two paragraphs above). †Can't imagine ever blocking anyone no matter how much I disagree with them. †

Frankly, I'm quite happy the uninitiated general public might find some of our discussions head-shakingly nutty/neurotic/downright bizarre. †As with Minnesota winters, it keeps out the riffraff. Well, most of it, anyway, LOL. 👍




This post was last edited 12/16/2017 at 09:46
Post# 973962 , Reply# 106   12/16/2017 at 08:56 by chetlaham (United States)        
Robert's Collection

chetlaham's profile picture
I would give a lot to see it in person, and use his 1-18, but its to far away for me. And I am not to thrilled about his down sizing. But in any case I think someone should give him a new in box 2017 Speed Queen as a Christmas present. He deserves it- and what a way to pass down the tradition of a future washer collector opening a new in box washers thats 40-50years old.


@Frigilux, I agree and not to worry. I myself have never restored a 1-18 or something that was badly rusted, and honestly my interests are more in 80s and 90s washers and 70s-80's dishwasher rather than truly vintage stuff. Except if its a Maytag wringer, those have always had a special place in heart. Though yet again I have never restored one.


As for the general public who judges us I have learned one thing: Its best not to care what they think. We are 18+, they no longer have control. I have a bigger opinion of them then they ever could of me. As is there are many others out there (thanks to the internet) which I have discovered who have similar talents and appreciations be it cooking, trains, physics, realestate, astronomy, traffic lights, plants, ect, ect. Every single thing the general public can't live without came from people like us. What you don't think those who created the Iphone, internet, Amazon, ect didn't spend years infatuated in their ambition? Laughing and crying over obstacles and break throughs? Many professionals would be viewed as insane for being their true selves- simply because most people can not even begin to comprehend what dedication looks like.




Post# 973981 , Reply# 107   12/16/2017 at 10:14 by washman (Butler, PA)        
to answer Johnrk question

washman's profile picture

yes.  We're all a bit daffy when it comes to appliances.  Some go ga-ga over things that I would never have 1 nanosecond of interest in, others probably think, and with good reason, that I might be a couple cans short of a six pack.  I mean who else lobbies on behalf of Speed Queen yet receives no financial compensation? Who else worries about whether or not Frig goes back to the dark side and starts using PODS again?

Does anyone else make a distinction between union made things and non union made things?

 

Where else can you go and find 2 sharply divided camps on DOE regs vs a rollback or elimination of said regs?


where else can you go and find information on detergents and real world advice on them, not sanitized lab results from CR?

 

Talk about free entertainment.....................!


Post# 973988 , Reply# 108   12/16/2017 at 10:51 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        
Why Not a Better Design?

iowabear's profile picture

I agree with reply #94 by peteski50, this design could and should have been better.

 

Of course that would mean that it would look obviously different, even to the casual buyer.  Many people will look at the tub and agitator in the 2018 model and just assume it works like the old one.  And if the lid locks, and if it cleans "well enough," maybe they will never know!

 

I have to wonder if this was another case of marketing over function.


Post# 973989 , Reply# 109   12/16/2017 at 11:01 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        

speedqueen's profile picture
I'm proud to be one of the wacky people on here. Despite my sometimes cantankerous nature around here I try not to incite arguments and be diplomatic, as do most of us here but we all can get a little(I know I'm understating it) impassioned.

No place I'd rather spend a Saturday right now than AW.


Post# 974017 , Reply# 110   12/16/2017 at 12:28 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

This post has been removed by the member who posted it.



Post# 974097 , Reply# 111   12/16/2017 at 18:31 by man114 (Buffalo)        
IowaBear

I think you are right, many people won't even know because of the lid lock. They'll load the clothes, let it wash. If the clothes come out pretty clean and with the amount of water it uses they'll likely come out fairly clean, most people will never have a clue. The machine looks pretty simple and will probably last a very long time.

Post# 974113 , Reply# 112   12/16/2017 at 20:14 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

I thought the lid only locked for the spin.

Post# 974116 , Reply# 113   12/16/2017 at 20:36 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

It doesn't lock during fill and agitation but action stops when opened, automatically resumes when closed (without requiring that Start be pressed).


Post# 974118 , Reply# 114   12/16/2017 at 20:53 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

I thought I remembered the guy in the sales video (now taken down) saying that it locked after five minutes to give customers time to add a forgotten item without the inconvenience of unlocking and re-locking.

 

 But that it would still unlock "quickly" anytime as long as the machine was not spinning.  But maybe I'm not remembering that correctly.

 

 

 

 


Post# 974121 , Reply# 115   12/16/2017 at 21:12 by glhturbo2 (Reidsville, NC)        
New Design?!

First off, I want to say thank you Eugene for taking the time to post a video of this new machine. Times are changing, for better or for worst.. Now, I have used several kinds of washers, old and new; and everything in between. From a modern day front loader (GE) to a 'Maytag' with a washplate, to a Frigidaire Unimatic; and a Maytag A806 (daily driver). This thing is not that impressive from what I have seen. The rollover is very slow, notice it takes quite some time for the brightly colored towels to start moving into the water.

Like it or not, the top loader design is probably on it's way out the door. Although, like a few others, I am NOT impressed with anything new. That is just my observation and my opinion. My clothes get very dirty and I need a good machine to get the clothes clean. The 432 could do so, just don't see this new machine living up to expectations that Speed Queen is known for.

I also wish appliance stores would have these machines hooked up, whenever I go into an appliance store, nothing is ever hooked up. Personally, if you had people see what the machine was doing, sales would shift in different directions. Though, one could argue that you could look these up on Youtube, though not everyone has the luxury of doing that. I just wish I could go back to the 50s and 60s and bring those old water hogs back with me. The old machines are not perfect but they suit me well.

Best of luck to anyone in the market for a new machine next year.

-Tyler


Post# 974122 , Reply# 116   12/16/2017 at 21:15 by johnrk (BP TX)        
I'll Never Understand

why English speakers can't distinguish between "its" and "it's".

Do they just not understand contractions? I was taught a half-century ago in school that if I wasn't sure about this one, simply to un-contract "it's" back to "it is". If it sounds wrong, it is wrong. This was of course for children who couldn't seem to get the possessive side of grammar at all.


Post# 974124 , Reply# 117   12/16/2017 at 21:25 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Most likely phone autocorrect doing that. No need to nit pick an otherwise well worded and written post.

Post# 974128 , Reply# 118   12/16/2017 at 21:54 by joelippard (Hickory, NC)        
Oh My!

joelippard's profile picture

It doesn't work in the old fashioned way anymore, what a shame, they've ruined it!


Post# 974130 , Reply# 119   12/16/2017 at 22:16 by johnrk (BP TX)        

This post has been removed by the member who posted it.



Post# 974132 , Reply# 120   12/16/2017 at 22:20 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Lid lock

Locks shortly after filling. Pressing pause will instantly unlock it unless itís spinning. The lid can be forced open several times before it will eventually break the lid lock.

Post# 974134 , Reply# 121   12/16/2017 at 22:58 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

There is a difference between one little word that nobody would notice vs an entire post/paragraph that is errored to the point of being unreadable. The difference being its rude to say something in one case, and in the other case having to say something because its unreadable. It seems especially rude to nitpick an otherwise well worded/written post.

I find it particularly amusing of you to draw to the conclusion that I don't value communication skills over my mention of this. I guess you don't notice that I rarely mess up a word in my posts, further pointing out that its pointless to nitpick one little word.



P.S. I had to manually change the autocorrected "it's" to "its" while typing this on my iPad.


Post# 974137 , Reply# 122   12/16/2017 at 23:25 by Infusor (Usa)        

This guy is rude to everybody, he even made a snarky nasty comment on kirks youtube channel when kirk posted the training video of the speed queen saying the speaker was mumbling and needed to "learn how to speak" kirk blocked him, some people are just a holes, people like that will never get anywhere in life, just report him to robert. We have no tolerance for such negativity on here!

Post# 974140 , Reply# 123   12/16/2017 at 23:59 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
speed queen quality

Let's get back on topic about this new speed queen. I enjoy its build tough quality. I don't think we should immediately condemn this machine just because it didn't clean particular articles of clothes very well. I know how users like Maytag85/Sean feels, but it is unfair to slam Speed Queen.
What if they're still working out the bugs? What if it's the particular type/brand of detergent/additive(s) used? You have to admit that Speed Queen's hands were completely tied. So let's get back on topic about this new revolutionary Speed Queen.


Post# 974154 , Reply# 124   12/17/2017 at 00:51 by Imperial70 (******)        

He attacked me too. Then a couple of others chimed in. I was only offering constructive input. Some people can be tools.

Post# 974167 , Reply# 125   12/17/2017 at 04:15 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Infusor-

I commented on the salesman's poor speaking on Rivas' channel, being surprised that someone in a position like that wasn't better trained. I removed the comment myself, haven't been "blocked" from anywhere. As for being "rude to everybody" I'd suggest reading my thread of comments.

However, if my comments aren't welcome here, then I'll cease making them.



Post# 974178 , Reply# 126   12/17/2017 at 05:58 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

Agitating tubs are not a new idea. However, out of all the wash systems that were developed over the past 100 years, there are only three types that have persisted until now. Vertical axis washers, impeller machines and straight vane agitators. Agitubs are not one of them. They have appeared at various times and in different incarnations and they have disappeared. Unless this latest offering from SQ delivers good and persistent results, it will disappear again. The more SQ adulterate their 'traditional' top loaders with functions and restrictions that are common to most HE machines, the less they will appeal to consumers looking for a regular, traditional American top loader. With social media allowing people to share and seek information instantly and across the globe, consumer reviews will be vital in determining the commercial success of this latest product.



Post# 974226 , Reply# 127   12/17/2017 at 10:54 by Infusor (Usa)        

I really wish whirlpool still made the calypso, of course anytime something actually works and is good they get rid of it. Why didnt they just spend money improving it instead of getting rid of it, even the F&P drive system they used in the cabrios after was way better than what they have now, the new cabrios are PITIFUL!!!!!

Post# 974229 , Reply# 128   12/17/2017 at 11:13 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
I think in part of it is cost, the Calypso costs more to make by the looks of it. Also the Calypso name was soured by angry customers and reliability issues. I will never forget the day more than 10 years ago when the Sears floor had more returned Calypsos then appliances on display.

Post# 974231 , Reply# 129   12/17/2017 at 11:20 by wishwash (Illinois)        

That was also around the time Whirlpool had bought Maytag out and was putting Norge transmissions in them. They really killed off anything but their direct drive platform. Not really a high point for US appliance companies.

I'm assuming the fancy F&P style Cabrios went away for the same reason, cost. We do have the agipeller Maytag which I suppose is similar to the Cabrio. I'd really have to see the two side by side to pass any judgement.

Again, seems everything is now in favor of the horizontal axis machines. At least they all have windows...


Post# 974234 , Reply# 130   12/17/2017 at 11:32 by chetlaham (United States)        
Horizontal access

chetlaham's profile picture
Said it before, but I think this thread is the place: We will all be compelled to switch to front loads. SQ is just one example. As TLs must please the DOE, everything they were good for will be gone or fall behind FLs. As the older generation retires, and as words spreads, kids today will be buying FLs no questions asked.


Yup- those were the lows in the industry.


Post# 974240 , Reply# 131   12/17/2017 at 12:35 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
beat me to it

blanket video coming up next









CLICK HERE TO GO TO Lorainfurniture's LINK


Post# 974241 , Reply# 132   12/17/2017 at 12:42 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
LOl- Sorry, I could not resist.

I just want to say you are doing a stellar job on these vids. :)


Post# 974244 , Reply# 133   12/17/2017 at 12:58 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
thanks

I really appreciate the support. Im kind of a private guy, so I am a bit nervous to do commentary. Worst, I literally have no experience editing videos.

I binge watched several editing videos last night so hopefully subsequent videos will be somewhat better quality.


This washer is shaping up to be a pretty decent unit.


Post# 974246 , Reply# 134   12/17/2017 at 13:05 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
Loraine, you are more than fine. I have no video editing skills either. Yes there are always those on the net (and everywhere else) that make negative comments just to get a rise out of others, but the overwhelming majority appreciate your time and effort.

Post# 974247 , Reply# 135   12/17/2017 at 13:10 by Infusor (Usa)        

I think you are doing a great job on the commentary, way better than i could do haha, we all appreciate the videos for educating us on fairly new technology. New for speed queen at least.

Post# 974251 , Reply# 136   12/17/2017 at 13:41 by logixx (Germany)        
Only one thing

logixx's profile picture
You need more light in your videos; everything is perfectly fine. 👍🏻 Thanks for the time to make these videos - I know this takes more time than one might think.

Post# 974255 , Reply# 137   12/17/2017 at 14:00 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

The videos are nice!† Lighting can be tricky and having a bunch of extra lights around can get in the way of handling the camera when moving it for various angles.

This "empty" wash video shows how gentle is the action.† There's not much churning of the water compared to other agitator machines.

I'm curious to see the Bulky, Delicate, and Handwash cycles.


Post# 974257 , Reply# 138   12/17/2017 at 14:18 by NOLAwashing (New Orleans)        
Thanks

Thanks for taking the time to do the videos and share the info with us. I am not too knowledgeable when it comes to computer, so I would miss out on all of this if it weren't for nice folks like you. Thanks for sharing :)
Todd


Post# 974266 , Reply# 139   12/17/2017 at 15:03 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
blanket wash






CLICK HERE TO GO TO Lorainfurniture's LINK


Post# 974271 , Reply# 140   12/17/2017 at 15:26 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        
My Opinions...

speedqueen's profile picture
Empty video:
Not impressed with their claim of moves more water through clothes while the old model moved the clothes through the water. This machine obviously works the opposite way, despite their claims. The water currents are pitiful.
**************************************************************

Blanket Wash:
I am impressed with this video, I think these machines work better with less water. Makes me reconsider the machines a little, I do hope they fix the auto-fill programming, if I recall correctly the first video used auto-fill too and the machine overfilled and we got less washing action than shown here.
**************************************************************

Cinematography:
Excellent job! I appreciate you making these fine videos of the action, as do most of us here, I presume.


Post# 974275 , Reply# 141   12/17/2017 at 16:11 by KenmoreBD (Mass, usa )        
Speed Queen

In all honesty, I think two things would make this washer much better, and would not change the overall design all that much.

1. Lock the tub in place during the wash and rinse. Yes, you would need a mode shifter. However, if they used good quality parts a mode shifter would not be a problem.

2a- Bigger fins on the base of the agitator. The speed queen will fill to the top, so like any deep fill top loader it will need something to create more action on high water levels.
2b. I think the overall agitation speed needs to be faster.


-Andy


Post# 974294 , Reply# 142   12/17/2017 at 17:23 by peteski50 (New York)        
Speed Queen 2018 top load comparison to frigidaire FFLE2022M

peteski50's profile picture
Their seems to be better performance with less water in the tub, but I agree with KenmoreBD something needs to be done with the agitator to create more friction! But even better they maybe should have not uses a agitator at all! Check out this wash action in Kirks video attached. Come on speed queen didn't you do some investigative work before you produced this monster!


CLICK HERE TO GO TO peteski50's LINK


Post# 974304 , Reply# 143   12/17/2017 at 18:16 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

Thanks again Eugene!  I think you're being completely fair, unbiased and objective with your videos.  You are showing the entire unedited cycles and people are drawing their own conclusions.  Exactly as it should be.

 

I'm sure the folks at Speed Queen expected exactly this and are watching the reactions here and and on YouTube. As Olav noted above, they have benefited tremendously from social media in the past but it's a double-edged sword.  Everyone here who is participating is actually helping them by letting them know the concerns and how best to address them in their new marketing campaigns. 

 

They said 19% gentler and 5% better cleaning in the sales presentation video.  I can easily accept the first claim.  As for the second, well I'm not from MO but they're going to have to show me.

 

 

 


Post# 974319 , Reply# 144   12/17/2017 at 19:13 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

I would've liked to have seen them stick with a design where the tub is stationary during the wash cycle, I feel like the agitub approach was purely a cost cutting measure with them desiring to save on the engineering costs of having to develop a new transmission for this machine, and any potential for said new part to prematurely fail and cost them even more money fixing it plus the PR problem that would follow.

Unless they can pull some magical computer programming wizardry out of their hats to maximize turnover, with the latest video (thanks once again Eugene!) I remain skeptical as to how well this machine will actually perform in the real world. They may just have to pay to develop that transmission after all... And if they do I'll gladly buy one.


Post# 974341 , Reply# 145   12/17/2017 at 20:45 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        

I Agree, Iím not sure if this washer will work better than the old one. If it winds up even being close, Iíd say thatís a great success. My observations:

I think the washer uses too much water in some cases. Iím pretty sure they know but are adding water to appease the customer

I think the agitator needs a little something extra to get the clothes moving when itís overloaded. Inevitably people will stuff this machine and complain, because it really doesnít do well. I figure a bit of a corkscrew or something.


Post# 974342 , Reply# 146   12/17/2017 at 20:49 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Turnover?

So every load I have done so far has had good turnover except the one that I overloaded. Iím definitely not a huge fan of the agitub idea, I think they could have designed a shifter mechanism easily. Shifters rarely go bad these days. Without that tub they really could whip that agitator.

Post# 974374 , Reply# 147   12/18/2017 at 01:50 by scrubflex (bronx, new york)        

Thanks for making the videos LorainF, excellent job...I've been dying to see the 2018 Speed Queen agitub in action...could you make some videos using the small to (smallest) water levels/washloads please?

Post# 974465 , Reply# 148   12/18/2017 at 14:41 by Brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

The first F&P electronic machines had (Gentle Annie) no mode shifter. There was a metal tab on the wash basket drive shaft and a corresponding tab on the agitator drive shaft. Any time the agitator moved more than 340 degrees the spin tub would turn.

It is a belt driven computer controlled motor. For the Gentle cycles it can slow the agitation speed down but rotate the tub as well for more gentleness.

You can do both with only a computer controlled motor.


Post# 974466 , Reply# 149   12/18/2017 at 14:47 by Infusor (Usa)        

I don't think the new speed queen would be so bad if the motor reversed directions more aggressively and usee a faster stroke like the immersion care, i mean come on you have 1 horsepower use it!!! The immersion care has 1/2 horsepower and it moves clothes better.

Post# 974486 , Reply# 150   12/18/2017 at 17:08 by mielerod69 (Australia)        
More vigorous wash action

mielerod69's profile picture
The SQ needs to beef up the agitation. Like this Australian made Hoover which is over 10 years old.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO mielerod69's LINK


Post# 974548 , Reply# 151   12/19/2017 at 00:28 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Maybe as someone here suggested-put larger blades on the base of the agitator-that should make a difference.Or try the one way DA "auger" upper blades.

Post# 974554 , Reply# 152   12/19/2017 at 00:58 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        
Reply #150

Wow, that Hoover is kicking ass and taking names!

Post# 974636 , Reply# 153   12/19/2017 at 16:50 by mielerod69 (Australia)        
Fisher & Paykel agitation

mielerod69's profile picture
Even the F & P kicks some ass with its agitation. This machine is the US model which is rated here in Oz as a 10 kg (22 lb) capacity. F & P lead the way in top loading washers.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO mielerod69's LINK


Post# 974637 , Reply# 154   12/19/2017 at 16:54 by mielerod69 (Australia)        
Soil removal F & P vs SQ

mielerod69's profile picture
Our consumer magazine tested washers in September and the SQ didn't do well in the soil removal test. The F & P removed nearly 20% more in an 8 lb test load.

  View Full Size
Post# 974641 , Reply# 155   12/19/2017 at 17:26 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Before I learned the new SQ would have an agitub I was expecting it to at least perform like the F&P. 

 

When I was shopping a couple years ago I almost pulled the trigger on that machine but went for the SQ because it was traditional topload design, and surprisingly, cheaper than the F&P. Now comparing the two I'd pick the F&P over the new SQ easily, the turnover on the F&P kicks ass compared to the new SQ and seems to rival the old one. I also like the large tub, and the overall way it functions seems pretty to the point for a modern TL. 


Post# 974647 , Reply# 156   12/19/2017 at 17:53 by cuffs054 (MONTICELLO, GA)        

The Fridgidaire does that annoying sense and fill like my Maytag, ten minutes into cycle and no action. But at least the F puts enough water in to wash with. The Maytag even on "deep wash" leaves clothes dry through much of the cycle. I thought I could sell them to a used app place. I called three all said they would not come and get them even for free.


Post# 974654 , Reply# 157   12/19/2017 at 18:30 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

BTW, when looking at the consumer review between SQ and F&P, it should be noted that in terms of cleaning, stain removal and rinsing, most front loaders would be rated very close to the F&P.

The cleaning outcomes I get from my SQ are vastly superior to 54%. I'd say that they are closer to 80%. Couple that with 97% rinse performance and my machine performs right up there with the best of them. Cold water washing, in this case tap cold, does not work all that well on regular to heavy soiling in any type of washer, especially not in a regular American top loader with short wash times. Most of us here know this already and puts the kind of comparisons done by CR organizations into a clearer perspective.




This post was last edited 12/19/2017 at 23:21
Post# 974655 , Reply# 158   12/19/2017 at 18:46 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

Thanks for bringing JoeyPete's videos to attention, I had not seen them.

There are some interesting "procedural" differences between the new model and my older F&Ps.

As I have brought to attention several times, the current WashSmart model is not HE and is a nice choice for a "traditional" deep-fill agitator machine.† The final spin is 1,100 RPM.


Post# 974656 , Reply# 159   12/19/2017 at 18:54 by mayfan69 (Brisbane Queensland Australia)        
Fisher & Paykel

mayfan69's profile picture
As Glenn has stated, here's my 10kg F&P Washsmart in action.

You can still choose a manual water level and deep rinse fill.

Cheers
Leon


Post# 974659 , Reply# 160   12/19/2017 at 19:38 by mielerod69 (Australia)        
Soil removal 80%?

mielerod69's profile picture
Hi Rapunzel,
It shows the F&P is a superior machine in wash-ability in cold water compared to the SQ. BTW the incoming cold water temperature is controlled at 20įC. Granted if you use warm or hot water, it will increase the soil removal rating, but F&P has a 20% head start before even switching to warm or hot wash.
What evidence do you have to claim 80%. Unless your using one of these swatches in the test load, it would be hard to make such a claim. Just saying....


  View Full Size
Post# 974675 , Reply# 161   12/19/2017 at 22:34 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

Hi there Rod,

The F&P may have an advantage in cold water, but this margin of advantage over SQ narrows exponentially when warm or hot water are selected in addition to a soaking period or in combination with a pre-wash.

You ask what evidence I have? My clothes are the evidence. In fact, because I know how to optimize my washer's performance, I will revise my previous claim up to an 85% dirt removal score - just saying.




This post was last edited 12/20/2017 at 00:09
Post# 974687 , Reply# 162   12/19/2017 at 23:44 by johnb300m (Chicago)        

johnb300m's profile picture
Mmmhmmm. Thatís nice. Iím sure your laundry is clean.
But nobody truly knows the soil removal effectiveness delta unless they have a spectrophotometer.


Post# 974691 , Reply# 163   12/20/2017 at 00:27 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

Let me assure you John,

My eyes have the acuity of a spectrophotometer and my nose is an olfactometer when it comes to laundry.


Post# 974700 , Reply# 164   12/20/2017 at 01:52 by mielerod69 (Australia)        

mielerod69's profile picture
Dear Rapunzel,

I'm not putting into question your laundry skills. I'm trying to remain factual and using documented evidence in my comparison between the two brands. The Australian Bureau of Statistics state that over 70% of Australians use cold water as their wash temperature choice. I don't personally agree washing in cold for many reasons. I use the 30/40/60ļC rule depending on the fabric type and colour.
Of course modifying time, temperature, detergent and mechanical action can vary the end result.
I have worked in the past as a laundry product manager and have some knowledge in the testing procedures manufacturers have to undergo to achieve their energy and water ratings. I have personally been to these test laboratories and have seen this first hand.
Washing machine manufactures have to achieve a minimum 80% soil removal to pass.
The 10 kg capacity Fisher and Paykel can achieve the minimum 80% with a warm wash and cycle time of 68 minutes. The 7.5 kg capacity SQ can achieve the same soil removal with a warm wash with a cycle time on the Normal Eco warm wash with a cycle time of 108 minutes. These figures are done with the manufactures claimed loads.
It is clear that the F & P wash technology is superior and they have managed to program the algorithms to achieve the desired result.


Post# 974704 , Reply# 165   12/20/2017 at 04:09 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

G'day Rod,

I have the utmost faith in Fisher & Paykel's algorithms. Fisher and Paykel make an excellent and sophisticated product that can hold its own in a global market. If I did not have my Speed Queen I would consider purchasing an F&P washer. At work and on other occasions I've had the pleasure of using F&P top loaders and find them to be very good. I would even go so far and state that Australian and New Zealand top loading washer designs are of the highest quality and show a great deal of innovation and creative thinking. Equally, I find it incredibly sad that this industry has been driven out of Australia, like so many other valuable industries; and we are worse off for it.

However, I prefer standard American top loaders. That is why I have stuck with Speed Queen for over thirty years and I've not been disappointed, yet.


Post# 974721 , Reply# 166   12/20/2017 at 08:11 by johnb300m (Chicago)        

johnb300m's profile picture
LMAO.
You can be great at laundry Rapunzel, but scientific calibrated equipment your eyes and nose are not.
They are qualitative instruments at best. 😙


Post# 974747 , Reply# 167   12/20/2017 at 10:00 by jerrod6 (United States of America)        
soil removal requirements?

I don't think there are any soil removal requirements included in the energy efficiency tests performed in the USA are there?

If not the clothes could pass the efficiency test and still not be cleaned properly.


Post# 974751 , Reply# 168   12/20/2017 at 10:30 by sPeEDqUeEN (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        
Things to consider...

speedqueen's profile picture
"No one judges w/o spectrometer..." I still remember that the old CR reports from the 1940s used magnification on the fabric swatches and visual comparison. A spectrometer would only be required if the differences between swatches were a few percentage points in variance. If you are comparing two tested items side by side, a qualitative visual observation could be used to tell which is cleaner.

Cleaning tests are really only relative anyway. IE, "this is cleaner than that". The constant for the tests that the machines and fabric swatches are judged against is the unstained fabric swatch. Without a spectrometer, one could still line up the swatches in order from dirtiest to cleanest. A spectrometer only adds arbitrary numbers and percentage points to the swatches, it doesn't change the order.

We also must remember that when these machines are tested, it is using the DOE normal cycle, results on other cycles actually used by the consumer are likely to be different because the machine is then working to design specifications and is not handicapped by the requirements.

Another factor to consider and I think that most can agree here that the detergent used matters more than the machine. If you load up a TOL modern heated front load with Purex detergent and pit it against an old prewar bolt-down Bendix that is handicapped for the test by skipping the soak and cutting the wash time down to a few minutes, if the Bendix has Tide instead of Purex, I can all but guarantee that the old Bendix would out-perform the modern, heated FL machine.


Post# 974754 , Reply# 169   12/20/2017 at 11:32 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
F&P compared to SQ

mrb627's profile picture
The test between the two models above is flawed.

Comparing the wash plate model of the F&P with a traditional SQ is not a fair fight. When the F&P is set for HE mode, there will be a lot more concentration of detergent on an 8 pound load than when you place the same 8 pound load into a SQ and select the maximum water level.

Malcolm


Post# 974756 , Reply# 170   12/20/2017 at 12:15 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        
Flawed Testing...

iowabear's profile picture

I haven't followed the Consumer Reports testing for a few years now. 

 

Back when I did, it seemed the machines with the longer "normal" cycles got the best scores for cleaning and worst scores for gentleness.  And the opposite was also true, the machines with the shorter "normal" cycles got worst scores for cleaning and the best scores for gentleness.

 

It wasn't the kind of testing that seemed useful, or even interesting, to me.


Post# 974772 , Reply# 171   12/20/2017 at 16:01 by mielerod69 (Australia)        
My Bad

mielerod69's profile picture
Hi Malcolm,

Thanks for the pick up. The difference between the two models is one letter WL vs. WA.
I have included the agitator model in the comparison. F & P's dirt removal is still better.
As you mentioned, maybe the new 2018 SQ will do better with less water in the wash as shown in the blanket test video. Not only is there a higher detergent concentration with a HE machine, but also the fabrics rub against one another to shift the dirt out.


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Post# 974775 , Reply# 172   12/20/2017 at 16:54 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Is This

permitted by copyright? CU certainly prohibits re-distribution.

Post# 974781 , Reply# 173   12/20/2017 at 17:12 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        

As far as I know you can re publish copyright material as long as you arenít making money off of it. ie educational purposes

Post# 974782 , Reply# 174   12/20/2017 at 17:26 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Ask Robert

He'll confirm what I questioned.

Post# 974796 , Reply# 175   12/20/2017 at 19:27 by sPeEDqUeEN (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        

speedqueen's profile picture
CU is certainly a No No, but this isn't CU, this is an Australian consumer magazine of the same type.

Content isn't just redistributable if you don't make money on it because while the person posting doesn't make money, the content creator which relies on paid subscriptions, either paper or online, to make money, loses money because the information is accessible without them ever receiving a payment.

Weather this is legal pertains to Australian copyright law. I do, however, know for certain that posting CR results, at least overtly, is illegal. Same reason that there used to be the old 1950s CU reports listed on the main page of AW until Robert realized they they were still actually under copyright law and took them down a few years ago.


Post# 974803 , Reply# 176   12/20/2017 at 20:48 by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
Back to the 2018 SQ

mark_wpduet's profile picture
Am I understanding correctly that this model hasn't been released yet, and they are still testing it? Or is this the final product?

Post# 974805 , Reply# 177   12/20/2017 at 21:04 by henene4 (Germany)        
Final Product

Given there has been service training, there had to be specification testing and that production will start in something like 11 or 12 days, that should be the final product.

What I am curious about right now is what all the speciality cycles are and what they do...


Post# 974811 , Reply# 178   12/20/2017 at 21:34 by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, the Netherlands)        

foraloysius's profile picture
The new Speed Queens are on their website now.

speedqueen.com/products/top-load...



Post# 974815 , Reply# 179   12/20/2017 at 22:32 by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

stricklybojack's profile picture
.
Wow, 7 year warranty on the TOL machine...


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Post# 974825 , Reply# 180   12/21/2017 at 00:10 by sPeEDqUeEN (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        
Warranty

speedqueen's profile picture
I don't particularly like this arbitrary standard they have set up for warranty length. The mechanism is all the same no matter BOL or TOL. Same mechanism, same reliability. This says to me that they will only offer a good warranty when the profit margin is good. The old 432 may have had less of a warranty but that was justified as the statistics said the standard timer was less reliable than electronic controls and they let the user know that within their advertising. This just seems like a ploy to get the user to pay more for the same thing. In this day of electronic controls, adding features doesn't cost anything, unlike in the mechanical timer days where each extra feature required more wires, switches, contacts, etc. Getting TOL just means you pay more for them to unlock all the features the machine can do. I highly doubt the TOL board costs more from the supplier than the BOL board. Putting the warranty into this pricing scheme just seems ridiculous to me.

Just my opinion.


Post# 974831 , Reply# 181   12/21/2017 at 05:38 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

1) The look of the new console on the TR7 has really grown on me. A lot.  Ditto the rear-console front-loader.


2) Not completely sold on the wash action, but dayamn how cool is it that this washer is basically a motor, a belt, a pump, an inlet valve and a rock-solid board?

 

3) I wish SQ/Alliance and local dealers nothing but the best in the marketplace with this new product.


Post# 974832 , Reply# 182   12/21/2017 at 05:42 by henene4 (Germany)        
Warranty

Sure they need a higher profit margin to refinance the additional cost for providing that warranty.

But 7 years seems a little out of place to me. Sure its long, but it almost seems like they know when the machine will go (year 8 onwards).
From a sales perspective, 3, 5 and 10 years would have been rounder, nicer to sell.



@Frigilux

Well, that is the nice thing about FLs. They have been and always be just that.

Oh, and you forgot the suspension in your countup ;)


Post# 974836 , Reply# 183   12/21/2017 at 05:58 by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, the Netherlands)        

foraloysius's profile picture
Apparently price is not everything for the length of the warranty. The stainless steel frontloader and it's matching dryer only get a 5 year warranty.

Post# 974841 , Reply# 184   12/21/2017 at 06:56 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Frigilux

Thanks for your posting. It shines.

Post# 974845 , Reply# 185   12/21/2017 at 07:38 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Warranty...

mrb627's profile picture

The warranty is a bit unusual across the FL lineup. For example, if you select the FL rear console washer, 5 yr. The matching dryer, 7 yr. What's up with that?

Meanwhile, the SS FL washer and dryer get 5 yr. The SS dryer is 5 yr while the white rear control is 7 yr. Longer warranty on the cheaper model. WTH?

Malcolm


Post# 974862 , Reply# 186   12/21/2017 at 10:37 by henene4 (Germany)        
Dryer warranty

Isn't the white rear control dryer the matching dryer to the 7 year warranty toploader? SO it would make sense it gets the toploaders warranty.

But the FLs really should get a Warranty bump as well. But their logic is probably to a) sell people towards the TL and b) that the FL is still the same base machine and thus warranty related questions did not change.


Post# 974881 , Reply# 187   12/21/2017 at 12:28 by mtn1584 (USA)        
I must say

theyíve taken an ugly front loader and made it even uglier by reversing the door. I like the T/L washer console BUT as a current SQ customer I donít know if Iíd shell out that kind of money for a new SQ washer. For the first time in a long time Iíd likely consider other choices of washing machines if the need were to arise. The new Maytag commercial TL has the kind of wash action I like, however their MSRP is also ridiculously high!
I really do not like the wash action on the new SQ TL and I think Iíd look to Maytag or Whirlpool for a front Loader if need be.
Mike


Post# 974886 , Reply# 188   12/21/2017 at 13:40 by trappn (Illinois)        
Buyer's Remorse

Bought our 92 Series Speed Queen a couple of years ago.

It's a nice machine. We are satisfied with how well it cleans & rinses. It, also, appears to be gentler on our clothes than the old Kenmore direct drive.

We are intrigued by the new clean-sheet design SQ has rolled out; however, we wouldn't consider buying one.

Everyone has their own hot buttons, when it comes to household appliances. Ours turned out to be the automatic temperature control we had enjoyed for 20 years.

During the winter, our incoming water temperature is lucky to exceed 55 degrees Fahrenheit. That's a long way from the 20 degrees Celsius that F & P offers.

There are various ways to ensure a warm water wash temperature, but we're tired of fiddling with it. A water valve that splits hot & cold @ a 50-50 ratio sounds good, but it really isn't.

So, the washers didn't have automatic temperature control, and the dryers didn't have moisture sensors. Which glaring omission would SQ correct, first?

Well, it wasn't the automatic temperature control on the new "clean-sheet" washer, and this from a company that is based more than 250 miles "north" of where we live.

If we decided to go with something similar to the 2018 SQ washers, we'd probably opt for the F & P WashSmart.

Thanks for listening, & have a nice day.



Post# 974892 , Reply# 189   12/21/2017 at 15:04 by henene4 (Germany)        
That was what ATC was originally designed for

ATC was once invented to warrant correct temperatures even if the incoming temperatures fluctuated during a single fill.

By now, a good ATC system like F&Ps allows for that.
A bad ATC just stupidly cuts down water temperatures.


Post# 974908 , Reply# 190   12/21/2017 at 16:48 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

F&P's ATC on older models modulates the valves together to attain the target temperature, does not alternate hot and cold flow.† Hopefully it works the same on current models.


Post# 974929 , Reply# 191   12/21/2017 at 20:07 by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

yogitunes's profile picture
before I would consider making that Agi-Tub a priority of reason to purchase this machine.....

energy usage would be a factor, at least for me......the amount of water this machine uses, just on the wash portion alone, and the energy needed to heat that water IS a concern...the EcoRinse means nothing....so I save a few gallons of tap water...big whoop!...and for the price of the machine to boot!

whether you like them or not, the FLer is your far better choice......less water all the way around, plus the energy to heat it, gentler washing, better rinsing, and a higher spin speed....don't need no special metering device to see how much it cost to run, my energy bills do that for me....

traditional agitator, Agi-tub, or impellor.....have been proven to wear your clothing out faster....

Alliance is eventually going to phase out TLers, or head towards a H2Low type of impellor setup....just because people want a lid on the top

but to each his own.....



Post# 974932 , Reply# 192   12/21/2017 at 20:51 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

All good and valid points Yogi, but only marginally so. Agitator and impeller washers come pretty close to front load washers with water and energy consumption - at least here in Australia. Maybe they'll phase out top loaders in the US, but I doubt that this will apply everywhere else where they are in use. Why waste all this time, money and effort to make top loaders more efficient - just to discontinue them. The DoE could have just told the industry to phase out vertical axis washers over a certain time frame.

SQ didn't come up with this latest design to please the greens. This is purely a commercial decision. Surely the DoE must be in consultation with all major manufacturers about how to best achieve efficiency outcomes whilst ensuring that washing machines continue to be fit for purpose. At least I would hope that there is some kind of scientific approach involved rather than some arbitrary process that pushes the envelope to a point where consumers are better off not buying new washing machines at all and regardless of washer type.

Just my two cents worth.


Post# 974997 , Reply# 193   12/22/2017 at 10:24 by jerrod6 (United States of America)        

I kind of doubt that the DOE is working with the manufacturers to insure the machines work as intended. I don't think the standards mention how well the machines wash/clean or how well they rinse; at least there is no testing of that. The standards only specify how much water and electricity must be used.



Post# 975009 , Reply# 194   12/22/2017 at 12:23 by Pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)        
model t7

pierreandreply4's profile picture
model t7 also have a warm wash warm rinse for any member info

Post# 975058 , Reply# 195   12/22/2017 at 20:16 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

If the DoE is not working with manufacturers they are not able to make informed and,thus, effective decisions, it's as simple as that. All of us understand that there are limitations to water and energy efficiency with existing technologies. Those limitations have to play a part in standard setting.

On their website the DoE state that they 'encourage all stakeholders to participate in all stages of rule making'. They also state that their regulations are derived from a multi-stage rule setting process that includes public participation.

There is also an Error Correction process.

"DOE has published a Federal Register final rule establishing a procedure through which an interested party can, within a 45-day period after DOE posts certain rules establishing or amending an energy conservation standards, identify a possible error in such a rule and request that DOE correct the error before the rule is published in the Federal Register. DOE has also issued a statement regarding DOE's final rules for energy conservation standards subject to error correction."

I don't agree that the intention is to regulate top loaders to extinction, or that the latest design by SQ indicates a complete move away from vertical axis technologies. It's rather that SQ see a benefit in the agitub design, which they believe will help their bottom line. Retooling a production line costs money. Hence, it would make better sense to keep producing the current line-up of top loaders until regulations demand that they be discontinued. When the time comes why then not just make a public announcement that top loaders will be discontinued due to new DoE regulations and that future developments will focus on front loader technologies. Nobody is doing that, yet.




This post was last edited 12/22/2017 at 22:01
Post# 975262 , Reply# 196   12/23/2017 at 22:54 by Spinmon (st. charles mo )        
look out,here comes tommorrow..

At 63 I like our 2012 AWN542 sounds and performance. I would love to see an '18/'17 equal dirt/stains/load-size wash and spin dry comparo.

If the 2018 SQ can compare to or exceed the old system,MAYBE I could handle the loss of our SQ's speed and happy sounds for the extra 15 mins and muted moaning emitted from Transless.

I DO like 2018's spin speed. The on/off electric pump no.


Post# 975265 , Reply# 197   12/23/2017 at 23:06 by johnrk (BP TX)        
Spinmon-

You're the guy I've been wanting to ask on here: what's the extra knob on your 542 for? I just bought the 432 in October and both the 542 and the 412 had been d/c'd. Does that extra knob on yours, the fabric one, set the agitate and spin speed? On my 432, the agitate & spin speed is set by the main dial, and the other two dials are for temp and water level.

Thanks-


Post# 975267 , Reply# 198   12/24/2017 at 00:28 by chetlaham (United States)        
Extra (3rd) knob

chetlaham's profile picture
Both Spin and agitate speed, with the following combinations:


Regular: Fast/Fast

Permanent Press: Fast/slow

Knits: slow/fast

Delicate: slow/slow


Hand-Wash and Delicate on the main knob force slow agitation and slow spin, while permanent press forces a slow first spin irregardless of where the speed knob is set.


Post# 975292 , Reply# 199   12/24/2017 at 09:26 by mtn1584 (USA)        
AWN542 Control Panel



  View Full Size
Post# 975311 , Reply# 200   12/24/2017 at 11:54 by electronicontrl (Grand Rapids, MI)        
Ugh!

electronicontrl's profile picture
This "washing" is depressing. Give me a wringer washer!

Post# 975333 , Reply# 201   12/24/2017 at 16:16 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
More videos soon

Did a few more basic laundry loads, my work clothes.

Whites: did an excellent job on small load, despite no bleach.

Work pants: fell flat on its face again. I did not overload it, I loaded it properly, it still did a lackluster job. The clothes came out cleaner, but not clean.

Colors/ cotton: did an excellent job.

Iíll be doing bed sheets next, and a queen size comforter.

Overall Im starting to think that this washer is just about on par with its predecessor. Itís better than most HE washers out there, but not as good as older (direct drives) washers.

Let me know what you guys think of the videos, i bought some studio lighting so hopefully that helps.


Post# 975368 , Reply# 202   12/24/2017 at 21:09 by mtn1584 (USA)        
Quick question

Have you thought of washing your flannel lined pants inside out? No matter what machine you use?
Mike


Post# 975376 , Reply# 203   12/24/2017 at 22:03 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Never considered it

My trusty direct drive does an excellent job no matter what.

In defense of speed queen, no washer other than the direct drive has been able to wash my lined pants. Not even front loaders.


Post# 975389 , Reply# 204   12/24/2017 at 23:52 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
No matter what people say, SQ TL, DDs and WP BDs were hands down the BEST washers ever made in the history of the human race. No other washers come close when all is said and done.

Post# 975391 , Reply# 205   12/24/2017 at 23:58 by Ultralux88 (Denver)        

ultralux88's profile picture

I'd be curious to know how this compares to the Speed Queen front loader. I talked some friends of mine into a Speed Queen set earlier this year, so far they have loved them, no complaints on the washability or anything, and I know they tend to have the same sort of high standards for how things come out of the wash as most collectors would. I'm probably going to invade their laundry room sometime this week while our Whirlpool DD is awaiting a new pump. 


Post# 975764 , Reply# 206   12/27/2017 at 16:02 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
coming soon






CLICK HERE TO GO TO Lorainfurniture's LINK


Post# 975771 , Reply# 207   12/27/2017 at 17:05 by johnb300m (Chicago)        

johnb300m's profile picture
eeeeeesh,
that's not so good.
I feel like SQ was too married to their current agitator design, and just modified that.
If they were more inventive with it, along the lines of WP or GE, I think the wash action would've been better.

That and even with the smaller load, the agitation speed seems too slow, even with that big beefy 1HP motor.


Post# 975780 , Reply# 208   12/27/2017 at 18:02 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

Small load reveals the action at the agitator base.† It's reasonable but would have to see how my yard socks come out on a full load.


Post# 975835 , Reply# 209   12/28/2017 at 01:49 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
Hate to say it, but my 1997 GE did way better than that on an extra small load.

Post# 975845 , Reply# 210   12/28/2017 at 08:12 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Iím really trying to love this machine

I just cant.

I never really loved the older generation speed queen, I felt like it had a hard time getting stains out. I sold it at my shop as the most reliable new washer you can buy that actually still does a decent job.

This new machine will be reliable, but itís definitely not as good as the old one. I think sq is going to alienate a big group of their middle class ďworking ď people ( people who come home with seriously dirty clothes).

Iíve been experimenting with different agitators, Iíll let you guys know if I find any improvement.


Post# 975872 , Reply# 211   12/28/2017 at 11:11 by washman (Butler, PA)        

washman's profile picture

Looks like a disaster in the making.  I fail to see how this will clean properly.


Post# 975873 , Reply# 212   12/28/2017 at 11:27 by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

gansky1's profile picture

Thanks for doing such a good job on these videos and your honest opinion of the performance, construction, etc.  Much appreciated by all.


Post# 975879 , Reply# 213   12/28/2017 at 12:34 by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod)        

toploader55's profile picture
Yes.

Thank you for your valuable time


Post# 975889 , Reply# 214   12/28/2017 at 13:33 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Thanks

I improved the lighting, aside from the actual wash action, is there anything else you would recommend to make a better video? Ie. sound, commentary, etc?

Post# 975892 , Reply# 215   12/28/2017 at 13:46 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

Always include a shot of the control panel selections for the load being run.


Post# 975904 , Reply# 216   12/28/2017 at 17:18 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

Thanks for the small load video, Eugene. I appreciate being able to see how the TR7 handles various types of loads. The lighting on this one was much better, too.

A couple of questions:

1. You mentioned upthread that only your "beloved direct drives" were able to clean your lined work pants well. What brand(s) and year of manufacture are the direct drives you're referring to?

2. You also mentioned that front-loaders didn't do a great job on the lined work pants. Any idea why they failed to cut the mustard?


Post# 975911 , Reply# 217   12/28/2017 at 18:25 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Eugene

I happen to own a late 90ís- early 2000ís kitchen aid. I like that washer in particular because it arrived to my shop in literally new condition. It was owned by an old lady. It has a porcelain top, 3 speed motor.

Just about any whirlpool built direct drive with a dual action agitator will likely do an amazing job. Iíd narrow the search to 1997-2005 ish. The last couple of years the dd washers had a failure prone transmission and that stupid automatic temperature thing that always went bad. The earlier ones may have a smaller tub, perhaps a single agitator, and just kind of look ugly.

It is a bit rough on my clothes but I donít mind as I typically buy new work pants annually.

The lg front load that I have is the wm3770hwa with sidekick washer. The washer is a great performer overall it just struggles to get the ground in dirt on my knees. Clothes are clean (except the knees a bit), and are well rinsed. Ultimately I think the lg is gentler than I prefer for my work pants.

Iíve had the speed queen FL, TL, whirlpool belt drive, and countless others. If I had to choose just one set forever Iíd likely stick with my LGís. Itís not really the best performing, not the longest lasting, but it does GREAT in every conceivable category.


Post# 975918 , Reply# 218   12/28/2017 at 19:55 by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

Eugene, thank you so much for taking the time to make these videos.  Even more convinces me my Whirlpool Duet with Steam, Allergen, and Sanitize capabilities are far superior. 


Post# 975926 , Reply# 219   12/28/2017 at 21:13 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

Eugene, I just wanted to add my thanks for the videos.  Great job.

 

My observations are the same as most others, if they are going to stick with this design they need to redesign the agitator to try to get more rollover on large loads. With a 1 HP motor they can surely do better.


Post# 975929 , Reply# 220   12/28/2017 at 22:46 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
my observations

I have to agree. My Kenmore Elite does a better job with the upscale laundry detergent and fabric softener than this speed queen. It may work for office dust. My Kenmore Elite has the accelawash and is made by LG.
I don't see how this new speed queen would clean your Dear Uncle Trevor's jeans and overalls after a nice sunny day in the yard making mud pies with the kids or Dear Aunt Sally's gardening clothes.


Post# 975957 , Reply# 221   12/29/2017 at 08:22 by mtn1584 (USA)        
Maytag vs Speed Queen 2018

Maytag Commercial TL wins hands down. Wash ability is like that of a DD machine. Why couldnít SQ design a machine like the Maytag Commercial TL? Maytag really is going to give SQ a run for the money considering their new washer costs less and has a 5 year warranty. Sorry as a SQ customer I would pass in their 2018 reincarnation and go with Maytag.
Thanks Eugene for the awesome and informative videos.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
Mike


Post# 975977 , Reply# 222   12/29/2017 at 10:04 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Yes, that Maytag commercial TL is very appealing now. So is the F&P WashSmart machine, apparently they're offering a warranty extension to 5 years if one claims online until 6/30/18. Must've been competing against SQ.

Post# 976036 , Reply# 223   12/29/2017 at 18:13 by trappn (Illinois)        
WashSmart & New Maytag

As mentioned earlier, we were thinking about the WashSmart, so decided to find every on-line review we could find.

Sounds like we may have been mistaken about how F&P controls the incoming cold temperature @ 20 degrees Celsius. Noticed several comments about how The cold temperature is only controlled when a "Cold" wash is selected; so, that wouldn't help us compensate for colder water during the winter, when we run a "Warm" wash cycle.

The other negative hot buttons were a few comments about the rod suspension system, & many complaints about lint. Perhaps, some of the F&P experts can chime in.

Sounds like the new Maytag is going to be the machine everyone talks about, in 2018. We were wondering how it goes about delivering a warm water wash. Assuming there are no sensors to help control the temperature?

Thanks for your help!


Post# 976044 , Reply# 224   12/29/2017 at 20:16 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

Trappn,

All previous F&P models had the temperatures specifically controlled for all selections except Hot, on which the behavior varied from controlled on some model/series to being tap-hot on others.

For example, the service manual I have for Phase 9 machines (which date circa 2010, previous to the current offerings) states:
††Hot = 130įF
††Hot/Warm = 115įF
††Warm = 105įF
††Warm/Cold = 95įF
††Cold Plus [controlled] = 60įF
††Cold [tap] = supply temperature

The controlled temperature points varied over the progression of models.† For example, my 2004 model runs Hot at tap-hot, and Warm at 115įF.† Older models in the mid/late 1990s had 120įF for Hot and 95įF for Warm.

I don't have hands-on familiarity with the current WashSmart model but I'd be surprised if it doesn't follow the established pattern of controlling all the temp choices except tap-Cold.


Post# 976063 , Reply# 225   12/29/2017 at 22:27 by trappn (Illinois)        
Thanks, DADoES

The only thing I see in their current marketing is the mention of "Controlled Cold," which could mean almost anything.

Some of the reviewers commented that an inordinate amount of hot water was being dumped on their cloths, followed by uncontrolled cold water to complete the fill.

Time to reach out to one of the local dealers, if any are left. Maybe they have a current owner's manual. Thanks for your help!


Post# 976075 , Reply# 226   12/30/2017 at 01:51 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

When get a NEW washer-if that happens,would consider the "commercial" Maytag over the new "agitub" SQ.Think this machine is going to KILL SQ home appliance dept!Watched the video-NOT impressed even with small loads.DON'T BUY!!!!Go Maytag!!!At least their machine has a REAL agitator and REAL wash action!The SQ just uselessly spins and paddles things around.

Post# 976131 , Reply# 227   12/30/2017 at 12:10 by Infusor (Usa)        

Sad to say but..... i have already put the new SQ on my do not buy list, i have a 4 year old lg front load that i like but i moved and my washer is on the right so the door gets in the way, i have been thinking about going back to a top load again, i seriously would consider the new commercial maytag, i prob will get the ge 860 model with smart dispense as i already have the matching dryer from 2013 that is still going strong.

Post# 976226 , Reply# 228   12/30/2017 at 23:23 by Ultralux88 (Denver)        
Lorainfurniture

ultralux88's profile picture

I can say from experience the direct drive Whirlpool does a damn good job of cleaning clothes, Even the old belt drive did a great job, until I splattered oil all over the floor and quit working. Its disappointing to see these new machines not cleaning as well as the design they replaced. I wonder if they will make any changes to the design as time continues? I can't imagine they want customers complaining about the wash quality...


Post# 976317 , Reply# 229   12/31/2017 at 13:00 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
New video






CLICK HERE TO GO TO Lorainfurniture's LINK


Post# 976328 , Reply# 230   12/31/2017 at 13:48 by speedqueen (Harrison Twp, Michigan)        

speedqueen's profile picture
This is just a blasted power soaking machine. No water currents, no clothes action, just enzyme soak.

Just about any washer with an independent agitator including WCI angel wings and a Maytag set to gentle would work better. In fact it looks like the original Frigidaire Agi-Tub was better too.


Post# 976341 , Reply# 231   12/31/2017 at 15:28 by washman (Butler, PA)        
Remember Crocoldile Dundee?

washman's profile picture

That's not a knife...........




 

Now to 2017.........that's not a washing machine, now THIS is a washing machine.





Post# 976347 , Reply# 232   12/31/2017 at 16:40 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
my review






CLICK HERE TO GO TO Lorainfurniture's LINK


Post# 976364 , Reply# 233   12/31/2017 at 19:55 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        

iowabear's profile picture

Eugene, I watched your video review and it's nice work, and a good summary of the your videos and results.  It was very fair, nobody can say you didn't test the machine thoroughly before drawing your conclusions. 

 

SQ really should rethink this design, even their own engineers in the sales video seemed kind of half-hearted about it.

 

Thanks again for all your work making and posting the videos.  I hope you continue to do more of them on other new machines.  Happy New Year!


Post# 976367 , Reply# 234   12/31/2017 at 20:27 by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

Eugene, from the bottom of my heart, I thank you immensely for taking the time to do videos.  And thank you for the candor of your overall review.  I can hear the pain and disappointment in your voice and it's definitely warranted.  And I also tip my hat to you for being honest and being respectful and mindful of your customers.  Bob


Post# 976380 , Reply# 235   1/1/2018 at 00:50 by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Like the HONEST review---And how you recommend that the buyer go to a different brand or type of machine.

Post# 976398 , Reply# 236   1/1/2018 at 06:22 by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod)        
What ashame

toploader55's profile picture
The momentum to watch Speed Queen climb to the top only to blow it with such a horrific design.

Thank You Eugene for the persistent testing to see if there was any positive notes on this design. You did find some good but not enough.

I highly respect you for not recommending this machine to your customers.

I think Allied should have just discontinued their Top Loader and stuck with the Front Load Machine.


Post# 976403 , Reply# 237   1/1/2018 at 06:59 by joeypete (Concord, NH)        
FP Water temps

joeypete's profile picture
I've had my WashSmart since November and I can fill you in about some things. First of all, this machine only uses water temp selected during the initial fill to Eco Active stage, where it recirculates the concentrated water/detergent solution on the items for 4 minutes. It then finishes filling with uncontrolled cold water. So depending on the season and location, can be very cold or not so cold. The only cycle that fills completely with the temp selected is Allergy. I don't have a thermometer but I can tell you compared to the other machines I've used, the selected water temp comes out TRUE. Hot is dang hot and warm is almost what hot was on my previous machines. So it doesn't appear that they dumb down the temps. There is an option to turn on or off controlled cold only. I have controlled cold on now simply because tap cold water in NH in the winter is very cold. However like I said, the machine finishes filling with that and you can't change that, aside from using Allergy.

To be clear, this is NOT an HE machine. It fills completely with water with complete manual control over load sizes. The auto load feature works surprisingly well and does use less water, but not low water by any means. From what I've noticed, auto will pick a load size roughly 1 smaller than if you selected it manually by using the load size guides on the agitator. Sometimes I've had to pause it and select the size manually (which is great you can do), just because I wanted a little more water. It's a very versatile machine.

Overall I've been very impressed with this machine. It's cleaned the dickens out of everything I've put in. Granted my stuff doesn't get that dirty but I've had some cat puke incidents on my bedding that came out no problem.

Mine did come with a 5 year warranty. Overall reviews are very positive. I did have 1 person comment on my YouTube videos that he had many problems with his, but I know 2 people personally that have had this machine for going on 10 or more years with no problems. It's a very simple machine actually. Even the suspension rods are easy to fix.

Hope that helps.


Post# 976421 , Reply# 238   1/1/2018 at 09:58 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

JoeyPete, your vids are great!† :-)

Presumably one can start on the Allergy cycle to fill for a load, then pause or cancel and reset to another cycle (manually select the same water level) and it'll continue along ... thus a full-hot fill could be had with a delicate-speed wash.

It'd be useful information if you could obtain one of those instant-read kitchen thermometers to check the incoming temperatures.† :-)


Post# 976432 , Reply# 239   1/1/2018 at 11:58 by neptunebob (Pittsburgh, PA)        
There's still one last hope...

neptunebob's profile picture
If the people running Speed Queen, since not many washers are in stores yet, decide at the last minute to cancel the redesign after reading so many bad reviews.

This has been known to happen in the movie industry, for example, the movie Heaven's Gate was canceled at the last minute because it saved the cost of distribution, even though the movie was very expensive. There have been several movies like that in past decades. One book about bad movies I read even said: "This is one abortion even pro-lifers would agree with". Could this Speed Queen be a bad movie?


Post# 976433 , Reply# 240   1/1/2018 at 12:01 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Doubt it.

Manufacturing is a slow process. They likely have millions of dollars in parts ready to assemble. They only thing they may be able to do is program adjustments. It likely wonít help. The issue is the fixed agitator. No easy rework for that as they redesigned the shaft assy, etc.

Post# 976440 , Reply# 241   1/1/2018 at 12:36 by whirlykenmore78 (Prior Lake MN (GMT-0700 CDT.))        
Eugene:

whirlykenmore78's profile picture
Thank you so much for taking the time to do all of those videos. I feel that your review was fair and honest. I could hear the pain in your voice and I hope that someone at Alliance heard it too. What a shame that a company who has built so many good products is letting this go to market. Thanks again.
WK78


Post# 976441 , Reply# 242   1/1/2018 at 12:40 by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod)        

toploader55's profile picture
Well,

Maybe we should invite Speed Queen to join AW and/or send them a link to all of Eugene's videos and all of our comments.

Then maybe Speed Queen will realize that Automatic Washer is a force to be reckoned with.


Post# 976452 , Reply# 243   1/1/2018 at 13:40 by RP2813 (The Big Blue Bubble)        

rp2813's profile picture

Eugene, thank you for doing such thorough testing and presenting the results here.  You invested a lot of time in this, and I know you had your customers in mind even more than the curious members of AW.  I admire your highly principled approach to appliance sales and protection of your customers against purchases they would regret.

 

Perhaps Alliance can design or temporarily outsource an adaptable agitator that will salvage this disaster.  It seems to me that this would be the quickest way to improve wash action, and if they have any class at all, they should offer to retrofit them onto every machine purchased, much like a mandated recall.  Otherwise both Alliance and their retailers who push these onto customers are going to to experience an epic backlash from legions of dissatisfied buyers.

 

Regardless, they absolutely need to go back to the drawing board, and fire all involved with pushing this redesign forward when it was clearly going to be an epic failure.


Post# 976476 , Reply# 244   1/1/2018 at 16:50 by neptunebob (Pittsburgh, PA)        

neptunebob's profile picture
Well, let's hope Speed Queen uses the "Just in Time" method of manufacturing so as to not have much parts inventory. That may be the only way SQ can be saved. I hope so, as "Heaven's Gate" destroyed United Artists as an independent studio and MGM bought them. After all, who would buy SQ, Whirlpool?

Post# 976482 , Reply# 245   1/1/2018 at 17:15 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Thanks everyone.

Not much of a YouTube type so it was a learning experience. I decided to make an effort to produce more videos, perhaps more of a review style than just wash videos, but likely a mixture of both.

I purchased a much better camera, and some semi pro lighting. In doing so I applied to have my videos monetized.

I figure it takes me about a full 8 hrs or more to produce one video. A portion of that is just downloading and uploading. A great deal of it is me trying to work that video editing software. I have a lot of respect for other videos that I see on YouTube that look like a tv show. That takes a lot of time and talent.

Iím glad that you all appreciate it, it motivates me to make more/better videos.


Post# 976484 , Reply# 246   1/1/2018 at 17:19 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Also

Aw exclusive: the old generation agitator wonít fit. The new hub is a larger diameter. I was able to squeeze a GE profile 2 piece agitator and watched it go. It improved slightly, but not enough to save this machine.

Post# 976486 , Reply# 247   1/1/2018 at 17:22 by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

Thank you Eugene for the above comment.  You're a real trooper. 


Post# 976502 , Reply# 248   1/1/2018 at 18:34 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
Can we see the GE agi? ;)

Post# 976507 , Reply# 249   1/1/2018 at 19:10 by trappn (Illinois)        
joeypete:

Thanks for the info on the F&P WashSmart, which some may choose as a reasonable alternative to the 2018 Speed Queen.

If F&P allowed for "Controlled Cold" under all circumstances, then the WashSmart would be on our list. Unfortunately, the winters are too cold, here.

Right now, our Kenmore D.D. from around 1990 is beginning to look pretty good to us. Unfortunately, I had it hauled away in 2005 after the transmission failed. This was before I began working on our own appliances.

Then, we had a Whirlpool Ultimate Care II for 10 years, but it didn't seem as durable as the Kenmore. It was a Quiet Wash; and, the noisiest machine we had ever encountered. Plus, we wanted our next machine to have a stainless steel tub.

If there was a mixing valve that could control incoming cold @ around 70 degrees Fahrenheit, then we'd be perfectly happy with our SQ 92 series. Unfortunately, these valves are usually not engineered to be set, that low.

We were thinking that if the politicians had to do their own laundry, bet we wouldn't have to put up with some of this nonsense.

Thanks for your help!




Post# 976509 , Reply# 250   1/1/2018 at 19:33 by DADoES (TX,†U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture

Any cold fill for the wash period should be controlled-cold on the WashSmart.† Rinses are probably tap-cold instead of controlled.


Post# 976527 , Reply# 251   1/1/2018 at 21:25 by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

stricklybojack's profile picture
.
So did SQ use an agitator to keep their fans happy, when perhaps they would have been better off using an agitation plate design instead?
Reviewed.com blasted the performance of their TL washer and dryer as crap, but nevertheless SQ likely sold a ton of them.
Maybe they don't need to care about washing performance on their "traditional" machines...just make sure the customer thinks it's like the machines of yesteryear and ring the register.


Post# 976538 , Reply# 252   1/1/2018 at 22:50 by henene4 (Germany)        
Recomended Delicate cycle for jeans

I just found out that the manuals were avaible for the machines. Went ahead, downloaded them.

Especially the Speciality cycles are interesting... There is now a Delicate, a Hand Wash and a Wool cycle.
Further, you can have both Heavy Duty and Delicate as "Eco" versions.
Plus a Denim and a Water Proof cycle.
Further a Whites Cycle and a Rinse/Spin with selectable final spin speed.


What somehow confuses me though is that the manual recomends the Delicate cycle for stiffer fabrics like jeans.

Laurain Furniture in the meantime slayed the washer design for its incapibility to wash exactly such loads. There is a general review up now.
AFAIK he only tested the Heavy Duty and Bulky cycle, and did not follow the manuals recomendations.


Post# 976539 , Reply# 253   1/1/2018 at 23:04 by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)        
The section of the manual in question

iowabear's profile picture

It actually recommends "Heavy Duty" for heavily soiled jeans and "Delicate" for stiff jeans. 

 

Who in the real world is going to select the delicate cycle for dirty work jeans, "stiff" or otherwise?

 

Very strange.


  View Full Size
Post# 976541 , Reply# 254   1/1/2018 at 23:15 by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Delicate cycle

Will agitate even slower than heavy duty.

Passing water through my work pants are certainly not going to get them clean, I donít care what that manual says. During my work pants cycle I highly doubt an extra few inches of water would have helped. In fact, it likely would have made it worse due to floating.

Maybe I can save a thousand dollars and just start showering with my clothes on.


Post# 976544 , Reply# 255   1/1/2018 at 23:24 by GusHerb (Chicago/NWI)        

Or wash your clothes as you soak in the bath, and can agitate the clothes with your legs. Bathe, launder, and exercise! Kill three birds with one stone!

Post# 976546 , Reply# 256   1/1/2018 at 23:29 by henene4 (Germany)        
Lorainfurniture

Never doubted your conclusion.

Just added what I found out and red.



I was hoping that the design worked, but apparently, it dosen't.

7 years of warranty give or take, these will be a debakel.


Post# 976556 , Reply# 257   1/2/2018 at 02:26 by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        

askolover's profile picture

Appreciate your time and energy involved in making these videos.  Although I will NEVER go back to a top loader, I like to see what's out there that I'm not missing. 


Post# 976557 , Reply# 258   1/2/2018 at 02:29 by tbolt25 (Kentucky)        
Just like when GM sold off Frigidaire to WCI!

I am very disappointed with this-this is like when WCI took over Frigidaire-the up-and-down agitation washers were gone! Very disheartening!

Post# 976559 , Reply# 259   1/2/2018 at 04:56 by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
My Thoughts On The New SQ TL Washer

combo52's profile picture

First of all thanks Eugene for all the time you put into recording and posting the videos on these washers.

 

As I already posted and predicted this machine will not turn over and wash large loads clean, no surprise here.

 

However some customers will like this new washer and it will solve a lot of the problems we see as a major servicer of SQ laundry appliances, the good points

 

It will be gentler on clothing, 

 

It will be more reliable,

 

It is quieter in operation,

 

It has much better water extraction,

 

It will have less linting complaints and less walking problems than the current machine,

 

It should be easier to repair.

 

As I predicted before SQ will lose around 25% of their TL washer sales in the coming years, possibility more.

 

This new machine will cause me as a servicer additional problems because there will be dissatisfied customers , but I lived through the 70s working for a Maytag home appliance store and we had LOTS of customers that were dissatisfied with their new MT AWsa nd we had to do a lot of reselling and teaching people how to try and get clean clothes out of their new MT when they had been washing clothing for years in their old Kenmore or just about any other brand washer and had never had any problems.

 

When we get one of these washers in the store we will post the results of a SXS cleaning test between this new machine and a few other popular washers.

 

John L.


Post# 976610 , Reply# 260   1/2/2018 at 17:41 by chetlaham (United States)        

chetlaham's profile picture
@ Stricklybojack: I agree. Consumer reports and reviewed made a mockery of Speed Queen, but I think people looked the other way because its not that bad. But now that these machines have an agi tub, its almost like they saw into the future. No longer will these reviews be off or biased, sadly.


Also, it does not matter if SQ used an impeller, agitator or even a nuetator, the issue is that these washers lack a mod shifter. Something as simple as a floating tub would have helped- but no. If Agi tubs were really that great, then GE would have used them when their hydro-waves washers came out. That would have lowered cost and eliminated a few failure points- but they didn't. In fact I am willing to bet that every manufacturer has considered an agitub at some point- but was quickly scrapped early in experimental R&D. How SQ let this get so far is beyond me.


Post# 976623 , Reply# 261   1/2/2018 at 18:52 by GELaundry4ever (Killeen tx USA)        
Very dissatisfied!

I am very dissatisfied! I was gonna have high hopes for this washer platform. No more! No way laundry detergent and fabric softener will be evenly distributed through the clothes!
I'd stick with a GE laundry pair with laundry detergent and fabric softener tanks. Speed Queen... no more!!!!


Post# 976741 , Reply# 262   1/3/2018 at 14:05 by duttyb11 (Mountain City)        
Strange to me...

They say resluts prove it cleans better than the old one....but how is that possible? The agitator is terrible the bottom fins are a joke. Who would in their right mind approve of this? WHO? If the tub spun faster with longer rotations and instantly reversed directions with a better agitator then maybe MAYBE it would have been semi decent. This damn thing is a joke. I predict Alliance will stop making washers for home use soon. This will be a disaster for them. Some ppl like everyone else said will buy it not knowing the difference, just like some people think buying a Fiat or Chrystler is a good idea. People are fools and they will sell some of these, but I sure as hell won't buy one. God what a dissapointment life is at times. I had high hopes. Those hopes were shit on real fast.

Post# 976768 , Reply# 263   1/3/2018 at 19:03 by stchuck (Winfield, il.)        
Goodbye to SQ

How many of you have now set their sites on the new commercial Maytag? If it had a water level adjustment I would have already bought it. I keep watching the videos and am constantly impressed.

Post# 976782 , Reply# 264   1/3/2018 at 21:55 by rapunzel (Sydney)        

I am going to keep my current SQ alive for as long as it is economically viable. Unless SQ continue to bring out top loaders with their standard transmission -
i.e. not agitub, I will probably go for Fisher and Paykel.

To address the reply #259 - after 30 years of owning and using SQ top loaders I am relatively experienced with their washers.

They are gentle enough on clothes - only marginally less so than front loaders.

My first SQ lasted 20 years and this one has been running for 10 and without issues. So, I'd say are already pretty reliable.

My current one is noisy in comparison to other washers, but I have a dedicated laundry room in the basement. I shut the door to contain the noise.

Water extraction is fine. Most full loads take an hour to dry on gentle heat in matching SQ dryer.

I don't have linting issues and on the occasion that there is a little bit of lint, it will come off in the dryer or I use my Scotch-Brite roller. Anyway, if there is excessive lint it's my fault.

My SQs have 'NEVER'walked and they usually spin without fail. The number of times that I have had an unbalanced load in 30 years I can count on one hand.

If I were a product engineer at SQ I'd be embarrassed to put my name to their new top loaders. This is nothing short of self-sabotage.


Post# 976803 , Reply# 265   1/4/2018 at 05:08 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Commercial Maytag?

mrb627's profile picture
Nope.

Malcolm


Post# 976831 , Reply# 266   1/4/2018 at 11:32 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Specialty Cycles Explained

mrb627's profile picture
I wonder if wash performance would be greatly improved using one of these choices...

Malcolm


  View Full Size
Post# 976844 , Reply# 267   1/4/2018 at 13:50 by duttyb11 (Mountain City)        
I believe....

IF this machine turns out to be the flop I see it as being, Speed queen will simply stop making washing machines for home use. I predict that they will just stick to commerical washer/extractors. What a shame this is, I remember being a child of the late 80's early to mid 90's and my aunt had a maytag she still has to this very day, and this machine reminds me so much of that maytag (2017 model) I love that washer so much. This sucks so bad guys. It seems like our washer options are shittier and shittier in the US. Why can't we have washers that heat the water to the appropriate temperature, oh yeah, because of the shitty DOE. I'm convinced that Europe, although smaller than US machines have the best washers.

Post# 976845 , Reply# 268   1/4/2018 at 13:54 by chetlaham (United States)        
European front loads

chetlaham's profile picture
Are simply the best front load washer in terms of clean-ability and versatility.


I said it before and I will say it again, if SQ had a FL washers with a heater in 2013 I would have probably gotten that over the SQ TL. A FL without a heater is useless IMO.


Post# 976880 , Reply# 269   1/4/2018 at 18:56 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

Malcolm-- Thanks for the chart explaining the special cycles on the new SQ top-loader. It would probably be to the company's benefit to give cycles like 'Super Soiled' a higher profile.

Wish my SQ had the Heavy Duty Eco and Delicate Eco cycles. I fill the washer with true warm or hot water, then switch to the Normal Eco cycle for nearly every load that doesn't contain liquid chlorine bleach. Saved a few hundred gallons of soft water last month. Frankly, I find the spray rinse does an adequate job. Have had no problems with detergent sensitivity or irritation even in our super-dry winter air.

I use the trick you mentioned in another thread about skipping ahead to the next portion of a cycle by pressing the Whites and Perm Press buttons simultaneously regularly, as well. It comes in handy when I want slow agitation for partial loads of things like dress shirts. I start the Bulky cycle, set a kitchen timer for the amount of wash time needed, then return to the washer, select Normal Eco, then jump it ahead to the spin/rinse sequence.


Post# 976907 , Reply# 270   1/4/2018 at 20:44 by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

Eugene, you give new meaning to the term push button washing. 


Post# 976951 , Reply# 271   1/5/2018 at 08:39 by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Easter Egg

mrb627's profile picture
I like how the machine will pause after the presoak/prewash and sound a tone for the user to add detergent for the main wash bath. Proceeding automatically after two minutes. Cool feature!

Malcolm


Post# 976954 , Reply# 272   1/5/2018 at 09:09 by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

Bob-- I'm definitely giving the SQ's electronic controls a workout, but it's kind of fun to play with, LOL. Have to admit I miss the 2015 Maytag front-loading set, which had everything a person could ask for in a laundry pair, but am having more fun with the SQ than I'd expected.

Malcolm-- The "add detergent" alert after the prewash or soak reminds me of my mid-'90s stacked Gibson-branded front-loader. It did that immediately after the fill for the final rinse so you could add fabric softener. An actual detergent dispenser would be ideal, but this is Speed Queen, so that would be looked upon as a frill. I have yet to use the soak or prewash options. Loads of heavily stained kitchen whites (plus personal whites) get a hot fill and a few minutes of agitation. Then I shut the machine down for about 45 minutes for a soak. After that, I add Clorox, fire up the Whites cycle plus a 2nd rinse and away we go. I've found this process to be the most effective for removing stains.


Post# 977278 , Reply# 273   1/7/2018 at 07:34 by Imperial70 (******)        

Eugene,
It seems you have figured out how to succeed with your top load washer. You are the master chef of top-load laundry.

paul


Post# 977480 , Reply# 274   1/8/2018 at 14:49 by LLMaytag (Southern California)        
Amana

llmaytag's profile picture
This is very discouraging. I'm not sure how much this machine was, but it seems to operate very much like my $269 sale Amana top load which I bought for a weekend home. I finally figured out on the Amana that I can select "bulky sheets and blankets" and deep wash+extra rinse and it will actually fill completely for the wash, with NO autosensing does intermittent full 360 turns of the agitator as it feels, even before any base level of water has been injected! Anyway, on these setting I can get a full-fill wash, and actually two deep rinses, but unfortunately a slower spin and slightly less vigorous agitation.

Post# 977511 , Reply# 275   1/8/2018 at 18:23 by peteski50 (New York)        
A Better washing AdjTub!

peteski50's profile picture
From looking at more vintage videos on youtube I encountered this European model and at least it has better washing action for a AdjTub!
Hey speed queen why didn't you do some research?


CLICK HERE TO GO TO peteski50's LINK


Post# 977522 , Reply# 276   1/8/2018 at 19:33 by chetlaham (United States)        
Best agi tub

chetlaham's profile picture
Well, maybe not exactly an agi tub...









Post# 977526 , Reply# 277   1/8/2018 at 19:47 by henene4 (Germany)        
Best agi-tub

Has to go to the Apex:






Post# 977568 , Reply# 278   1/9/2018 at 03:26 by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, the Netherlands)        
Pete

foraloysius's profile picture
That's not a European model, but I think that is most likely a South American machine.




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