|
Thread Number: 9352
Awesome KitchenAid Dishwasher I Found!! |
[Down to Last] |  |
|
Post# 173859 , Reply# 1 12/8/2006 at 22:07 (6,347 days old) by appnut  (TX) |
||
That looks to be a KDI19. These Energy Saver IV series were only on the market for just less than 2 years, like 1979-1091. This series had no heated dry. Every major water change heated the water to 150 degrees before it continued with the cycle. Customers practically revoled against these. Uhh, where Tomturbomatic when I need him!! Sing it loud Tom.
| ||
| Post# 173916 , Reply# 2 12/8/2006 at 23:15 (6,347 days old) by decodriveboy (FL, US) | ||
|
If it had some features that weren't a hit with consumers, it sure is a nice looking DW, even today. Considering it was 1979-1981, I'm guessing a large appliance with a stainless steel facade wasn't normally sought after (or available?) during that period.... | ||
|
Post# 173918 , Reply# 3 12/8/2006 at 23:18 (6,347 days old) by appnut (TX) |
||
|
| ||
|
Post# 173930 , Reply# 4 12/8/2006 at 23:34 (6,347 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
Smart looking machine!
Considering the dishwasher probably ran on 120v/15hz circut, heating water anywhere from tap cold/cool or warm to 150F probably took more time than many housewives of the time were willing to wait for clean dishes. Wondering if the thermostat was routed through the timer so cycles would commence once water reached proper temp, rather than waiting for a set time period to elapse. If one had a decent hot water supply to the dw, that should in theory shave some time off cycles. OTHO have never understood why so many people get their kickers in a twist about dishwashers taking so long to complete cycles. A majority of housewives/consumers run their dishwashers last thing at night, often before going to bed. Therefore it's not exactly like they are standing around waiting for the machine to finish. | ||
|
Post# 173940 , Reply# 5 12/8/2006 at 23:56 (6,347 days old) by appnut (TX) |
||
|
| ||
|
Post# 173945 , Reply# 6 12/9/2006 at 00:03 (6,347 days old) by peteski50 (New York) |
||
KitchenAid 19 Series!
My Mom had the KDS 19 series Surburba model. It heated water to 150 degrees in the first and last rinse. During the wash phase the heater was on but used lower voltage. The no heat drying cycle took about 40 minutes. It did a good job drying if you used jetdry. If not the drying performance was degrated. It lasted for 25 years and was replaced with a tall tub GE. Peter | ||
| Post# 174092 , Reply# 7 12/9/2006 at 13:19 (6,346 days old) by retroguy () | ||
|
That is truly a unique find... I'd dole out a lot of coins for one of those in good cosmetic shape, even if it didn't work. | ||
| Post# 174167 , Reply# 9 12/9/2006 at 18:18 (6,346 days old) by westytoploader () | ||
|
Definitely needs a good scrubbing, but very cool nonetheless! | ||
| Post# 174189 , Reply# 10 12/9/2006 at 19:56 (6,346 days old) by decodriveboy (FL, US) | ||
|
On a related note, I have one of the KA Artisan Series mixers (color, 'Ice') and put up with its noisiness b/c I love the look--as I'm sure I would also do with this particular dishwasher....despite Tom's good advice, I'm hardheaded! | ||
|
Post# 174213 , Reply# 11 12/9/2006 at 21:50 (6,346 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!) |
||
Tom, don't forget the filming problem in the KD-19's resulting from heating the final rinse water to 150F and spraying over tepid dishware - particularly worsened with hard water. Even KitchenAid considered this to be the red-headed step-child of their line... Didn't Jason replace the timer or change the heater - maybe disconnect it - to resolve these problems? I would think you could change out the fan-only drying unit in the 19's with an 800 watt heater & fan unit from a 18, 20 or 21 series and solve the drying issues easily. Don't be offended 19 owners, every classic has a story and personality all it's own - we really do love them all! Given some of the landfill fodder being made today in the domestic dishwasher industry, the KD-19 series looks like a commercial-grade dream machine! | ||
|
Post# 174533 , Reply# 13 12/10/2006 at 22:30 (6,345 days old) by appnut (TX) |
||
|
| ||
|
Post# 174553 , Reply# 15 12/10/2006 at 23:49 (6,345 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
Heating the small amount of water dishwashers use is not a problem. Problem lies in that most American homes use 120v power on 15amp circuts, which limits the heater to about 1000 watts give or take a few, especially when one takes into account the motor needs some juice as well. Commercial dishwashers heat water to 180F or higher and manage to complete a cycle in under 30 minutes, but they rely on 208v/220v/240v power. What I would like to see is for someone to bring out new version of the Thermador steam dishwasher. If powered by 220v,that sort of unit could do a steam "pre-wash" quickly then a nice hot (140F-160F)wash, then a rinse at either wash temp or up to 180F. Since the first wash would be steam, it wouldn't need as much water as a normal wash, that could cut down on water use. L. | ||
|
Post# 174561 , Reply# 17 12/11/2006 at 01:01 (6,345 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
Speaking of European dishwashers, their preferred method of heating water, via an inline heater is also faster and more efficient than exposed heating elements used by most American domestic dishwashers. Think of how fast a tankless hot water heater can produce an almost endless supply of hot water, compared to a tank version. | ||
|
Post# 174627 , Reply# 20 12/11/2006 at 10:38 (6,344 days old) by peteski50 (New York) |
||
|
KDS19 series
What I don't understand is why KitchenAid didn't design these machines to have the main wash period heat the water to 140 degrees. Even after the first series when they put the drying heater back they continued to have the 1st fill just sit and heat water. In my mothers 19 series suburba we would stop it at the beginning of the dry cycle and let the dishes flash dry and in a few minutes they would be dry to put away. We did this mostly when their was company and at holidays. Under regular use if you used jetdry the dishes would come out dry. Back than it wasnt a norm for dishwashers to run for almost 2 hours. Today that is the norm. Even though the 19 wasn't a good design - it did clean very well. My mother had it for 25 years. Why couldn't we design these babies? Peter | ||
| Post# 174655 , Reply# 21 12/11/2006 at 13:14 (6,344 days old) by varicyclevoice (Davenport, Iowa) | ||
with regard to the KitchenAid Energy Saver line
I really loved the design of the 19 and 20 series. They are beautifully-designed machines. They were sold when I was just in junior high but I remember seeing them in the appliance stores. A few of my relatives still own them. One has a KDP-19 and my other aunt has a KDC-20. I always thought heating the water in the machine was quite ingenious therefore by saving money turning down the main water heater. The only thing I never liked about the Energy Saver line is the first heated pre-wash. For one thing, it didn't purge the line of cold water so it took awhile to heat the water...sometimes 10-15 minutes. The second thing, and my biggest gripe was that after spending all that money heating the water, it drains after only circulating the water for a mere 3 minutes. I think for as much time and money spent to heat the water, it should have used that water for a longer period of time...say 6 or 7 minutes. Just my two-cents worth. But all in all, I do like those machines. | ||
|
Post# 174792 , Reply# 22 12/11/2006 at 22:26 (6,344 days old) by dadoes (TX, U.S. of A.) |
||
I could be wrong, but it is my understanding that the inline water heating used on Euro dishwashers (such as Bosch and Miele, I guess, for the models that have it in the U.S.) is inline to the recirculation pump, not to the incoming water supply. This is the kind of heating element unit Robert plumbed into his Super Unimatic. Even at 220/240 volts, heating the incoming water flow to 140°, or as high as 160°F+, would take an enormous amount of instantaneous power. My whole-house tankless water heater can do that (maximum output of 140°F) but can also pull up to 120 amps @ 240 volts running at full-flow rate -- that's 28,800 watts folks. I don't think a residential dishwasher, even in the Euro countries, would be wired to a dedicated 120 amp circuit.
| ||
|
Post# 174894 , Reply# 23 12/12/2006 at 14:03 (6,343 days old) by dadoes (TX, U.S. of A.) |
||
|
As a point of reference, I did a test this morning. Input temp 64°F Output temp 134°F Temp Rise 70°F Flow Rate 1 GPM My tankless reported running at between 37% and 40% of full output capacity, which is between 10,656 and 11,520 watts or 44 to 48 amps. Faster flow rate, lower input temp, higher temp rise, or any combination thereof would require accordingly more instantaneous power. | ||
| Forum Index: |
| Other Forums: |
|
|
|
|
|
Comes to the Rescue!
