Thread Number: 13253
The 4-way HydroSweep or The Big Blue washarm? 		[Down to Last]

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Post# 229662   8/11/2007 at 18:02 (6,101 days old) by mrcleanjeans (milwaukee wi)        

According to old KD15 literature,the 4 way HydroSweep was as far ahead of the blue wash arm as that blue arm was ahead of competetive inefficient impeller type systems.Is this a stretch?Which do YOU like better,and why.Also,who has done tests to confirm their conclusions? Thanks.




Post# 229690 , Reply# 1   8/11/2007 at 19:59 (6,101 days old) by neptunebob (Pittsburgh, PA)        

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I don't know which is better but I have seen a big gray washarm in a commercial Hobart cup washer when I worked at a Mr. Donut. Maybe the iron wash arm is used in industrial dishwashers?

Post# 229691 , Reply# 2   8/11/2007 at 20:16 (6,101 days old) by gyrafoam (Wytheville, VA)        

IMO either/or-----they are both VERY effective.

Post# 229702 , Reply# 3   8/11/2007 at 20:53 (6,100 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

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Yup, both do a decent job and can build a tremendous amount of pressure for blasting away soils in mere minutes. I tend to lean toward the blue cast iron arm simply because any machine that has power enough to make that turn at 52 rpm is impressive and I love the water-sounds it makes.

Post# 229740 , Reply# 4   8/11/2007 at 23:40 (6,100 days old) by jetcone (Schenectady-Home of Calrods,Monitor Tops,Toroid Transformers)        
The original wash arm was solid

jetcone's profile picture
copper/ bronze and made around 1913! I saw the original machine restored at the restaurant show here in boston. Beautiful restoration BTW!

It had cedar racks for the dishes and glasses!!

Definetly the blue wash arm, if you had made a machine with double blue wash arms for each rack and compared it to a hydrosweep which do you think would win??

Post# 229747 , Reply# 5   8/12/2007 at 00:14 (6,100 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

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I've yet to see either working! I saw the HydroSweep machines being loaded at the Tucson wash-in (by the amazing Bob-loader himself!) but I never got to see the results!!! I'd like to see both machines running with some plexi-glass!

Post# 229766 , Reply# 6   8/12/2007 at 03:21 (6,100 days old) by tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

The introduction of the 15 series introduced many features that brought KitchenAid way up in the ratings compared to the ratings of the 14 series in the Consumer Reports testing. The tank in the 15 series was wider and taller so the new wash arm was better able to cover it with the new water pattern. I can give you one very concrete example of when the Big Blue Wash Arm was better than the 4-Way Hydrosweep. When I would use my Farberware open hearth broilers, I would put the food rack upside down flat in the lower rack of my KDS-14P. I think it sort of sat up on the center row of loops. Then I would put the body of the broiler over the grill and various stuff around the edge of both racks. The 6 wide "Moving Walls of Water" provided a more uniform water pattern that completely stripped the rack of all food and film. The 4-Way Hydrosweep did not do as well and the machines with it had longer double washes than the 14, so I think it was a case of water pattern. The 4-Way Hydrosweep was intended to produce a greater number of more powerful, but smaller jets of water (with the new pump and motor) that could offer maximum cleaning without the danger of breaking items like some of the GE dishwashers would. The jets on the later GE wash arms were just punched out holes while each hole in the 4-Way Hydrosweep was engineered to have a dimple around the hole. The GE shot hard jets of water while the KA dimples forced each jet of water to fan out as soon as it left the hole, providing powerful jets of water that spread out to cover a wider area and offer a powerful, but slightly diffused column of water that did not break glasses and other light weight glass items as readily as the GE machines.

Hobart made an improvement to the cast iron wash arm in the the middle 50s(I can't remember the year) when they changed the angle of the jets on the end of the arm to give better coverage to the corners and still keep it turning around.

Post# 229847 , Reply# 7   8/12/2007 at 11:34 (6,100 days old) by mrcleanjeans (milwaukee wi)        

Thanks everyone, verrrry interrrresting indeed! BTW,in 1960,KitchenAid boasted about newly designed jets in the blue arm that controlled both volumn and velocity of the water for complete and effective coverage of every item in the wash chamber.But CR rated the KDS-14 as fairly good at cleaning and the KD-15 was very good.Perhaps today's enzyme detergents would boost the 14s?

Post# 229925 , Reply# 8   8/12/2007 at 15:43 (6,100 days old) by machinehead ()        
Did i read that right, 'cast iron'?

 Just clarifying here: the big blue wash arm was made of cast iron? Same as the commercial Hobarts i've seen and used? And the part about using commercial-grade parts: fascinating!

thanks to all for the insights, i love learning the "why's" engineer's do the things they do.

Post# 229927 , Reply# 9   8/12/2007 at 15:54 (6,100 days old) by maytagwc401 ()        

Now most brands use plastic. What a shame.

Post# 230154 , Reply# 10   8/13/2007 at 08:41 (6,099 days old) by tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

While it's true that most of the KA machines with the Big Blue Wash Arm washed at temps of 120 or below, I would think that the wash portion of the cycle was too short for most enzyme activity to take place. I might be wrong about this, but it seems that the enzyme detergents were introduced about the time the new dishwashers were advertised to be able to work with 120 degree water. Some washed and heated for about an hour. Incidentally, when the original KitchenAid soak cycle for tough soil was introduced, it was intended to be used with a little known enzyme product for dishwashers. The product was pulled in most markets so the load just soaked in dishwasher detergent water. Unfortunately or maybe not, the soak period came early in the cycle so while the enzymes might have been very happy in temperataures slightly higher than bathwater, the dishwasher detergents of the time were not at their most effective in tepid water. The water was not heated because only the Superbas had the water heating element. The KDS-18 was the first to have Soak 'n Scrub instead of the Soak cycle. It alternated water circulation with heating periods. The rest of the 18 series, even the Patrician, still lacked water heating elements. Even the Soak 'n Scrub performance was not really up there with the Whirlpool Power Scour Pot Smasher cycle which provded water circulation during the entire time the first wash was heating to around 150 degrees which took a looong time.


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