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Miele W1065
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Post# 239201   9/29/2007 at 00:30 (4,377 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Thinking of buying a used Miele W1065 washer, said to be in great condition.

Anybody have any feedback on this model? As I understand it, it's an older version with mechanical timer and see-through window door. Supposed to be built like a tank, but without the sophisticated computer driven logic of the later Novitronic series.


Post# 239208 , Reply# 1   9/29/2007 at 01:35 (4,377 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Dood - Go Get It!

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That is the cousin to my W1070. Difference is that the W1065 as you know has a glass porthole window, whereas mine is a solid door front.

Only holds 11lbs, but that is allot when you think about it, and water heating goes up to 200F! Cycles are a bit long compared to today's Miele washers, and not as quiet, but these mechanical Miele washers just keep on going. Whenever am speaking to Miele tech support or customer about my machine, they always tell me about how amazed they are so many of these units are still out there chugging away.

Operation is easy, and best of all because the machine is electronic with a mechanical timer, there are all sorts of fun work arounds. Oh, these babies use lots of water for washing and rinsing. The final rinse for cottons or permanent press is the same water level used for the "Woolens" cycle, and that is allot of water.



L.


Post# 239211 , Reply# 2   9/29/2007 at 01:41 (4,377 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Thanks, Cimberlie. If it's still available I'll go get it. It would be fun to have a "real" front loader, lol.


Post# 239212 , Reply# 3   9/29/2007 at 01:42 (4,377 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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PS-Would I be correct in assuming that I can hook this washer up to cold water only, and the heater will do the rest?


Post# 239242 , Reply# 4   9/29/2007 at 05:01 (4,376 days old) by nmaineman36 ()        

You are correct ...you can hook the washer up to cold water only and let the machine do the heating. Seems like Miele prefers the hookup to cold anyways since to them it saves energy. Thats a handy feature to have if your hot water isnt up to par. My Miele washer and dishwasher say they can be hooked up to cold only if it has to be.

Post# 239251 , Reply# 5   9/29/2007 at 05:30 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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Have to look at my owner's manual, but IIRC two hoses must be connected (cold and "warm")water, regardless if one is going to use cold fills. My manual does state that one can use warm water fills to speed cycle times instead of heating cold water.

Remember these are timed fill (though will add water when it detects level drops)and like older mechanical dishwashers, the heating portion of the wash cycles is timed, rather than routed through a thermostat. Once the machine has reached the set temperature, you hear a loud "click" shutting off the the thermostat, but the timer will not advance until it is time. OTHO if the water is too cold and time has run out during the heating phase, the timer will advance, but the heating will continue until the proper temperature is reached.

To save on my electric, I almost always use warm fills,unless laundering really badly stained laundry. Even then will use a cold pre-wash then go over to "hot" wash cycle. When using machines of this vintage, you have to think like a 1980's housewife with the sort of products that were on the shelves then. By default the normal cottons, permanent press, and delicate cycle all have pre-washes. Miele changed this with the 1900 series to make pre-wash an optional cycle because modern detergents (Persil) and the great washing action removed the need for pre-washing. A wash starting from cold, or even cool or warm water and if need be going to hot will give great results these days.

This series of Miele washers has a thing about suds. They make all sorts of odd sounds if suds/air gets into the pump, so a word in your shell like ear; ditch any non "HE" detergents and stick with Persil. Gave away all my normal Tide products and only use Persil or other European detergents in my Miele and the results are spectacular. Clean and clear rinses (there are four of them, but only 1 half spin, 1 full spin between rinses, then a final spin), with great stain and soil removal.

One reason this series of Miele washers takes so long is that rinses are via dilution as mentioned above, and that before the final spin, there is a series of graduated spins for the normal "cottons" cycle. Mind you it does make sure that by the time final spin cycle starts, there is little chance of suds locking or too much water trying to enter the pump all at once, slowing down the cycle. Again, you will have much better results using Persil or a low/no suds detergent.

If you get the washer, I'm yours to pick for suggestions/tips.

L.


Post# 239299 , Reply# 6   9/29/2007 at 10:03 (4,376 days old) by rapidry1000 (San Francisco)        

Sudsmaster
There's a Miele 1065 for $50 on Craigslist SF. Motor is shot.
Washer is located in SOMA area of San Francisco.


Post# 239311 , Reply# 7   9/29/2007 at 10:19 (4,376 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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The W1065, is that the model with three rotary control and a few push buttons? I like those older Mieles, they're not very quiet, but I love the sounds they make. Very sturdy machines. I wonder if the one on Craigslist doesn't have bad brushes, that would be an easy fix.

Post# 239334 , Reply# 8   9/29/2007 at 13:07 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
One down, one to go...

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Well, fate intervened and I picked up a 1918 for $200 in Oakland this morning just now. It was not hooked up with no 220 available, so at this point I don't know if it works or not, but it is in good condition exterior wise. Still planning on getting the 1065... when it rains, it pours.

Here's a shot of the 1918, still on the appliance dolly:



Post# 239335 , Reply# 9   9/29/2007 at 13:09 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Wired for 3 prong power

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Odd plug, I'll have to replace it anyway to run it off the outlets in the shop... at that point I'll find out if they simply omitted the ground wire or rewired it for 110 (don't know if the Novitronics can do 110 tho)...

Post# 239340 , Reply# 10   9/29/2007 at 13:52 (4,376 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        
"when it rains, it pours"

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It does indeed! Congratulations, you might have more Mieles than me soon! LOL Nice machine, hope it works.

Post# 239345 , Reply# 11   9/29/2007 at 14:18 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
So far, so good...

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Rewired the plug for the W1918 to something my shop outlets can handle. Powered up just fine. Door unlocked. Checked coin trap, clean as a whistle - good sign. If the washer had been malfunctioning, it probably would have been sudsy or smelled bad. Inner drum clean as well.

Set it to do a 1600 rpm spin. Very quiet, went through its routine just fine. Shut off normall at end. Pump is a little odd sounding, but perhaps that's normal? Will find out soon enough once I hook up a "Y" and a hose from the nearest muni cold tap (don't want to use well water). The 220 requirement means it's not so easy to set this up in the yard, although I do have an awesome 220 volt extension cord gadget on a big rolling crank wheel, but with range outlet, not dryer/twistlock 220 outlet. But I can cobble something together for more washing in the sunshine action ;-).



Post# 239347 , Reply# 12   9/29/2007 at 14:23 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Notice that the temp dial goes "only" to 170 on this particular model. I thought they went up to 190...? Anyway, 170 is plenty hot as it is. Certainly enough to "sanitize".

And then there's always the 1065 if I get it, for boil washes.


Post# 239350 , Reply# 13   9/29/2007 at 14:31 (4,376 days old) by funguy10 ()        

Why are the prongs on the machine's plug facing the wrong way?

Post# 239363 , Reply# 14   9/29/2007 at 15:35 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Welcome To My (Miele) World!

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It is about time you got off your duff and got a Miele! *LOL*

Miele cranked down the max temperature, IIRC on the 1918 series IIRC because the same results could be had using a good oxygen bleach containing detergent like Persil, even at 170F. Also it saves energy to use "lower" wash temperatures, and not that many people even in Europe were/are boiling laundry anymore.

Miele has funky plugs, they swear you must use instead of normal 220v plugs. Am glad you were able to get things arranged to run in your shop.

Do yourself a favour, run a 170F wash cycle with about 1 quart of vinegar and a cup or so of baking soda, or if you have it any good commercial descaler; though vinegar kills germs and mould. This will flush out and help kill any muck or such hanging around in the washer. When the cycle is done, leave the door open overnight/several hours to let things air out. Did this with my vintage Miele and it makes a world of difference.

If you didn't get the owner's manual, they can be had from Miele's website.

Yes, the w1918 is streets quieter than the w1065, IMHO.

Good work dwag!

L.


Post# 239366 , Reply# 15   9/29/2007 at 15:52 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
So far, still good...

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Before I saw your reply, Cimbi, I got together some old work clothes with nasty stains (brown veggie stain from taro plants in the pond, nearly a colorfast dye), and am running a 170 cotton wash with max spin (1600 rpm). Total time something like 156 minutes, might have to stop it as I'm going to go look at the other Miele soon. But it's washing just fine.

Used 1.75 oz of a Sears HE/STPP mix. At first in cold water, no suds. Now, as the glass has gotten too hot to touch for long, it's sudsing a bit more than I'd like, but still ok.

The machine is louder than the Neptune, no surprise there I suppose. The motor emits a low buzz as it tumbles, but doesn't seem to be struggling at all. There's about 120 minutes left to the wash, as this point, still hasn't drained for the first rinse.

I have to say it's a pretty cool machine. Not sure if I'd put it in the main house just yet - the laundry closet is within hearing distance of the bedrooms and all. On the other hand, I'm tired of all the thunking tha the Neptune does when it tries to balance a heavy load, and the Neptune pump is quite loud as well. Six of one, 1/20th of a gross.

The washer was so clean that I'm not to worried about muck and such. And this first load has lots of STPP and the clothes are quite old anyway.

Can I stand to have two of these things? Think so... lol...


Post# 239367 , Reply# 16   9/29/2007 at 15:56 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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PS to fungi,

I'm pretty certain the plug in the photo was not the one that came with the Miele, as the Miele officially wants a four wire plug/outlet. In this case, the round ground prong is used for neutral, and the two flat plugs are used for line 1 and line 2 (hot 110, 180 out of phase with each other). This is a bit of an odd plug but probably what the former owner had rigged up. It's rated for 30 amps so no worries about that. But a concern I have is that the plug's metal shell is grounded to the neutral. This means when you pull the plug, you're actually connected to the neutral. Unfortunately the outlet in the shop is also 3 prong, although it's a more robust twist-lock type of plug. Same issue: the metal casing of the plug is grounded to the "neutral" prong.

Gotta go back and see if I can catch the first rinse!


Post# 239415 , Reply# 17   9/29/2007 at 19:04 (4,376 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

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Great finds - it sounds like you won't be jumping "off the grid" anytime soon! I'd love to find one of these around here - best keep watching Craigslist!

Congrats on the new babies - I'll be very curious of what you think of it compared with the Neptune. I found the same suds-issue with the Asko I had. The heater seemed to cause more foam with the Sears detergent.


Post# 239430 , Reply# 18   9/29/2007 at 19:54 (4,376 days old) by appnut (TX)        

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Congratulations Rich!!

Post# 239437 , Reply# 19   9/29/2007 at 20:05 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
The gods must be crazy...

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Matched set (I think)

Post# 239439 , Reply# 20   9/29/2007 at 20:07 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
W1065 Close-up

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Fairly minty considering the age (how old is a W1065 anyway?)

Post# 239441 , Reply# 21   9/29/2007 at 20:09 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Control panel

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"Only" 1100 rpm... but look at that 200F!!!

Post# 239442 , Reply# 22   9/29/2007 at 20:11 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Thanks Bobba. I'm completely exhausted. It was a 100 mile rt to get the 1065 pair, and these suckers aren't light! LOL. Now, to watch the rest of the 1918 cycle... last time I left it, it was in the 2nd rinse (just shut off the power, and it remembers where it was, just like the good old days).

Probably won't get to try out the 1065 until Sunday. It needs a new plug, too.

The dryer is kinda cool. Vented, with butterfly drum rotation (switches back and forth).



Post# 239444 , Reply# 23   9/29/2007 at 20:17 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Atta Boy!!!!

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As I stated, the w1065 is the exact same washer as my W1070 except you have a window/porthole and mine is a solid door.

If you can give me snap of the electrical plate, may have some good news for you, as well.

The W1065/W1070 were, IIRC the second generation of Miele washing machines sold in the United States. Miele stopped selling them here around the mid to late 1980's or early 1990's with the introduction of the W1900/Novitronics series.

L.



Post# 239464 , Reply# 24   9/29/2007 at 21:36 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Cimbli,

Where might one find the electrical plate on this machine? Inside the door? Down by where the electricity enters the box?

BTW, thanks for all the support. I kind of wavered at the seller's house, knowing that I already had a working 1918. But I knew I'd never hear the end of it from you if I passed on this pair ;-). A couple Saturdays overtime will cover the expense... lol...

Incidently, the 1918 completed its cycle just fine. I'm quite impressed with all the tumbling and spinning that goes into the four rinse cycles. And as everyone already knows, the laundry comes out damp dry at the end of a 1600 rpm spin. Still, sad to report, the taro stains didn't quite come out. Nor did the redwood stain, the foundation epoxy (like JB Weld), or the Rustoleum red primer. I guess Miele can't do everything. Still, they are very clean with no odor whatsoever. These are the togs I put on when I'm doing some serious work in the crawl space. No clothing emerges from there quite the same.

Manana I will tend to the 1065. For now, dinner and rest.


Post# 239474 , Reply# 25   9/29/2007 at 22:12 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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Mine is right inside the door, over the porthole boot of the washing machine. Could also be inside the cover of the pump area.

L.


Post# 239475 , Reply# 26   9/29/2007 at 22:15 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
See I Told You

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Missing out on the Texas Miele set was for a reason! Now you're cooking with gas!!!!!!!!!!!!

L.


Post# 239492 , Reply# 27   9/29/2007 at 23:05 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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What Texas Miele set?


Post# 239493 , Reply# 28   9/29/2007 at 23:09 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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May have you confused with another member then,as there was a Miele set in Texas they were going for.

Sorry.

L.


Post# 239494 , Reply# 29   9/29/2007 at 23:14 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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You might be thinking of Sudsman. He lives in Texas.


Post# 239499 , Reply# 30   9/29/2007 at 23:23 (4,376 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Yes,

launderess's profile picture
Always get you two lads mixed up.

L.


Post# 239500 , Reply# 31   9/29/2007 at 23:31 (4,376 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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OIC.

Here's a way to tell us apart.

Sudsman is the high sudsing one.

I'm the low sudsing one.

Does that help?

:-)


Post# 239502 , Reply# 32   9/29/2007 at 23:45 (4,376 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

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More congrats on a very cool looking set!

Post# 239513 , Reply# 33   9/30/2007 at 02:10 (4,375 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Thanks Greg. Been printing out the owner's manuals from the Miele site. Don't understand why more mfg's don't make their manual available in this way.



Post# 239526 , Reply# 34   9/30/2007 at 04:31 (4,375 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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Congratulations again Rich! It's quite a weekend for you. That's a very nice set. The washer is wonderful to play with! The dryer isn't the exact match to your washer, actually it matches the W1070 that Cimberlie has. Here's a picture of the W1070, just for the record.

Post# 239701 , Reply# 35   9/30/2007 at 22:32 (4,375 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Thanks, Louis.

Got the W1065 hooked up this afternoon. Here's a shot of the serial plate, as Launderess requested. I downloaded the manual from Miele, and this model is capable of being hooked up to 110 only. More on that later.



Post# 239702 , Reply# 36   9/30/2007 at 22:39 (4,375 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Side by side...

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It's not pretty, but it works. I'm referring to the bucket with the sump pump in it. LOL. Not to mention the garden hose delivering cold water only.

Ran a load of bath sheets (3) just to test the 1065 out. Used a very small amount of old style Sears HE Plus with STPP. It just kept on sudsing throughout all the rinses. Didn't see that problem using even more of the Sears HE/Oxyclean (new purchase) in the 1918. So maybe the 1065 has a lot of built up detergent, or the towels had a lot of left over Safeway liquid HE, or the Sears HE Ultra sudses more than the Oxyclean version, or maybe all three.

The 1065 uses far more water for the rinses than the 1918. On the other hand, the 1918 does more spins between rinses.


Post# 239703 , Reply# 37   9/30/2007 at 22:40 (4,375 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Bingo

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Same as with my W1070, your Miele can run on 120v power, from a 20amp circut. You need to contact Miele for the special power cord however. Basically one is only engaging one heating element (1500w), so anyting above 140F is going to take a long time, and that is from warmish to cool water,don't even think about starting from cold water. Honestly if you have any intentions of using the higher boiling wash temperatures, stick to 220v power if possible.

Post# 239704 , Reply# 38   9/30/2007 at 22:44 (4,375 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Here's a shot of the plug I'm using to connect all three machines (two washers, one dryer). I'm using this style because it matches most of the 220 outlets all over the workshop. It's rated at 30 amps, 220 volts, twist lock style.



Post# 239705 , Reply# 39   9/30/2007 at 22:45 (4,375 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Cimberlie,

I have lots of 220 outlets in the workshop, so 110 operation is not an issue at this time. If I were to move the washer to a location in the home without 220, I might look into the conversion. But it might be easier (for me) just to extend a 220 volt line to the new location.


Post# 239714 , Reply# 40   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by panthera (Rocky Mountains)        
Congratulations

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Both of those washers are excellent machines. Parts shouldn't be a problem, but if they are (Laundress, this is for you, too), I live around the corner from the Miele repair center in Munich and am bouncing back and forth between the 'States and Munich a lot these days.
You do have to watch for scale and lime in these, by the way...those heating elements pile it on. I wouldn't use vinegar regularly, but citric acid to de-scale.
That dryer has a rear bearing which tends to wear a bit fast (for a Miele, that is), so if you hear unusual noises from the drum, get it replaced immediately or you could have some real fun.
Oh, just for the heck of it...how refreshing to see that even Miele refers to North American split phase as "two-phase". Tee-hee.
I remember that plug from our enormous window air-conditioner back in the early 1970's. The electrician really didn't like it...and exactly for that reason. We had to keep it, 'cause of the warranty, but the day the A/C was out of warranty, it got replaced with a 'dead' plug. There are several variations on 110v and '2-phase' (just teasing, O humourless ones) plugs in North America. If you have a proper 20Amp single-phase outlet, you will notice that the neutral (living dangerously here, O worshipers of the 2006 NEC) has the blade slot in both axis.


Post# 239716 , Reply# 41   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

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Thanks, Panthera.

Question: the 1918 works fine, but during the tumbling the machine gives off a low buzz during each tumble. It doesn't buzz at all during the spins (or not that I recall), so it's a bit strange. The 1065 doesn't buzz at all during tumbles or spins. It does have a very low hum during tumbles, but I figure that's normal motor sound.

Could the buzz be from worn brushes? Or is it coming from the tumble speed control?



Post# 239718 , Reply# 42   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by panthera (Rocky Mountains)        
not sure

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The hmmm...hmmm...hmmm I am familiar with. A 'buzzing' sound is new to me. You might notice that the very powerful heating elements make noise between the tumbles. Could that be it? I have'nt heard this model in ten years or so. I suggest you ask the question in a new thread - bound to be lots of us with this machine still in use. I gave mine to my neighbour's son when he got married in 1999 - and it was still going when I left Munich in July.
The pump should sound forceful, but if there is any sort of grating sound then there could be a button or such in there. The filter is pretty lax about stuff like that.
A silly question, but the shipping bolts were all removed?


Post# 239720 , Reply# 43   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Tale of Two Mieles

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By the way, whereas the 1918 came from a former half-way house, and the 1065 came from a spotless home in a fairly high rent suburb of SF, the inside story is a bit different.

The lint filter/coin trap for the 1918 was spotless. But the 1065... yeeccch! Pulled out a dime and a very corroded penny. Lots of crud came out of the drain tube, and there is an encrustation on the lower part of the filter housing that I didn't have time to tackle. Whereas the detergent tray for the 1918 was quite clean and fresh, that for the 1065 was quite grungy. OK, one machine is probably about five to ten years older than the other, but it wouldn't have hurt the owners of the 1065 to clean out the coin trap once in a while.

Think I will dose the 1065 with vinegar next time.

Oh, and Launderess - it appeared to me that ALL the rinses on the cottons cycle were deep. The water came up about 2 inches above the bottom of the door at each pause in the tumble.


Post# 239724 , Reply# 44   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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Panthera:

I stated clearly in another post that my Miele W1070 read "2 phase" on the electric plate, but you said it was a "mistake".

Suds:

The W1065 is only "electronic" but not as much as the Novatronic. I hear no buzzing when my 1070 is washing or spinning. Mind you the pump makes enough noise to wake the dead at times, especially if one uses too much detergent and has froth.

The rinses on on my 1070 are the same wash level as either delicates or woolens, can't remember which. Know this because once in a effort to flush out some excess froth (from my days of using regular Tide w Bleach), moved the cycle knob over to either delicates or woolens when the machine was on final rinse, and it wouldn't add more water.

These machines are picky on a few fronts. If you set the wash cycle for "1/2 load", and decide after the machine has stopped filling you to change your mind, forget it; the washer will not add more water. Drains and fills are all controlled by time. While the machine will start tumbling in both wash and rinses if the correct water level is not reached, the draining time is based upon parameters set per cycle. That is if one is using the max water cycle (woolens) the draining is longer to allow all the water to be pumped out before the machine starts spinning. If you change the cycles or try to create a work around and set the machine to do something when there is too much water in the drum, machine will simply advance timer to the end of the spin cycle. You'll have to use the "drain" cycle to get any remaining water out, or set the machine back to another spin.

Wouldn't trade my 1070 for anything else, except perhaps a 1918. You'll have fun discovering all the neat things your machine can do.

L.


Post# 239725 , Reply# 45   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Suds:

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These old Miele use lots of water! Wash levels are probably more than the 1918, and the rinses certianly are, IIRC.

Miele made some major changes between the 1065/1070 and the 1900 series:

Pre-wash became an option, instead part of the normal wash cycle for cottons, PP and delicates. Miele researched and found out newer washing actions along with modern detergents meant pre-washing was not always necessary, especially when starting from cold water.

Less rinse cycles, but more spins between rinses. As you know by now, the 1065 has a maddening number of rinse cycles, and only one 30sec spin after two rinses, then another short spin, after a third rinse, with a final spin after the fourth rinse. The 1918 has only three rinses IIRC, but spins after each one.
Mieles of the 1000 series had a morbid fear of suds locking, thus used the dilution method of rinsing.

No half load button. Miele ran adverts rubbishing Asko machines because the Miele Novatronics such as the 1918 automatically sensed load size and adusted water levels accordingly. However the half load funcion was still in 1918's,just called "Starch" when one used starch in the final rinse.

L.


Post# 239727 , Reply# 46   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Oh Yes,

launderess's profile picture
My 1070 arrived smelling foul of mould with god only knows growing inside the drain/coin trap, around the detergent dispenser and the door boot was GROSS. Thank god ordered a new boot from Miele to be on hand when the Miele tech arrived to install my new toy. When he took the old boot off I was almost sick. Was going to keep it, until I saw the state, then quickly had it wrapped up and chucked into the rubbish bin outside. Took several long cycles of vinegar and baking soda to clean out the machine, especially what growing in the pump/drain. Even then for months afterwards would see bits of muck and god only knows what else floating out in the sink as the machine drained.

Do yourself a favour and run each machine with a good descaler (Miele sells some), designed for cleaning out boilers/European washing machines. Most people don't bother, and if they have hard water and or are using normal detergents/badly dosing you can have a build up problem on the heating elements which will cause premature failure.

L.


Post# 239728 , Reply# 47   12/31/2069 at 18:00 (18,162 days old) by brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        
Water level fills are by Pressure switch

Hi Laundress,

I'm not sure what you mean when you say that the fill is controlled by time. The machine starts tumbling after the first water level on the switch is tripped, and then stops filling when the correct water level trips the switch again. If you listen, you should be able to hear the pressure switch click.

The machine tops up, as the fabric absorbs water, lowers the level of the water in the machine and resets the operating level of the pressure switch. When the clothes are fully saturated and dont absorb any more water, then the water level becomes static overall and no more water is added. The cooldown top up at the end of the main wash is also controlled by the pressure switch, rather than time.

I agree with the inability to change the cycle configuration. Unless the machine has done the first 2 dilution rinses and then spun, its impossible to try and skip ahead and get it to work properly. The machine behaves best when it's allowed to follow its programmed cycle. Its amazing how badly these early machines can sudslock.

On my W423, the Woolens cycle has the highest wash and rinse levels. If you load with the suggested 1.5kg of fabric, it basically floats in the water and doesnt tend to move too much. Laundress is right, the Delicates wash level is the same as the rinse level on cottons.

Sudsmaster, the machines from the mid eighties backwards, do sound a bit growly at times, its a sort of whirr that is different on the later fully electronic models. Could the Buzz be a whirr?

Congratulations on your acquisitions, they're great machines.

Nathan


Post# 239731 , Reply# 48   10/1/2007 at 02:19 (4,374 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Thanks, Cimberlie.

One of the Miele manuals says to use a descaler product called "Quick" which is, of course, available from Miele. I'll check with our local Miele dealer to see if they carry it.

The 1918 has four rinses. One can reprogram it to add a fifth rinse to the cottons cycle, and also for the Rapid wash. Also, one can reprogram the machine to have higher rinse levels in the cottons program.

The 1065 manual lists the water consumption of various cycles. They are all significantly more than what I observed running a rather small load on the 1918. This is also what I observed when running the 1065 through a short cottons wash this afternoon. The 1918 used less than 20 gallons for the entire long (1:56) cycle. The 1065 must have used about 30 gallons (as confirmed by the manual). This is of some importance to me right now because I have to run the sump pump manually to prevent the 20 gallon muck bucket that is acting as a drain-less laundry sink from overflowing. Eventually I'll figure out a way to extend a drain to the wall where the washer collection is "gathering". I suppose in the meantime I could use a larger bucket ;-).

I still have somewhat mixed feelings about getting so many Mieles all at once. The 1918 probably would have been more than enough. But I'm looking forward to opening one of them up and taking a personal look at the engineering and construction.


Post# 239733 , Reply# 49   10/1/2007 at 02:38 (4,374 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Nathan,

Yes, do understand that the washer will continue to fill until the proper level is reached, even once the timer has started the machine to tumbling, IIRC even mentioned that in one of my posts. What the washer will not do is add more water say in cottons, if one has the 1/2 load button pressed and the machine as finished filling and begun washing. From my experience even when the load requires more water, and the 1/2 load button has been or was depressed, the washer will not add more water even after the cycle has started. Never could stand the noise made by the pump under those conditions to wait long enough to see if machine would rectify the situation on it's own.

Suds:

The descaler Miele sends me just as "Miele" on the box. When I do the wash tomorrow, will take a closer look at the box in question.

Don't feel guilty about having "too many" Miele washers. Miele will soon be discontinuing the 220v washers in the United States, from what one has heard, and even now the 1918 is highly sought after by some. Worst comes to worst you can clean up the W1065 and after marking it up, sell it on. After all it is a very RARE 120v Miele washing machine. Built to those 1980's tank like construction.

Leave us not be too hasty, play around with both units and see which one you like best. You can always move one indoors for use with or instead of the Neptune.




Post# 239745 , Reply# 50   10/1/2007 at 07:40 (4,374 days old) by panthera (Rocky Mountains)        
phase change and time outs

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Actually, Miele washers of that vintage do have a built-in time out on the fill. Yes, if the water pressure sensor indicates that the proper level has been achieved the timer will advance. But these machines still only alloted a given span of time for filling. No feedback from the sensor within that time span and the machine went into it's famous click, clack, click program, bringing the timer back to stop. The schematic packed with these machines as well as the instruction manual has clear instructions on how to deal with very low water pressure.
At least in Germany, Miele's de-scaler is a mixture of citric and a second acid (Ameisensaeure, don't know the English name but think it is 'formic' as in Ant) together with some buffers, etc. Vinegar, at least on my most modern Miele is Verboten!
I don't recall whether it was me or someone else who made that statement about the '2-phase'. If it was me, sorry! I have tried to block that ridiculous bit of queenly bitchiness out. I teach technical terminology to, among others, electrical engineers in Munich, but try to speak like a normal person. What a horrid thought that I could be so catty. Again, dear lady, my apologies. Every normal person uses words which only the PC-Police object to. Two-phase instead of split-phase. Neutral instead of the 'Grounded (not Grounding)' wire, etc.
I strongly suspect those dear souls strike out the plus and minus signs on their batteries and paint them onto the 'correct' ends...


Post# 239768 , Reply# 51   10/1/2007 at 10:37 (4,374 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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According to my dictionaries Ameisensäure is indeed Formic Acid.

Post# 239776 , Reply# 52   10/1/2007 at 11:21 (4,374 days old) by tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

I had this machine. The new motor, which is cast iron, in 2003 was $750.00 which is why I do not still have the machine. It was a beauty. Itty bitty short short spin after the second rinse. Longer spin after the 3rd rinse.

Post# 239828 , Reply# 53   10/1/2007 at 18:26 (4,374 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
$750 for a motor is a bit steep, esp since the entire machine cost about $1500, or less, new. One could probably get a new motor for a Frigmore for $75.



Post# 239835 , Reply# 54   10/1/2007 at 18:49 (4,374 days old) by tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

Suds, Costwise, I figured the same thing. The motor contained two motors in one, half for tumble and half for spin. You cannot compare any part of the Miele with the Electrolux-made FriGEmores. The entire cabinet of the Miele, inside and out is porcelain. The top, of course, is not.

Post# 240253 , Reply# 55   10/4/2007 at 01:24 (4,372 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Yuck Fest

sudsmaster's profile picture
OK, Launderess, I truly believe you about all the MUCK that an old Miele can accumulate.

I did a load of work duds in the 1918 tonight. That went fine, more about that in another post. While it was running, I started poking around the W1065 to try to figure out why the detergent drawer was jamming and why the safety latch wasn't catching.

Eventually I just pulled the whole thing and brought it to the kitchen sink for a good scrubbing. Every part I poked, some mold or slime came out. Yecch. The worst was the fabric softener channel at the bottom of the drawer. It was completely plugged with a combination of white slime and black mold. Awful. Well, at least it didn't stink. But some pretty big globs came out during the washing.

For the latch issue, I poured boiling water in a glass mug, and then stuck the little red plastic latch assembly in that. Once it was hot, I bent the spring portion open a bit, and then ran it under cold water until it set.

The end result was a much cleaner drawer, minus globs of curdled softener and mold, which now slides in and out of the washer smoothly, stopping when the red safety latch catches like it's supposed to.

The rest of the washer will need a good going over with a descaler, I'm sure.


Post# 240261 , Reply# 56   10/4/2007 at 02:37 (4,371 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Do yourself a favour; take the detergent drawer all the way out, then shine a flashlight inside the compartment. You'd be surprised how much and what can grow back there, especially if previous owners/users were generous with detergents such.

One thing about the 10** series I do not like, is some powders do not totally dispense completely during the wash fill. Found this out when out of nothing better to do during one wash, took the drawer out and peeped. Got so bad used to squirt water back there with a turkey baster to flush the remaining detergent down into the washer. Now I just wait a second or two after the machine has started filling, carefully pull the drawer out and dump whatever powder detergent right down the chute. One probably could just pour detergent into the drum, but often use either oxygen bleach or detergents like Persil that contain bleach and am very afraid of causing stains or bleach spots.

Granted the first rinse fill will flush any remaining detergent down into the tub,but what is the good of that when the wash cycle is over?

L.


Post# 240317 , Reply# 57   10/4/2007 at 14:27 (4,371 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
I have looked inside the drawer cavity, and while it's a bit grungy, it's nowhere near as disgusting as the drawer channels were.

This reminds me. I'll have to check with my local Miele dealer to see if he has any descaler solution. If not, I have plenty of white distilled vinegar.


Post# 240323 , Reply# 58   10/4/2007 at 14:53 (4,371 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
You can order the descaling powder directly from Miele via their 1-800 number. IIRC one contacts either "parts" or "tech support".

You might be better off using the Miele powder, as it will tackle the job of really cleaning out god only knows what is inside the washer (no offence), while not causing any harm.

L.


Post# 240327 , Reply# 59   10/4/2007 at 15:10 (4,371 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Miele Descaler

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Ok lads, here is what the packet from my laundry product stash states:

Reckitt Benckiser Serivce
Miele 436001

Schnellentakalker/Quick Acting Decalcifier

Contains:

Less than 5% Nonionic Surfactants
Citric Acid, Maleic Acid

You pour the product into the washer, let it run a short wash program at 60C with at least 3 three rinses.

Apparently this product is also used in dishwashing machines, which leads me to believe it is nothing more than our "Dishwasher/Washing Machine" Magic sold for the same purposes.

L.


Post# 240361 , Reply# 60   10/4/2007 at 17:15 (4,371 days old) by nmaineman36 ()        

I never realized that with what i have read here about the yuck that can accumulate in the washer. I looked at mine today...granted the washer is only less than a month old...I did find that the main wash side where the flap is to hold in detergent is getting a buildup on a couple of pieces. I rinsed that off and I am going to keep up with keeping it clean. Nothing worse than a smelly washer with mold...my sister's LG is kinda ripe and I am going to have to clean it out for her. It has never been properly cleaned and I can smell the yuck on her clothes...she doesnt notice it but I do. In Maine the water is naturally soft and hopefully I wont have to look into a descaling product for the heater.
Now wouldnt using the wrong detergent like a one for a top loader being in a front loader also create an enviornment with all the suds to deposit gunk on the insides. We have a tenant that uses regular Tide Liquid in the Maytag Neptune and coupled with that gawd awful lavender Downy its really stinkin up the machine. I have "suggested " that he use Tide HE or an HE product...but he wont use it since they dont make the matching scent ...Lavender Tide ...Now you can imagine that his clothes come out smelling like a French whorehouse...and he likes that...eeeehttp://www.


Post# 240374 , Reply# 61   10/4/2007 at 18:39 (4,371 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Worn Brushes?

launderess's profile picture
According to my Miele service tech and Miele's tech support, the motor for my 1070 does not have brushes, so one assumes neither does the 1065.

L.


Post# 240375 , Reply# 62   10/4/2007 at 18:44 (4,371 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
All of the scented liquid versions of Tide detergent leave a residue behind in the machine that takes days to leave, if ever. One reason stopped using the Lavender/Rose Tide liquid is that the plastic/rubber parts of my Miele (detergent drawer, door boot),reeked of the stuff days after use.



Post# 240392 , Reply# 63   10/4/2007 at 20:25 (4,371 days old) by nmaineman36 ()        

Wow its not just me then....i thought that I was being kinda petty but I am glad to see that I am not alone.

Post# 240424 , Reply# 64   10/4/2007 at 22:59 (4,371 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
I have half a mind to just juice a bunch of limes (I have a very productive large lime tree) and let that run through the washer.

Let's see... 60C is about ... 140F ... no problemo ...


Post# 240425 , Reply# 65   10/4/2007 at 23:04 (4,371 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Thanks Launderess. But I was asking about the motor on the 1918, which is slightly buzzy during the tumble action (not during spin). But I imagine that if the 1065/70 motors don't have brushes, then neither does the 1918.

Another issue cropped up during last night's washing of work duds in the 1918. The pump got sort of noisy, as it it were loose on some sheet metal. So I'll have to inspect the coin trap again (it was clean as a whistle when I checked it the first day), but maybe I let a coin get in there. Or, perhaps its mountings are loose and I'm going to need to peek inside the cabinet. It's not obvious to me what's the best way to open this thing up, so if you have any insight there I'd appreciate it. I hate to be taking out the wrong fasteners and have some internal component take a dive ;-)



Post# 240431 , Reply# 66   10/4/2007 at 23:29 (4,371 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Cannot help you about opening up a Miele washing machine. The nice Miele service lad changed the boot on my machine,along with doing the install.

L.


Post# 240432 , Reply# 67   10/4/2007 at 23:33 (4,371 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Well, just got through running 2 oz of filtered lime juice in a quart of water through my drip coffee maker, no problem. So I think I'll try about a cup of filtered lime juice in the W1065.

Post# 240439 , Reply# 68   10/5/2007 at 01:49 (4,371 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Just add Tequila

sudsmaster's profile picture
Well, ran a short cotton wash at 140F, with the aforementioned lime juice - 1.5 cups worth.

Lots of suds... not too surprising, since it foamed a bit in the coffee maker as well. But there were lingering suds in the rinse, which leads me to think that at some point in the recent past the former owners overdosed the washer with high sudsing detergent. The suds subsided considerably by the last rinse, but still too much. The water came out pretty clean, with a few white granules - lime scale, no doubt. There might be more, don't know at this point. The stainless wash basket looks fine, but it did to begin with anyway.

So next step is to run the washer with about a cup of STPP (with a little sodium metasilicate to protect washer parts) at 200F on a long cotton wash. If that doesn't get rid of the suds residue, I don't know what might. The water came out pretty clean, with a few white granules - lime scale, no doubt. The STPP treatment will probably have to wait until this weekend, when I have more time to tend to the volumes of water that require manual intervention with the sump pump in the bucket, lol.

I will agree that the washer is entertaining, with all sorts of interesting sounds. And lots of water.


Post# 240577 , Reply# 69   10/5/2007 at 21:34 (4,370 days old) by earthling177 (Boston, MA)        

Wow, cool, congratulations, Rich!

As for the plug, yes, that is the "official" plug for those machines, they are whatever NEMA wants you to use for a 220V 15A appliance. That's because the neutral is not needed, just two hots and a ground. While it may be true that in Germany they use a hot and a neutral to get the 220V, the truth is that a Schuko plug is reversible and the distribution system at the time the plug was invented was insulated from ground, that is, the only ground (if there was one) was the one connected to the appliance, making the concept of a "neutral" wire a bit odd. Both conductors are insulated and not connected to any frame of the appliance, making it easy to just use two hots to obtain 220V like we do here. See en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthing_sy... for more info on our system(s) (TT, TN) and theirs (IT).

If you get too much trouble from excess suds, I can tell you that I've been happy with the combination of regular detergents and defoamer. Give it a try.

Cheers,
-- Paulo


Post# 240579 , Reply# 70   10/5/2007 at 21:49 (4,370 days old) by earthling177 (Boston, MA)        

Oh, forgot to say, if the descaler has Maleic acid, it might be the same stuff they have in dishwasher cleaners (like Glisten or JetDry Dishwasher Cleaner), altho you should check it, if I remember right at least one version of the JeDry cleaner had Sulfamic acid instead -- while it might not make any difference it you are cleaning a dishwasher or a clothes washer, I have no idea if one of the acids is not appropriate for say, the rubber boots.

Good luck!


Post# 240601 , Reply# 71   10/6/2007 at 00:09 (4,370 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Paulo,

Thanks.

Interesting info on the plug. In both cases the "ground" pin was connected to the white neutral wire from the washer. The green ground wire was simply clipped off. (The washers have four conductor wire cables: black, red, white, and green.).

Unfortunatetly the previous owner of the W1065 set clipped the original washer and dryer power cables about a foot or two short, and used the remnant to fabricate a splitter assembly to connect to a standard 3 prong 30 amp 220 volt dryer outlet. Although he said he would include the splitter with the purchase, once I had paid him and loaded the machines on my truck, he refused to give them over, saying he'd need them for a Bosch set they were getting. Sheesh. Anyway, it looks like I will have to rewire the washer and dryer with longer power cables, as the existing cables barely reach the shop outlets, and I'd rather avoid having little extension cables.


Post# 240605 , Reply# 72   10/6/2007 at 00:38 (4,370 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Ebay rule number one when picking up a prize; Gets all dat is yours before forking over da cash!


Keep your eyes peeled on FleaBay, Miele power cords and even that splitter doodad pop up there often enough. IIRC a spilter was just up last week. Of course you can just order either new from Miele, but not sure about the cost.

L.


Post# 240606 , Reply# 73   10/6/2007 at 00:55 (4,370 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
I think the cost of the Miele splitter is about $90. However, it wouldn't do me much good anyway in the shop, as the 220 outlets there are of the twist-lock variety, as I picturd earlier in this thread. I have just enough of those to connect these three Miele's: two washers, and a dryer, direct to the wall outlets. If I should happen to move them to the main house, where there's a more conventional dryer outlet, I could fabricate another splitter to handle that connection.

I need to run some water lines into the shop, and extend a drain line from where the washers are to the one and only drain 50 feet away.


Post# 240707 , Reply# 74   10/6/2007 at 15:27 (4,369 days old) by nmaineman36 ()        

I can tell you that splitter is not $90...try $250. When I bought my Miele set they...the dealer...didnt know about the adapter the 4 wire to 3 wire 240v cord. They were going to sell me the splitter that connected to the 3 wire 240 that I have. I called Miele and they told me that I only needed the 4/3 adapter that cost me $70. When the guys came to deliver the washer and dryer they had no idea how it worked or how to install it. Plus the splitter is only for the smaller Miele machine like you have and I was told that you cant run both at the same time...doesnt make sense to me.

Post# 240726 , Reply# 75   10/6/2007 at 18:03 (4,369 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Mainman,

You were told wrong... the requirements of the smaller Miele 220 volt washers is only 15 amps 220 volts. Same for the dryer. So, together, they require 30 amps 220 volts, which is what the standard American dryer outlet supplies.

Anyway, it's not rocket science to create a new splitter; just requires some judicious wiring and the correct plugs and sockets. I haven't priced out the cost of additional pigtail sockets; I happen to have enough in my shop from the previous homeowner's collection to create a splitter. But I will be searching for more plugs as I have some other 220 volt equipment that needs to be adapted to the multiple outlets already in place on the shop walls (and hanging from the rafters).

If you were told that you can't run an American style electric dryer and a 220 volt Miele washer off the same outlet, that is correct.


Post# 240728 , Reply# 76   10/6/2007 at 18:11 (4,369 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Suds Surprise

sudsmaster's profile picture
Well, today I set about "cleaning" out the W1065 washer of scale etc.

Ran 2 oz of STPP/Silicate through the prewash, and 4 oz through the main wash. Lo and behold, as the mainwash heated up, suds galore. Enought to cover the window and bring out the fabric softener to suppress the foam so I could stop the cycle and drain and rinse the thing. Ran several more main washes (skipping prewash) with more STPP and same result. Major suds. Checked the STPP in a shaken jar of hot water; no suds. So the suds were coming from inside the washer.

Cleaned out the detergent drawer cavity. It needed it, but I didn't find any obvious source of excess suds. My conjecture - since I know the couple I bought this from have a young daughter - is that the tyke dropped some regular hand soap bars (maybe the little hotel size or leftover remnants of larger bars) under the detergent drawer directly into the outer wash tub. Thus, the bars are lingering there and dissolving and creating suds whenever the water heats up (especially when it's got plenty of STPP to make the water soft).

My solution at present is to run multiple main washes at 200F with STPP, adding some fabric softener at the end to suppress suds enough to do a good drain, then rinse, drain, and repeat until the suds are gone. So far, must have run about five main washes, still over-sudsing.

I *wish* the previous owner had been honest and revealed this problem - surely they must have known this washer has a built-in sudsing issue. But the upside is that other than that, and some grunge, the washer appears to be in fairly good mechanical condition.

I'm currently letting the washer "soak" in the main wash with the power off, and going to the hardware store to pick up plumbing supplies. If I find a carpet cleaner foam suppressor and dishwasher cleaner I'll get those as well.

Never a dull moment. But I *will* "master" these suds.


Post# 240737 , Reply# 77   10/6/2007 at 19:41 (4,369 days old) by nmaineman36 ()        

Thats what I thought ...the guy I had a feeling didnt know what he was talking about at all. Doesnt surprise me. I knew that the smaller Mieles were 15 amps and i said that if you hook it up to a 30 circuit it should work at the same time. So another guy at the dealer backed up what the first guy said...I think if I buy anything else...and it wont be for a while....it wont be from that dealer. I told Miele when i called them for my dead washer episode that the guys at the dealer had no clue and that as a company selling high end products that maybe just maybe there should be some training going on.
Anyways its good to see that you seem happy with your machines....I know I love mine.


Post# 240746 , Reply# 78   10/6/2007 at 20:17 (4,369 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Not to burst your theory, but due to the design of the "chute" that leads into the tub, those soap bars would have to be very small indeed; so msmall as to be almost of an non-thought because water, time and temperature would have melted them down. Unless of course the child was dumping soap chips down there by the cups full. Also am almost certian there is a divider bar on top of said chute, that alone would prevent large objects from going down into the machine. In fact it sort of makes sense as a washing machine protection system, to keep small objects like children's toys and such out of the washer.

Depending upon water conditions of the previous users,type or types of detergent used, amounts and often used water temperatures, you may have a VERY bad case of detergent/muck build up between the inner and outer tubs. Sort of like the soap and muck mess that gets trapped in grease traps on bathroom sinks from all that undissloved soap.



Post# 240747 , Reply# 79   10/6/2007 at 20:20 (4,369 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Rug Doctor

sudsmaster's profile picture
Just got back from HW Store #1. No 4 wire 12 ga cable. No hot water hose (need 75 feet to run from sump pump to drain in back of shop). No dishwasher cleaner.

But, they did have Rug Doctor anti-foam, and it works nicely at suppressing the suds in the 1065. I'm letting it sit with a drum full of 200F water as I go out shopping, then come back and let it tumble for a while. If the suds build up again, add more Rug Doctor. Repeat as needed. Eventually I'll get tired of this, or the suds will finally stop forming. Also adding more STPP as I go, just to make sure I'm not creating more soap scum.

Off to HW Store #2. Found a plug/recepticle that "looks" like what the shop is fitted with, but came home to pick up a sample in order to be 100% sure. Looks like an NEMA L6, but the ones I have are pat pending Hubbell with no NEMA numbers.

Later.

(Can't say I'm completely in love with either Miele at this point, as they both need some TLC, lol).


Post# 240759 , Reply# 80   10/6/2007 at 21:06 (4,369 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Just a thought, if you supress suds too much, how will you know when the machine is "clean"?

Now you know why I just called a Miele tech out to install my vintage machine. Only work one had to do was make a fresh pot of coffee so as to be able to offer. *LOL*

L.


Post# 240796 , Reply# 81   10/6/2007 at 23:01 (4,369 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Oh, there's nothing wrong with the "installation", as such. It's just the past lives that are catching up with the poor 1065.

I will know that the suds are gone when I run a 200F main wash with STPP without foam suppresset with no sudsing. It's that simple!

If I had way more experience with this particular washer mechanics, I'd open it up and expose the inside of the outer drum. I'm sure I'd see little soap bars in the shape of animal crackers. If so, eventually, they will all dissolve and the problem will be resolved, non-surgically.

Oh, and I took a sample of the shop outlet and matching plug. Turns out it's an obsolete design... I could file off the angle on the ground prong and get a NEMA5L to work, sort of, but I'd rather not go that route. I will check in with a local electrical supply house next week (I work just a block from one) and see if they can solve my "Hubble Trouble".


Post# 240799 , Reply# 82   10/6/2007 at 23:07 (4,369 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
While the Miele tech was installing my unit, he checked every thing out, changed the door boot, removed the inner glass porthole and cleaned it out, and while the front was off the machine (necessary to change the boot), gave everything a once over. Well everything that could be seen from the front that is.

L.


Post# 240812 , Reply# 83   10/7/2007 at 02:54 (4,368 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Pssst! Hey Suds! Chme Here!

launderess's profile picture
Err, take a peek mac. You interested?

CLICK HERE TO GO TO launderess's LINK on eBay


Post# 240817 , Reply# 84   10/7/2007 at 05:28 (4,368 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Thanks Cimbi. I will bid on that one, I think. Price may well be less than I could spend on parts alone. The plugs won't fit what I'm using now, but I can always rewire the Miele end. I know the plugs are available at OSH/Home Depot, unlike the obsolete Hubbell plugs I'm currently using.

PS-Got fed up and ran about 2 qts of white vinegar in the 1065. Seemed to free up more encrustation, with little to no sudsing. Also ran a scoop of Borax in another wash, not much sudsing there either. But the instant I put in a scoop or two of STPP/Sodium Silicate, suds start up, and get somewhat un-manageable by the time the temp reaches 200F. (all these different additions are on separate main washes, so you know I've been spending a lot of time trying to descale/de-suds this thing). I know there is encrustation becuase it's collecting at the bottom of the makeshift laundry tubs I'm using (upgraded from 20 gallon muck bucket to 32 gallon plastic trash can today). Also cleaned out the coin/lint trap again. There was a black encrustation at the bottom of it, had to scrape that off. This revealed a small channel of some sort, which turned out to be plugged, so I unplugged it as best I could. Don't know what the channel is for, but it felt good to unplug it ;-).

More news on the 1065. Intermittantly, and sporadically, it makes a loud noise while tumbling. I'm guessing there is an automatic belt tensioner in this machine, and the bearings are shot in the rollers. Just an educated guess, but my experience with other machinery (namely a lathe I own) that makes a similar sound when the belt tensioner is mal-adjusted leads me to believe this is the case with the 1065 as well. It may be wishful thinking, since a new motor reportedly costs something like $800. So it would seem that I will be taking the front off the machine anyway, to check out the source of that sound. Might as well pull the boot and poke around the inside of the outer tub while I'm at it. Also planning on pulling the front panel on the 1918, as its pump sounds like it's loose, and the motor makes a faint buzz (not as concerning at this time as the loud noise from the 1065).

Also finally got an industrial grade garden hose (75 ft) so I can now send the drain water from the "laundry tub" to the one drain in the shop - no longer do I have to send it out a window into an unplanted area. Progress.

Meanwhile, my regular laundry is being handled by the trusty old Neptune. Since its major repairs three years ago, it's been very reliable, knock on powder coat.




Post# 240836 , Reply# 85   10/7/2007 at 07:19 (4,368 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Loud Noise:

If it sounds like a goose being strangled, then it is normal and caused by air getting into the pump,IIRC. Happens when machine is over-loaded, over-foaming, or when the water level drops below a certian point as the machine is tumbling (such as while draining), and air gets to the pump. Damn annoying, but is my one clear indication my machine is either overloaded or has too much suds.

Creda Power Splitter,

Am almost certain this is the second go around for this item, thus if it does not sell, seller may not relist. There was a Miele splitter on a week or so ago,but guess auction has ended as cannot find it now.


Encrustation:

As Andy Griffth told Aunt Bea - "Call da Man" *LOL*

Call up Miele and get a few boxes of their descaler, maybe you can find a member who is a dealer that can hook you up with a discount, then run several cycles at 200F to get whatever is in that machine out. Must say don't remember my 1070 being that badly encrusted. Mouldly around the pump and door boot yes, but what is to be expected when a front loader is shut up and sitting unused as mine was.

Whatever brews you dream up/try to clear the problem, take heed that their are some sensitive sensors and such inside Miele wash drums. Perhaps more on the 1918 than the 1065, but they are there and can be harmed by certian chemicals. Must be the previous owners used heavy powdered detergents and or perhaps not very high wash temperatures; those factors along with hard water can lead to massive gunking of any machine.

Wish you the best of British luck on your project. Know how you feel though, couldn't wait to get my Miele up and running,it sat for a good week or so until the old unit was shifted, and Miele tech arrived for the install. Then to make matters worse didn't have the proper outlet, so had to wait a week for electrican to come out.

L.


Post# 240855 , Reply# 86   10/7/2007 at 09:58 (4,368 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

foraloysius's profile picture
The pump of my Miele W715 makes kind of a rattling noise. These pumps are noisier than the older ones. I believe almost all newer pumps are louder than their older counterparts. When I bought a new AEG frontloader in 1993 the pump was simply loud. Very cheap sounding. Miele makes better ones, but not as good as the old ones IMHO.

Post# 240867 , Reply# 87   10/7/2007 at 11:33 (4,368 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Thanks Cimberlie and Louis...

I am used to the "empty tub" pump noise, but that's not what the 1918 is doing. The sound of the pump suddenly changed from relatively quiet to very loud and rattling. I checked the coin trap and it's still clean. I suspect the pump is loose on its mounting, becuase it's sort of a rattling sheet metal type of sound.

I haven't used any descaler type chemicals in the 1918, so its sensors are as yet unmolested. The 1065 has seen lots of STPP, Borax, white vinegar, and lime juice (!). But the intermittant motor/pulley noise has been there from the beginning. At first I thought it was part of the vintage Miele charm symphony, but I no longer subscribe to that notion. I think I agree, a call (or online order) to Miele for their descaler is in order. From your post it sounds like it takes one order per washer per treatment. At $20 a pop, that could get sort of pricey. I will also look into descalers at my local appliance parts store. Perhaps they have something that would work just as well. But since I'm going to take off the front of the unit anyway to inspect the pulley system...

Part of the reason why I get stuff like this is so that I can take it apart and learn how it works. Certainly the Mieles promise to fulfill that goal.


Post# 240967 , Reply# 88   10/7/2007 at 23:52 (4,368 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Quick Question:

How did you move your Miele washers? Did you reinstall the shipping bolts? Maybe something got shifted during the move and could be the cause of the noise?



As for the descaler: I'd look into Dishwasher/Washing Machine Magic or any of the other descaling products sold for automatic washing machines, dishwashers or even boilers. Bound to be along the same lines as the Miele (surfactants, and various types of acids), and probably much cheaper than the imported Miele product).

L.


Post# 240968 , Reply# 89   10/8/2007 at 00:52 (4,368 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Shipping bolts? Nowhere to be found at either of the sellers' premises. I did move them gently, but I do agree that the 1918 at least may have suffered some shifting of internals either during the move or more likely when it was moved from the basement of the half-way house to the garage some time prior to my purchase.

All is conjecture until I can get the machines open for inspection. At this point I'm probably not going to run any more loads in either one until I know more.


Post# 240971 , Reply# 90   10/8/2007 at 01:33 (4,368 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Original owner long ago lost the shipping bolts for my machine. Had to order a new set (very dear), and have them shipped down to the seller, who very nicely offered to insert/prepare the unit for freight pick-up.

When ordering the shipping bolts, Miele's tech told many, many times either the Miele pepole themselves doing the installation, or Miele authorised installers take the shipping bolts away with them after work is done. This can cause problems later if the owners wish to shift the machine or sell it on, because it means they now must pay for something which came "free" with the unit. My shipping bolts are back in their original shippping box, saved in case of a move.

Creda Splitter:

Happy to see you won the item! Atta boy! Look forward to seeing if the splitter works out.

L.


Post# 241066 , Reply# 91   10/8/2007 at 14:16 (4,367 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
My assumption has been that since both machines spin to top speed with load with no balance problems, that nothing major was dislocated in the move even without shipping bolts. My gut feeling is that they are needed when being handled by commercial shippers, who may treat a crated appliance with all the loving care of an airline baggage handler, but for gentle homeowner moves with no sudden jolts, they may not be required.

Will know more when the machines expose their innards.


Post# 241079 , Reply# 92   10/8/2007 at 15:12 (4,367 days old) by brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        
Exposing the innards

Hi Suds,

Both machines are designed to be serviced from the front for the most part.

There should be a screw on either side of the lid, 3 bolts around the door opening, and a few screws around the detergent drawer.

The lid is hinged and once the screws are removed it should just lift up.

The door boot, may or may not be held in place with a wire ring and a spring. If there is no wire ring, then it is sandwiched between the outer door and the inner frame.

Once you remove the screws around the detergent dispenser and the bolts around the door, the front panel should be hinged on the right and just swing open.

One word of warning, two out of four old machines that I've opened, I've never been able to get to seal properly again without a new door boot. Just something to keep in mind before you break in :)

Also, all Australian and Euro machines up until about 10 years ago, all had brush motors. Now all machines other than the TOL ones still have brush motors. I've got the motor out of a W1065 here, I'll try and take some pictures tonight to show you where they go. Unfortunately though, you need to remove the motor from the machine to change them, and its a bear of a job.

I hope this helps.

Regards
Nathan


Post# 241082 , Reply# 93   10/8/2007 at 15:27 (4,367 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Nathan, strange you state that the 1065 has motor brushes. When I contacted Miele tech support/parts department about my 1070, specifically asked if the machine has brushes in the motor ( was concerned about them wearing out and parts being NLA), and the tech went up and down the parts list/diagrams and repeatedly told me that my unit did NOT have brushes.

Maybe just caught one tech on a off day, will call again and pose the same question.

L.


Post# 241083 , Reply# 94   10/8/2007 at 15:30 (4,367 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
New Boot

launderess's profile picture
Ordered one for my 1070, before it arrived, just in case the one with the machine was rotted, and was so glad I did because the thing was totally gross. Took the nice young lad doing the install better part of 20 mins or so to fit the new boot on. Required lots of tugging and stretching from what one could see, but guess that is why the thing is water tight.

Cannot remember what the new boot cost, but like all things Miele, it was not cheap. Think still have the invoice somewhere.

L.


Post# 241176 , Reply# 95   10/9/2007 at 01:12 (4,367 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Nathan,

Thanks for your post. Too bad I didn't read it until now, but no worries. I spent the better part of the evening taking apart the 1918, and discovered the same fact you mention: that the front panel is hinged on the right, and the lid easily slides off after you pull the two screws on either side.

The 1918 is squeaky clean; there's reason to believe it never saw much use, but was, rather, an object of study at a local household products company's R&D labs. In any case, I tightened up a few fasteners while I was in the process, and satisfied myself that the pump wasn't loose. After I got it all buttoned up, I ran a mixed load and observed that the bottom panel/pan is responsible for most if not all of the rattling noise during drains. No problems with leaks after closing the front panel, but, then, I didn't pull the boot off the outer tub.

I picked up a remote infrared thermometer over the weekend. I observed that the 1918 runs a bit cooler than the dial would indicate. At 140F dial selection, the actual temp is between 132F and 136F. In contrast, the 1065 got to a real 200F.

I was thinking the most direct route to the motor would be if one were to tip the machine on its back, and the pull the bottom pan. Otherwise one would have to pull the boot, inner drum and outer tub, etc, which certainly would be a bear since it weighs so darn much.

I agree with those who say the Miele is very well built. Not only is the entire outer cabinet thick porcelain coated steel, but the internal struts braces etc are also porcelain coated steel


Post# 241212 , Reply# 96   10/9/2007 at 08:35 (4,366 days old) by aamassther (Hendersonville, NC )        

aamassther's profile picture
Well, California seems to be a mecca for used Miele these days...
Used W1070 and matching dryer.


CLICK HERE TO GO TO aamassther's LINK on eBay


Post# 241334 , Reply# 97   10/9/2007 at 18:42 (4,366 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        
Caveat Emptor...

sudsmaster's profile picture
"Washer timer sticks on rinse cycle and requires a manual "click" of the dial. All else working. Sold as is. "

Post# 241354 , Reply# 98   10/9/2007 at 20:39 (4,366 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Saw that auction earlier,dryer looks interesting. From the seller's tone, don't expect him to let go of these units for "a song". The remark "can these units down to the Salvation Army ... and take the tax write-off", says quite allot. Far as one is concerned he can haul his tat anywhere he choses and good luck. Da noive, a washing machine with a faulty timer that will cost probably as much if not more than what the seller is trying to flog the washer for in terms of parts and labour; assuming one does not do the work themselves. Even if one could do the work, parts have to come from Miele, and they are not always cheap.

L.


Post# 241362 , Reply# 99   10/9/2007 at 20:54 (4,366 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Any washer that requires manual intervention is no longer an automatic washer in operation; and while I commend the seller for his honesty, I do think he's trying to capitalize on the Miele reputation without giving due consideration to the cost to the buyer.

For example, my 1065/1050 pair cost me $400, plus perhaps $40 for gas there and back (truck gets lousy mileage). Plus time. A new Miele capable of 190F runs for just under $2000, although I saw a clearance tag on one recently so it may be less as dealers are clearing discontinued stock. Anyway, let's say my 1065 needs a new motor. I understand the motor part alone is $850, not including labor. That's nearly 1/2 the price of a brand new Miele.

The same goes for so called classic reliable cars. They are only as reliable as the maintenance and repairs go. All machines eventually wear out and need major repairs - unless they are just left to sit, unused, and even then things like rubber, oil, grease, sealants, etc dry out or deteriorate despite the best of care. Heck, one can get a new 4.0 cu ft 110 volt Miele for $1600 ($1900 for the top of the line model). If the motor in my 1065 is bad, as in bad bearings, I'm prepared to try to rebuild it myself, as I have the skills and access to machining equipment to do a lot of stuff the normal owner wouldn't attempt. For me it's more of a collector's item. New timer/controller for the 1070 in the listing? Who knows? I'm guessing the part would start at $400.



Post# 241411 , Reply# 100   10/9/2007 at 23:38 (4,366 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Well, all this talk about descaling and cleaning up vintage Miele washing machines, made one think it was time to see what was goin on in my unit. So got out my cleaning supplies and decided to give Brunhilde a good going over.

First of all, as usual found nothing besides some lint in the coin trap. This is to be expected as one is quite careful about pockets, buttons and that sort of thing. Draining the bilge water out before opening the coin trap, produced muck filled and somewhat soapy water. The inside of the pump/coin trap area was had some muck and mould as well. Made note to oneself to swear off soap and non "HE" detergents from now on.

After cleaning everything up and out, gave the front of the washer including doors, every crack and nook a good wiping down with disenfectant cleaner. When all was put together fired up ole Brunhilde for boil wash with Miele descaler.

Those of you whose machines do not reach temps over 140F, much less 200F don't know the wonderful thrill a boil wash can bring! Steam rising from the detergent drawer, sounds of "boiling" water inside the machine. The smell of soaps/detergents and such wafting through the laundry as the machine goes about it's business.


Post# 241436 , Reply# 101   10/10/2007 at 02:14 (4,365 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
According to the MSDS, the product "Washer Magic" is 10% to 30% citric acid. Lemon juice is about 5% citric acid. Lime juice may be higher in citric acid than lemon juice. Assuming that Washer Magic is 20% citric acid, then it would take four times as much lemon or lime juice to equal its effect. A standard dose of Washer Magic is 24 oz. so it could take 98 oz of lemon/lime juice to equal its strength. In my 1065, I added about 12 oz of fresh lime juice (and that was a fair number of limes). Since I have a big tree, I could probably squeeze four times that amount, but I might have some concerns about other components (pectin etc) in the natural juice that might interfere with the cleaning action. It would smell nice, though:).

When I dosed the machine with vinegar, I used 1/2 gallon, which is probably close to the organic acid concentration of the Washer Magic product. Plus, since the Miele only uses about 5 gallons of water per wash part of the cycle, one might expect that one could use less of the product to achieve a final concentration equal to that when it's used in a traditional top loader. But since the 1065 seems to be so loaded up with lime scale and mold I probably would use the entire 24 oz of the Washer Magic product.

It's funny. My remote sensing thermometer indicated that the 1065 reached a true 200F during its boil wash, but I didn't hear any "boiling" going on. When I added de-foamer, I did hear a sizzling sound as the suds disappeared during the pause of each tumble rotation. The lime juice sure did smell nice though, at that temp!


Post# 241464 , Reply# 102   10/10/2007 at 06:03 (4,365 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
IIRC, packet states 250g.

Odd you don't hear any "boiling" sounds from your 1065. One hears sounds almost like what comes from inside a kettle before it begins to whistle.



Post# 241472 , Reply# 103   10/10/2007 at 08:19 (4,365 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Correct, I found a UK listing for the descaler, says it's 250g.

Also says it's L2.99. That works out to perhaps $8. Way less than the $20.00 that Miele wants us to pay in the USA.



Post# 241473 , Reply# 104   10/10/2007 at 08:23 (4,365 days old) by sudsmaster (East of SF, West of Eden, California)        

sudsmaster's profile picture
Perhaps I mistook boiling sounds for subsiding suds sounds. Will have to run a 200F cycle with plain water at some point to see if there are any suds and if I can hear the boiling.

But first gonna tip the 1918 on its back to pull the bottom pan, see if I can quiet it down, and also to see if the pump and the main motors are accessible from there.

Other than the loud pump rattling the bottom pump, the 1918 seems to work fine. Also fixed the water supply and drain arrangement so that I can actually let the machine run unattended.





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