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Thread Number: 19496
Euro wash times vs. US wash times... |
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Post# 313622 11/7/2008 at 11:24 (5,642 days old) by pulsator  (Saint Joseph, MI) |
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How long does the wash cycle usually take on Euro washers? I've been thinking that the reason I'm having such trouble with the Ariel Excel Gel and Persil may be related to the fact that my Miele W1215 only washes for 27 minutes on the Normal cycle with a full load and 43 minutes on the whites cycle with a full load. My whites loads are usually on the small side and so the machine cuts the wash time to 36 minutes! Is that drastically different from Euro wash times? I've been using the extended option and am wondering what else I can do? Is there a way to change the programming to wash using Euro cycles? Because from my understanding, Euro wash times seems to be a LOT longer than US wash times!
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| Post# 313625 , Reply# 1 11/7/2008 at 11:40 (5,642 days old) by cbosch () | ||
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euro wash times on my miele the cottons wash at 60 is 1hr49 and the minimum iron cycle is 1.19. have tried Arieal gel and think its ok but I do prefer presil non bio liqui gel, better bubbles! | ||
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Post# 313644 , Reply# 4 11/7/2008 at 13:44 (5,642 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land) |
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I could be wrong but..........
My understanding of US spec washers vs. European spec washers and their cycle times is......... Here in the US we have externally heated water supplies (water heaters) and washers have both HOT and COLD water supply lines connected to them, thus, get the desired water tempature WHEN the washer fills. From what I have seen in Germany, Italy and Hong Kong, the Euro spec washers have only a COLD water supply line connected to them and use an internal heater to, yes you guessed it, heat the water for anything beyond cold. Obviously it takes TIME to heat the water (and the wet cloths) from cold to the desired degree of hot-ness (hows that for a word? LOL) for the chosen wash cycle. Time required to heat water = longer cycle times. | ||
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Post# 313648 , Reply# 5 11/7/2008 at 13:50 (5,642 days old) by mrboilwash (Munich,Germany) |
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Are you talking about the wash time or the whole cycle time, including rinses and spin ? Is it a cold fill machine ? My Miele is set to 45 min wash time on a regular cotton cycle and if the extended button is pressed it is 75 min. A whole cycle can easily take 2 hours to complete. I remember your socks did not come clean in the Ariel Excel thread. May I ask what type of Persil gives you poor results, German or UK one, powder or liquid ? | ||
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Post# 313651 , Reply# 6 11/7/2008 at 13:59 (5,642 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land) |
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Yes I referred to cycle time but...... | ||
| Post# 313653 , Reply# 7 11/7/2008 at 14:17 (5,642 days old) by seamusuk (Dover Kent UK) | ||
A suggestion.....
Jamie Your Miele is 220V and has a heater right?? Id suggest putting a Y adaptor on the cold feed and trying it as cold fill only. Euro detergent is designed with an enzyme stage thats designed to work as the water heats- putting hot water in at this stage wont help things. Using cold will probably extend the wash times as well. If you were feeling brave I dont know if Miele US would be prepared to give it a Euro PC update??? Seamus | ||
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Post# 313658 , Reply# 8 11/7/2008 at 14:52 (5,642 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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The main wash on our Electrolux takes approx. 25 min. for a cold quick wash 35 min. for a 104°F quick wash 40 min. for a 140°F quick wash 70 min. for a 104/140°F regular wash 100 min. for a 140° wash on the energy saving cycle Rinsing & spinning adds another 30 to 40 minutes. Have tried the Excel stuff and am not too pleased, either. Alex | ||
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Post# 313663 , Reply# 9 11/7/2008 at 15:33 (5,642 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Wash times on "European" washing machines reflect several factors. First, time is allowed to heat water (tap cold or warm) to whatever temperature desired. Some Euro front loaders have their thermostats routed through the timer, much like dishwashers and will hold the heating portion of the cycle untilt he proper temp is reached, (however long that may take). Other machines simply are programmed to allow certain time parameters for heating water, once that time is up machine will advance to main washing portion of the cycle, regardless of water temperature. However most if not all of the these machines will continue to heat the water until it reaches the set temp. However should the wash cycle time out before the temp is reached, then that is the end of that. To be fair on 220v or even 400v power, heating 8 to 10 gallons of water from 80F to 140F or even 200F isn't going to take that much time. With American front loaders running on 120F, there probably are going to be some problems. Long wash times also are a reflecton of European detergents, which combine oxygen bleaches, and perhaps enzymes. The cold or cool water start, prevents protien stains from being set. Warm water period is to activate enzymes, which worked best at 100F to 120F Hot to boiling wash period was to give the oxgyen bleach proper temperature and time to work. Being as all this may, modern detergents on Europe are more and more designed to work in "quick cycle" wash times. This is due mainly to advances in detergent chemistry which allow the above chemicals to work in cold, cool and warm water. Thus cleaning takes place rather quickly, instead of a long drawn out process. There are enzymes that will work in cold and warm water. Activated oxygen bleaches or percarbonate bleach (works in cold water, unlike perborate which needs hot water), mean bleaching action can start sooner and is complete even in warm water. Your problems with Ariel and Persil may be related to your water quality and types of soil, and not merely a short cycle problem Try adding some STPP along with your Persil. In my Miele normally use 2 tablespoons of Persil "Sensitive" along with 2 teaspoons to one tablespoon of STPP, for a full (5kg) wash load, and find everything comes out great. If you are in the habit of wearing socks around the home as "slippers", then you have ground in dirt, which will take some work to shift even under the best situations. However phosphates are great at removing clay based soils from laundry. L. | ||
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Post# 313688 , Reply# 12 11/7/2008 at 17:54 (5,642 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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One reason I love my vintage Miele is that it has a mechanical timer. Can adapt any cycle to suit my needs, rather than allowing the machine to decide. This very handy when one has lots of laundry to get done, and not lots of time. Cold Fills are one of the biggest "lies" being thrown around these days for front loaders. The concept does make sense in many parts of Europe, the UK and other parts of the world where central hot water heaters are unknown. Many French kitchens for instance still have a small on demand hot water heater in the kitchen near the tap, another in the bathroom and that is it. So if the washing machine is no where near either, it makes sense to let it take in cold water and get on with heating. However if one has a central source of hot water, and that water is going to be heated regardless, the savings by cold filling aren't what they are cracked up to be. Consider many European front loaders do not heat water at full blast, but rather gradually, supposedly this is better for textiles. Well it also adds time to the cycle. | ||
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Post# 313714 , Reply# 13 11/8/2008 at 01:39 (5,642 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land) |
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Thank you David... | ||
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Post# 313721 , Reply# 14 11/8/2008 at 04:03 (5,641 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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Post# 313790 , Reply# 17 11/8/2008 at 17:03 (5,641 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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At least you're not alone, Pulsator | ||
| Post# 313808 , Reply# 18 11/8/2008 at 20:53 (5,641 days old) by peterh770 (Marietta, GA) | ||
I don't know how it worked in the EU, but here we had the wringers for a long time before automatics came out. Even then, women typically washed for 10-15 minutes, enough time to rinse twice the previous load with wringing in between. Detergent manufacturers knowing this developed their products to work well in relatively short order. When the switch to automatics came about, detergents were already available for about a 10 minute wash. Since automatics saved the homemaker so much time and effort, short and efficient wash cycles mimicked how the wringer was used. While the first automatics were frontloaders, Bendix gave a relatively long prewash at 6 mintes before the 9 minute main wash, thoroughly removing the dirt (we know rinsing was another matter). Westinghouse had a significantly longer wash times (IIRC about 20 minutes). The war set everything behind, but post-war was the toploading automatic boom. Does anyone know why frontloaders were so much more popular in EU than tops? Were agitator wringers and twinnies the order of the day before the war, or was it semi-automatic H-axis washers that easily converted to automatics? | ||
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Post# 313821 , Reply# 19 11/9/2008 at 00:10 (5,641 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Many European and UK homes/kitchens simply aren't as large as those found in the United States. Front loading washing machines are easily fitted into small kitchens or some other area of a tiny apartment such as a bathroom or WC. Yes, twin-tubs, and wringer were around in Europe, just look at some of the photos posted by members from the EU. Or, check out various European appliance maker's history museums, such as Miele's or V-Zug's. Main differnce between European wringers and twin-tubs versus their American cousins, is the former most always had some sort of heating system (electric, wood or coal fire), to accomodate the boil washing European housewives and laundries wouldn't be without. L. | ||
| Post# 313823 , Reply# 20 11/9/2008 at 00:38 (5,641 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
The explanation I have been given about wash cycle times, water consumption and overall quality of the wash does come down to a few things.. Water consumption Older front load machines used at least 50% more water than they do now. My old Australian built Hoover Electra was rated at 4kg and used 90ltrs or 22.5ltrs:kg....my 2 1/2 yr old Westinghouse (Zanussi-electrolux) is rated at 6.5kg and 72ltrs or 11.1ltrs:kg.....thats less than half the water and the Electa was considered efficient! Detergents Are more complex chemically than they used to be and with the lower water levels, lower phosphate content need longer to be effective on FULL loads... Capacity and Load used Machines now hold more - technically. Try weighing out the capacity of your machine and then getting it all in. Most of us only put enough in the drum for it to be 'comfortably full'. I was always told to put enough in so that it 'moves back and forth' as you try to put more in...then take 1 medium sized item out. It has never let me down. I can wash on the 40c Quick wash and get A1 results as my load is about 2/3rds rated capacity. So try not putting quite as much in, use a good powder detergent and warm water and see how you go....and your machine should last longer too...spinning capacity weight every time does horrible things to bearings... Oh, and my machines normal 40c = 117min...quick = 68... | ||
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Post# 313833 , Reply# 23 11/9/2008 at 05:58 (5,640 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands) |
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Europe
Overhere in Europe wringers were also used for a very long time. The first automatic washer that was installed in a home in the Netherlands was a Bendix from the USA. In 1954 Constructa introduced the first European fully automatic frontloader on the market. V-Zug in Switzerland already had introduced an H-axis toploader in 1950, but that wasn't fully automatic, you had to manually adjust the programme settings. That was one of the few semi-automatics that we got here in Europe. No need of handling wet laundry though, it was all done in one drum including spinning. Why Constructa and V-Zug chose for H-axis machines? I'm not sure about that. I don't think space was the reason, those early frontloaders were bolt down machines, not suitable for installing under a kitchen counter. Most of them had a soap dispenser on top so that made an under the counter installation impossible too. And these frontloaders were wider than modern European machines. Modern European frontloaders have a standard width of 60cm (23 something inches) while the older frontloaders were 68 cm or thereabout. My wild guess is that because of the different way of heating water (most smaller houses and apartments had flow through water heaters, although in the UK that was different I think) it took longer to fill a washer than it did in the USA from a tank water heater. They designed a washer with a heating element. That wasn't a problem at all because 220V had become a standard by then and 380V was easy to get. Heating elements of 6000 Watts weren't unusual in early frontloaders. It made more sense though to heat a smaller amount of water in a frontloader than a full tub of water in a toploader. Here's an ad for an early Constructa frontloader. 
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Post# 314212 , Reply# 30 11/10/2008 at 18:48 (5,639 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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"As someone else noted, the German manufacturers are now offering hot-fill as an eco-option (who'd have credited it) - I bet we'll be asked to pay more for this!!!" That was me. The two models sold by Miele are the AllWater washer, which has been around for several years and the Softtronic W 1747 WPS EcoLine. Found the later one selling online for about 1100 Euros. 
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| Post# 314234 , Reply# 31 11/10/2008 at 20:40 (5,639 days old) by toggleswitch2 () | ||
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A hot fill? This should be interesting after all the poo-pooing that the crowds over the pond have dished out over doing it that way. | ||
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Post# 314326 , Reply# 33 11/11/2008 at 08:28 (5,638 days old) by jetcone (Schenectady-Home of Calrods,Monitor Tops,Toroid Transformers) |
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David | ||
| Post# 314374 , Reply# 36 11/11/2008 at 15:04 (5,638 days old) by mrx () | ||
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Mercury filled thermostat ?! Wow, that sounds like something that would be an absolute NO WAY item these days. | ||
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Post# 314379 , Reply# 38 11/11/2008 at 15:57 (5,638 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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No, it's true. On the current (German) All Water washer, connecting the appliance to hot water water (55°C/130°F) reduces the cycle time by max. nine minutes. The max. water temp allowed by Miele is 60°C. Hot water is used for washes of 40°C and above. Warm rinses are used on all cycles of 50°C and above; Permanent Press allows warm rinses even on a 40°C cycle. The manual does not state a temperature for the warm rinse, only says it'll fill from both taps. Warm rinses can reduce overall water consumption by 10%. Wool and Silk cycles do not use the hot water fill. Being called All Water, the machine may also be programmed to use well water, rainwater or softened water. | ||
| Post# 314391 , Reply# 40 11/11/2008 at 17:00 (5,638 days old) by favorit () | ||
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Hot & cold fill Zanussi Electrolux in EU ? Haven't found the Sunny h&c fill w. elsewhere than on rex.it It's very strange, cause the IronAid dryer came out everywhere in EU at the same time. | ||
| Post# 314822 , Reply# 41 11/13/2008 at 15:56 (5,636 days old) by newwave1 (Lincoln, United Kingdom) | ||
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Post# 315132 , Reply# 42 11/14/2008 at 19:57 (5,635 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Space in French Kitchens? | ||
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Post# 350317 , Reply# 44 5/20/2009 at 08:41 (5,448 days old) by yogitunes (New Jersey) |
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many people don't understand and a common problem...in my new house the BRAINIACS who did the plumbing put the hot water heater on the other side of the house away from the kitchen and bath/laundry....it takes a long time for the hot water to get there....with my front loader only using about 3 gallons, if I want a hot wash I have to run water in the tub until it gets hot, otherwise it fills cold and by the time it gets hot the machine is done filling...same thing for the dishdrawer...water cools in the pipes, so when the machine calls for a refill its getting a cold fill and dishes don't get clean....I'm gonna have this moved...
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| Post# 350373 , Reply# 45 5/20/2009 at 13:16 (5,448 days old) by laundromat (Hilo, Hawaii) | ||
From what I was told by folks I met in England during my '93 trip to London for the Shakesspearien Festival they have anualy in November,I asked why they had machines that had no bleach dispenser.One of them said "We would rather boil the 'racing stripes' off our undies than to use a caustic,poluting chemical to get them out.We are in no hurry on wash day to do our chore because during that cycle,we can go to market,vacuum our floors,beat our rugs,walk our pets and work out." We here in America are so god damned spoiled and want everything right now.I call that McStupid.I do my laundry once a week.I am currently using a Staber washer that is in for service.So far,I have replaced its presure switch,balance switch,presure hose,and the mother board.Now,due to the receded water that swishes around the outer tub during the spin,I found there is a missing clamp that holds the sump hose going to the pump in an even keal with the pump.Currently,it just hangs down like an old boob causing water to rest and not drain into the pump properly.However,it is a good performer and the average cycle takes just over a half hour with a wash and two rinses.Realitively easy to work on but,you have to be "dainty" while replacing the cheapasss,plastic parts.Otherwise,as in my case,they break and you have to reorder and wait for another.They will not allow you to stock up on parts.That's because the Staber customers are suposed to do their own repair.They have no dealers or service companies that are authorised to searve their customers.
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| Post# 350397 , Reply# 47 5/20/2009 at 17:03 (5,448 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
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The Blomberg we had in the UK would only take cold water in if set to 30c or below, mixed on 40c and 50c and hot only on 60c. Mind you, the ancient Vaillant boiler had to be run not only to purge the lines, but to get some water up to any form of 'warm' before you started the machine....even though the machine was only 2 metres away from it..... | ||
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Post# 350400 , Reply# 48 5/20/2009 at 17:34 (5,448 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Oh my Miele W1070, unless the temperature dial is set to "cold" which effectively turns off the thermostat, should the machine sense incoming wash water temperature is higher than the one set, it will stop adding hot and add cold water to get the proper balance. Installation manual makes it clear the washer MUST be hooked up to hot and cold water (or cold only, but still both hoses must be used), and one assumes the above is one of the reasons. It certianly would prevent "boiling" water from a hot water heater from being "dumped" onto laundry. Well unless the thermostat was dialed off, then that is whomever is doing the washing's problem. As for European washer (front loader) long cycle times, was reading a rather interesting post on one of the UK washer/appliance repair boards. Such sites are similar to our group here and THS. DIY is VERY popular in the UK as well, so there a lots of posts from persons looking on how to do their own appliance repairs as well. Anyway, the author of said site gave an interesting view of why today's Euro/UK front loaders take so long to wash, even when set to cool or warm water. Answer? Though manufacturers have produced larger drum tubs, the machines all still suffer from energy rating madates an or desires to use less water. So you have a 6kg, 7kg or larger unit having to wash with the same or only a tiny bit more water than the new standard for a 5kg unit. Obviously it is going to take longer to get laundry saturated with water/detergent solution, even when doing "wet wipe" washing. If one looks at how much water a commercial or laundromat grade washer uses for the same rated laundry capacity, it is more than what domestic washers are forced to struggle with. The above may also tie into why so many consumers are reporting increased wear and damage to their washing when using newer front loaders. Laundry tumbling to and fro with very little water is bound to create increased friction as textiles rub up against each other. | ||
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Post# 350412 , Reply# 50 5/20/2009 at 18:11 (5,448 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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European Wash Times Verus American
One thing to remember, and one has stated this before, detergents are tested and marketed under the conditions of whatever local market the product is destined to be sold. American laundry detergents were designed for the rather short (eight to perhaps fifteen minutes) wash times of top loading washing machines, and the rather dilute detergent to water ratio. That meaning one cup or less (or more depending upon soil, stain and water hardess levels), diluted into ten to twenty or more gallons of wash water. As top loading washing machines until rather recently all tended to use the rather aggressive central beater (in all manner and sort of form) action, detergents while strong, did not require very high concentration levels. Remember the four variables of good laundry practice. By increasing the mechanical action (and or also water temperature), along with perhaps adding additionals chemicals (chlorine bleach), you can have shorter wash cycles and a "weaker" detergent. OTHO detergents designed for front loaders have to cope with cleaning, stain removal, soil suspension, water hardness based upon at most about only five gallons of water for a wash cycle (probably a bit less on modern washers), and the reduced mechancial action of tumble style washing machines. Because the wash action is more gentle, off the bat one of the variables of good laundry practice has changed,and the others must be altered to compensate. Notice you've not seen American laundry detergents, even those designed for "HE" washers redesigned for "short wash times", whilst many European/UK versions have. L. | ||
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Post# 350423 , Reply# 51 5/20/2009 at 19:58 (5,448 days old) by yogitunes (New Jersey) |
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Toggle...
I have been looking into the recirculation pump...but also been thinking about 2 hot water heaters to split the useage...I have 2 dishwashers, 3 high effic washers, and 3 full bathrooms, one with a jacuzzi, have never run out of hot water but sometimes to take the load off of only one... builders just put all equipment for the house in one corner...eventually I will have them moved to under the stairs which will put them in the center of the house....I have the same issue with heat/AC....one side chills/heats rapidly but the other half barely gets any...I did try to consider why they put them where they did...and I could see if the lines coming in were on that side but actually they don't...they cross over the entire house...even the well is on the north side of the house and they ran the pipes under the basement floor to the other side...I think what confused them is my house was a reversed design and they didn't reverse the basement plans...but just the same it should have been put in the center....like washer manufacturers...they don't think of what makes sense! | ||
| Post# 350456 , Reply# 52 5/20/2009 at 22:59 (5,448 days old) by paulinroyton (B) | ||
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Wash Times One thing with my hotpoint aqualtis aqxxf149pm, it has a delay start option, which I find so usefull. I time the machine so by 8am, or 9am my washing is done Paul | ||
| Post# 350540 , Reply# 53 5/21/2009 at 08:02 (5,447 days old) by mrwash () | ||
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My Miele Navitronic needs 2H 36 Mins in the Hygiene cycle with the option "extra rinse" X-D | ||
| Post# 350550 , Reply# 54 5/21/2009 at 08:29 (5,447 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
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Electrolux machines sold here are very similar to the versions sold in the UK, though ours tend to come from Thailand. My Electrolux/Zanussi made Westinghouse is Italian made and has the following cycle times that I use regularly Cotton 1200rpm spin .........Normal......Quick Cold.....1.44.........55 30c......1.51........1.01 40c......1.58........1.08 (wash component of Quick is about 40m @ 40c) 60c......2.00........1.15 Synthetic short 900rpm spin Cold....................39 30c.....................45 There is also a Quick 30 programme I use often 30c....3kg....30m but it is let down by a 700rpm v.short spin Additionally, whilst the machine is rated at 6.5kg (15lb), I run the quick cycles 80% of the time and with probably about a 4-4.5kg (9-10lb) load with great results. | ||
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Post# 350766 , Reply# 55 5/22/2009 at 10:00 (5,446 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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Yep, our washer has the exact same cycle times as Chris' machine above. I use the Quick wash option all the time - with extra rinse. Here are the cycle times for the UK version of the Duet washer. Look at the amazing SuperEco cycle - takes only five hours! But I really like how the washer adjusts to different amounts of laundry. Full Programme Guide 
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| Post# 350840 , Reply# 56 5/22/2009 at 19:04 (5,446 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
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| Post# 350906 , Reply# 57 5/23/2009 at 02:18 (5,446 days old) by dj-gabriele () | ||
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Duet/Dreamspace Italian wash times and cycles are different! Anyway, whirlpool has the longest cycles I have ever seen! CLICK HERE TO GO TO dj-gabriele's LINK 
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Post# 350914 , Reply# 58 5/23/2009 at 03:41 (5,446 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Five Hours? | ||
| Post# 350923 , Reply# 59 5/23/2009 at 04:00 (5,445 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
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Post# 350990 , Reply# 60 5/23/2009 at 12:21 (5,445 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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| Post# 351069 , Reply# 61 5/23/2009 at 18:29 (5,445 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
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Post# 351070 , Reply# 62 5/23/2009 at 18:32 (5,445 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Thing To Remember About
"Older" European front loading washing machines is that many heated water by time and not temperature. That is just as with vintage and some modern dishwashers the thermostat is not routed through the timer. Rather a set period of time is alloted for water to heat regardless of incoming water temp and or when (in some cases if) the water reaches set temperature. My Miele W1070 has two sections on it's timer for heating water. One for the longer "normal" and another for "short". Even when wash water has reached the proper temperature a set on the thermostat, timer will not advance until alloted time is up. Say if one chooses 120F as wash water temp, and fills the machine with warm water at about 110F, the thermostat clicks off quite soon. If one selects 100F and fills with the same or higher water, again the thermostat shuts off, however in all cases the timer does not advance out of the heating portion of the wash cycle regardless. Happily since this is a mechanical timer all one needs to do is nudge the thing along, and it goes into the main wash cycle. Am not certian, but think this is what Miele calls "cycle gaurnantee" in the owner's manual. Damn fustrating. Am wondering if modern totally electronic controlled washing machines have wash times controlled by temp, or allot a set period of time to heat water. Still, the mind reels at the damage and wear that must happen to laundry being tumbled about for two, three or even five hours, all with very little water to help cushion all that rubbing and beating. Oh yes, will keep my old Miele running for as long as one can! *LOL* | ||
| Post# 351071 , Reply# 63 5/23/2009 at 18:38 (5,445 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia) | ||
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I believe
...that there are some washing machines that will vary the cycle time depending on various factors... - Absorbancy of load (more water = heavier load = longer cycle) - turbidity of water (especially for rinse...e.g. mieles will add another) and I am sure there are other factors too.... These are a few of the things I miss about my old Hoover Electra. - Hot and cold intake. Our HWS is less than 3 feet from the tap - Higher water levels...the wash particularly - Top speed interim spins (OK it was only 800rpm, but they were effective) In its defence though, the Westinghouse does top up just before the end of the wash cycle on the quick programmes and has high level rinsing on quick cycles with intermittant spins (cotton) | ||
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