Thread Number: 19793
Temperature Readings
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Post# 317522   11/30/2008 at 17:59 (3,586 days old) by dadoes (TX,U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture
I recently bought a multimeter that has a temperature probe accessory. Last night I checked the temps through a cycle in my DishDrawer. Dangled the probe at the right-front corner, closed the drawer. Normal Eco, 88 mins. Prewash, main wash, rinse, final rinse, dry. Target 125F for main wash and final rinse. I did not prime the hot water at the sink faucet before starting.

68F Initial fill
70F End of prewash

67F Start main wash
125F Main wash @ 48 mins remaining
127F End of main wash @ 47 mins remaining

101F Start of 1st rinse
105F End of 1st rinse

94F Start of final rinse

I did not stay on it to check at end of the final rinse, but I don't doubt it reached the target 125F again.

Post# 317560 , Reply# 1   11/30/2008 at 20:52 (3,586 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

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Cool toy! I saw those when I replace my MM some years ago but they were prohibitively priced for a cheapskate like myself and I bought the basic model. Have they come down in price? My MM needs replacing, maybe I'll get one to fill my stocking...

125 degrees?? No 180 final rinse? Blech. ;-)

Post# 317756 , Reply# 2   12/1/2008 at 20:46 (3,585 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

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That's kinda scary... I much prefer extremely hot dishwashers! If I can stand to touch a dish fresh from the dishwasher for just a second or two, then it's not hot enough! I wonder what my Bosch dishwasher reaches in terms of temperature? The Hobart commercial dishwasher at the cafe my sister used to work at had 2 options. One, reach 120 degrees F and put chlorine bleach in the rinse or option two, reach 180 degrees F and put nothing in the rinse. (There was only one rinse.)

Post# 317757 , Reply# 3   12/1/2008 at 20:47 (3,585 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

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BTW, Glenn, is your dishwasher hooked up to cold water then? Is it a 110 volt machine or 220?

Post# 317773 , Reply# 4   12/1/2008 at 23:24 (3,585 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, Theres a Lady on Stage)        
By Law

launderess's profile picture
At least in most areas, commercial dishwashers must either reach a a set (by the area)thermal temperature for final rinse, or use chemicals, in short either thermal or chemcial disenfection. This obviously is for public health.

Which method an establishment chooses probably factors in energy costs vs chemical costs.

Post# 317813 , Reply# 5   12/2/2008 at 05:05 (3,584 days old) by favorit ()        
LCB in rinse water ... are you sure ?

"Our" EU Hobarts don't add in rinse water anything else than rinse aid. Other brands do the same. CB based and/or Na-OH, K-OH based detergents are however used even in case of very hot rinse. This way beer glasses, that are rinsed with cold water and without rinse aid, are sanified too

At times here it has happened some people went to ER because of bad rinsed glasses/cups. Some old commercial tank sys DW haven't the booster pump for rinsing. They rely only on water supply pressure. So, when pipes pressure decreases because of many simultaneous demands, those glasswashers can't rinse properly. They should go out of law

As for temps, regular commercial DW rinse @ 85C/185F. Thermodisinfector DW (for hospitals, fresh water sys like domestic DW) rinse @ 93C/200F for 10 mins
Some brands have also newer systems that rely more on chemicals and wash/rinse @ 40C/105C i.e. ReTemp machines on


Post# 317818 , Reply# 6   12/2/2008 at 06:09 (3,584 days old) by sudsman ()        
In Fort Worth / Tarrant County Area

Health Dept. Guidelines state that final rinse must be at least 180 for 30 seconds or 120 with LCB at the rate of 200 ppm 3 oz 10% lcb to 10 gallons of water. For Dishwashing.
Institutional laundring must reach water temps of at least 150 for 10 mins or 100 for 10 mins with LCB. the guidelines have not been updated in years and do not take in to account the newer methods of laundring. In 30+ years I have yet to see any inspector actually check the temps.

In this area most all health dept guidelines were written in the 40's and have not been updated since. Most of the inspectors need to br totally retrained too.

Post# 317863 , Reply# 7   12/2/2008 at 14:40 (3,584 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, Theres a Lady on Stage)        
Yes I'm Sure

launderess's profile picture
Unlike many parts of Europe, LCB is probably the most used disenfectant/santising agent around for both domestic and commercial uses.

Americans use gallons per household per year for laundry use, and many automatic dishwashing powders still contain chlorine bleach. In contrast, Europeans mainly use LCB for floor and perhaps bathroom cleaning, with some laundry use, but no where near what Americans. Indeed the most oft heard complaint from American housewives stationed overseas with their husbands is that they cannot "find" LCB in the supermarket. Most often because it is in the housecleaning section, and not laundry products.

When one was at school, it was easy to tell when the kitchen ladies were running the dishwasher, as the scent of chlorine bleach wafted through the halls around the cafeteria. LCB was also used to wipe down tables after meals were over. Something many restaurants still do.

Post# 317874 , Reply# 8   12/2/2008 at 15:27 (3,584 days old) by favorit ()        
What really struck me ...

...was not LCB usage in itself, but LCB dispensed in the LAST RINSE. Surely it's only a question of dilution ... yet it seems a little scary :-))

Probably LCB is no more so common in Northern EU ... here it is still common. There is simple LCB for laundry/universal purpose and there are CB added detergents to clean floors, bathrooms and so on.

Some crazy people use a special LCB "Amuchina" to wash out soil and chemicals from vegetables and fruits (for this purpose baking soda is cheaper and safer..)

As for DW detergents, today the Finish gel formulation is the last CB added one still available

Post# 317875 , Reply# 9   12/2/2008 at 15:36 (3,584 days old) by dadoes (TX,U.S. of A.)        

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The meter was $35 @ Lowe's.

Scary? LOL, then I best not say what are the target temperatures for the Fast and Fast Eco cycles! The unit is connected to hot water, but due to the distance from the water heater as the plumbing runs, it's essentially on cold unless I prime the kitchen tap first. Each cycle has specific target temps for main wash and final rinse. Normal non-Eco is 140F/150F. Heavy is 150F/163F. I was curious if the target temps are being reached. The temp rise is a little faster than 1.5F per minute.

Post# 317877 , Reply# 10   12/2/2008 at 16:09 (3,584 days old) by favorit ()        

Here the DishDrawer is sold rebadged as Whirlpool and is not very common (...mielish prices: 1435 for the doubledrawer). Guessed it was cheaper in the US but it isn't (1429$ @ :o

Post# 317878 , Reply# 11   12/2/2008 at 16:13 (3,584 days old) by brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

Those run times are very different to the Australian ones. The Dishdrawers we have at work are 110minutes on a Normal or 120minutes on a Normal Eco.

The target temp for wash is 60degC on Normal or 45degC on Eco. The final rinse is 65degC on Normal or 50degC on Eco. The prewash on Normal is also heated to 45degC.

Inlet temp here is around 15degC at this time of year.

Post# 317949 , Reply# 12   12/3/2008 at 02:37 (3,583 days old) by dj-gabriele ()        


- LCB and Amuchina: if you feel better in disinfecting your vegetables and fruit Amuchina does the job, you only need one, meaning one, little drop on a bowl of water and wait for a couple of hours, baking soda is just as affective as normal kithchen salt! That's a common misconception carried on from Solvay to sell more of their products!
Anyway, the best (if you believe in it, wich I don't, as tests showed that the stuff is the same as standard food if not worse) would be to buy organic food (for Italians, organic is translated as Biologico, free of pesticides and chemicals, and not Organico that means Harmonic or Staff or Compound of organs).

Now, back to dishwashing! Yup, it feels strange to add chemicals to rinse water (even rinse aid is something I use sparingly) but if I think of some UK friends that dry their hand washed dishes without rinsing them and they're happy about it, who am I to say anything?! :)

Post# 318201 , Reply# 13   12/4/2008 at 23:54 (3,582 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, Theres a Lady on Stage)        
Chlorine Bleach and Dishwasher Products

launderess's profile picture
Another reason for including chlorine bleach in automatic dishwashing products (mainly detergents), is that CB breaks down protien. It is for this reason CB cannot be used on wool,silk and other animal fibers which are made from protien.

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