Thread Number: 21214
Disposable appliances
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Post# 334855   3/11/2009 at 07:09 (5,496 days old) by dj-gabriele ()        

Hi guys! After the break down of our old abut reliable Philco washer the landlord bough us a Whirlpool washing machine, model AWOD3080, I believe it is the least expensive washer that was in the shop... anyway, the bearings are gone, not even 6 months after it was run for the first time and it didn't suffer any abuse at all! Of 4 people in the house one doesn't wash any clothes, the other is out most of the time and the remaining two do around 5 (underloaded) washes per week.
The rattling noise came all of a sudden with the spin, so loud that I could hear the machine from the chicken behind 2 closed doors and a room in between.
I never saw a belt so thin, no grooved pulley, just a plain sting on a smooth disc going to the motor and the plastic welded tub that can't have bearings changed. The whole tub assembly is due to arrive next week at best... the repair man told that if I wanted I could do 5-6 washes before the complete collapse but I think I'll use my sister's washer as I don't want to risk burning the motor.

Did a similal breakdown ever happened to one of you so early after a new purchase or is only bad luck?

PS: the service man was great but the telephone customer care was among the worst I have ever experienced! Rude and become even worse after I told that the bearings were gone (after 6 months it can't be they told me! Ha!)





Post# 334893 , Reply# 1   3/11/2009 at 12:13 (5,496 days old) by iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        

iheartmaytag's profile picture
I know some will disagree with me, but in my opinion and only my opinion. Some of Whirl-crap is the epitiomy of Disposable. I had the same experience with the Whirl-crap "Cool line". When I am standing in water up to my ankles for the second time in two weeks, it is not a nice thing to say to me "It's not our problem that you got a lemon."
The new Maytags were delivered three days later. Unfortunately, Maytag is now part of Whirlpool.

After blasting them just now. I will say that in my searching the Whirlpool Duet appears to be the best choice I have found so far. I am still praying over my Dependable Care Maytag, hoping that it will last at least another year before I have to replace it.


Post# 334895 , Reply# 2   3/11/2009 at 12:34 (5,496 days old) by thomasortega (El Pueblo de Nuestra Señora de Los Angeles de Porciúncula)        

If you think this whirlpool is crap, you should see the Brazillian Whirlpools (Brastemp and Consul) they started to sell almost 10 years ago.
The design is amazingly beautiful, but a can of soda is more resistant.


Post# 334915 , Reply# 3   3/11/2009 at 14:32 (5,496 days old) by bertrum ()        

hi dj-gabriele,

My advice would be to buy the bearing kit and do the job yourself!

I know its a pain in the neck doing a split tub bearing job but do you really want to wait for ages for an engineer to come and not do a good a job as you could do?.

I certainlty would not let the manufactures near my daily under guarantee or not!

Im sure you are more capable than most so Definatley do it yourself.


Post# 334942 , Reply# 4   3/11/2009 at 17:31 (5,496 days old) by xraytech (Rural southwest Pennsylvania )        

xraytech's profile picture
That sounds how our 2nd POS Frigidaire made Kenmore dishwasher was. Almost 2 months old, wouldn't drain and then flooded the kitchen, not to mention the lack luster performance. It was rebuilt on warranty and then again right before the two year extended warranty expired then about 6 months later the motor went and we replaced it with another Kenmore. This is Dishwasher #3 in almost 6 years. And we have had the same problems with the first one, the new one is 4 months old and no problem yet.

Post# 334960 , Reply# 5   3/11/2009 at 19:22 (5,496 days old) by autowasherfreak ()        

Saw this on Craigslist, only two years old, what is up the appliances today? Here's the description.

"I have a whirlpool duet washer, Model # GHW9100LW2, that I am parting out. the only thing that is not for sale is the rear tub (bearing is out of it) and the stainless steel inner drum (bearing went out and now the shaft is warped). Everything else is in used shaped, its about 2 years old. All pumps and motors are working and guaranteed. Email at Twright624@yahoo.com or call 815-631-2870 for parts and prices. thanks for looking."



CLICK HERE TO GO TO autowasherfreak's LINK on Quadcities Craigslist


Post# 335042 , Reply# 6   3/12/2009 at 05:06 (5,495 days old) by dj-gabriele ()        
My advice would be to buy the bearing kit and do the job you

It can't be done! The tecnician told that he must change the whole tub assembly as it can't be opened!
Anyway I wouln't have the skills except for basic DIY :)
I think that if I had to buy the whole assembly by myself it would cost more than getting another machine! And this time be it Italian made! :)


Post# 335043 , Reply# 7   3/12/2009 at 05:20 (5,495 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

At this point I am not going to buy any NEW laundry applainces until I can be assured they can last longer than 5 or 7 yrs.I have seen MANY videos on youtube about short lived but very expensive front load washers-most common failures--Drum spiders on Frigidaires.circuit board and rear bearing failures on Duets.and balance problems for GE FL machines.Or is it these folks are not using these machines properly?Oh buy the way--that expensive pair of LG washer dryer is still at Best buy-more than a year-no takers.they put the machines in the stores vestibule hoping someone entering the place will buy them.I don't know-they almost look like expensive krusher-trash truck bait in 5-7 yrs.I will continue to buy WP-KN BD TL machines at the swap shop.I know they will work and usually last longer than 5-7 yrs.

Post# 335116 , Reply# 8   3/12/2009 at 14:30 (5,495 days old) by autowasherfreak ()        

So far (knocking on wood) I have had excellent luck with my Frigidaire Gallery set.

Post# 335198 , Reply# 9   3/12/2009 at 20:21 (5,495 days old) by paulg (My sweet home... Chicago)        
Speed Queens and old Crosleys

paulg's profile picture
My newer-vintage 2005 Speed Queen TL pair are still going fine in their fourth year. God bless them. Used almost every day. Basic, basic design. Can't beat simplicity.
I SO agree with the notion that I will NOT buy anything new unless it'll last 5-7 years or more. I truly believe the bargains are at the resale shop.
My 1954 Crosley refrigerator still runs. Now THAT'S VALUE!


Post# 335200 , Reply# 10   3/12/2009 at 20:46 (5,495 days old) by gizmo (Victoria, Australia)        

I have an LG front loader. Its main bearings died and it was thrown out, I got it from the recycle centre. It was only 4 years old. The main seal had badly scored the drum axle, so the drum spider had to be replaced too.

The good news is, the machine is particularly easy to work on, parts were cheap and easily available in as nearby country town. (I live out in the sticks.) I bought SKF bearings so they should last longer, the seal and spider were genuine LG parts and cost approximately $20 for the seal and $40 for the spider. The machine is back together now and I really like it, it washes just how I like, has a big load, fairly quiet (though it does jump if it gets off balance) and I now know it should be easy to fix if it plays up again. I have never liked LG stuff, but this machine isn't bad at all.

On the other hand, I have two dead Whirlpool front loaders in the shed and have recently turned down an offer of a third machine of the same model (AWM 293-600). They all have broken drum spiders. The spider is not available as a spare part, the whole drum assembly is about $400 and you can buy a new front loader with 2 or 3 year warranty for about $450. Disgraceful.

I still have my Asko 12004, it is 17 years old and still works well, bearings are good as new. That machine is built to last. It has had a couple of trivial faults over the years but the only reason it has been retired is that the LG washes a bigger load with less power, less noise and rinses much better. (rinsing was a weakness of the Asko.)

Chris.


Post# 335205 , Reply# 11   3/12/2009 at 21:21 (5,495 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
One reason front loaders lost market share to top loading washing machines is the ease of design and repair of the later.

H-Axis washing machines, by nature of their design must cope with forces top loaders do not. Supporting ten or more pounds of wet laundry for several cycles, even with moderate use is going to require some strong support systems.

Commercial front loaders can run several thousand dollars for even the smallest units. However bearings and other parts are easily replaced. One can find Wascomats ten or twenty years old still chugging away with few if any major repairs.

Problem for many laundry appliance makers is that consumers on both sides of the pond tend to view such purchases less and less as "major" and more of a "consumer" good. No one wants to pay the price (adjusted for inflation), a built like a tank vintage washer would cost today. Worse for American manufacturers the US government is pushing front loaders as a way for saving water, just when consumers aren't interested in spending major money. Worse many do not like front loaders to begin with and would balk in greater numbers if they had to pay say what a MOL or TOL Miele or V-Zug costs.


Personally think we all should be outraged that some major appliances barely make it past four years. Even as late as the 1970's or 1980's any make of appliance that didn't give value for money would have been throttled. Also a bulk of appliance sales were done by local small independent shops. Such places valued their customers and by and large would go out of their way to keep them happy. If Mr. Average American came in and started beefing that the washer sold to his wife not four years ago was dying and worse needed a major repair, you can bet he got satisfaction.

L.


Post# 335441 , Reply# 12   3/14/2009 at 13:17 (5,493 days old) by bertrum ()        
welded tub!

Hi dj-gabriele,
What a shame the machine has a welded tub, this gives no scope for future repair, sad to say but this machine is destined for the dump.


In my opinion rather than build an appliance to be AAA rated and lasts 2 years wouldnt it be better to build an appliance that is DDD rated and lasts 20 years?

Which one would be better for the environment?.

I am of the opinion that the rating system is a complete scam. The environmental waste of manufacturing materials alone for these modern throw away machines must be more than the supposed benefits of the rating system.


Post# 335540 , Reply# 13   3/15/2009 at 03:43 (5,492 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Yes But

launderess's profile picture
Government regulations seem to be strictly focused on water and or energy costs in use, not production and disposal.

L.


Post# 335548 , Reply# 14   3/15/2009 at 05:59 (5,492 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

I feel the Govt energy and water usage regs for appliances is another "scam" that should be scrapped.We could get rid of an agency we don't need.(that would help the national budget)This can be handled by the PRIVATE sector.If folks want energy and water saving machines so be it.Let the PEOPLE decide here NOT govt.While the Republicans were in office this would have been a good thing for them to do.Instead they just fuddy-duddied around.Now we are stuck with these and it will get WORSE under Obama.I think if they want to regulate-life and disposal should be a concern too.What good is it to try to sell an expensive engergy-water saving fixture to a customer only to have it last 5-7 yrs?That is NOT BEING resposible to the enviornment.You are just filling landfills at customer expense.

Post# 335742 , Reply# 15   3/15/2009 at 22:03 (5,492 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia)        
Both...

ronhic's profile picture
...manufacturers and consumers are to blame in equal portion for the deterioration of quality.

Consumers, because most want all the 'bells and whistles' but don't want to pay 'too much' for them...

...and manufacturers because they want consumers to buy their goods which have to have enough 'goodies' and be priced at a point where people will buy them - lots of them - which often means slightly cheaper than the opposition.

To do this something has had to give and quality is often the first to go. They still get built to 'look' like the better quality, older machines, but when you dig deeper it would appear that it (quality) is not there.

When we replaced my mothers ASEA late last year I stumbled across a site operated by the Reserve Bank of Australia - an inflation calculator.

When I run the cost of things through, it tells me what the equivalent money is at any year point up to 2008 that I nominate.

eg.

1968 Simpson Fluid Drive approx $200.00 became $1134 in 1989
1989 Asea Cylinda 12000 $1250 became $2142 in 2008.

BUT in 2008, mum was not prepared to spend over $2000 on buying a washing machine even though historically, this is the same money that was spent in 1968 and 1989...

...so what has she lost out on? Probably the 20 odd years of service she had from each of the other 2 machines. If she gets 5-8 years out of the bigger capacity, more programme replacement (which cost $800), then she should consider herself owed nothing.

So before we start lamenting the lack of quality, maybe we should also look at how much we are (or are NOT) paying or prepared to pay for said appliance.

The Bank of England operates a similar site (www.bankofengland.co.uk/education...) in 1985 GBP300 = 681 in 2008!...

....as does the US Federal Reserve (www.usinflationcalculator.com/...) $200 in 1968 = $1247 in 2008...


CLICK HERE TO GO TO ronhic's LINK


Post# 335747 , Reply# 16   3/15/2009 at 22:34 (5,492 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Inflation

launderess's profile picture
We've touched on that topic on and off here in the group.

If one were to adjust a top of the line Maytag, Frigidare (GM,not WCI), or such washing machine from say 1970's or even 1980's for today's money, a $400 washer would easily reach over one grand, USD.

Problem is, and many appliance makers saw this coming ages ago, persons tend not to hold onto appliances (at least in the United States)the way they used to. People move house often and their appliances usually stay with the old house. Divorces, and other causes of change of address also mean people move about more and aren't willing to pay to shift major appliances.

On the one had, plastics and such have made building washing machines cheaper, as metal parts have been replaced. OTHO those newer plastic parts often do not last, so the unit must be junked as it is "too costly" to repair.



Post# 335749 , Reply# 17   3/15/2009 at 22:41 (5,492 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

pulsator's profile picture
I sooooo very often get people asking me what washer they should buy, they only have 2 requirements most of the time...

1) It has to be built to last like an old Maytag
2) It has to be under $400!!!

I find myself quite often just burst out laughing at them! They just don't seem to be able to understand that appliances are not made the way they used to be!


Post# 335763 , Reply# 18   3/16/2009 at 00:07 (5,492 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        
How the disposability virus propagates itself:

gansky1's profile picture
I brought home a Whirlpool-made direct-drive TOL Maytag washer last week that is a little more than a year old. The balance ring had come loose from the stainless steel basket, rubbed on the the tub top cover, wearing a hole in the ring. The water got away and now the machine won't balance properly in spin. The owner said her repair-dunce told her she was facing a $200+ repair bill and it would be wise to just go buy a new washer. He recommended a Whirlpool. And she did just that.

I ordered the new balance ring for $24.


Post# 335773 , Reply# 19   3/16/2009 at 02:57 (5,491 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia)        
Launderess....

ronhic's profile picture
...you are correct about the use of plastics and lighter weight materials to make products less expensive.

We saw a huge change here in the late 1970's where Malleys, Simpson, Hoover et.al. went from 'Maytag' (or close to it) quality and weight, to something close to aluminium foil and cling film. Simpson Delta anyone?

The balance of Australian designed machines (now made O/S!) being Simpson and Electrolux Top Loaders, do appear to have gained some strength and solidity back from what I have seen in the shops, but most of our friends have gone Front Load - there are incentives and we are on water restrictions.

When it comes to changing appliances, Australians don't tend to leave them behind. That would be the exception rather than the rule. Most would update if it is either too small a capacity (growing family), have been advised it is not economical to repair or are generally unhappy with the product.

Still, if we decided to spend the same money as our parents did, we would get better quality...Miele anyone?



Post# 335861 , Reply# 20   3/16/2009 at 16:48 (5,491 days old) by brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

Hi Ron,

I disagree about the Quality and weight of the Aussie made plastic machines. Most made up until the mid 90's would still last 10 - 15 years. They looked flimsy by comparison, but they were good designs that just kept going. They are very easy to service and there is little to go wrong with them. Hoover is prob the exception here, they rusted, went out of balance, but on the whole would still give 10 years service.

The first generation in the late 70's still had a proper gearbox, it wasnt until the mid 80's that the reverse to agitate motors happened.

They mightnt look as impressive, but there was certainly nothing wrong with them. They were a shining example of how you could cheapen a product but still get reasonable longevity out of it. Unlike the Korean and Chinese stuff available now.


Post# 335869 , Reply# 21   3/16/2009 at 17:12 (5,491 days old) by arrrooohhh (Sydney Australia)        

Ron I have to agree strongly with what Nathan said. Especially for those 90's Simpsons. They may not look strong with those plastic lids but they sure washed and washed and I know several that lasted for 12 or more years.

They also has some wash drama for young washing machine enthusiasts as myself, and control panels that often had an array of buttons.

And as for Simpsons that often get thrown away, the most common fault is a solenoid that costs about $70 as a spare part. Gansky mentioned that about the Whirlpools. Too often someones washing machine stops working and they go and buy a replacement that afternoon without even checking to see what is wrong.

For me personally to see so many Simpsons being replaced by Samsungs and LG's because they are promoted heavily as the latest and greatest and that Simpson is old fashioned is the biggest shame ever. That is why all our machines are now made overseas.


Post# 335921 , Reply# 22   3/17/2009 at 00:08 (5,491 days old) by twinniefan (Sydney Australia)        
Quality/premium brands?????????

twinniefan's profile picture
Hi guys have to agree with you about quality in some ways however a few days ago my alleged premium brand dvd player,(Sony.),totally packed it in after just 15 months, 3 months outside warranty well a $99.00 dvd player is not worth getting repaired anyway,so I bought a new one last wednesday, a $55.00 Daewoo (Korean made.)and it seems to actually have better features than the Sony, so premium brands are not always the best choice.
Miele are of course the exception in washers, but really how many average families can afford to or even more so want to pay big dollars for a Miele?, I would suggest probably not too many.
I feel it comes back to this the average consumer wants Miele type quality but are only prepared to pay Samsung type prices.
Cheers.
Steve.


Post# 335947 , Reply# 23   3/17/2009 at 03:24 (5,490 days old) by ronhic (Canberra, Australia)        
I should have said....

ronhic's profile picture
...perceived quality.

My comment wasn't to say that they didn't wash or indeed last, but more that they (80's machines in Oz) lacked the solidity of construction of their forebears. There is a big difference between perceived and actual quality be it in construction or performance.

I know that they can last. My cousin has my grandmothers Delta 10 (I think it is an 'S') and while she hates it for how rough she finds it, she hasn't complained about the fact it still goes and hasn't let her (or our grandmother when she had it) down.

I wasn't trying to deride the fact that many of the appliances worked and continue to do so, more that they lacked the the same perceived quality of what went before...


Post# 336202 , Reply# 24   3/19/2009 at 06:20 (5,488 days old) by dj-gabriele ()        
REPAIRED!

The tecnician came yesterday to repair the washer!

...he could have done better bringing a new machine!
Since the tub assembly couldn't be repaired of the bearings he brought a new one, plus new door boot, new motor (just in case) and of course transmission belt.
The only thing left original in the machine were the electronic programmer, the water solenoid and the pump... oh, and the water hose!
If it was to be made out of warranty to change the tub alone would have costed 285 euros, including work (1 and a half hour of work) plus the calling home of the repairman.

285 € for a washer paid 199€ !!! Go figure!



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