Thread Number: 22161
My New Laundry Plant
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Post# 347202   5/7/2009 at 09:15 (5,439 days old) by sudsman ()        

5 285 /lb washers




Post# 347203 , Reply# 1   5/7/2009 at 09:16 (5,439 days old) by sudsman ()        
3 310lb/ Dryers and 1 200 lb

Automatic cool and reversing

Post# 347204 , Reply# 2   5/7/2009 at 09:18 (5,439 days old) by sudsman ()        
Flatwork Ironer

Feeds Irons Folds Counts and Stacks and reurn to feeders in bundles of 10 or 20

Post# 347254 , Reply# 3   5/7/2009 at 12:39 (5,439 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

pulsator's profile picture
WOW!!! VERY COOL!!!! I have always thought it would be fun to work in a laundry plant!

Post# 347275 , Reply# 4   5/7/2009 at 14:51 (5,439 days old) by favorit ()        
Professional liquid detergents

Hi Lee,
do these washers have peristaltic pumps for liquid detergents supply ?
Do liquid detergents have the same performance of powders ?

T.I.A.


Post# 347280 , Reply# 5   5/7/2009 at 15:06 (5,439 days old) by iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        
Wow!!!

iheartmaytag's profile picture
When's the wash in at your place?


Post# 347284 , Reply# 6   5/7/2009 at 15:32 (5,439 days old) by animasinsulinpu ()        
OMG!!!!

I would LOVE to work there!!!!!....Bill in Az.....

Post# 347286 , Reply# 7   5/7/2009 at 15:39 (5,439 days old) by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture
Lee, those dryers & ironer look like the ones at our laundry planrt here.

Post# 347318 , Reply# 8   5/7/2009 at 18:53 (5,439 days old) by cleanteamofny ((Monroe, New York)        

cleanteamofny's profile picture
Calgon, take me away!

Post# 347326 , Reply# 9   5/7/2009 at 19:39 (5,439 days old) by sudsman ()        
Appnut :

Very well could be the same as these models are widely used in hospital laundries beacuse of the ultra fast drying times.. They will breeze thru a load every 18 mins. And the Tilt a matic feature cuts turn around time down to less than 2 mins. So 3 loads/hr is not hard to achive.

Post# 347329 , Reply# 10   5/7/2009 at 19:53 (5,439 days old) by sudsman ()        
Favorit:' Liquid Detergents...

I have the washers on the Ecolab liquid System. The other plant is on AutoChlor system and uses powders as well as liquid.

both clean about the same.. the big difference is cost and control. A good washman takes years to train. And with the liquid system you dont have to worry about over or under use. Powders do have some spillage and must be used wisely in the proper amounts to avoid damage to the load. I have a good washman at the other plant and he knows how to use any product correctly.. And on some loads perfers to use powders.. Costing with powders is always less. but the likely hood of misuse out weighs the extra cost of liquid products. The washman I had that helped me train the one at the other plant, was with out a doubt the best I have ever had in 35+ years. He still works for me on a part time basis but just cannot work full time anymore. Hope this answers your question if not let me know.. I will explain better.


Post# 347334 , Reply# 11   5/7/2009 at 20:35 (5,438 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Question for a laundry pro:

I've always wondered what, if any one thing, gives hotel linens their distinctive clean smell. I can’t stand bed sheets and towels that smell like perfume. Since sour is used in such small quantities, I would think that it would have to come from something else. Maybe powdered chlorine bleach? What do the pro’s use at home? I have a SQ small OPL FL. Any suggestions as to a good combination of products that would produce professional results at home?

Post# 347427 , Reply# 12   5/8/2009 at 04:02 (5,438 days old) by sudsman ()        
Laundry Nut

For personal clothing I use Sears Ultra Plus and use it some at the old plant. Nothing can beat it on Heavy soil blood work.

The use of sour has nothing to do with the fragrance of the finished linen. Sour is used to counteract the alkali used in the main wash and break operations. Also to help remove rust and iron in the water supply. Some sours also include antichlors which also help keep the bleach from damaging the fabrics. And causing yellowing on the flatwork ironer.. If too much or too little is used it can cause major problems on the ironer and folder also.. As too much will cause excess static electricy and automatic folders hate that. The softners help with static electricy also. Fabric softners are what give the fragrance to most of the linens. There are many to choose from. From no fragrance to heavy.. The end result is up to the laundry manager. Some companies offer as many as 10 different versions of softner. I do perfer powder softners as they tend to leave the linen with a nicer hand and do well on the ironer. And are VERY cost effective. I know a large number of laundry managers that use the liquid system for most of the linens but still use powder softner on the last operation.


Post# 347456 , Reply# 13   5/8/2009 at 09:30 (5,438 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        
Lee...

revvinkevin's profile picture
If I have been paying attention, you work in a hospital laundry, is that correct? Or do you work for a company that installs or maintains the equipment?

Did they just build a complete new laundry facility or rebuild / remodel the old one? (Hmm, that may be a silly question as they cannot do without a laundry for the months which would be required to re-build the old one.)

Also, do the washers tilt as well or only the dryers? Would it be possible to get photos of the interiors of these LARGE machines?

Thanks!
Kevin


Post# 347459 , Reply# 14   5/8/2009 at 09:53 (5,438 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        
More questions....

revvinkevin's profile picture
The washers are 285 lb and the dryers 310 lb capacity. Is that dry weight and wet weight (respectively), or dry weight for both?

How do you do the loads? Meaning, since the machine capacities are different, do you do ONE washer load in ONE dryer or do you combine washer loads to fill the dryer completely?

You mentioned the cycle (or turn around) times for these dryers is about 18 minutes, what is the cycle or turn around time for the washer?

Are there different (wash & dry) programs you use or is it one program for all?

Do you happen to know the washer program breakdown (how many washes/rinses for how many minutes)?

Can you also get a photo of the dryer tilted and unloading?

Thanks again!
Kevin


Post# 347470 , Reply# 15   5/8/2009 at 10:37 (5,438 days old) by sudsman ()        
Kevin

Will get pics of the machines.insides.. The Dryers do tilt to unload the washers do not. Although they do make washers that tilt also.. for another 20,000.oo These were 95,876.00each anyway.Dryers were 43,500.oo and the flatwork ironer was 237,000. the towel folder was the cheapest @ 42,000
I now manage 2 plants both totally different. One is a shared services facility and the other is a single decitated plant. The capacity on any machine is dryweight. A load out of the washers go directly into the tumbler.
Wash Formulas: there are 15 ranging from lite soil to extra heavy. Drape formula, Uniforms, Kitchen and mops are also done. there are 2 mop formulas as some are standard mops and some are microfiber mops.. both must be done very .differently. On a avg. turnaround time on the washers is 45 mins. And depends entirely on the washman. I leave it up to him as to have a assit. help him unload or unload alone. It all depends on the amount of work that must be done that day.On blankets it always takes two to unload 1 cannot get them out of the machines without killing himself. The dryers avg time in 15 mins including a 3 min cool down and the unload time makes around 18 mins. Most all loads dry in the same amount of time as the washers have a 1200 rpm extract and with the 52" tub ,that is some serious g forces. some of the work does not require drying at all. Curtains go right back to the rooms out of the washers Flatwork goes right to the ironer, mops are so dry they go right back to housekeeping. The times on the General formula are as follows
Flush 3 Min Split hi level 22"
Wash 10 Min Hot lo level 12"
Bleach 10 mins Hot lo level 12"
Carry/Over
Rinse 5 MIN Hot lo level 12
Rinse 2 min cold hi level 22"
Extract lo 1 min
Sour/Soft 5 min split lo level 12
Final extract Hi 6 mins
hope this got most of your questions, if not just ask.. anything you wish.


Post# 347541 , Reply# 16   5/8/2009 at 18:03 (5,438 days old) by laundrynut ()        
sudsman

Thanks for the info.

Post# 347600 , Reply# 17   5/8/2009 at 23:16 (5,437 days old) by volvoguy87 (Cincinnati, OH)        
Powder softener?

volvoguy87's profile picture
Who makes that, and how do people get it? Would it be suited for home use, or is special for industrial use?
Dave


Post# 347616 , Reply# 18   5/8/2009 at 23:49 (5,437 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Commercial Laundry Products

launderess's profile picture
Normally have a very tight distribution system, designed for one to keep products out of domestic users hands. Ecolab for a start is very protective in keeping their "professional" and insitutional products under a tight leash.

Being as the above may, some suppliers will sell to anyone, however it may not be the top shelf products, and one may have to purchase bulk quanities, such as 55lbs.

The other important thing to remember is many commercial laundry products are calibrated for washing machines starting at 35lbs (dry weight) or even 50lbs, up to the behemoth washers shown above. If the product contains strong alkalines or acids, there is a risk of damaging washing machine parts if the product is not diluted properly.

Sometimes customer service will work with a person who is either a non-professional or purchased product via a third party, other times (as with Ecolab), one is SOL. Ecolab for instance will only dispense "customer service" mainly via it's local reps. That is if one has questions and or problems with a product, the local rep calls to help one sort things out.



Post# 347629 , Reply# 19   5/9/2009 at 02:18 (5,437 days old) by hooverzodiac12 (Melbourne, Australia)        

hooverzodiac12's profile picture
how fast do the washers spin. and is it possible for them to go out of balance. they look scary haha:P

Josh x


Post# 347635 , Reply# 20   5/9/2009 at 05:14 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
Softener/// spin speeds

Dave; Dry or powdered softner is mostly avail. to commerical users only. and in min 45lb quanity One would most likely only need a teaspoon full or less in a home washer.. but as stated above Getting help from Ecolab or any other companies will be non existant as they will tell you that you are not to have the product anyway.. The dry softener will not harm a home washer, I have used it for years in the smaller washers and at home too. Only have to use 1/4 teaspoon here. Ecolab AutoChlor and P&G commerical and most of the others, Will flat out tell you on the phone (and be nasty about it too) that they don't care if you damage your clothes or washer you dont have it under their contract so too bad!

SPIN SPEEDS are 1200 RPM and the basket is a full 52" so we are talking some serious G forces on these machines..They are vibra mount (soft mount) machines so they can handle a out of balance load pretty well. They do have a balance proceedure they go thru before going into extract and it all but stops the unblance problem. Have not yet had one to go out of balance. If they sense a out of balance load they stop and redistribute the load and start again automatically. It will tell you on the screen what it is doing so the washman knows.The programmer can be programmed to the second and temperatures to the degree, There is nothing that cannot be programmed or added or deleted. A operation can be skipped or added at any point in the cycle , Temps can be raised or lowered at any point. levels can be raised or lowered at any point also. Wash time can be added anytime by the second, min, or even hour, a soak can be done for any length of time anywhere in the cycle.Extract time can be shorter or longer by the second or min. with only a touch of a button.


Post# 347641 , Reply# 21   5/9/2009 at 06:58 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
There is also a 110/lb machine

The same as the others but extract on it is 1600 as basket is smaller but loads out of it are just a bit drier than the 285's

Post# 347643 , Reply# 22   5/9/2009 at 07:02 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
Touch screen programmer

Anything can be programmed

Post# 347644 , Reply# 23   5/9/2009 at 07:03 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
Towel Folder

nothing special at all

Post# 347645 , Reply# 24   5/9/2009 at 07:05 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
Ironer

Already had a lot of problems with it. does not produce quality work.Would like to send it back across the pond where it came from. Freight collect! Is down more than up.

Post# 347646 , Reply# 25   5/9/2009 at 07:06 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
Linen Room

One of the clean linen rooms

Post# 347647 , Reply# 26   5/9/2009 at 07:08 (5,437 days old) by sudsman ()        
Holding hall

There are 45 Carts each hold 500lbs of work.. When unloaded with clean shelves fold down and make a soiled cart for return to the plant.

Post# 347745 , Reply# 27   5/9/2009 at 20:28 (5,436 days old) by favorit ()        
customizable step programmers

Sudsman, don't you feel all our envy ?!? ;-) *LOL*

A machine that allow you to choose tumbling cadence, tumbling speed, levels, insert a cooldown, profile heat/wash, set different rpm for spins in different steps ...
this is our dream indeed !!!

Can laundrymen use preset formulas only or are they allowed to compilate new ones too ?

Thanks for the answer about detergents


Post# 347746 , Reply# 28   5/9/2009 at 20:51 (5,436 days old) by peterh770 (Marietta, GA)        

peterh770's profile picture
Who makes the Ramco washers? I've never seen them. Will look for them at the Clean show in June. Seeing as tho' they are softmounts, that place must be ROCKING when they all go into the final spin!

My guess is that the dryers are ADC...


Post# 347761 , Reply# 29   5/9/2009 at 22:38 (5,436 days old) by hooverzodiac12 (Melbourne, Australia)        

hooverzodiac12's profile picture
haha dude im so jelous. i want a washing machine like that just a domestic size though:P. 1200 rpm?? my god thats some force. i cant imagine what kinda of motor can do that ioits just amazing haha to me anyway:P

thanks
x


Post# 347762 , Reply# 30   5/9/2009 at 22:54 (5,436 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Wow sudsman!! You have an awesome job. Yeh, I want one of those machines too.

Post# 347822 , Reply# 31   5/10/2009 at 15:45 (5,436 days old) by laundrynut ()        
"Safer" Commercial Laundry Products

If one were to persevere far enough, safe commercial laundry products can be found and purchased via an on-line janitorial supplier. For example: I’ve ordered Ecolab Brite White (although it’s on backorder and I've yet to audition it). It is a pre-measured powder, designed for residential type TL’s. I've also found Ecolab “Clearly Soft” online, but it’s $249 for a 5-gallon pail. They can keep it. Zep has built detergents and other commercial laundry products, some of which are designed for home-style, small machines. I've tried Zep “Vantio” (powder) which is a built detergent that has a (1% solution) 12.3 - 12.7 pH. And it’s designed specifically for residential style machines. Another is Zep “Zeplift,” an enzyme-based, powdered detergent. One of the best I've tried is Colgate Palmolive’s “Dynamo” (thick, blue liquid). It has (what they call) “special builders” but is not as caustic as some detergents with high concentrations of alkalies. It’s safer to use and still gets everything clean, including hair-dye-stained colored towels. I’m still working on finding a softener that’s to my liking. I’m very picky... Hate Downey, Snuggle, etc. And some of the dryer sheets can block your dryer’s air flow.

I can understand why commercial distributors keep a tight leash on to whom they sell products. Some of that stuff can really mess up your laundry and equipment if not used correctly (as already stated by launderess), not to mention: cause physical harm to the user. Also, there are a lot of DOT restrictions on transporting the really toxic laundry products. Give the UPS man a break... not an ‘Alkaline Break’.. LOL.

One more thing I thought of: Some of the commercial products have a limited shelf life. Take for instance, sour: (and sudsman, correct me if I’m wrong) It contains phosphoric acid, so it is dangerous if used incorrectly and without the proper protection, and probably comes only in large quantities, so it would probably expire before you could ever use it up at home.

I've been doing some homework on this, but I'm sure the pro's can elaborate with a lot more accuracy and experience, which I’d love to hear. I don’t want to sound like the know-it-all newcomer to the forum. It may be strange, but I just find the whole industry (machines and products) to be very interesting and enjoy reading about everyone’s cool machines and experiences. Low suds and high spins to everyone! Wash On! (corny, I know) Ha!


Post# 347838 , Reply# 32   5/10/2009 at 17:41 (5,436 days old) by sudsman ()        
Answers

Pete The dryers are ADC They make the best going, Ramco claims to built their own but I dont beleive it for min. Having lunch with one of their Servie men tomorrow and going to find out for sure then.

Favorit: A good laundry manager uses what ever formula he wants. I use different formulas at both plants. Machines are different and supplies are different soil contents are different.. what works one place will not another.

Laundry Nut:
Sours are made of a lot of different products now.
My favorite is Raylene sour. IT has a brightner and blueing in it and is a dry sour made with Ammonium Silica Fluoride
Ecolab dry sour also has a brightner and is good but I prefer a sour with a blueing. Just a old laundry managers thing. Have and do use Clearly Soft some on the Gowns,our price is only 98.00 but have problems with it on the ironer. Ecolab gives deep discounts to "buying groups" other wise you get it up the A###. The same with most of them. AutoChlor claims they will NOT sell to the public but I have seen some on ebay..and in hotel supply catalouges.

Thanks to all four the nice comments I needed it at this time in my life have been thru a lot in the last 2 mons.. thanks to all..











ecola


Post# 348128 , Reply# 33   5/11/2009 at 17:21 (5,435 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        
More questions.......

revvinkevin's profile picture
HI Lee,

Thank you for all the info, this is very interesting! I'd love to come hang out and watch everything for a few hours!

I have questions about the wash program you listed above. Ready? Here we go!

>>Flush 3 Min Split hi level 22"
Is this sort of like a "pre-wash" W/O detergent? If not, what is the purpose? What is the "split", is that the water temp?

>>Wash 10 Min Hot lo level 12"
It sounds like there are two water level settings, or is that also adjustable?

What is >> Carry/Over?

Bleach, rinse, rinse, extract, sour, etc….

>> Extract lo 1 min, Sour/Soft 5 min split lo level 12 , Final extract Hi 6 mins
If the HIGH extract is 1200 RPM, what is the LO extract speed and are these adjustable as well?

Also, I would assume there is at least a "drain" between the flush, wash, bleach, carry/over, rinse, rinse, etc. Is there an extract also or only a drain?

20 years ago I worked briefly at a dry cleaners (with the plant in house) and they had bought a 50 lb Unimac for their shirt laundry work. I noticed this machine had 4 speeds (wash, drain/distribute, low and then high speed extract). It also had two different motors on the same drive belt. Are any of these washers like this (2 motors)?

Would it be possible to capture one of the "285" washers on video (for the sound) when going into final extract?

Thanks again!
Kevin


Post# 348180 , Reply# 34   5/11/2009 at 19:49 (5,435 days old) by sudsman ()        
Kevin

the machines are very quite and extract there is hardly a noise.

the levels are programmable along with any and everything else.
Split is both hot and cold water open at the same time. there are automatic drains. When the drain is called to open it stays open as long as water is running thru it. When is slows to a trickle it closes and continues the formula. This is so a heavy load of blankets will drain just a well as a load of sheets. there is a drain programmed at the end of each operation in the formula. There are 2 8" drains on the machines so the machine dumps the water and in less than 30 seconds you are running the next operation.
Flushes are used to carryoff loose soil and keep stains from setting. blood ect. They also help cut down on detergent useage.
A carryover is usually used after a bleach to help get the most from the bleach and rinse it to the point it does not interfere with other operations in the formula. A extract can be programmed anywhere in the formula and lo extract is any speed that is programmed it to be.. I use 400 one extract in the foumula is enough as the volume of water is enough to rinse well alone. The levels can be programmed to the 1/10th of a inch of level.. there are 5 preset levels or you can use any level between. There is a starch level which is very low 6" low med and hi soak level and a float level. Which is very high and used for curtains and drapes. with only 2 or 3 rpm. As far as sound there is almost no sound from the washers themselves . About the only sound there is, Is when the air operated valves operate the drain or the fill valves. then there is the sound like air brakes on a large truck. The Edro at the old plant uses air operated valves too and sounds the same.


Post# 348254 , Reply# 35   5/11/2009 at 22:59 (5,434 days old) by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture
Lee, this is all so wonderful, but my head is spinnin!!

Post# 348265 , Reply# 36   5/11/2009 at 23:58 (5,434 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

pulsator's profile picture
These machines just blow my mind!!! I have GOT to get myself into a laundry plant to at least try working in one! I just LOVE those big washers!!!! I'm very likely headed to Clean '09 in June as well as taking that tour of the Milnor plant the day before!!! I might have to come down to Texas at some point!!

Post# 348274 , Reply# 37   5/12/2009 at 01:53 (5,434 days old) by washerfan ()        

sudsman: Anyway you could take some pictures of the wash tubs for us? Maybe use a yard stick or something for a visual size reference?

Post# 348280 , Reply# 38   5/12/2009 at 04:25 (5,434 days old) by washerfan ()        

I found this on YouTube about RAMCO washers...





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Post# 348281 , Reply# 39   5/12/2009 at 04:27 (5,434 days old) by washerfan ()        

Well that didn't work. I wish I knew how to post YouTube videos where it shows a picture of it here.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO washerfan's LINK


Post# 348312 , Reply# 40   5/12/2009 at 10:29 (5,434 days old) by sudsman ()        
Very hard to get pics of the insides

they are so large i cans seem to get it all in the pic. but hears a try anyway Dryer

Post# 348313 , Reply# 41   5/12/2009 at 10:29 (5,434 days old) by sudsman ()        
and

a closer one

Post# 348314 , Reply# 42   5/12/2009 at 10:30 (5,434 days old) by sudsman ()        
Washer

Has 100 sheets in it a is about 1/2 full

Post# 348319 , Reply# 43   5/12/2009 at 10:47 (5,434 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        
clean 09?

Hey Pulsator,

Could you take some pictures of the clean 09 and the milnor plant and post them? Please with sugar on top?


Post# 348321 , Reply# 44   5/12/2009 at 11:00 (5,434 days old) by sudsman ()        
Dont know if this year will be any different

but in years past they do not allow cameras on the convention floor. I plan to attend to as in years past.

Post# 348325 , Reply# 45   5/12/2009 at 11:15 (5,434 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        

revvinkevin's profile picture
Wow Lee those pix are great, thanks! 100 sheets in the washer? That does not even look half full, wow!

I see the dryer has 4 (blades), how many does the washer have, 3 or 4?

Thanks again!
Kevin

P.S. Clean '09?? Is that a convention for comercial laundry / dry cleaning equipment? When is it and where?


Post# 348327 , Reply# 46   5/12/2009 at 11:20 (5,434 days old) by revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        
Clean '09

revvinkevin's profile picture
Post# 348519 , Reply# 47   5/12/2009 at 22:44 (5,433 days old) by norfolksouthern ()        
Size perspective?

I wonder, has anybody ever climbed into one of these things? But don't turn it on!

NorfolkSouthern


Post# 348530 , Reply# 48   5/12/2009 at 23:36 (5,433 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
"Clean"

launderess's profile picture
Is the professional launderers, dry cleaners, etc and so forth mega CONVENTION! Lots of fun (so I've been told), and more important to those in the business a chance to see new products and equipment, while also attending classes/training in whatever is new and interesting.

For a laundry appliance buff, it can be a bit like a child let loose in a candy shop! *LOL* So many machines, so many choices, and one has so little space at home.

Usually all the domestic and international laundry equipment/suppliers are there, and yes chemcial suppliers as well (nice time to pick up samples and such of detergents and other professional laundry chemicals).


Post# 348560 , Reply# 49   5/13/2009 at 02:24 (5,433 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

pulsator's profile picture
How many vanes does the washer tub have? 6? I have got to get my hands on a Milnor!

Post# 348561 , Reply# 50   5/13/2009 at 02:45 (5,433 days old) by washerfan ()        





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Post# 348564 , Reply# 51   5/13/2009 at 03:52 (5,433 days old) by sudsman ()        
Ramco no longer

has the 230 or the 35 and now has a 110

Post# 349230 , Reply# 52   5/15/2009 at 17:13 (5,431 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Question for laundry managers

I've noticed that the tags on my white cotton towels (Martex brand) and bed linens suggest washing in "warm water & no bleach." Of course, that's just a "suggestion." What would your wash formula be for these types of items? Also, built or non-built detergents, pH levels, etc. I'm thinking more along the lines of a small, B&B type OPL with light soiling and not a hospital. Any and all input greatly appreciated.

Post# 349260 , Reply# 53   5/15/2009 at 20:44 (5,430 days old) by sudsman ()        
all depends on a Great number of factors

Soil content one night use or 2 or 3 night only changed on check out. ect
The water temperature.
The type of washer used
The type of finishing done.Tumble dry or Flatwork ironed
The color content
The water hardness or if there is a softener
If color safe bleach is used or not.
Load size
Type of supplies to be used liquid or dry expensive or bargain rate
Are items to just be clean and acceptable or top quality
Turn around time needed for equiptment a factor or not
Is machine to be properly loaded or heavy loaded
Are the dryers gas, steam or electric all require different ph to keep yellowing to a min.
If flatwork ironer is used is it gas , steam , electric or thermal oil If gas is it natural gas or propane.
These are just a few factors that a good laundry manager must consider before every setting up a formula for any loads.


Post# 349270 , Reply# 54   5/15/2009 at 21:08 (5,430 days old) by mysteryclock (Franklin, TN)        
It is such a dumb question....

mysteryclock's profile picture
...that I have to ask: How does one learn how to become a good laundry manager? Is there a formal set of coursework or is it an apprentice-type program? Sounds almost like you need a degree in Chemistry to really get a handle on the formulas!

Post# 349289 , Reply# 55   5/15/2009 at 23:25 (5,430 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Wow, Sudsman, a lot of variables to consider...

Don’t know if this is enough information to go on, but see what you can come up with.

For this scenario, let’s assume we’re talking about 80% cotton bath towels, Martex brand, commercial grade, used 2 to 3 times between laundering.

Available water temp. 130-140 degrees.

18 lb. FL with 3 possible main wash times: 25, 21 or 13 mins. The main wash cycle can be manually repeated to add additional baths. 3 possible rinses, 2 mins. each, with the option of manually adding more.

Electric Tumbler. Current drying time on 6 full sets of bath linen is about 15 mins.

The color content is strictly white.

City water supply, not unusually hard, but no additional water softening.

Products available:
For this application, let’s assume dry bleach with 9% available chlorine.
Powdered detergent with a blend of alkalinity and detergency, intermediate quality ($32 for 50 lbs.) It’s not Ecolab. Moderate alkalinity; no heavy duty breaks. And a softener/neutralizer.

The machine will be operating with the normal recommended load. Gees, I don’t own enough linen to overload it.. LOL

Desired quality is bright white, fluffy, clean-smelling bath linen with a pH level that’s comfortable to the skin. Sterilization is not a necessity.

Turn-around time is not a factor.

No ironing. So the scorching issue is not a factor. They would come from the dryer, get folded and put on the shelf.

Not looking for an exact formula; just something to start with. Or, some guidelines for coming up with my own formula. I could always go to the supermarket and pick up a box of All-Temperature Cheer and some Snuggle, but then doing the laundry wouldn’t be any fun. Besides, this is all so much more interesting.


Post# 349328 , Reply# 56   5/16/2009 at 05:09 (5,430 days old) by sudsman ()        
will try

First 32 .oo for a 50 lb box of commerical detergent is a very cheap detergent. Any main wash time more than 10 or 12 mins is a waste of time and money. And you carry a greater risk of graying. You are far better off with two shorter washes than one longer one.
the best that I can offer with out knowing much more

Pre Wash Warm 90 to 98 no hotter 6 min Hi level
Wash/Bleach Hot no hotter than 150 12 min lo level
Rinse Hot 2 mins Hi level
Rinse Warm 2 mins Hi level
Extract 1 min
Sour /Softner Warm or cold 5 min lo level
Final Extract 6 to 8 mins

Amount of detergent will vary greatly but a good starting point is 2 oz. for a commerical detergent..on such a small machine.
Bleach. no more than a teaspoon full would be more than ample.
softner and sour Depends on what type of sour you are using. but no more than 1/2 teaspoon would be needed in that size machine. If heavy alkali maybe 3/4 Dry Fab soft no more than 1/2 teaspoon if liquid 1/2 oz (one tablespoon is plenty.

There a lot of variables be careful. on the detergent use, use the full 2 oz on the prewash then 1 oz in with the bleach. If there is a lot of suds on the main wash dont use the one oz of detergent the next time. Just on the prewash. just use enough to give a good suds on the main wash but not more than enough that will rinse out in the 1st rinse.


Post# 349342 , Reply# 57   5/16/2009 at 08:51 (5,430 days old) by laundrynut ()        
thanks loads

Will start from there and see how it works. Much appreciate your taking time to read and respond... and so fast too.

Post# 349349 , Reply# 58   5/16/2009 at 09:28 (5,430 days old) by suburbanmd (Maryland, USA)        
Any main wash time more than 10 or 12 mins is a waste of tim

Surprised to read this, because extended wash cycle (approx. 1 hour just for wash) on my Miele gives great results. Could it be another difference between regular home-style detergents (Sears Ultra Plus powder in my case) and commercial systems? Like, home-style detergents contain anti-redeposition agents that commercial systems don't have or need?

Post# 349350 , Reply# 59   5/16/2009 at 09:46 (5,430 days old) by pulsator (Saint Joseph, MI)        

pulsator's profile picture
I think it may also have something to do with the fact that our clothes are dropped what like 8-10 inches in a home machine versus 3 or 4 feet in a commercial washer of such large size? The wash action seems much more aggressive in those large machines I bet the load just doesn't need as much time being picked up and dropped because they are being dropped such a large distance?

Post# 349353 , Reply# 60   5/16/2009 at 10:04 (5,430 days old) by sudsman ()        
surburbanmd

Read some of the prev post on this subjuct there a number of test that have been done here and by the lab in the past. The bear this out.

Post# 349417 , Reply# 61   5/16/2009 at 19:51 (5,430 days old) by norfolksouthern ()        
That's gotta hurt

"I think it may also have something to do with the fact that our clothes are dropped what like 8-10 inches in a home machine versus 3 or 4 feet in a commercial washer of such large size? The wash action seems much more aggressive in those large machines I bet the load just doesn't need as much time being picked up and dropped because they are being dropped such a large distance?"

-------------------------------------------------

Imagine, being hoisted and dropped 4 feet, each and every second, into boiling hot water and detergent. Then face a 1600 RPM extraction speed at the end (if you even survive the first cycles). Oh man, I would hate to be the one working on a repair inside that drum, only to have someone accidently slam the door with the power on!

NorfolkSouthern


Post# 349433 , Reply# 62   5/16/2009 at 23:30 (5,429 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
No, Not Four Feet

launderess's profile picture
Look at how the machines are loaded in photos above.

If loaded at or even barely below rated capacity, there won't be much lifting and falling the full drum, but rather more against other laundry. Or, perhaps against the side of the tub.

Could be wrong, but that is what one sees when the large SQ front loaders at local laundromat are fully loaded.

L.


Post# 349555 , Reply# 63   5/17/2009 at 17:13 (5,429 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Can I answer the question?

>>>Could it be another difference between regular home-style detergents (Sears Ultra Plus powder in my case) and commercial systems? Like, home-style detergents contain anti-redeposition agents that commercial systems don't have or need?>>>

See, I’ve been here for only a week or so, yet learned so much from Professor Sudsman. Let me take a stab at answering this question:

Here is an excerpt from a commercial detergent label: “Contains anti-redepositing agents, optical brighteners, builders, emulsifiers and wetting agents. Blended to provide optimum balance of alkalinity and detergency.”

Most detergents (store-bought and commercial) contain some common ingredients, including anti-redepositing agents. The commercial detergents (depending on the application for which they’re formulated) can also contain high amounts of alkaline builders, which expand the textile fibers, allowing soil to be more easily removed in the wash process. Commercial dry bleach can have between 9% and 18% available bleach content, while regular Clorox is around 5%. These, along with other factors, make the time necessary to “clean” the load much less than what you would need using supermarket brands. Overexposure to bleach can cause damage and greying. Thus, short wash/bleach bath cycles. Multiple rinses with commercial additives like anti-chlor and sour are necessary to neutralize the alkalinity and chlorine presence and bring the final pH back to normal, prolonging the life of the textile, not to mention, making it easier to handle during the finishing process.

But, being the student in training, I yield to the sudsman for correction and/or clarification.


Post# 349588 , Reply# 64   5/17/2009 at 18:41 (5,429 days old) by laundrynut ()        
woops!

I meant to say "9% to 18% available CHLORINE content," not bleach.

Post# 349699 , Reply# 65   5/18/2009 at 04:06 (5,428 days old) by sudsman ()        
Dry Bleach is avail. up to 20 %

All detergents have Anti-redeposition chemicals in them. Some have more than others. H E detergents have the most as they have to keep the soil in supension longer beaucse of the screwy wash times they have to deal with now. Commerical do have less in them as almost no Laundry Manager runs any bath longer than 15 mins at the most anymore.. It just causes too much wasted time. and does not cause better work. The longer a load sloshes around in dirty water the more soil that will be redeposited on the load even with a lot of agents some will still go back into the load. The A/R chemicals will not stop it all 100 % Wascomat was one of the first to realize this many many years ago. When they set up the 1st automatic formual on their washers. Some of the very 1st ones went into the early submarines . Their fomulas was almost same as standard ones still in use today.. Prewash wash and 3 rinse.About BLEACH A old laundry managers rule.... Wash the load clean and bleach it white. Bleach is NOT a good substitue for good laundry practices. but too many people use it to hide bad laundry proceedures. Dont get be wrong use of it is needed but too many times it is used for the wrong reason, and in quanites far too high. The dry chlorine bleach is not as hard on colors and fabric as liquid, but will produce the same work as liquid bleach.


Post# 349710 , Reply# 66   5/18/2009 at 06:18 (5,428 days old) by laundrynut ()        
You're the early bird

Wow, sudsman, your post is time stamped 4:06 AM. You're an early riser. Is that a requirement of the job or insomnia?

Post# 349739 , Reply# 67   5/18/2009 at 09:11 (5,428 days old) by sudsman ()        
Early???

I start the plant and boiler each day by 2 or 2 :30 am. Most hospital laundry plants start at 4 or 6 am. Some at 3 but more at 4 & 6 the most at 6 esp.on a Monday Sometimes a hour later on Saturday I am up working when others are just getting home to bed..

Post# 349740 , Reply# 68   5/18/2009 at 09:13 (5,428 days old) by suburbanmd (Maryland, USA)        
Phosphates

Thanks, sudsman (and LaundryNut!). Another question...for what kinds of loads do you use phosphates, and when do you avoid them? What do you think of the practice of adding a couple of tablespoons of STPP as a booster in domestic laundry?

Post# 349789 , Reply# 69   5/18/2009 at 12:39 (5,428 days old) by sudsman ()        
Phosphates

& STPP check the searchlator We have beat that to death. If you dont come up with anything let me know I LL explain again.

Post# 350866 , Reply# 70   5/22/2009 at 21:16 (5,423 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Are there any tips for loading FL's?

With all those huge machines in the laundry plants, are there any rules on how to load articles into the machines? For example: Do you just grab a pile of towels or sheets and throw them into the machine in one big clump? Or do you have a more orderly procedure, say, towels laid out flat and layered? I understand the concept of washing similar articles at a time, like just towels or just sheets, etc. I'm trying to overcome an out-of-balance problem during extractions. My machine isn't sophisticated enough to stop and redistribute prior to high spins. :(
Or is how it is loaded irrelevant to being unbalanced due to the tumbling rearranging everything anyway.


Post# 350901 , Reply# 71   5/23/2009 at 00:29 (5,423 days old) by alr2903 (TN)        

Sudsman thanks for the pic's and taking so much time to answer all our questions. alr2903

Post# 350929 , Reply# 72   5/23/2009 at 04:52 (5,423 days old) by sudsman ()        
Loading

Loading is done by weight. Each cart is weighed and then loaded into washer. That way the capacity is used but not overloaded. Most of the time towels are damp or wet so a we add 15 lbs/to 100 wt. for wetness it avgs. out just about the right amount of weight. Linen in then loaded by arm loads into the machines. counting would take too long. Turn around time in VERY important to keeping workflow in progress. I have 2 unload, with 2 it takes about 3 min. Loading takes about 3 min. I want the machines stopped for no more than 10 mins at a time. Any downtime is a killer in any laundry.All machines must be kept running as much of the time as possible. On avg. the weight of a sheet (hospital sheet)is 1 lb. so we know if there is 285 lbs going in to washer there is about 285 sheeets in the load Gloves (very thick ones.and rubber aprons are a must for a loader as you dont want to have the linen next to your clean clothes or bare hands. We never know just what we are going to find. Even unloaders must be very careful and watch where they put ones hand as sharps and other items do make it thru the processing. the only good note is that at least one does not have to be concerned about infection control if stuck or cut by a sharp. This is not just a problem on hospital work but on kitchen linens also. Forks knifes and glasswear can cause serious hurts. .On the Flatwork ironer sheets are to be lapped over at least 3" this helps the sheet feed in better as in rides in on the tail of the last sheet . The lap is broken about 1/2 thru the ironer as each roll pulls a little faster and up on exit on the way to folder there is usualy about 1 ft between each sheet.. Folder is actually working on 3 sheets at a time. Measuring the first sheet out of the ironer and primary folding it and making the crossfolds and counting the other 2.

Post# 350968 , Reply# 73   5/23/2009 at 09:44 (5,423 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Would love to see...

those ironers and folders in action.

So I guess the actual loading, after sorting and weighing, is just a matter of (carefully) tossing a pile into the machine? No particular way of arranging the articles in the wheel?


Post# 351016 , Reply# 74   5/23/2009 at 15:22 (5,423 days old) by sudsman ()        
Laundry nut

just happen to have a video of it. Here at the old plant the machines are just about the same.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO sudsman's LINK


Post# 351276 , Reply# 75   5/24/2009 at 15:01 (5,422 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Thanks for the ironer video.

Hard to believe that a machine can do all that. Must be a b##ch if it ever jams. I can see where static could cause problems.

Is there a machine that can do the same thing with fitted sheets?


Post# 351296 , Reply# 76   5/24/2009 at 16:07 (5,422 days old) by sudsman ()        
Laundry Nut

We process fitted sheets just as well as Duvets and hard finish blankets(Old time hospital bedspreads) herringbone type.With the same machines. Static is A MAJOR problem if formulas are not run correctly and a good softener is used.Also load must have just the right moisture content (25%) to finish well and keep static down.. In colder months when static is bad we keep 2 steam vaporizers under the folder. Jamming is rare if feeders do the job correctly. Pull the items tight and keeping them straight is the key to good quality work. Other wise jams cause too much downtime. A good flatwork crew works well with each other and the machines.In the video there are 4 on flatwork, 1 shake out 2 feeders and 1 inspector. Machine folders work only as good as the feeders do.. IF work is crooked or not even it cannot measure to make the folds at the proper times and work WILL look awful.Most all folding problems are caused by the feeders. 75% of Ironer problems are also feeder caused.

Post# 351337 , Reply# 77   5/24/2009 at 19:01 (5,422 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Wow.

Would love to see a fitted sheet run through that machine. I've been hand folding mine for years.

Post# 351428 , Reply# 78   5/25/2009 at 04:27 (5,421 days old) by sudsman ()        
Laundry Nut

will make some still shots of it I m not so good at the video as you can see.

Post# 351432 , Reply# 79   5/25/2009 at 05:56 (5,421 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Isn't there some sort of metal detector you can use to check loads before and even after they are loaded and unloaded from the washers?I would think besides being a hazard to personell-the sharps could damage the machines and the items you are washing.Metal detectors are used by sawmills for checking logs for metal-metal items in logs can damage sawblades-as well as causing the blades to break violently and the peices can have the force of a bullet!a bullet in a log can do that.I would hate to imagine what a sharp can do in one of those 285lb washers when it goes to spin!I don't know what sort of detector you would use for glass items.

Post# 351546 , Reply# 80   5/25/2009 at 15:34 (5,421 days old) by sudsman ()        
There is no time for metal detector.

The most sharps are so small that they would not be picked up anyway.. A good washman knows what to watch for and good sorting room attendant is priceless. Most damage is not done in extract but in washing with the items falling on the sharps. That is why O R and ER nurses are to keep count of all sharps before during and after surgery. Most have log sheets they must sign off on.. but still some get past. Just a part of it. Actually really get more sharps from Hotel work than hospital work. Razors and blades and glass. and some needles too. Drugs are not limited to hospitals anymore. There is NO limit to what we find in hotel work.. From the expected to the embarssing, it all comes with hotel work. Over the years there is VERY little you can name that I have not found in hotel work, Condoms, sextoys, pills, drugs, glasses, dentures, artifical hands, legs, feet, gloves, eyepatches & covers, every piece of clothing there is, female products, food, cups, saucers, silverware, billfolds,pocketbooks. Guns, kinfes, bullets, I could go on and on..

Post# 351604 , Reply# 81   5/25/2009 at 19:52 (5,421 days old) by laundrynut ()        
You should write a book

You can name it "Laundry Treasures." Talk about airing dirty laundry. Some of that sounds pretty gross!

Post# 351622 , Reply# 82   5/25/2009 at 20:19 (5,420 days old) by launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Sharps, Instruments and

launderess's profile picture
Other OR equipment is not only counted and accounted for in terms of laundry, but for a more important reason, to make sure nothing has been left inside a patient.

Scrub and circulating nurses are held accountable for all sponges, swabs, sharps and all other surgical instruments, and such. Swabs and often other items as well are counted out on a board in the OR, once the operation is over, but before the patient is closed up, a count must be taken of unused, used and discarded items, if the count does not total the doctor must be informed and a "hunt" is commenced. If after the hunt the missing item still cannot be accounted for, a patient is often X-rayed in an other attempt to locate the missing item. Should this fail to produce results, the head nurse (and often supervisor and DON) are informed at once, if they have not been already.


Post# 351705 , Reply# 83   5/26/2009 at 00:42 (5,420 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Can you imagine

After performing surgery, the surgeon is missing his cell phone. No problem. Just call the cell phone and see if it rings inside the patient.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.


Post# 351757 , Reply# 84   5/26/2009 at 05:28 (5,420 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Holey Moley-sounds like working an industrial laundry is somewhat hazardous for what you find IN the laundry you have to wash.Industrial laundry operators should get hazard pay-sounds like you get as many foreign objects to "wash" as laundry!Maybe you should open some sort of thrift store selling some of the stuff you find-the motel laundry sounds much more dangerous than the hospitals.Guns,ammo, in their laundy?strike a deal with the gunshop for the ones you find.Yes I have heard of surgeons leaving "tools" in patients!maybe the check lists should be refined.At where I work leaving tools in the transmitters is common-some times harmless-but other times-and aroesol cleaner cans can explode from the induced RF.

Post# 351849 , Reply# 85   5/26/2009 at 10:23 (5,420 days old) by sudsman ()        
Rex

Guns ammo and knifes are all turned over to PD. they get so much from hotels that they have a dept just for it..The better items billfolds nice (very nice) watches (rolex ect ) nice expensive shoes handbags, diamond rings ect we auction to employees usually for about 1% of the acutal cost.. I use the money then for the Birthday club.. where we buy a cake for each ones birthday.. And they get a % of the money. to keep them turning items in. The finder gets a gold star on the lost and found board. When he gets 10 they get 100.00 . needless to say they make sure they turn in everything they find.If it is a real valueable they get a chance in the drawing pot @ 1000.00 works out well and gives employees some fun too. I bought a rolex watch and gave it to a friend for 50.00 . I will not wear such as I beleive it makes one more prone to be a crime satastic. Esp. in this area where crime runs wild in the streets. I keep items in lock down for 60 days and when no one claims them it is auction time. Very very rarely do any items get claimed. Most are from wealthy who just file insurance claims and get a new one.. A lot are left just for that reason so the can file a claim and get a new item.to replace the one they"lost"

Post# 352017 , Reply# 86   5/26/2009 at 20:46 (5,419 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Sudsman,

You said you prefer to use powdered products in your plant. Are there automatic injection systems for powdered detergents, bleach, softener, etc.? Or do you have to manually add them to a dispenser on the washer itself for each load? I’ve seen the systems for solid product injection, but never noticed one for powders.

The reason I’m asking is: Powdered chlorine bleach can take your breath away if you get even a small whiff while handling it. Too big of a whiff and it can really ruin your day. What type of procedures to you have in place at your plant for handling materials like powdered chlorine bleach? Aprons, goggles, gloves, respirator, etc.?

It’s sort of a good thing that it has such a strong odor. It lets you know if you’re getting too close.


Post# 352129 , Reply# 87   5/27/2009 at 03:45 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
I use both

It depends on the load and soil content. I like to use some dry bleach on the patient gowns as it is not that agressive on the colors and yeilds a good clean load. All commerical machines have dry injectors on them. At one time that is all there was. Different mfgs. do it differently. some have a "dump" cup that dumps the chemical right into the fill water. some have cups that are rinsed out as the machine fills Some have cups that are spray rinsed. I have never had the need to use any speical percautions for dry bleach. Have never had a problem with ones wanting to sniff it. If it is putting off a strong chlorine odor that shows it needs to be stored in a cooler location the bleach is acting. The area where I store all the dry chemicals is a highly vented hi air movement area. Even on the heaviest soil loads only 6oz is all that is needed for a 125/lb load. In the home style machines all we use is 1/2 teaspoon if the load is really bad. Otherwise 1/4 teaspoon does a good job for us.. But I do use STTP when using dry bleach. 4 oz per 100 wt. 1/4 teaspoon in home style machines.

Post# 352173 , Reply# 88   5/27/2009 at 08:58 (5,419 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Always learning something new

Didn't know about the temperature of the room affecting the amount of chlorine odor. Will keep that in mind. Haven't been "sniffing" any bleach lately -- LOL.

The follow-up question to the dry chem injectors is: How does the chemical get to the cups? Does the machine have storage bins that dispense the proper amount of chemical to the cups? Or, does someone fill the cups before each load?



Post# 352227 , Reply# 89   5/27/2009 at 11:22 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
The washman fills all the cups before starting the machine

most can use liquid or dry products Will take a pic of the one on the edro it is for liquid or powders supplies. And is the flush cup type. Humidity will also effect dry bleach it needs to be kept tightly closed.

Post# 352232 , Reply# 90   5/27/2009 at 11:32 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
Edro Dyna Wash

can be used with or with out cups the the last cup is being used for liquid softner the rest dry. They flush in when programmer calls

Post# 352234 , Reply# 91   5/27/2009 at 11:33 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
125/lb Speed Queen

uses cups and flush system.

Post# 352235 , Reply# 92   5/27/2009 at 11:35 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
After a full day they have to be cleaned

a good hosing down has to be done anyway

Post# 352375 , Reply# 93   5/27/2009 at 18:47 (5,419 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Thanks for the pics

and explanations. Those cups in the photos are looking a little nasty.

Post# 352376 , Reply# 94   5/27/2009 at 18:47 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
This is another type of injector

A flush tray type for liquid or powders

Post# 352377 , Reply# 95   5/27/2009 at 18:49 (5,419 days old) by sudsman ()        
looking into the flush tray

this style of flush tray is widely used.

Post# 352436 , Reply# 96   5/27/2009 at 21:25 (5,418 days old) by laundrynut ()        
Those are some big cups

Just one of them probably holds more detergent than I use in a month.

I've seen pictures of a liquid injection system with what looks like a central chemical dispenser with lines running to individual machines. As many as 12 injection ports per machine. Would that be for plants that run multiple types of loads out of one or two machines?


Post# 352442 , Reply# 97   5/27/2009 at 21:33 (5,418 days old) by suburbanmd (Maryland, USA)        
Central chemical dispenser

I saw a setup like that in the laundry facilities of the new county jail, on a tour before it opened. This way the inmates can operate the machines, but don't have access to the chemicals, which are in a separate locked room.

Post# 352645 , Reply# 98   5/28/2009 at 09:30 (5,418 days old) by sudsman ()        
The inmates dont have acess to the liquids here either.

they are in a seperate LOCKED room behind the washers.

Post# 352734 , Reply# 99   5/28/2009 at 14:46 (5,418 days old) by laundrynut ()        
inmates?

at a hospital?

Post# 354479 , Reply# 100   6/3/2009 at 19:41 (5,412 days old) by toggleswitch2 ()        

Sometimes, language can be used figuratively!

Post# 354565 , Reply# 101   6/4/2009 at 03:57 (5,411 days old) by sudsman ()        
Right On Toggles

Too much of the time they all seem like inmates anyway. and damn sure act like it.


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