Thread Number: 28756
Something interesting pulled me into the basement the other day... 		[Down to Last]

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Post# 438787   5/31/2010 at 22:48 (4,688 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I pulled home another machine the other day, and it literally pulled me into the basement.

I have a riddle that provides key information about the machine that needs to be solved.

This machine falls some where between the "Mitty Mac" and the "Big Mac". What is the capacity, Brand, and manufacture year of this machine? The link to the video may help with the year and the brand.

Please fill in the blanks:

This machine is of ______ brand, model _______, of ________ capacity, made in the year _______, with a ________.

The first clue is below.

Post# 438789 , Reply# 1   5/31/2010 at 22:49 (4,688 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Here is the video link

CLICK HERE TO GO TO supremewhirlpol's LINK
Post# 438790 , Reply# 2   5/31/2010 at 23:00 (4,688 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Here is another video that may help with the year, and the relative location of the brand.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO supremewhirlpol's LINK
Post# 438933 , Reply# 3   6/1/2010 at 16:43 (4,687 days old) by americansuds ()        

So the video is 1989, I am guessing that is the year it was made.

Post# 438973 , Reply# 4   6/1/2010 at 20:58 (4,687 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

1989? Not only 1989, but the videos are all UK groups. Yes the machine is made in 1989.

Here is another video. The rest of the answers can be found here with the exception of the model and the capacity. Watch it closely.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO supremewhirlpol's LINK
Post# 439026 , Reply# 5   6/2/2010 at 05:44 (4,687 days old) by askomiele (Belgium Ghent)        
Oké

 blank 1: Primus brand, build in Gullegem in 1989?


Post# 439254 , Reply# 6   6/2/2010 at 20:50 (4,686 days old) by americansuds ()        

Is this machine one of Alliance's new products?

Post# 439478 , Reply# 7   6/3/2010 at 18:11 (4,685 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

askomiele: It's not Primus brand, but you get additional brownie points for living in Belgium. If I lived there, I would be at the Primus factory everyday!

americansuds:
Is this machine one of Alliance's new products?

well... The Brand is Ipso. In 2007, Ipso got gobbled up by Allinace, now Alliance-Ipso, so you now see Ipso Branded TL machines (yuck!), higher prices for Ipso parts, and timers for coin-op machines and other essential parts now NLA. So, I reject the Alliance and insert the Ipso. If you looked carefully at the setup of the machine in the Primus video, the machine has an additive injection system. My machine has one that is fitted to it as well.(more on that later) It is made by Ecolab! Now that we know who makes the machine, lets go on to get the model number and capacity. The following link has info on the later models.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO supremewhirlpol's LINK
Post# 439683 , Reply# 8   6/4/2010 at 23:18 (4,684 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The answer to the riddle:
This machine falls some where between the "Mitty Mac" and the "Big Mac". Mitty Mac refers to the WE73 machine and Big Mac refers to the WE234 machine. If you look at the last link, models WE234, and WE304 are too big to fit into a normal sized door way, otherwise, I'd find a way to get one of those. The model I have is WE165. The info on the site is specs on the later machines with bigger windows, which is incorrect for my year of machine. Here is the machine plate:

Post# 439688 , Reply# 9   6/4/2010 at 23:47 (4,684 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

If you look at the plate, you notice it weighs ~539LB. It was a pain to unload from the truck, and If you think your going to get it down some stairs by yourself, THINK AGAIN. I had to rent a stair climbing machine, and even with that, it was STILL a pain to get down the stairs. The climber was a help, but on the periods where there was nothing for it to grip, the extractor pulled me and my help(dad) down the stairs like gravity on steroids. We'd try our best to hold the extractor in place for the climber to grip the stairs, but the extractor just kept going DOWN, what a scary/dangerous ride! The machine is rated for 40LB. capacitiy, which I am still confused about why Ipso would rate it as 40LB, when they changed the newer models to 35LB. The machine does work, however, it has to issues that I am addressing. This machine has a additive injection system that custom fitted to it. The fittings that were punched into the drum show signs of leaking. The armature in the motor rubs against the inner part of the stator.(a separate thread on that) The belts need to be replaced. Several other things need to happen before the machine is installed. Machines this big have to be bolted down in 6 to 8 inches of concrete. I will also make a steel base to install this machine on so removing it for repairs, etc. will be easier. Here is a picture of the front of the machine.

Post# 439690 , Reply# 10   6/5/2010 at 00:02 (4,684 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I also had to get a new handle, because the handle was just missing. There are apparently imposer handles floating around. The Genuine handle is NOT cheap, hence the plastic still on it. The other thing is that the wind blew off the top, ripped the hoses to the soap box all in one move, even though it was strapped down pretty securely. The top was irretrievable because it fell over the side of a bridge, which was a drop of several hundred feet. The machine is some-what wide, and it has a switch in the side for what looks like a starch cycle. Here is the back of the machine. Moving this machine across the floor is quite a work out, and it does weigh a little more than Primus W-10X^2. I have run the machine through a complete cycle, and they are longer. There is so far one thing that I HATE about this machine. That is there is no reversing relay. The tumble relay stays in, and the reversing timer does ALL if the work, that's VERY BAD!! I'm still deciding whether or not I'm going to change this.

Post# 439728 , Reply# 11   6/5/2010 at 06:19 (4,684 days old) by PeterH770 (Marietta, GA)        

peterh770's profile picture
The switch on the side probably turns off the timer motor. When using starch, you have to let it tumble thru the clothes for a while, longer than the standard program will allow. It is an OPL machine, but probably has a standard coin-op timer in it that has a quick less-than-30-minutes cycle. With the switch, you can probably have a nice long wash, long rinses and long spin. Seems to me that these old Ipso's only spin out at 80g's.

Post# 439995 , Reply# 12   6/6/2010 at 19:59 (4,682 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The switch on the side controls the water valves for the soap box. The soap door had a injector nozzle that went to the second compartment. When the switch is set to Starch, water only flows in the second compartment and not both compartments 1 and 2. Also this machine has a Starch button on it as well. When it is pressed in The timer advances to the main wash section, ativates the Ecolab injectors, drains, then advances to the last rinse, where a different pump is activated, and then the final spin. The machine has 2 rows of buttons. The first row are the cycles: 1. Hot wash with prewash 2. Warm wash with prewash 3. Synthetics with prewash 4. Washn'wear 5. Cold wash. The second row are the options: 6. Start 7. Starch 8. High water level with gentle wash 9. no spin 10. Advance button.

The cycle times are longer on this machine, as compared to the coin-op Primus, or the coin-op Wascomat P12 that I have. As far as timers are concerned, there is a difference between the Ipso timer for the Coin-op and the timer for the OPL machines. The Cycle motor and the gears operate faster in the coin-op version this timer is also NLA from Allinace(Thanks so much Alliance!). The OPL version has longer cycles, slower motors and gears, and inputs for injection systems. This timer is still available, but has undergone a price hike. They are now $500.00 to $800.00. I would not be surprised if these become NLA soon as well. Why can't Alliance be like Wascomat.

There is still lots for me to learn about this machine. Currently I am working on the motor, so I can't play with the machine any more until I get that done.

Post# 443622 , Reply# 13   6/22/2010 at 17:13 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The first major issue with this machine that I will tackle is the motor.

Post# 443624 , Reply# 14   6/22/2010 at 17:22 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Given the above picture, there is only one safe way to remove the motor with the drum and basket assembly installed. The motor has to come out through the front of the machine. Removing motors from Gen 3,4 Wascomat, W series Primus, Dexter and some Alliance machines are a lot easier than this machine. The reason for removing the motor in this case is because the shaft does not turn freely, but instead stops abruptly with a deep grinding sound. SO LETS DO IT!!

Post# 443626 , Reply# 15   6/22/2010 at 17:26 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

First the frame cross bar has to be removed. The bolts were a big pain to remove as they were super tight.

Post# 443627 , Reply# 16   6/22/2010 at 17:30 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

cross bar removed; Next, remove the belts(2) slowly and gently and let the motor rest on the ground.

Post# 443628 , Reply# 17   6/22/2010 at 17:34 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Remove the tension spring

Post# 443630 , Reply# 18   6/22/2010 at 17:35 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Then lift up on the motor tension bar and slide it out of place.

Post# 443631 , Reply# 19   6/22/2010 at 17:37 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Remove the power connector

Post# 443632 , Reply# 20   6/22/2010 at 17:38 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Remove the ground

Post# 443633 , Reply# 21   6/22/2010 at 17:41 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Now all that has to be done is to uninstall the motor... Remove the bolt (from the front of the machine)that holds the mounting rod in place

Post# 443634 , Reply# 22   6/22/2010 at 17:44 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Notice the other end of the rod(from the back of the machine), there are 2 retaining bushings that have to be loosened. One is located in front of the last mounting arm of the motor. The other is located at the back of the last mounting arm.



This post was last edited 06/22/2010 at 20:47
Post# 443635 , Reply# 23   6/22/2010 at 17:46 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Here is one of the bushings...

Post# 443636 , Reply# 24   6/22/2010 at 17:49 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Once the bushings have been loosened, slide the rod out from the back of the machine. Then begin moving the motor to the front of the machine.

Post# 443638 , Reply# 25   6/22/2010 at 17:56 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The motor weighs ~70LB. And the clearance at the front of the machine is tight! It is very easy to get the motor stuck against the bottom of the outer drum. Maneuver the motor as needed, without damaging the outer drum, to remove it.

Post# 443641 , Reply# 26   6/22/2010 at 18:07 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Here is the motor. It's big and kinda heavy. Here are the specs:
Elmo Motor 3~60HZ
Motor type: CV 132 D/2-18-2T -2564
1.3/0.3 KW 3450/360 RPM IEC 34 TP 130`C
1.8/0.4 HP 6.0/4.2 A INS.CL. B Max Amb. 40`C
Y/Y 208-240 V Duty cycle Spec Drift Spec Duty
E47623-B IP 20 IC 01

This is actually the original motor, so it is over 20 years old! Because the basket assembly is removed from the front the gasket, which is prone to leaks does not sit above the motor to short it out, like in the Wascomat, Dexter, Alliance, and Primus.

Post# 443642 , Reply# 27   6/22/2010 at 18:10 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Time to open up the motor: Loosen the set screws on the pulley with allen wrench, Remove the pulley with a puller.

Post# 443643 , Reply# 28   6/22/2010 at 18:13 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Remove the shaft key, be careful not to damage the winding through the open front of the motor. If you damage the windings, be looking to get another motor.

Post# 443645 , Reply# 29   6/22/2010 at 18:14 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Loosen the housing bolts

Post# 443646 , Reply# 30   6/22/2010 at 18:17 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The motor housing end bells did not just slide off, and I actually had to apply a hammer and screw driver to them. That's a good sign.

Post# 443648 , Reply# 31   6/22/2010 at 18:19 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Top housing off exposing the armature and stator

Post# 443652 , Reply# 32   6/22/2010 at 18:22 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Removing the armature shows that there is "play" in the bearings, which explains the shaft turning rough. Armature and stator show that this issue has been caught early. (Another good sign)

Post# 443654 , Reply# 33   6/22/2010 at 18:30 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The windings, don't look very well. They are full of 20 years worth of microscopic dirt. Using compressed air won't work here. Oil-based microscopic dirt actually eats the varnish off the windings. The windings then become more resistive in nature and the motor will basically self-destruct. While replacing the bearings I can do, cleaning the windings, I don't have the proper equipment to do so.

Post# 443656 , Reply# 34   6/22/2010 at 18:32 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

So off to the motor shop it goes...

Post# 443657 , Reply# 35   6/22/2010 at 18:37 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

3.5 weeks later it's back, and in an interesting shade of gray, with a stamp on it. My motor has been marked!

Post# 443658 , Reply# 36   6/22/2010 at 18:39 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

what a fat-looking motor!

Post# 443659 , Reply# 37   6/22/2010 at 18:40 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

And while I was at the motor shop, I had to take these with me.

Post# 443660 , Reply# 38   6/22/2010 at 18:41 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The back please the back

Post# 443661 , Reply# 39   6/22/2010 at 18:45 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I will get to more about the fans later...Now time to install the key and pulley

Post# 443662 , Reply# 40   6/22/2010 at 18:47 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The motor goes back in for testing. It is best to test the motor by re-installing it back into it's original environment.

Post# 443665 , Reply# 41   6/22/2010 at 18:58 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Now the re-installation process... manuever the motor in machine the through the front. Make sure the mounting arms face the right side of the machine. Align the motor arms with the openings in which the rod slides through. Insert the rod from the back of the machine, sliding the bushings onto the rod as well. The bushings go against the front and back of the last mounting arm(facing the front of the motor), and do not tighten them yet. Secure the other end of the rod into place with it's bolt.

Post# 443666 , Reply# 42   6/22/2010 at 19:00 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

securing the rod

Post# 443668 , Reply# 43   6/22/2010 at 19:07 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

position the tension bar back into place above the motor, reconnect the tension spring. Reinstall the belts, adjust/check to make sure the system is in alignment. After the pulley system is in alignment, tighten the bushings that are against the last motor arm.

Post# 443669 , Reply# 44   6/22/2010 at 19:09 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Reconnect the power connector and ground.

Post# 443670 , Reply# 45   6/22/2010 at 19:10 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Lastly, re-install the frame cross-bar

Post# 443671 , Reply# 46   6/22/2010 at 19:12 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Now it is time to test the motor... Here is the configuration:

Post# 443672 , Reply# 47   6/22/2010 at 19:30 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The configuration of my rotary phase converter has 2 3phase line reactor the are in series with one another so that the supply is still inductive when the Primus machine goes into extract with a full load. The reactors do not supply enough current for the Ipso machine, as it has a bigger motor. Since the reactors can't supply enough current for the Ipso machine, the 3 phase supply then becomes capacitive with a lagging power factor. This condition is very bad for when you have hard to start 3 phase motor. So, the solution is the following:
Take the existing line reactors out of the circuit and use a bigger one. This line reactor has a 55 A capacity, compared to the existing ones, which have only 4 A. There are some other things that I have to do to the phase converter, before the project is finished... I will get to that later.

Post# 443673 , Reply# 48   6/22/2010 at 19:31 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The rear of the phase converter

Post# 443678 , Reply# 49   6/22/2010 at 19:38 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Motor tests good! Guys at the shop say it's one heck of a motor. So, what did they do? They replaced the bearings, washed the windings, re-coated them, and painted the motor. The windings now are a teal type of color. But there is still that big issue with Elmo motors of extreme heat on the slow speed. The solution is to attach a fan. I did the same thing to the motor in the Primus machine. Having the motor reconditioned was a small fee compared to paying $1300.00 for a new one. So now the fans...

Post# 443680 , Reply# 50   6/22/2010 at 19:46 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

These 2 fans I got from the motor shop, and they are VERY special. These fans move lots of air, are sealed, and the motors are rebuildable!. I was told that they cost ~$250.00 each, but I have seen similar fans for about the same price, and those were not build as good as these. My thoughts are that these cost more that $250. These fans run on 208-220V and nothing less, they do not like lower voltage AT ALL! When ran on proper voltage they are loud and move some air. They move so much air that If you put your hand in front of the intake side, the blades will try to suck you hand in! These are 1 phase models.

Post# 443682 , Reply# 51   6/22/2010 at 19:48 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

specs of the smaller fan

Post# 443683 , Reply# 52   6/22/2010 at 19:49 (4,666 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

In the next few days the fan will be fitted to the motor.

Post# 443733 , Reply# 53   6/22/2010 at 23:16 (4,666 days old) by A440 ()        
Awesome Job Melvin!

 I am enjoying your education so much!
Thanks for the time of posting this!
Love the washer, motor rebuild, and can't wait to see your invention with the fans!
Thanks!
Brent

Post# 443893 , Reply# 54   6/23/2010 at 15:16 (4,666 days old) by bertrum ()        

Hi nice restoration work, What are you going to use this commercial machine for?, not your domestic laundry?

Post# 443988 , Reply# 55   6/23/2010 at 22:15 (4,665 days old) by americansuds ()        

its amazing how you just came up with all of this on your own, as if no one on this site helped you or advised you on anything about the motor at all, taking it apart, removing the key, inspecting the windings, determining if there was bearing failure, encouraging you to take it to a motor shop...very interesting indeed.

Post# 444491 , Reply# 56   6/25/2010 at 18:22 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Time to fit the fan to the motor...

Post# 444494 , Reply# 57   6/25/2010 at 18:25 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I made the mounting brackets out of Whirlpool/Kenmore DD cabinet fasteners.

Post# 444497 , Reply# 58   6/25/2010 at 18:27 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

bracket

Post# 444498 , Reply# 59   6/25/2010 at 18:29 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

There are a total of 2 barckets holding the fan on to the motor.

Post# 444499 , Reply# 60   6/25/2010 at 18:31 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

fan fastened to motor

Post# 444500 , Reply# 61   6/25/2010 at 18:32 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

close up of bracket

Post# 444502 , Reply# 62   6/25/2010 at 18:35 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Motor back in, drain hose to outer drum needed to be removed.

Post# 444505 , Reply# 63   6/25/2010 at 18:40 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Everything on this machine is 220v, so no transformers are needed, just find an appropriate place to add the fan to the circuit. The fan will run off the same circuit used for the tumble contactor coil.

Post# 444508 , Reply# 64   6/25/2010 at 18:51 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Fan installed, sounds like a mini jet engine! These open Elmo motors also HATE phase imbalance. Some 3 phase motors have better tolerances for this and can deal with the heat, which is another reason for the high out put fan. Changes have also been made to the phase converter to support bigger 3 phase motors. A bigger line reactor has been installed to better regulate the voltages of the legs, under the load of the bigger motors. It also keeps the supply inductive. The box to hold the line reactor is being mounted on to the phase converter

Post# 444509 , Reply# 65   6/25/2010 at 18:58 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

line reactor

Post# 444510 , Reply# 66   6/25/2010 at 19:01 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

specs

Post# 444511 , Reply# 67   6/25/2010 at 19:03 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Reactor mounted

Post# 444512 , Reply# 68   6/25/2010 at 19:06 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The thermal-overload on the supply circuit contactor has to be upgraded as well.

Post# 444513 , Reply# 69   6/25/2010 at 19:08 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

the new overload

Post# 444514 , Reply# 70   6/25/2010 at 19:09 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

overload specs

Post# 444515 , Reply# 71   6/25/2010 at 19:12 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

the wire used is 14-3 with ground

Post# 444516 , Reply# 72   6/25/2010 at 19:13 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

wiring the line reactor

Post# 444518 , Reply# 73   6/25/2010 at 19:16 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

putting in the thermal overload, the old 4-6A is too small.

Post# 444519 , Reply# 74   6/25/2010 at 19:18 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

line reactor wired, now just worry about the grounds!

Post# 444522 , Reply# 75   6/25/2010 at 19:22 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The old line reactors are disconnected and removed. Tidy the wires up a bit.

Post# 444528 , Reply# 76   6/25/2010 at 19:38 (4,663 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Now to test, and check imbalances. (1-2, 2-3, 1-3) Voltages are ~239 (1-2) ~241(2-3) ~246(1-3) There is still phase imbalance, however the phase angles and voltages of the legs will become more synchronized when I run more than one 3 phase device. For me, the overall voltage of the system is still a little on the high side. The machines prefer more toward 220V, or even better toward 208V. Now it is time to add at least 2 more L20 recepticals.

The Ipso machine has developed new symptoms, that suggest the cycle timer needs to be replaced. Given the price for both a new or a used timer, I will have to find a business to rebuild it.

Post# 446200 , Reply# 77   7/1/2010 at 19:49 (4,657 days old) by rollermatic (cincinnati)        
melvin you are an

 rollermatic's profile picture
electrical whiz!!! love the pics and your thread. very interesting to read!

glad i was able to see this machine in action today when i was up! those european front loaders mean business!

Post# 446208 , Reply# 78   7/1/2010 at 20:34 (4,657 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
THANKS FOR POSTING ALL THE PICTURES

 combo52's profile picture
It was great seeing all the shots of your machine after having talked to you the other day. Can't wait to see it in action some day. I may begetting that 1967 WP Imperial Mark 12 this weekend I told you about, I will keep you posted. Keep a look out for that 3 phase extractor I am looking for Thanks John

Post# 447160 , Reply# 79   7/5/2010 at 10:47 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Now it is time to add another receptical.

Post# 447163 , Reply# 80   7/5/2010 at 10:49 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Mount the box.

Post# 447165 , Reply# 81   7/5/2010 at 10:55 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Run the wire, in this case I used 14-3 solid + ground. connect the wires. Make sure they are tight.

Post# 447167 , Reply# 82   7/5/2010 at 10:58 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Tape the ends! It would very bad if ANY of the terminals touch the box while in operation.

Post# 447169 , Reply# 83   7/5/2010 at 11:01 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Well there they are.

Post# 447171 , Reply# 84   7/5/2010 at 11:05 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Wire the receptical. I could have wired the second receptical off the first one, but for possible heat issues, I wired it directly from the reactor. Lets put those big lugs to use.

Post# 447177 , Reply# 85   7/5/2010 at 11:31 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Now for testing: At this point, the second receptical will be used for running another motor. This motor will be used to help refine the 3 phase supply. The first test is with a Baldor 1/4HP TEFC motor wired for 230V 3 phase. When running the Ipso and this motor leg voltages are: 225, 242, 242. These readings are better, considering that this other motor also brings the relationship of the legs more toward 120 degrees apart. The motor in the Ipso machine no longer heats up as quickly, which is a good thing. The second test will be with a Reliance 1.5HP motor wired for 460V. I'll post results of that test in a few days.

Post# 447179 , Reply# 86   7/5/2010 at 11:44 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Yesterday, I got the Ipso in "good enough" condition for a water test. I didn't send water through the hot and cold water valves because of the "missing" soap box. This is still a high voltage situation. The only leaks that I saw were from the dump valve, and the additive hose nozzels. I removed the hoses because they are clogged with dried starch, etc. I ran a hose from the sink instead. This also allowed me to test the pressure switches, and observe for the machine behaves.

Post# 447180 , Reply# 87   7/5/2010 at 11:46 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The dump valve leaks a little, but I have never seen one that has not.

Post# 447181 , Reply# 88   7/5/2010 at 11:49 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

No leaks in the front.

Post# 447182 , Reply# 89   7/5/2010 at 11:55 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Splashy Splashy! The water level looks a little low for my tastes. It does take a lot of water though, and I have found out the higher the water level, the more turbulent the water. The water is significantly more turbulent in the Ipso, compared to the Primus.

Post# 447183 , Reply# 90   7/5/2010 at 11:58 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

First machine drain. Smells like starch!

Post# 447186 , Reply# 91   7/5/2010 at 11:59 (4,654 days old) by askomiele (Belgium Ghent)        
Thanks for the additional brownie points!

 Ipso is also build in Belgium ^^

Post# 447187 , Reply# 92   7/5/2010 at 12:03 (4,654 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Another thing that I did notice is that the drum emits a lot of heat when hot water is used. I may decide to wrap it with some insulation. I have resolved the spin issue with the timer using contact cleaner, but now it tends to stick a lot and not advance through the cycle.

Post# 451129 , Reply# 93   7/22/2010 at 13:48 (4,637 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The top and kick panel arrived today! Apparently this is the top for the coin-op version, but it will do. I was also able to get Alliance-Ipso to send me the wiring diagrams. Since I don't have a scanner, I can't post them here. Now that I have the wiring diagrams, I should be able to send the timers off to be rebuilt soon. If anyone wants a copy of the wiring diagrams, please send me an email.

Post# 451165 , Reply# 94   7/22/2010 at 17:28 (4,636 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        

mark_wpduet's profile picture
Wow, just wow!

Post# 451170 , Reply# 95   7/22/2010 at 17:55 (4,636 days old) by vintagesearch ()        

ooooooo aaaaaaaa i want one!

Post# 451180 , Reply# 96   7/22/2010 at 18:42 (4,636 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Randy:
If you really want one, I would say getting one should be easier given that you live around cities that have a number of laundromats, along with lots of different brands. The commercial machine market is different than the consumer machine market. When a consumer machine stops working, people throw it out and it sits there for the taking. When Commercial machines stop working, they get repaired, or rebuilt. From my experience you have to pay to get even broken commercial machines. If you really want one, look for distributors in your area, and business who repair the commercial machines. You may even luck out on CL or ebay. Depending on size and age of machine, you can pay into the upper hundreds to a few thousand for a used working machine. If you don't have that much, look into purchasing a broken machine. If they are really old and the person is going to send them to scrap, offer him scrap price for one. Also remember that these machine are HEAVY DUTY, and the parts reflect that, so they will weigh a lot. I recommend that you start with a small machine, like 12-18LB machine. Those usually weigh 250LB. to ~450LB. depending on how old it is and the Brand of machine. Also bring help with you, you WILL need it. For example, my 1974 Wascomat Junior W73(3 phase) is 18LB machine and weighs ~275LB. Moving it with a dolley is not too bad, help may be needed, depending how I feel to move it up some stairs. The Primus W-10 (3 phase) 22 LB. machine weighs ~425LB, and when you move it, it lets you know exactly how heavy it is. In fact When my dad and I went to Chicago to pick up those machines, I took 3 people to lift them into the pickup truck. They were a pain to unload, once we got home. Moving them on a dolley is not too bad of an issue for me, but steps require 2 people. The Ipso we165 (3phase) 35-40LB machine weighs ~541 LB and is a BIG pain to move. To move it up/down steps, you either need to be friends with a massive body builder, or rent a stair climber. Even with a stair climber, it a VERY rough ride. So know what your limits are and get help. There are 1 phase machines too some smaller 12-18LB machines can run on 115V 1 phase. Also know which type you have. Some are hard mount(rigid base), which require bolting to concrete, others are soft mount, like consumer machines. If you really want one you will do what is necessary to acquire it. When you are ready, I can help you with that.

Now that the machine has a top and kick panel, it doesn't look so naked.
All that is left are the belts, timer rebuilding, removing the pump system, back panel, building a base, and installing the machine.


Post# 451184 , Reply# 97   7/22/2010 at 19:00 (4,636 days old) by sudsman ()        
glad to hear you are comming along with it.

 I am sure you are excited too.

Post# 451355 , Reply# 98   7/23/2010 at 17:24 (4,635 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I'm so excited, I'm shaking in my boots!! I think I'm going to have to post video of it when everything up and running.
The Ipso needs a name..

Post# 452148 , Reply# 99   7/26/2010 at 14:46 (4,633 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The belts and soap box assembly should be arriving shortly.

Post# 458544 , Reply# 100   8/22/2010 at 20:40 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Belts and soap box have arrived

Post# 458545 , Reply# 101   8/22/2010 at 20:43 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Old belts look really bad

Post# 458546 , Reply# 102   8/22/2010 at 20:45 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Machine comes up to speed quick with new belts, no more burning smell.

Post# 458547 , Reply# 103   8/22/2010 at 20:49 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I removed the Ecolab pump system as well, because it would just be in the way. Lots of wiring to be corrected.

Post# 458549 , Reply# 104   8/22/2010 at 20:54 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I made a back panel, out of some SS metal that was sitting in the yard. Needs a polish.

Post# 458552 , Reply# 105   8/22/2010 at 21:03 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Soap box I have is PB3, since the top of the machine is for a PB3 soap box. For WE series Ipso machines, PB2 and PB3 soap boxes are offered. By default they can't be interchanged, unless the top and outer drum are changed as well. The main difference that prevents the soap boxes from being interchanged is that PB3 soap box is wider and has bigger diameter hose that is required. PB2 is basically the same soap box that is used in some Primus machines.

Post# 458553 , Reply# 106   8/22/2010 at 21:06 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

PB3 allows for more expandability, than PB2, also has required breathe outlet as well

Post# 458556 , Reply# 107   8/22/2010 at 21:12 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

The outer diameters of the required hoses are not standard, and so far it has been a real pain to find the replacement hoses, so I have a solution for now. It was a REAL pain to get that 3" to 2" adapter on, all I know is that is works for now, while I try to come up with something else.

Post# 458557 , Reply# 108   8/22/2010 at 21:18 (4,605 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

Leaks a little at the center bottom of the outer drum, from the connection. It won't hurt very much, outer drum is SS, fan and connections are water resistant, but leaks are still bad.

Post# 458564 , Reply# 109   8/22/2010 at 22:02 (4,605 days old) by Jetcone (Schenectady-Home of Calrods,Monitor Tops,Toroid Transformers)        
Kewl thread

jetcone's profile picture
That motor is a honker! It makes repairing my Duo look easy! 70 pounds for a motor --holey moley

Post# 458666 , Reply# 110   8/23/2010 at 09:33 (4,605 days old) by macboy91si (Frankfort, KY)        
Wow

 macboy91si's profile picture
You're basement amazes me if I haven't already mentioned. I'm glad to see that machine coming along, many of us who are faced with large projects can get out of touch with it and let it sit. I'm glad you're still working on this, because it's really freakin awesome to have one of these in your basement. I'd love to see it in operation.

-Tim

Post# 462098 , Reply# 111   9/8/2010 at 10:31 (4,589 days old) by supremewhirlpol ()        

I have posted a video of the water test and some of the machine in operation. I don't plan to keep it up very long. You can find the video here for now...

CLICK HERE TO GO TO supremewhirlpol's LINK
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