Thread Number: 53623
My New Dishwasher :)
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Post# 759698   5/26/2014 at 19:45 (3,616 days old) by Mich (Hells Kitchen - New York)        

mich's profile picture

Well... It was time. I was so tired of standing over the sink, and *gasp* washing dishes by hand, that I marched into Lowes this afternoon, and got a Bosch Ascenta. After Four Whole Hours...

 

I finally got it installed. Apparently, the Bosch uses a different water inlet connection, than our previous Kenmore.. so, it was pretty hard to install. 

 

Anyhow, initial impressions. The Racks seem really cruddy. 

 

I really am not trying to be critical of Bosch, but these racks don't hold anything. Well, they do hold dishes, but, they simply hold nowhere near an american model of the same price range. 

 

The Upside however is, this thing is really, really, really silent. I mean, really quiet. I thought our Ultrawash was quiet, but this is a whole other level of quiet. I really like that. Not that I had to shout in the Kitchen before, but, I really do like the quietness. 

 

I also.. really like this whole flow-through heater thing. I mean, our hot water heater, is really, really far away.. and despite how much priming I do.. there's always residual water in the line that's really cold.. and nothing would get it to, burning your face steaming hot. 

 

This Bosch solves that problem quickly. I mean, the water steam, from opening the door really does hurt. And, I'm simply in love with that. 

 

I really don't think we will save anything noticeable on the water or electricity bill. I mean, the old Whirlpool Ultrawash, was pretty damn efficient with water to begin with. But.. I do really like the fact that the water gets to a higher degree of "hotness" if that's a word. 

 

Anyhow.. I promised Pics to Dustin. So here they are :) 

 

It's still running the first load.. I'll upload more pics, when it's actually done washing. Hopefully, Soon, lol :)

 

 


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Post# 759707 , Reply# 1   5/26/2014 at 20:31 (3,616 days old) by retropia ()        

Looks good! It's nice to have the warranty you get with a new dishwasher, just in case. Keep us posted how you like it after you've used it for awhile.


Post# 759709 , Reply# 2   5/26/2014 at 20:45 (3,616 days old) by Mich (Hells Kitchen - New York)        
One thing a little odd..

mich's profile picture

Is it has that "new car" or leather cleaner scent. I actually don't mind the scent at all, I think it's kinda pleasant, I just don't understand why it's there. Is it the stainless steel tub, or is it a component in the machine that gives off the scent? :) 


Post# 759715 , Reply# 3   5/26/2014 at 21:19 (3,616 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

dadoes's profile picture
 
... or is it a component in the machine that gives off the scent?
Rack coating, maybe?


Post# 759753 , Reply# 4   5/27/2014 at 05:26 (3,615 days old) by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie)        

frigilux's profile picture
First of all, congratulations on your new purchase! It's always fun to get a new appliance and learn about its features and how to maximize loading efficiency.

My sister and brother-in-law just moved to a condo they purchased and they need a new dishwasher. I'd like to recommend either a Bosch (have heard good things; they're reliable; and they score well in tests at Consumer Reports) or a GE (down a couple of models from the one I have). Their kitchen is open to the living space, so they need a near-silent machine. Let us know how your Bosch cleans, too!

Capacity: I was surprised at the smaller interior of the GE compared to the LG it replaced, which had huge capacity. I've read a number of times in consumer reviews that the Bosch didn't hold as many dishes as their previous machine.


Post# 759802 , Reply# 5   5/27/2014 at 14:28 (3,615 days old) by Rolls_rapide (.)        

The smell you're getting could be from the sound insulation matting situated around the tub, between the tub and outer cabinet, and between the door inner and door outer. Usually (in Europe at least), the mats seem to be composed of greenish fibres with stray coloured cotton threads pressed into them. Superior machines have more of this matting. Cheap machines have either a minimum amount, or none at all. The smell could be from fire-retardant chemicals in the matting.

Also, stainless steel machines usually have bitumen panels stuck to the outer surfaces of the tub to prevent tinny rattling sounds. This is the basic sound insulation.


Post# 759803 , Reply# 6   5/27/2014 at 14:37 (3,615 days old) by Mich (Hells Kitchen - New York)        
Well...

mich's profile picture
I guess Finish is now "safe" enough for use in my dishwasher, and now I can begin working on the stash.

Didn't encounter any of that horrible etching effect in the Bosch. And was quite pleased actually with the performance of some power-ball tabs. One wonders if I'll be able to continue using them, safely in my soft water.

Was also quite pleased with the performance of Phosphate Free Cascade Complete action-pacs.. so I guess, I know of two decent available detergents I can purchase.

One will have to try seeing how the Phosphate Laden Cascade Stash, preforms in the next coming week.

Also - that scent, of leather cleaner has somewhat dissipated after four cycles. One thinks the Enzyme Detergents had quite an effect of some, on the smell. It's still there though, although, the rack coating would make a lot of sense.

I called Bosch earlier this morning, and was told while Cascade may be a great product, it's very much unrecommended by Bosch. I was also told using Cascade or Finish Gel.. may void the stainless steel tub warranty of the appliance.

From my first impressions.. It does seem like the water pressure is much stronger than the Ultra Wash, but I'd say the cleaning is about on-par, or very similar. If you currently have a working Power-Clean, or Ultra-wash, I wouldn't recommend "upgrading" to a Bosch, as it's really not worth the money, cleaning performance wise.

The Flow Through Heater, is just perfect. If your dishwasher is located far away from the hot water heater, I'd upgrade just for the fact of having Hot Water.

I also.. really consider the Bosch, to be really good for what's considered "eco" or "environmentally friendly" I mean, your not losing cleaning power here, it actually does use enough water to get the job Done.

I can't wait to post pics, of some actual Bob Loads, and some pics of the tub itself :)



Post# 759805 , Reply# 7   5/27/2014 at 14:50 (3,615 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
Just load it up!

I try to tell my Ma over and over to fill it just up. Really. I tried it ones: I had a small serving bowl, loaded it, loaded a same sized one behind, added a plastic box over it, than a nother box, a small mixing bowl, than a big serving bowl, and than a big mixingbowl over it. All soiled with mouse aux chocolate. It just filled up the back row of our 18" Bosch, including the cuttlery-basket. Than I added plates in the front and a serving plate just between these 2 rows. I added a burned on pan on the top rack, leaned over 2 rows of cups. Just 2h later, everything was clean. These things may seem small (as do Mieles), but once you figgured out what to place where, you just feel like fitting your whole kitchen inside it. At least that is with me...

Post# 759808 , Reply# 8   5/27/2014 at 14:58 (3,615 days old) by jerrod6 (Southeastern Pennsylvania)        

I wonder what their problem is with Cascade or Finish Gel.  They mentioned voided the Stainless Steel warranty.   Never mind gels don't seem to clean as well as tabs but is it because these gels may contain chlorine bleach?


Post# 759814 , Reply# 9   5/27/2014 at 15:42 (3,615 days old) by Mich (Hells Kitchen - New York)        
Would anyone know...

mich's profile picture
If I can somehow turn off the pre-wash cycles on my Bosch? I'd like to try Bubble Bandit.. But, I don't want to use the machines dispenser cup (because, I've heard so many complaints about it not dissolving well)

This Bosch seems to do about two pre-washes before, it goes into the main wash, and dispenses detergent. I'd love to know if there was a way to skip both of them, or one of them.


Post# 759828 , Reply# 10   5/27/2014 at 17:09 (3,615 days old) by washer111 ()        

Don't worry about getting rid of the pre-wash phase of the wash - since the performance may very well suffer.

 

I wouldn't be concerned about using the dispenser, just make sure that the water flow up to the dispenser (and down to) is not blocked by some object, so the detergent gets out. Also make sure nothing stops the cup opening. 

 

You'll probably find a lot of the complaints with any machine are caused by user stupidity more than the machine's own shortcomings, although they can influence the tolerance to low grey-matter count folk. 


Post# 759835 , Reply# 11   5/27/2014 at 17:31 (3,615 days old) by whirlcool (Just North Of Houston, Texas)        

Is this one of those dishwashers with the "Cold Wash" button so you can use DW detergents that have enzymes in them?

Look at your warranty. Does it say anything about using Cascade or Finish Liquid gels in the machine? Is it mentioned in the users guide? If it isn't it's most likely the opinion of the person you talked to at Bosch rather than company warranty policy.


Post# 759915 , Reply# 12   5/27/2014 at 22:11 (3,615 days old) by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        

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Sounds to me like the people of Finish paid them more to endorse their detergent than the people of Cascade.

 

For the record my Stainless steel Kitchenaid came with a sample of Cascade, and a sticker on the door recommending Cascade for best results.

 

Can't see where they could get by voiding a warranty over a detergent usage.  Me thinks P&G would file suit just as fast as the people of Penzoil did when Ford Motor company said they would void coverage if you used their oil.  I ran that Mercury 460 145,000 miles on Penz with no problems.


Post# 760022 , Reply# 13   5/28/2014 at 13:08 (3,614 days old) by Mich (Hells Kitchen - New York)        
I called Cascade..

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And was told, they had never heard of the Gel causing damage of any sort.. although the lady said, overtime, with continued use of a Chlorinated product, if your dishwashers door seal is made of rubber, it may deteriorate or wear out a little faster than normal. 

 

If I do have any damage, I can file a claim with the company, and they'll reimburse me, which is quite comforting. 

 

I understand Finish is probably paying Bosch big bucks, but still.. I somewhat wonder if theres any truth to there "No Gel" claim. 


Post# 760034 , Reply# 14   5/28/2014 at 14:28 (3,614 days old) by jerrod6 (Southeastern Pennsylvania)        

They may be being paid money but I asked because my Miele FL purchased in 2003 explicitly said not to use chlorine bleach in it.  I believe the concern was over the outer drum being solid stainless steel, and the corrosive effect chlorine bleach can have on stainless steel over time.  So till this day I don't use chlorine bleach in it and I am none the worse for not - I mean everything gets clean and stains are removed. 

 

 

 

 


Post# 760038 , Reply# 15   5/28/2014 at 14:46 (3,614 days old) by Rolls_rapide (.)        

Finish Gel is absolutely fine. The Bosch customer care 'adviser' is talking hooey. Stainless steel will gleam. Be aware that glass corrosion (milky, opaque, scratches) may occur more readily. Items with surface decor may fade more quickly. Aluminium cookware though, will look grey and dreadful.

My 2003 Bosch and my parents' 2013 Bosch both state that detergents can be in any format (powder, liquid and tablets); that they can be phosphate based or phosphate free; that chlorine bleaching systems or oxygen bleaching systems can be used.

Also, they say that stubborn tea stains are best removed with a detergent containing chlorine.

Finish Powerball tablets will be using an oxygen based bleach, a manganese based bleaching accelerator, and a zinc based glass protector, alongside other components.


Post# 760238 , Reply# 16   5/29/2014 at 12:21 (3,613 days old) by Mich (Hells Kitchen - New York)        
I almost forgot.

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Allen. My Bosch doesn't have any "cold wash" or "reduced temperature" options. It does do, two pre-rinses with completely non-heated water, before going into the main wash stage, which heats the water up to 160*. I personally haven't noticed the dishes looking any less clean, from the reduced Enzyme activity, in fact, I think the dishes actually look a little bit cleaner.

 

I'm still experimenting with the use of those Powerball Tabs. So Far, No Damage whatsoever. I'll definitely keep an eye on that though, and post if the results change. They do seem to do a somewhat noticeable better job cleaning, than the Phosphate Free Cascade Complete pacs. I still need to try them up against phosphate laden Cascade, and compare. 

 

I personally don't mind, not using Chlorine or Bleach based Detergent. Honestly, I had mostly gotten into that habit, because it kept the tub on my last machine, cleaner (*plastic tub*). It is however, very nice to know, that your manuals do state it's safe. 

 

It really doesn't state much in my manual, just to consider using Powder Detergent, instead of Tablets, and tablespoon for most loads. When I called Bosch and asked for their recommendation for Soft Water, they said use Finish Quantum tabs, and turn up the rinse aid, instead of down.. so, probably not the best advice :P 

 

I did do one load with Great Value dishwasher Powder, and the tub simply sparkled. I'd even say, it looked cleaner than the one I did with the Cascade Platinum tabs. And, it's so much more economical. Of Course, I did have rinse aid, in, which, probably helps quite a bit. 

 

I still need to pull out that Cascade Complete with Phosphate in it. I bet, it'll do wonderfully :) 

 

 

 

 


Post# 827008 , Reply# 17   6/7/2015 at 22:57 (3,239 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA)        
I hate washing dishes by hand!

I don't know about you, but I hate washing dishes by hand! I'd take a dishwasher anyday! I am a full time college student and Idon't have the time nor patience to do dishes by hand! I wish my dorm had a kitchen! And yes! a dishwasher! I need a dishwasher! That's it! I dn't care how disgusting the dishes look! All I need is a dishwasher wih cascade detergent and rinse aid with powerful jets! That's it! I'd go for the Cascade Complete citrus breeze and the cascade spot and film protection rinse agent with fast drying power! Who hates washing dishes by hand with a passion? I don't have time for this!

Post# 827009 , Reply# 18   6/7/2015 at 23:00 (3,239 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA)        
excuse th spelling.

Excuse the spelling. Stupid laptop! Anyway... You get the point.

Post# 827033 , Reply# 19   6/8/2015 at 08:33 (3,238 days old) by Practigal ()        
Warranty

What the warranty says is what you have to live with.

I haven't seen a warranty identify any product by brand name, because the formulation of any product can change at anytime.

Some dishwasher manuals recommended powder only. Some note that use of geltabs in softwater may cause there to be detergent left on the dishes because the geltabs contain sufficient detergent for hard water use which is too much detergent for soft.

Some of the Bosch dishwashers recommended powder only,

Some of the newer warranties exclude "unauthorized service (including self performed "fixing" or exploration of the appliances internal workings" and " adjustment, alteration or modification of any kind"...


Post# 827034 , Reply# 20   6/8/2015 at 08:48 (3,238 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        
yeah

askolover's profile picture
cause they don't want you to get in there and see just how crappy those new ones really are on the inside!

Post# 827038 , Reply# 21   6/8/2015 at 09:24 (3,238 days old) by PassatDoc (Orange County, California)        

My 2001 model Bosch DW has a sticker on the inside rim stating Bosch recommends Electrasol (previous name of Finish) and Jet-Dry rinse agent. I recall looking at newer Bosch models about a decade ago, just to see what the current models were like, and I spotted a label inside stating that Bosch recommended Cascade (and I don't remember if they switched from Jet-Dry). So it looks as if they swing back and forth, possibly due to paid "sponsorships".

As far as the common issue that "Bosch holds fewer dishes than my old DW", I think two factors are at play:

1. Bosch has thicker insulation--which accounts for its quiet operation--and consequently a smaller tub. The outside dimensions are all the same, so the thicker insulation has to take a toll somewhere.

2. The tines, at least on my machine, seem to be placed farther apart than on, say, a KA. If the plates are farther apart, it stands to reason that cleaning performance will improve, but at the expense of capacity.

Since I live alone and run only 1-2 loads a week, capacity isn't an issue, but it might be for people with a large family in terms of not being able to get through the day without having to run an extra load.

The smaller inside tub dimensions and wider spacing were pointed out to me by friends who bought a Bosch, on my recommendation, to replace their builder-special GE. Kitchen is open to family room, so they needed a quiet machine to regain their family time after dinner. Normally, they ran the machine after dinner, and conversation/tv viewing was nearly impossible with the GE. While the Boach achieved their noise objective, they sometimes have to run a second daily load to keep up with their family.

My DW is a 2001 300-series with the controls in the door rim. Ascenta was not yet being produced. The Ascenta line seems to provide good value and feature set at reasonable price. My only concern has been the bottom of the tub, where the steel and plastic meet, should the seal ever fail. Anyone heard of an Ascenta tub failing? (hope not)

FYI the owner of our local appliance store told me that most if not all contemporary DWs do NOT have heated first rinse---rinse occurs at your ambient incoming hot water line temperature. The integral heater does heat the wash and final rinse water, but not the first rinse water. Therefore, in the era of no-phosphate detergents, he recommends priming the hot water line at the sink, to its maximum temperature, prior to starting the DW, to ensure the hottest possible first rinse.


Post# 827311 , Reply# 22   6/10/2015 at 01:54 (3,237 days old) by mieleforever (SOUTH AFRICA)        

Really good looking machine, congratulations on your purchase, I think you will have years of trouble free dishwashing.

As stated in previous posts that I have made, we have a Siemens, but I think it is the same thing as the Bosch, and we have not had one problem for the past seven years, we just top up the rinse aid and salt dispenser and off we go.

It really gives good resluts and is excetionally quiet, without any bells and whistles, it just goes about its job, quietly and good and we have given it some really hard labour as we often entertain and we invite guests, normally a party would consist of about 25 adult people excluding kids and that my friend is a lot of washing up to do.

Another thing that maybe is off the cuff "Bells and whistles usually will turn into thorns and thistles", I just wanted to through it in there.

Anyways enjoy your machine.

Cheers.


Post# 827549 , Reply# 23   6/11/2015 at 10:26 (3,235 days old) by labboy (SD, CA)        
Priming hot water line...

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I used to do this with our recently replaced KA. When we installed the Bosch, I tried it for a few cycles then stopped to see if it made a difference. Things come out flawless either way. (Not the case with the KA...priming was essential to make sure it started with hot water. If we did not prime, we saw an increase in white film or unclean silverware.)

Bob



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