Thread Number: 63383  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Former Apple Exec & engineer showing Combo Washer/Dryer at CES 2016
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Post# 859652   1/2/2016 at 17:20 (993 days old) by appnut (TX)        

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Glenn Reid taking an existing washer from a Chinese manufacturer and adding the mechanics necessary to turn it into a conventional dryer as well.  And it's supposed to be a vented one. 


See article


This post was last edited 01/02/2016 at 17:49

Post# 859677 , Reply# 1   1/2/2016 at 20:24 (993 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        
that looks like

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a "GE" washer!

Post# 859681 , Reply# 2   1/2/2016 at 21:19 (993 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

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It sure does. Even the oval pattern in the metal sides are the same. Made by Little Swan Washing Machine Co.

It's going to be interesting to see the specifics on the machine. Two combos in one house won't work for the majority of existing homes with single vents, electrical and water/waste hookups.

  View Full Size
Post# 859732 , Reply# 3   1/3/2016 at 05:45 (993 days old) by henene4 (Germany)        

I think you could double both up. Water and waste water with Y-adapters, though the waste water adapter would be kind of new to me, and venting 2 units through 1 vent dosen't seem impossible either, given these hybrid units won't have the air-throughput of a normal dryer.

Electrical power is more interesting in my opinion. With a gas option, that won't be a problem, but with an electrical one, I'd think that they run into a problem.
The either make it 240V to get some decent wattage, but most setups only have 1 240V connection. They could make it only 2,5kW and then share a 240V outlet.

If they even considered the 2 machine idea.

Post# 859749 , Reply# 4   1/3/2016 at 09:10 (993 days old) by logixx (Germany)        

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It's a 240V unit according to this brochure

Post# 859751 , Reply# 5   1/3/2016 at 09:37 (993 days old) by cuffs054 (MONTICELLO, GA)        

It's about damn time!

Post# 859759 , Reply# 6   1/3/2016 at 10:02 (993 days old) by A440 ()        

Very interesting.

I sure hope this will force the other big manufactures to follow and do the same. 


Post# 859762 , Reply# 7   1/3/2016 at 10:21 (993 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!)        

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LG is using a "Y" adapter setup for their Sidekick washer. I wonder if they need to have some sort of back-flow preventer in both lines to keep pumped water from entering the other machine? The pumps may already have a back-flow preventer built in.

Before I had softened water, I used a few of the Y splitters for the water supply lines and the aluminum/pot-metal versions would corrode and leak surprisingly quickly.

From their installation/users manual (Link .pdf):


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Post# 859763 , Reply# 8   1/3/2016 at 10:21 (993 days old) by henene4 (Germany)        
Oh, so cute...

They stuff Linux and a quad core into a washer? That's honestly going to either fail completly or take of. If they somehow manage to make it survive the vibrations, heat, moisture and lint.

I somehow feel that this actually has an Apple feeling to it. You know, lots and lots of new technology, new ideas, and so on. And on the way, the main idea got lost.
I mean, if you take Apple, our "Smartphones" are anything but phones.
This is anything but an applaince.

You see, first of: It has a 3,8 cuft drum. That's about 1,9 cuft of usable space during a wash\dry cycle. That's quite a bit smaller then what the market is used to and makes it a no-go for a lot of consumers.
It runs on 240V, which means you either abandon your additional dryer, or get a new 240V line. Or can't get it, at all.
It has a literal PC built into it. And if anybody ever used a PC over a period of time, we all know they have quirks. In an office condition. Not in a shaking, heating, water-connected condition.
They wrote a 6 page paper about condensing drxing being slower then venting. I mean, if you have to write a paper about that, you should not be in the laundry business.

My point is: Washer dryer combos have bern widely phased out due to their complexity, impractical layout and overall inefficency.
Now they take a already fault prone design due to its complex structure, and dump a whole lot of high tech into the mix, without changing anything meaningfull about the base pricipal.

To make this work, they'd need to get about 2,5-3 cuft of usable space into it, make it somehow actually replace 2 machines (aka make it possible to set up 2 of those side by side without changing your house around), and probably then worry about features.

For me, this get's a "Who wants to bet about when they will vanish?" rating.

Post# 859771 , Reply# 9   1/3/2016 at 10:57 (992 days old) by appnut (TX)        

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I bet most people still don't fill their front loaders up full when they do a wash  1/2 to 2/3 full would probably be realistic.  User manual and other owner information needs to convey that requirement for proper operation. 

Post# 859779 , Reply# 10   1/3/2016 at 11:17 (992 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        

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It is a smart looking machine, based on the brochure.
And if they plan on taking feedback from their customer base to enhance cycles and other design elements, now is our chance as an enthusiast community to help used the industry.

Stackable = YES.

I wonder what this is all about...


Post# 859782 , Reply# 11   1/3/2016 at 11:27 (992 days old) by henene4 (Germany)        

But most people indicate the wish to wash their comforters, pillows etc in a FL. They have to be dried then. And most comforters that I've seen pretty much fill 3.8 to the brim.

Its just that I don't doubt they could be usefull in some aplications, yet, I don't think they'll be as sucessfull as the few media releases make it look.

Post# 859784 , Reply# 12   1/3/2016 at 11:41 (992 days old) by logixx (Germany)        

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This reminds me of the TOL Samsung washer/dryer that is old in some places. The Samsung has a touchscreen, a recirculation pump, auto-doeses liquid detergent and softener and has an air-condensing dryer part.


Lots of informative videos here:


Post# 860173 , Reply# 13   1/5/2016 at 03:50 (991 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, the Netherlands)        

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This is nothing more than another gadget. If they really wanted to do something, they should have made it more efficient with a heat pump dryer instead of a vented dryer. This is not Apple, this is more like Huawei.

Post# 860176 , Reply# 14   1/5/2016 at 04:18 (991 days old) by qualin (Canada)        

Last time I looked at buying a combo, it was a Euro style Ariston, cost an arm and a leg and took anywhere between 3-4 hours to wash and dry a single load of laundry with a 1.5 cu.ft tub. Mind you, this was nearly 20 years ago now...

I'm glad to see that combos are making a comeback, especially if they don't take three hours to do a single load of laundry. This does look promising.

I'd like to read some reviews once these hit the market.

Post# 860426 , Reply# 15   1/6/2016 at 13:48 (989 days old) by henene4 (Germany)        

"They are not that different technologies!"
"It has never been done before!"
"... and I almost couldn't tell them apart!"

Seriously: Boy, as much as I'd love to like your idea, you just made your self look a whole lot less trustable to me...

Post# 860430 , Reply# 16   1/6/2016 at 14:24 (989 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Some of the idea here, i think, is the savings on shipping and storage. I saw Apple shrinking their stuff over the years and knew the cost of transport from China/UPS was part of the reason. Also if you buy one of these directly from their website that eliminates the middlman and his warehouse.
When you bake Linux onto the chip a lot of issues are lessened or eliminated as far as jiggling and such. iPods had hard drives and they coped well.
Also Apple has done well creating enough desire for their products to over come backward compatibility. Time and time again we were told xyz product would fail because it lacked this or that port or other backward compatibility.
The article also states this is the initial effort with a more dedicated design to follow...if they can survive that long.
I'm with appnut, huge comforters are just as much a fad as anything else. Most people this is aimed at have modern insulation and central heating, comforters are a bulky nuisance with the modern materials we now have on the market. Ginormous puffy jacks are long gone and their bed clothes brethren may, for many, not be far behind.

Post# 860436 , Reply# 17   1/6/2016 at 15:24 (989 days old) by logixx (Germany)        

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LOL Henrik - these are exactly the point in his presentation that had me laughing.

Post# 860437 , Reply# 18   1/6/2016 at 15:38 (989 days old) by henene4 (Germany)        

I know, I know, people don' fill their machines to the brim, people don't wash comforters, etc.

Yet, there is barley any full-size FL out there below 4ft³.
Wonder why?
And its not only vibration. You know you should clean out your dryer every year or so? And your PC as well?
Now combine them.

@Alex Yeah. I was just like starring at my screen in the hope he'd be joking or something.

Post# 860440 , Reply# 19   1/6/2016 at 16:14 (989 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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The popularity of stacked W/D's tells me this idea will have ears out there listening.
McMansions are not as cool with the younger set with the dough as is urban living.
Apartment space seems to be limited by some sorta law, in the U.S. at least, so this design angle could
All they do is have to function for a max of 10yrs by the new reckoning consumers seem to accept.
Computer aided design and new wash technologies (beads for one) may dovetail into this as well.

I cheer this on regardless, how could you not if your an appliance fan?

Post# 860449 , Reply# 20   1/6/2016 at 17:25 (989 days old) by logixx (Germany)        

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As good as it all sounds, it reminds me a lot of the Dyson Contrarotator: cutting-edge technology to revolutionize the way we do laundry... and in the end it's a financial loss for the manufacturer and the buyers.

Post# 860511 , Reply# 21   1/7/2016 at 03:36 (989 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Retail Price...

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Wait for it... $1200

He will probably sell a few.
This thing is no crazier than the thing LG is putting in the pedestal.


Post# 860546 , Reply# 22   1/7/2016 at 08:46 (989 days old) by rapunzel (Sydney)        
This article is a joke, right?

My advice - "stick to tablets and I-pods." I love how these entrepreneurial types always want to 'change' things they know nothing about. Let alone take into account what consumers really want.

We must quickly and unequivocally acknowledge, that these 'entrepreneurs' are responsible for much that is extremely undesirable in today's world.

Laundry is best done by people who know what they are doing and we should stick with designs that have proven themselves over time. 'Modern' or 'new' isn't always better and most of us still live in the real, not virtual, world where things happen in real life and not in some electronic device.

Post# 860583 , Reply# 23   1/7/2016 at 14:27 (988 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK)        
Washer Dryers

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"Washer Dryers havnt changed in 70 yrs" hhmmm, do we know the spin speed and residual moisture content after spinning of this model?

If this has a large dryer heater and fan unit to get rid of all that moisture like the 60`s models then it could work, but if this is aimed at apartment users, dont we have regular feedback that many apartments dont allow outside vents to be installed.

After a separate washer and dryer a washer dryer is a compromise but workable, I`m in a studio apartment and have Servis Vestel model, 9kg wash , 6kg dry, 1400rpm spin, 65ltr drum - 2.2 cu ft, just did all my Whites in one load, 16 t-shirts, 4 hand towels (this registered 3kg on the sensor) ..took 1.28 to wash @ 60d and then 65 mins to dry, condenser dryer. Dryer has sensor settings, I use hanger dry setting and just enough moisture to smooth flat or quick iron!!

Gonna be an interesting watch on this Marathon one!

Post# 860602 , Reply# 24   1/7/2016 at 16:57 (988 days old) by revvinkevin (So. Cal.)        

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Call me "old school" but can someone please tell me why in the hell ANYONE needs a full keyboard, internet (and cloud) access via their washing machine?!?!?!?!

The idea of a (220V or gas/vented) W/D combo is great, really! Especially for that price, IF they can make it work AND have good (great?) washing / drying performance, without having to be re-booted every few wash loads!


Post# 860622 , Reply# 25   1/7/2016 at 19:11 (988 days old) by logixx (Germany)        
Keyboard and internet?

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Clearly so you can wash your laundry and surf this forum with just one machine.

Post# 860645 , Reply# 26   1/7/2016 at 22:17 (988 days old) by A440 ()        

It all sounds like a very cool idea.  The issue I am seeing is the huge gasket made out of rubber.  I can't see the gasket lasting very long with "normal" dryer high heat with either electric or gas as the source.  I wonder if the drying temps are lower? 

Post# 860652 , Reply# 27   1/7/2016 at 23:11 (988 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        

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they should have made it with a gasket like Asko bellows.

Post# 860655 , Reply# 28   1/7/2016 at 23:23 (988 days old) by MattL (Flushing, MI)        

Why so much negativity?  No one has really seen, let alone used the product yet so many are dumping on it.  Yeah, it's different in some ways, better?  Who knows.  Let it get on the market, see some test runs then evaluate.  Just because it's different does not mean its bad - or good for that matter.  Wouldn’t many of you naysayers be surprised if it was open source and you could make it do things other machines could not---

Post# 860675 , Reply# 29   1/8/2016 at 08:20 (988 days old) by robliverpool (england Liverpool)        
It's not a new idea

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Ariston had a washer dryer in the 80s and the dryer part was vented. I had one. Not sure you could fix a flex pipe on it but it did have a filter on the back of the machine to catch the fluff

Post# 860685 , Reply# 30   1/8/2016 at 10:37 (987 days old) by henene4 (Germany)        

The thing is, if it is open source, who has the computer ability of us to actually do something with it? I surely don't.
Further, if you rewrite Linux to work on a WD combo, and try to sell it, you don't make it open source. Period. You developed it, and if you want to make money off of it, you let them pay.
And I'm not even sure if they'd be allowed to. Somebody trying to fiddle with, disabling some temperature checks, burning down his house, and Marathon has to pay.

So far, we are just criticly thinking about it as if we would have to market it. WD combo that really replaces both units fully: Write me in.
A small, highly computerized machine, with a market about as big as the combo market is right now, developed by somebody who says stuff like "washers and driers aren't that big of a difference": I'm sceptical.

Post# 860692 , Reply# 31   1/8/2016 at 11:01 (987 days old) by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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The machine will surely not be open source, remember this is an ex Apple exec pushing this ;) With a machine like this allowing users to alter the software would only create a nightmare of potential problems for the manufacturer.

As for the durability of the boot, it will probably be well longer then that of machines in the past. Rubber and polymer technology has made great advances in the past 60 years. Just because all the Westinghouse boots have failed, doesn't mean this one won't easily outlast the design life 10-15 years of the machine. It will come down to the quality of the manufacturing and design which of course remains to be seen.

I like the idea of having a machine be connected and having a touch screen interface. Properly made electronics are VERY durable and will hold up just fine. In our machine shop, it's never the electronics that fail, it's the mechanical bits! Of course there is the possibility that they will cheap out on the electronics but that remains to be seen. A common thing I see with people judging the reliability of appliance electronics, is looking at electronics from 15-20 years ago. Reliability has become far better in recent years with advances in technology and just learning what works and what doesn't.

I second Matt's comments. Lets see this in the flesh before we Monday morning quarterback it to death.

My hunch is that it will fail for the same reasons that all the other combo's did here in the states. The electronics may actually help its viability!

Post# 860704 , Reply# 32   1/8/2016 at 13:11 (987 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK)        
Washer Dryer

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"My hunch is that it will fail for the same reasons that all the other combo's did here in the states."

Hi Phil for us overseas could you explain what the reasons are / where that the early combo`s failed?

Cheers, Mike

Post# 860716 , Reply# 33   1/8/2016 at 14:30 (987 days old) by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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Well I'm not really the combo expert here but my understanding goes along these lines.

The typical US household tends to batch their laundry so come wash day there are a few loads to do. With all the washing/drying all in one machine the effective throughput is ~1/2 that of a pair of machines. Add in the fact that a combo machine could cost what a pair of traditional appliances costs then about all that is saved is the floor space.

The other issue is that American's have long held the top load washer as the standard and haven't embraced horizontal axis machines the way most other countries have. (As an aside, see also: The Metric system...)

In Europe where space and water are more scarce, I have the feeling that combos are considered in a bit better light then here in the states.

Post# 860718 , Reply# 34   1/8/2016 at 14:36 (987 days old) by revvinkevin (So. Cal.)        

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Very well put Phil!   


Mike, this may (or may not?) be helpful.



Post# 860740 , Reply# 35   1/8/2016 at 16:59 (987 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK)        
Washer Dryers

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Many thanks Phil & Kevin, very informative!!

I guess as times change and big families become smaller and single occupancy ensues there may be a way forward for these appliances.

Post# 860756 , Reply# 36   1/8/2016 at 20:31 (987 days old) by verizonbear (Glen Burnie )        

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Here's the website. So who is going to make a pre order ????

CLICK HERE TO GO TO verizonbear's LINK

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