Thread Number: 71698  /  Tag: Ranges, Stoves, Ovens
Moffat Range
[Down to Last]

automaticwasher.org's exclusive eBay Watch:
scroll >>> for more items --- [As an eBay Partner, eBay may compensate automaticwasher.org if you make a purchase using any link to eBay on this page]
Post# 948706   7/17/2017 at 23:33 (2,473 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

So I found this stove a few months back and decided to give it a home. Moffat was a Canadian company most well known for its ranges. From what I understand, Moffat was acquired by GSW in 1971 and GSW merged with Canadian General Electric in 1977 to form Camco.

Anyway, before I picked it up I found an ad showcasing this range in a newspaper from 1959. I was excited to learn it was the TOL 30" model and had many features I'd read about but hadn't ever had the chance to see in action.





Post# 948708 , Reply# 1   7/17/2017 at 23:51 (2,473 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

So I picked it up in late winter and it had kinda sat in the garage for the last little while until I had a chance to clean and fix it up recently.

I have to say it appears to be one of the most well appointed ranges on the market at the time. Some of the features include a deep well with a steamer insert and frying basket, thermostat controlled element, temperature probe, built in rotisserie, warming drawer, roller oven rack, external oven rack height control, outlet, time bake etc etc etc!

Here are a few pictures


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 7         View Full Size
Post# 948709 , Reply# 2   7/17/2017 at 23:52 (2,473 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

Here it is all lit up! Really like that big panel light!

  View Full Size
Post# 948711 , Reply# 3   7/18/2017 at 00:00 (2,473 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

The oven is pretty interesting. Its old enough to still have an open coil broil element and it must be one of the first stoves ever made with a roller rack. It had a bit of surface rust on the wheels and so I had to spend some time with a dremel wire brush and sandpaper but it works like a charm once again!

The other thing that is really unique is the elevator control for the rack. To raise or lower the rack you simply turn the wheel on the front of the range (with the door open or closed). There is a numbered guide inside the oven so you can match the height to what the recipes call for in the instruction guide.

To preheat the oven you first turn the control to Broil and then to the desired temperature. By doing this you activate both top and bottom elements until the temperature is reached for faster preheat.

It also came with all the accessories including the rotisserie rack and spit, original broiler pan and the probe.. The rotisserie rack fits into four holes in each corner of the broiler pan. The only thing that is missing is the handle that screws onto the spit for taking it out of the oven.


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 3         View Full Size
Post# 948715 , Reply# 4   7/18/2017 at 00:11 (2,473 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

The surface units are all infinite heat but the markings are a bit different than what I've seen before. There are different sections on the dial and apparently the lower the number in that section, the higher the temperature. I think...haven't quite figured it out.

To start the element you first set it to "Start" until it heats up and then change the setting to what you want to cook at.


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 948717 , Reply# 5   7/18/2017 at 00:18 (2,473 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

But there were some problems of course. Some I've taken care of and some I'm still going to need to figure out.

First, the timer was shot so with help from Eddy I had it rebuilt and just reinstalled it. Thanks again Eddy!

Second, the panel light switch was one of those starter-less switches that had broken and so I replaced it. Couldn't find one with a white plastic button like the original so I had to use one with a metal one.

Also, the lens on the indicator light for the warming drawer was broken so replaced it with a NOS one.


Post# 948744 , Reply# 6   7/18/2017 at 07:41 (2,472 days old) by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

Wow James, that is the Cadillac of Moffat ranges for sure (or perhaps I should say the Meteor... LOL)  

 

I've seen Moffats of this era with the extra wide and high lighted back panel, the 'grillevator' and the temperature probe but never with a deep-well cooker.  Maybe it was a special model, just for the Ottawa market... LOL  

 

Two things that really brought back the memories - the Con-Rad elements and the broiler heat adjustment.  A friend of mine's mother still has (I think) a model similar to this, but sans the deep well cooker.  If I remember that family's legends correctly, their Moffat was acquired used from a family member (along with an Inglis Centennial dishwasher!!) in the Ottawa area where they lived at the time in '67 or '68. 

 

Congratulations and happy cooking!! 

 

 


Post# 948745 , Reply# 7   7/18/2017 at 07:45 (2,472 days old) by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

Oh, and perhaps the handle from one of those generic barbecue rotisseries may fit the spit rod.  Those show up at garage sales and thrift stores a lot!


Post# 948889 , Reply# 8   7/18/2017 at 23:52 (2,472 days old) by petek (Ontari ari ari O )        

petek's profile picture

Tres deluxe and it ought to be for that price back then.  Growing up we had a 50's Moffat double wide (left side warming oven only) which my mom, although not a big cook, loved. I've seen variations on it with different burner placements and I think a deep well option.  They pop up occasionally on sale sites and twice now in the past 10 years at Habitat for Humanity. Built like tanks.  Dad has a bit of prob getting replacement parts in the late  80's pre internet days.  After dad died in 94 and she was having her kitchen redone she reluctantly got rid of it figuring since they don't make them anymore really, if she had to buy a new stove eventually  she didn't want a big gap where it stood and so bought a standard size stove with the cabinets redone to fit that.  


Post# 948953 , Reply# 9   7/19/2017 at 14:09 (2,471 days old) by kevin313 (Detroit, Michigan)        

kevin313's profile picture
Not real familiar with Canadian ranges, but this one is a real beauty!! Hope you enjoy many wonderful meals on your Moffat range!!!

Post# 1008976 , Reply# 10   9/29/2018 at 11:55 (2,034 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

So I finally got this one hooked up after sitting in the garage for almost 2 years. 3 of the 4 elements appear to work, the element in the warming drawer is functional, the probe works (although the conduit is broken near the plug), oven bakes/broils, etc.

The 4th element is the deep well / thermo-guard (automatic burner). It will power up but it stays on Hi and doesn't kick out when the temperature is reached. The burner light stays on constantly too so something is open.

Appears this automatic burner setup is the same one used on Frigidaire ranges, a Robertshaw model. I took apart the sensor last night at the burner end and it appears the little spring is connected between the sensor surface and the wire/tube. My suspicion therefore is the switch.

I've attached some pics - has anyone ever tried to repair one of these? I took the switch apart and sanded the little round contacts but no dice.

Thanks guys!


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 1008997 , Reply# 11   9/29/2018 at 14:53 (2,034 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Robertshaw Hydraulic Automatic Top Element control

combo52's profile picture
There were a lot of these controls used in the US from 1955-around 1975.

Usually when the heat won't cut down the sensor has lost its Freon charge, it may have a broken capillary or leak in the sensor head or bellows in the control switch. I have never tried to repair one of these controls when it failed in this manor, but I guess anything is possible.

If the indicator light is on all the time the control has a closed contact, nothing is open.


Post# 1009039 , Reply# 12   9/29/2018 at 21:51 (2,034 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

LOL yes, just re-read that, a closed contact, not an open one!

Don't know much about stove/oven controls so didn't realize they were charged with freon. If that's the case then definitely repair is out of scope.

John do you have any of these kicking around for sale? Can't locate anything on ebay but I suppose they could be under a variety of PN's if many different manufacturers used them.


Post# 1009973 , Reply# 13   10/6/2018 at 23:39 (2,027 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        
Fixed!

So I thought, nothing to lose by taking apart the automatic top element control - it didn't work anyway. The tricky thing with these is the sensor and control are permanently connected so it can't easily be removed from the stove.

As I mentioned, there were two things happening with the control: the sensor was not shutting off the heat when the pan reached temperature and the indicator light was on even if the element was turned off.

Turned out the problems were related.

I found continuity between L1 & 4 (the pilot light) when the control was turned off. This was why the light wasn't going off. I took the back off and didn't see anything obviously wrong so I moved on to trying to figure out the reason for the constant high heat.

There is a small actuator at the switch end of the thermostat line. This moves backwards and forwards with changes in temperature from the sensor in the burner. This movement mechanically opens and closes the contacts inside the switch to turn the heat off and on to maintain the temperature. I found the actuator was gummed up and stuck in its shaft, unable to move the contacts open to shut off the burner when the target setting was reached. I cleaned it up and gave it a tiny squirt of WD40 and got it moving again. The spring that pushes the contacts open when the switch is shut off was also stuck - hence why the pilot light was always on.

Once both were unstuck and free to move again, the control had to be recalibrated. This was actually the most difficult and time consuming part of the repair as the adjustment has to be very precise to make the controls work properly and it has to be adjusted in two separate spots.

Once I got the hang of the calibration I put everything back and tested it out and SUCCESS!!!

I'm really happy about this as its a really great feature and was going to be next to impossible to find a replacement.


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 1010000 , Reply# 14   10/7/2018 at 08:28 (2,026 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Good News

combo52's profile picture

That you were able to save this control, these were well designed and built controls and I have had good luck with several of them.

 

I added two to the front elements of my 1974 TD five burner drop in range and within a few years had problems with both, it is on my long to do list to fix these controls. James your success with yours encourages me to try fixing mine, I also bought up about a dozen NOS controls if mine can't be fixed.

 

John L.


Post# 1010010 , Reply# 15   10/7/2018 at 10:59 (2,026 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

Yes they seem to be very well built controls and I was surprised that it was such a simple and effective design when I opened it up. They really seemed to be designed to be a serviceable part so give it a go John!

Were Robertshaw and GE the only ones that built an automatic element control or did other manufacturers also build their own? From what I've read it looks like Frigidaire used the Robertshaw, I'm wondering who else? I'd like to find one spare control like this in case mine ever can't be repaired.




Post# 1010011 , Reply# 16   10/7/2018 at 11:24 (2,026 days old) by appnut (TX)        

appnut's profile picture

James, congratulations!!!  I'm very impressed!!!  Such a beautiful range and fully featured!!


Post# 1010063 , Reply# 17   10/8/2018 at 01:09 (2,026 days old) by Supersuds (Knoxville, Tenn.)        

supersuds's profile picture
Yes, congrats on fixing it!

Our family had a Philco-Ford range that used the Robertshaw unit. I seem to remember Mr. Controls, the Robertshaw mascot, stamped into the center button, or whatever you call it. The other burners just said Philco.


Post# 1010074 , Reply# 18   10/8/2018 at 07:28 (2,025 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
The Little Man In The Middle Of The Sensor

combo52's profile picture

Was Robbie Rheostat, Robertshaw had a factory in western Pennsylvania around Johnson Pa where these controls were made. 

 

There was a sign that you could see from the Pennsylvania Turnpike as you drove by of Robbie Rheostat, does any one else remember this sign ?

 

John L.


Post# 1010174 , Reply# 19   10/9/2018 at 00:01 (2,025 days old) by Supersuds (Knoxville, Tenn.)        

supersuds's profile picture
Nope, he was Mr. Controls.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 1010186 , Reply# 20   10/9/2018 at 07:20 (2,024 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Mr Controls

combo52's profile picture

Hi John, thanks for the documentation on our little friend from Robertshaw.

 

I would have sworn that his name was Robby Rheostat, I will have to do some digging to see if his name was changed at some time, but I could certainly be mistaken, [ it has actually happened before ] LOL

 

John L.


Post# 1010224 , Reply# 21   10/9/2018 at 19:27 (2,024 days old) by Moparwash (Pittsburgh,PA )        

moparwash's profile picture
I remember that building and the neon sign of Mr Controls near the New Stanton turnpike exit from many turnpike trips I remember from the 70's...the building is now occupied by Westinghouse



This post was last edited 10/09/2018 at 19:51
Post# 1010255 , Reply# 22   10/9/2018 at 23:29 (2,024 days old) by Supersuds (Knoxville, Tenn.)        

supersuds's profile picture
Robbie Rheostat would have been a great name. My father, grandfather, and an uncle worked for Robertshaw or a predecessor and we had Mr. Controls-branded promotional stuff all over the house. There were even some playing cards at one point.

Post# 1012426 , Reply# 23   10/29/2018 at 02:11 (2,005 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        
Oven Calibration

Thanks for all the feedback guys! I've been using this range for the past few weeks to run it through its paces and it bakes and cooks like a dream!

Have a question on the operation of the oven thermostat.

The oven appears to run a bit hot - I think. It does have a preheat cycle but I get the same result whether it is used or not so I don't think that has anything to do with it.

During preheat, the bake element will cycle off almost right at the temperature setting however the residual heat from the element as it shuts down pushes the heat about 10-15 degrees warmer.

Similarly, the oven cycles back on right about at the temperature setting. As such it seems to maintain a temperature between 10-20 degrees higher.

Should the thermostat be functioning in this way? For instance, if you set the oven to 350 should the element cycle off right at 350 or should it be somewhere between 335-340? Similarly, should it cycle back on right at 350 or should it be at a point below the set temperature?

I understand it would be impossible for the thermostat to maintain the temperature at the exact setting but what is considered an acceptable range? Using the 350 example would it be something like 340-360 or less precise than that? Or is 350 really just the cycle off/cycle on temperature?

There is an adjustment underneath the knob on the switch but it appears to be 3/4 of the way fully adjusted so I haven't touched it yet. I did check the sensor and made sure it wasn't touching the wall of the oven.

In terms of my test equipment, I'm using one of those $5 oven thermometers. I'm assuming there is also a margin of error in these but I'm not sure how much.


Post# 1012476 , Reply# 24   10/29/2018 at 14:53 (2,004 days old) by fisherpaykel (BC Canada)        

There is always going to be some overshoot in the temperature, I think your numbers are quite good. My current use stove has 15-20 degree overshoot. Did you run this test empty? Maybe with a food load the effective average temperature at the food perimeter will be closer to set temp. Also did you test say 30 minutes later when all parts of oven should have a stable heat loss? If so you might try to adjust thermostat to turn on at say 340 so the 10 degree +  or - is equal around your set temp. Enjoy your quality built vintage Moffat.


Post# 1012502 , Reply# 25   10/29/2018 at 18:38 (2,004 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Oven Temperature

combo52's profile picture
I would leave the calibration alone, Thermador always instructed us to set their ovens exactly the way yours is running. They said to never let the temperature go below the set point, that way the customer had an oven that cooked on the FAST side of what recipes call for the cooking times.

Likewise I am sure that you can get used to your great Moffat vintage range cooking everything on the faster side.

John L.


Post# 1012532 , Reply# 26   10/29/2018 at 22:40 (2,004 days old) by 114jwh (Vancouver)        

Thank you gentleman - that makes perfect sense. Yes I've monitored it both empty and with food and observe similar results. Appears the oven is very well insulated as it maintains some pretty good heat for sometime after it is shut down. I've used it for loaves of bread, buns, pie, a cake and a roast and it baked wonderfully so I'm going to leave well enough alone. Thanks again guys!


Forum Index:       Other Forums:                      



Comes to the Rescue!

The Discuss-o-Mat has stopped, buzzer is sounding!!!
If you would like to reply to this thread please log-in...

Discuss-O-MAT Log-In



New Members
Click Here To Sign Up.



                     


automaticwasher.org home
Discuss-o-Mat Forums
Vintage Brochures, Service and Owners Manuals
Fun Vintage Washer Ephemera
See It Wash!
Video Downloads
Audio Downloads
Picture of the Day
Patent of the Day
Photos of our Collections
The Old Aberdeen Farm
Vintage Service Manuals
Vintage washer/dryer/dishwasher to sell?
Technical/service questions?
Looking for Parts?
Website related questions?
Digital Millennium Copyright Act Policy
Our Privacy Policy