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Thread Number: 78108
/ Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
New Miele W1 Little Giants |
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| Post# 1021225 1/14/2019 at 23:53 (1,925 days old) by mielerod69 (Australia) | ||
Here is the first pic of the new Miele Little Giants based on the W1 series domestic range. The model shown has touch screen controls. There are three new models ranging from 6 kg to 8 kg capacity. Wash times around 49 minutes. There are two dryer models, a vented one which dries a load in 38 minutes and a heat-pump which can dry a load in under an hour.
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| Post# 1021248 , Reply# 1 1/15/2019 at 10:26 (1,924 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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Debut date? And no don’t lose that button . I wonder when can we expect them in the US? Shame that they removed the mechanical orange start button , it’s a signature Miele identity . | ||
Post# 1021252 , Reply# 2 1/15/2019 at 10:45 (1,924 days old) by logixx  (Germany) |
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Post# 1021253 , Reply# 3 1/15/2019 at 11:06 (1,924 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK) |
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Yellow button | ||
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Post# 1021256 , Reply# 4 1/15/2019 at 12:26 (1,924 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany)) |
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Miele did away with a door open button day one with the W1 series. Launchdate for Germany is sometime in April. 2 lines: Performance and Performance plus, 7kg vs 6,7 or 8kg and connectivity. | ||
| Post# 1021263 , Reply# 5 1/15/2019 at 14:48 (1,924 days old) by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod) | ||
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| Post# 1021266 , Reply# 6 1/15/2019 at 15:13 (1,924 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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Is touch screen gonna be so much better now ? What’s the difference between performance and performance plus ? Any new internal changes or is it just vanity ? | ||
| Post# 1021283 , Reply# 7 1/15/2019 at 17:43 (1,924 days old) by SGT10 (California ) | ||
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I can’t imagine the Little Giants getting any better so I hope they don’t change them too much. When we see that they are “based upon the W1,” I wonder what that means. The Little Giants seem better than the W1s, at least IMO | ||
| Post# 1021312 , Reply# 8 1/15/2019 at 22:01 (1,924 days old) by moon1234 (Wisconsin) | ||
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Is there a PDF somewhere or some place we can "read more about it"? | ||
| Post# 1021456 , Reply# 9 1/16/2019 at 21:04 (1,923 days old) by richnz (New Zealand) | ||
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Thanks to the mielelovers website Someone with much sharper eyes shared a photo on Instagram which shows such machines. That photo is from September 2018 (from ifa) It shows touchscreen machines and ones with a knob. Wonder what else about these machines is floating on the internet | ||
| Post# 1021477 , Reply# 11 1/17/2019 at 02:05 (1,923 days old) by richnz (New Zealand) | ||
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Are those them behind the man? | ||
| Post# 1021547 , Reply# 12 1/18/2019 at 00:12 (1,922 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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So they do have knobs and buttons? How different is performance plus vs performance? It’s odd that no other companies will create an equivalent version to compete against Miele’s Little Giants. | ||
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Post# 1021556 , Reply# 13 1/18/2019 at 06:29 (1,921 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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If you're speaking of North American market
Likely no one will take on Miele's Little Giant washers at least for the electrical power requirements. As Miele itself learned when they finally gave in and began producing 120v washers for sale here, Americans just aren't going to spend the money for rewiring when they can get a perfectly good washer that doesn't require.
Miele can spread production costs of their Little Giants across a world wide market. So even if there are only small number of sales in North American everything balances out. | ||
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Post# 1021692 , Reply# 15 1/19/2019 at 12:06 (1,920 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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USA/North America Might Be Miele's Largest Market
Outside of Germany, but they remain a relatively small player in the appliance market here.
Electrolux, Whirlpool, and lately LG sell far more laundry appliances than Miele. Miele USA lacks a serious nationwide service network for a start. Meaning if you live far from (or in some cases even relatively near) a major urban area like NYC, LA, SF, Boston, etc... you can be waiting a very long time for a call out. Worse if the technician does not have the part(s) required he must send to Princeton, NJ. Heaven help if part isn't in stock there either as it must come from Germany. Miele has steadfastly refused to open production plants in USA. LG, Bosch, Electrolux and of course Whirlpool all have manufacturing in USA. Now that White Swan owns GE who knows where that will lead. | ||
| Post# 1021716 , Reply# 17 1/19/2019 at 15:55 (1,920 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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The little giant washer design The design is so appealing . It has the performance credentials to match it . Washers are one of the few appliances I can take with me if I move . What does the new Electrolux look like ? | ||
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Post# 1021717 , Reply# 18 1/19/2019 at 16:14 (1,920 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Back when front loading "compact" washers pretty much were only Miele, Bosch, and Creda things were different. Unless willing to go with a Westinghouse, you had to deal with one of the named three.
However things have changed and North Americans have vastly more choices for H-axis washers. Miele has been stubbornly slow in adapting IMHO, and that cost them market share. It wasn't until just a few years ago they finally realized 208v-240v service is *NOT* as widely distributed and or can be accessed as Miele hoped and or thought. Persons being asked to pay over one thousand for a washing machine often balked at paying an equal sum (or more) to put in the required wiring where it didn't exist. While Miele appliances are wonderful when they are running, again heaven help you when they don't. Initial contact with Miele's customer service here seems to espouse all the not so nice traits persons attribute to Germans. What did you do to the machine? No, it can't be doing *that*, you are doing something wrong...." When a repair person finally does confirm the thing *is* doing what you said it was (after a wait of two or more weeks for a call out), you'll likely be told another appointment must be made to fix the appliance. This can be again two or more weeks away. Meanwhile you've spend huge sums for an appliance that is sitting broken. It's like buying a BMW or Mercedes then having to deal with the thing being laid up in repair shop more than on road. Unlike say Europe where spares can be had from many sources, for North America Miele insists on keeping everything under their control. You basically can only get Miele parts by either going through them (MieleUSA), or trying your luck shopping in Europe by internet or whatever. Because Miele won't supply parts and other things required for "non authorized" service men to work on their machines, few want the hassle and bother. Though IIRC Miele recently opened a service center here in NYC, but don't know if they are part of that company or independent. | ||
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Post# 1021719 , Reply# 19 1/19/2019 at 16:19 (1,920 days old) by SudsMaster (SF Bay Area, California) |
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I'm not so sure the "electrical requirements" of a Miele washer is all that important.
That's because Miele sells a setup where both the washer and dryer can run on a single 220 volt split phase American dryer outlet. Electric dryers seem to account for 50% or more of American home installations, after all. More likely it's the smaller capacity of the traditional Miele that turns off some buyers - as well as the significantly higher price. As for Electrolux, I like very much their front loaders, but they have poor market penetration in part due to the fact that they can be quite hard to locate in shops here. I like their washer because it seems to be the only front loading washer on the market with a reversible door. (I have a tight laundry closet where the washer must go to the right of the dryer). Their build quality seems OK to me, above average for washers for the American home market. | ||
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Post# 1021723 , Reply# 20 1/19/2019 at 16:39 (1,920 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Was referring to the 208v-240v connection in general
Not every home has such electrical service in their laundry area, especially when it came to urban settings where it meant apartments.
Miele lost many sales here in NYC because even residents of our very best white glove buildings found their requests to upgrade electrical service denied. Or course if one owns one's own home as in a house or something besides multifamily that is something else. Often what it came down to is that due to age of housing stock it wasn't just a matter of upgrading a meter. But replacing a fuse box *with* a meter and pulling up wiring to handle the increased loads from basement panel. This was if things could be supported without having local utility run a new line from street to panel. We've had this discussion previously; you have multifamily housing here where units barely have 100 amp service. That and there hasn't been any significant upgrading of electrical service since building went up ranging from early part of last century to the 1960's. Salesmen at local Miele dealers would tell of deals they thought were done, only to have customers either return the Mieles for something else, or cancel entirely because of issues getting proper electrical service installed. | ||
| Post# 1021728 , Reply# 21 1/19/2019 at 18:10 (1,920 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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208v -240 v setup for washer This setup should essential for washers. I know it’s expensive but It keeps whites whiter , hygienic , and many other clothes cleaner . Most of clothes I keep for a long time | ||
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Post# 1021781 , Reply# 22 1/20/2019 at 00:42 (1,920 days old) by SudsMaster (SF Bay Area, California) |
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Post# 1021878 , Reply# 25 1/20/2019 at 18:16 (1,919 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Whatever reasons Miele and others give in their marketing materials and elsewhere about benefits of "Honeycomb" drum and or smaller holes leave us have no delusions. One large (if not main) purpose is that those smaller holes keep more water inside main basket as opposed to between. It is about close to solid tub washers of old as they are going to get.
OTOH in commercial laundries you have "sluice" washing machines where inner basket has large (or decent sized) holes in order to allow solids, muck, vomit and other debris to freely exit and flush down drains. In fact even on commercial washers of old (and maybe modern for all one knows) you don't find any of this pin sized holes in drum nonsense. It is just unsanitary. This is why you can load say the Braun machine shown here with poopy diapers and or other laundry contaminated with solids and have things come out hygienically clean. | ||
| Post# 1021890 , Reply# 26 1/20/2019 at 20:09 (1,919 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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Small holes to reduce frailling of the fabrics I think at one time miele’s marketing team claimed that the honeycomb drum reduces the frailling of the fabrics. | ||
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Post# 1021897 , Reply# 27 1/20/2019 at 22:14 (1,919 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Small holes to reduce frailling of the fabrics
Well they would say that wouldn't they?
When you have cycles that go on for 1.5, 2 or more hours yes, am sure some sort of mitigation against textile damage must be instigated. OTOH commercial washers (and some old domestics) can crank out full loads ranging from eleven pounds (domestic) to several hundred (commercial) in anywhere from just less than one hour to in about 35 minutes. The latter is mostly commercial machines however. It all comes down to the wash "pie" for optimal results; chemicals, time, mechanical action and water used. Any decrease in one results in a required increase in others to compensate. So these "honeycomb" washers use less water, fair enough I suppose. But they still have to get things clean. So cycle time is increased which again means beating washing about for long periods of time. | ||
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Post# 1021905 , Reply# 28 1/21/2019 at 01:05 (1,919 days old) by SudsMaster (SF Bay Area, California) |
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It doesn't make sense to me that the honeycomb drum would retain more water than a more perforated drum. That's because the water is introduced from outside the drum, and gets into the drum through the holes.
Or am I missing something? Also, poopy diapers aside, the place where most larger debris is removed from fabrics is in the dryer, not in the washer. And poopy diapers are supposed to be flushed out prior to loading in the washer anyway. I remember my mom dunking them in the toilet and sticking them back into a wet pail for the journey down to the Bendix front loader in the basement. | ||
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Post# 1021909 , Reply# 29 1/21/2019 at 01:58 (1,919 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Patent for Miele's honeycomb drum: patents.google.com/patent/US2009...
If by "larger debris" you mean hair or whatever, maybe so for residential settings. OTOH for commercial/industrial laundries things are different. First and foremost not every wash load will go to the dryers for "larger debris" removal. It would also be questionably hygienic not to mention visually repulsive to have bits of vomit, faeces and other matter "dried" onto fabrics and or contaminate that machine as residue. Have read online reviews of laundromats where customers found dried bits of faeces in tumble dryers before putting their freshly washed laundry. Needless to say it put them right off and while having to get the job done, obviously chose another machine. What someone choses to do in their own home in regards to soiled linen obviously is influenced by many factors. OTOH if you think a commercial/industrial laundry is going to manually sluice/pre-rinse scores if not hundreds of pounds of washing per hour or day; think on. Not even sure various local, federal, union or accrediting bodies allow such a thing. Before Chux, disposable diapers and other such things came along hospitals, nursing homes and other facilities dealt with far more fouled laundry because diapers and draw cloths were washed and reused. This on top of soiled patient gowns, bed and bath linen. Linen from infectious wards/rooms, OR and so forth is what it is. www.laundryserv.co.uk/blog/posts/... | ||
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Post# 1021916 , Reply# 32 1/21/2019 at 04:48 (1,919 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Ideally since arrival of extractors
Things should come out of a (commercial) washer (or extractor if separate machine) dry enough to go straight to ironers if that is their ultimate destination. Remember the process of ironing does dry materials, it just depends upon how damp they are for a start.
Now there has been and still is a debate among "laundrymen" about the value of pre-conditioning flatwork and other goods to be sent to ironers by sending them through dryers first. Some of this is because a dryer will break apart and otherwise fluff and loosen what can be a hard mass of extracted laundry. In old days they had (or still do for all I know) workers called "shakers" who took flatwork and other wash from machines and shook, unfolded and otherwise separated the mass which came out of washers/extractors. Another way of dealing with this was with a machine called a "tumbler" which did just that, but didn't dry. There is considerable energy and time savings to be gained if wash can go directly from extractor (or washer) to ironer. But only if goods are evenly moist enough for proper ironing that the machine doesn't have to run slowly to evaporate excessive water. With nearly fully automated laundries built around continuous batch washers (tunnel washers) you tend to see even linen going to be ironed sent to dryers first. Again this is because the extractor of tunnel washer doesn't leave things dry enough for fast ironing, and they emerge in a flat mass pancake. Here from Kannegiesser (at about 5:40) you can see again linens coming from dryer and sent to an automated ironing/folding. Same in Spain: Couldn't find examples in video, so links to print will have to suffice. cgilaundry.com/commercial-rental... From below you see what one has been saying; the dryers are used more to "pre-condition" the linen (breaking apart the hard mass that comes from washer/extractor) then fully drying. www.laundryandcleaningnews.com/fe... | ||
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Post# 1021926 , Reply# 33 1/21/2019 at 08:16 (1,918 days old) by SudsMaster (SF Bay Area, California) |
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Post# 1021931 , Reply# 34 1/21/2019 at 08:46 (1,918 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany)) |
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The little giants were always ment as a broad band solution. You will find these over here anywhere from doctor offices to laundromats to multi housing units to commercial laundry setups. Though you'll often find the washers paired with larger dryers the more commercial the setting gets. They are basicly used anytime the amount of laundry you do is "household-sized" but the usage is high. | ||
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Post# 1021938 , Reply# 35 1/21/2019 at 11:42 (1,918 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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"Is the topic of this thread, the new Miele "LIttle Giant" W1 washer, intended primarily for residential or commercial usage?"
Well answer to your query comes from where Miele markets the machines; and that would be as part of their professional series. Best case they are very high grade OPL solutions for domestic users who want something more than what from the residential line. | ||
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Post# 1021952 , Reply# 37 1/21/2019 at 13:34 (1,918 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Over years have seen at least two or three
Little Giant sets on offer (CL) at practically give away prices.
Story was same; people somehow got their mitts on the things, had the required electrical work and whatever else needed for installation..... now are moving house but not taking the units. It largely comes down to the electrical requirements for washer I suppose. If not many Americans bothered with the 208v-240v connection needed for a compact unit, having to double or triple that (not sure) for the Little Giant washer surely wasn't going to fly. For the OPL laundry market and or small dry cleaners/laundries Miele washing machines long have been popular. No American manufacture offers the same build quality, cycle choices and so forth, especially at those price points. If you want something with built in heating then Miele might be the only way to go; unless of course you have a steam line or something. | ||
| Post# 1021979 , Reply# 38 1/21/2019 at 20:08 (1,918 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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Buying at non retail price Finding a little giant washer is hard. I’m in Seattle it this helps . Any tips or experiences? | ||
| Post# 1022077 , Reply# 39 1/22/2019 at 17:01 (1,917 days old) by Moon1234 (Wisconsin) | ||
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Just call Miele directly in Princeton, NJ and ask to speak to sales. They will sell directly to you on any little giant model. They usually discount some to offset the cost of shipping. If they don’t then ask for a discount. Worst they can say is no. | ||
| Post# 1022122 , Reply# 40 1/22/2019 at 23:59 (1,917 days old) by FreshNclean (WA) | ||
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W1 over the little giants Moon1234, With 14 people household , that’s a lot of laundry . Why was the w1purchased over the little giant ? | ||
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Post# 1022434 , Reply# 42 1/25/2019 at 14:07 (1,914 days old) by logixx (Germany) |
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Press release | ||
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