Thread Number: 78287
/ Tag: Other Home Products or Autos
Party Line Telephone Service - Tell Me Why |
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Post# 1023116   1/31/2019 at 01:41 (1,884 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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What gave with sharing a telephone line with your neighbors or half the town. Couldn't people afford their own private lines?
Just got finished watching an episode of Alfred Hitchcock presents where the plot revolves around a party line (gossip, busybodies, murder....), and don't see why anyone would put up with such a thing. Or maybe am missing something. |
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Post# 1023117 , Reply# 1   1/31/2019 at 02:01 (1,884 days old) by ea56 (Cotati, Calif.)   |   | |
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In rural areas there weren’t sufficient lines to accommodate private lines for everybody that wanted one, no matter how much you were prepared to pay. That was the situation for my family in the 60’s when we moved to the country. We had five on our party line, and I can assure you that my Mom would have gladly paid extra for a private line, she LOVED talking on the phone, and that five party line really hampered her.
Now, when I got my first telephone in 1971, it was a matter of economics, a two party line was I believe $2.65 per mo, a private line was $5.35. When I was netting about $40 to $50 per week, even that small amount made a difference. Eddie |
Post# 1023118 , Reply# 2   1/31/2019 at 03:16 (1,884 days old) by MattL (Flushing, MI)   |   | |
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Exactly. Shortage of lines was probably a bigger reason than cost. We had a party line when I was young because that is all there was, after a few years it was private but they had to build a new switching station to accommodate all the lines. |
Post# 1023151 , Reply# 5   1/31/2019 at 10:04 (1,883 days old) by ea56 (Cotati, Calif.)   |   | |
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you wanted to?
Well, everyone had their own ring. Ours was 1 long and 1 short, the other rings on our party line were 1 long, 1 long and 2 shorts, 2 longs and 1 long, 1 short 1 long. So, you had to pay attention to the rings to know if the call was for your line. We had two phones, a beige wall phone in the kitchen and an ivory Princess in Mom’s bedroom, both had dials, but they were disabled. To place any call, you lifted the receiver and the operator came on the line. You announced you number (ours was Russian Gulch #3) and requested the number you wished to call. If the number was on your party line, you hung up and listened for the rings, and when they stopped, you knew your party was on the line and you picked up the receiver and commenced your call. The worst part of this set up for us was that one of the neighbors had a business doing towing and heavy equipment work, and their 1 long and 2 shorts ring sometimes rang round the clock when the weather was bad. Coming from the San Francisco Bay Area in 1963 this was a culture shock, but we soon adjusted to it just fine. Eddie |
Post# 1023157 , Reply# 7   1/31/2019 at 10:17 (1,883 days old) by jamiel (Detroit, Michigan and Palm Springs, CA)   |   | |
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Post# 1023166 , Reply# 8   1/31/2019 at 11:47 (1,883 days old) by turquoisedude (.)   |   | |
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Party lines were still around up here for many years, but mostly in rural areas where 'modern' switching equipment wasn't available and Ma Bell decided it wasn't worth investing in. Odd phenomenon - in some communities, Bell turned their back on offering basic phone services because they didn't make enough profit, so Co-Operative telephone companies popped up. At our first country house in the Eastern Townships, our phone service was offered by such a co-op. The downside was that party lines were the rule, not the exception. Not surprisingly when Bell was partially dismantled back in the 1990s, the co-ops went into high gear to offer updated phone services as well as internet services and cable TV - all at prices that beat the tar out of Bell!!
And believe it or not, when Chris and I bought a country getaway house in 1995, we still had the option of having a party line as our phone service. We took it - we were the only ones on the line anyway and it cost about 1/4 of what Bell wanted for a single-line service. They were on our case for YEARS trying to get us to switch. Sadly, we moved... LOL |
Post# 1023171 , Reply# 10   1/31/2019 at 12:56 (1,883 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1023172 , Reply# 11   1/31/2019 at 12:59 (1,883 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1023175 , Reply# 12   1/31/2019 at 13:07 (1,883 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)   |   | |
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TurquoiseDude: Odd phenomenon - in some communities, Bell turned their back on offering basic phone services because they didn't make enough profit,Not at all odd. Profit is the driving force for Bell, AT&T, XYZ, whatever is their nomer this week. One of my aunts/uncles had a party line on their rural road/area for some years (they married in 1969). I recall we'd be visiting, the phone would ring, they'd listen for a moment ... "That's not ours." |
Post# 1023176 , Reply# 13   1/31/2019 at 13:14 (1,883 days old) by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor, Maine)   |   | |
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Post# 1023187 , Reply# 14   1/31/2019 at 15:54 (1,883 days old) by IowaBear (Cedar Rapids, IA)   |   | |
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Post# 1023189 , Reply# 15   1/31/2019 at 15:55 (1,883 days old) by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)   |   | |
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Post# 1023194 , Reply# 16   1/31/2019 at 16:35 (1,883 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)   |   | |
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Residential telephone lines in any format have never been a profitable sector for providers of switched network/local exchange services. Local exchange carriers were mandated to offer residential service, but relied on measured rate business lines and Long Distance charges for compensatory revenue.
The Bell System break-up and subsequent systematic stripping away of regulations for local exchange services have resulted in monthly rates seven or eight times higher than they were 25 years ago. The telcos have always been provided a guaranteed rate of return for such services, and as a result of deregulation and the telcos' collective push to abandon copper service entirely, they have been allowed to raise their rates. Even though nothing has changed with residential service for about twenty years or so, the rates have gone up to compensate for the negative return on investment. In the past, most PUCs wouldn't have allowed this, but regulatory power over the telcos these days is negligible compared to what it used to be. |
Post# 1023197 , Reply# 17   1/31/2019 at 17:01 (1,883 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Well it seems if one had been around back then would have been spared the indignity (*LOL*) of party line service. By 1930 NYC didn't have them, so that would have been me sorted.
techchannel.att.com/play-video.cf... If am understanding this correctly, parts of PA had party lines right up until the 2000's. That's hard to credit. articles.mcall.com/2000-06-27/bus... |
Post# 1023218 , Reply# 19   1/31/2019 at 19:38 (1,883 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)   |   | |
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Yes, ringer wiring in the guts of the telephone was different for party lines as opposed to private lines. Among collectors of vintage telephones, there have been many requests on collector sites for help to get a found vintage phone to ring due to the instrument having been configured for party line service.
When we moved into a new house (to us -- it was built in 1927) in 1960, we discovered that we were on a party line. I was six and not using the phone much yet, but my dad had no patience for whatever woman was constantly using the line (I remember him yelling at her) and switched our service to a private line post haste. I presume the switch involved a technician visit to reconfigure the ringer wiring in our telephone. I was probably at school that day. |
Post# 1023234 , Reply# 21   1/31/2019 at 21:19 (1,883 days old) by cadman (Cedar Falls, IA)   |   | |
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I'm not sure when frequency ringers came into their own. I know it was an option on the early 500 sets, but to hear family talk about their party lines in the 50's/60's, it was still ring-pattern based.
When my grandparents built their retirement home in rural MN and moved in around '80, they were on a party line with a separate ringer wire. They had that phone plan for years but never did hear another party on the line. Kept their rotary until the 90's, too, as the Touch-Tone plan cost extra! |
Post# 1023242 , Reply# 23   1/31/2019 at 22:36 (1,883 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)   |   | |
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Even though NYC was still enjoying its long gone status as the center of the universe back in the olden days (including that of AT&T), it's still amazing to me that party lines were gone by 1930. I doubt this was so in the immediate suburban exchanges.
Many parts of the country were lucky to have any telephone service available at all in 1930. As has always been the case, Ma Bell was following the money and shunning areas that weren't going to provide an immediate return on investment. Thank goodness for government regulations that changed all of that, albeit at a snail's pace.
These days, the situation is repeating itself with telcos not being under any obligation to provide high speed internet service to rural areas if it's not worth their trouble.
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Post# 1023250 , Reply# 24   2/1/2019 at 00:42 (1,883 days old) by sarahperdue (Alabama)   |   | |
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My grandparents had a party line until the late 1970s in an Alabama town so small our entering and leaving signs are on opposite sides of the same post. Operator assisted long distance calls were the norm into the 80s. The advent of one plus dialing was a big deal. (and being rural, just about everybody was long distance--I get that whole "you can see your neighbor wave but it's a long distance call thing.")
I now own their home and have the same phone number. I'd say it's been the same since 1938, but I know it changed with the advent of 7 digit dialing. I had to call Triple A for service this afternoon... I'm not sure what map the dispatcher was looking at when she asked if I was between Rodeo Drive and the post office. "M'am, we lost our post office and zip code in 1976..." (and we don't have any drives...they're all roads and only a few of them are paved.) Both of our homes have POTS--plain old (hardwired, copper line) telephone service. Telcos are trying to phase out POTS and often use bundled services and deals to bait and switch users to digital or VoIP. A friend designs 911 systems, and he told me several years ago that current POTS line subscribers were protected by law--at least for now. Our landline in our primary home is also POTS, but AT&T switched us without fully disclosing what they were doing as part of an internet upgrade. We figured out what they'd done when the tornadoes hit us (Tuscaloosa Alabama) in 2011, and our phone wouldn't work. We had to fight to get the POTS line back. Maybe it's the country girl in me, but I still want to be hardwired, and I want my phone to work when the power is out... Interestingly, the power line is still strung on poles to the country house, but the telephone line has been buried for decades. Sarah |
Post# 1023333 , Reply# 25   2/1/2019 at 21:11 (1,882 days old) by petek (Ontari ari ari O )   |   | |
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We had a two party line growing up until about 1965. The "party" was my aunt and uncle next door which worked out perfectly because mom could call my aunt by dialling 1191 instead of their full number Di4-0596 (still remember it). As well because my grandma and great aunt who both lived 100 miles away could call mom or my aunt and one of us kids would run next door to tell our moms to pick up the phone and they could have a 3 way call without paying for it.
Party lines still exist here with Bell but you cannot sign up for one any longer My friend still has his but his "party" he figures has long ago either died or got rid of hers. I don't think Bell can discontinue it as much as they'd like to . |
Post# 1023336 , Reply# 26   2/1/2019 at 22:19 (1,882 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)   |   | |
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I recall my mother talking about her mom having a party line into the 70's. She lived in a little spot on the map town 10 miles from us. We all had the same telephone company though...Loretto Telephone Company. Lawrenceburg and Summertown had Bell Telephone. Lawrenceburg was local but Summertown was long distance...and it was only a 30 mile drive within the same county. |
Post# 1023359 , Reply# 27   2/2/2019 at 08:28 (1,881 days old) by polkanut (Wausau, WI )   |   | |
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My parents were on a party line until the mid '80's. At the time I had a clock radio with a phone that was set up for a private line only. When the phone in my bedroom would ring my sisters and I would pick up and eavesdrop until Mom or Dad caught us. I still remember the name of the lady on our line, Viola Hansen. She was the neighborhood gossip so it was great to be able to get one over on her once in awhile. |
Post# 1023360 , Reply# 28   2/2/2019 at 08:31 (1,881 days old) by jamiel (Detroit, Michigan and Palm Springs, CA)   |   | |
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Post# 1023475 , Reply# 34   2/3/2019 at 10:35 (1,880 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)   |   | |
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my aunt in Long Island, NY had a party line for years until she sold her house in 1987...she always called Mom after midnight, supposedly the rates were lower, and less chance anyone needing the phone....
also while visiting a friends winter home in Rutland, Vermont in 1990....mainly this was used in the winter season near Killington Mountain Ski Resort....was still surprised a party line was in use.... I guess many times it was a matter of cost, and of having a phone service, but not really needing it exclusively I don't recall any special ring tone....never got to use one much, so don't know all the ins and out of having one... someone could pick up and hear your conversation, or you theirs...but was also told, if you picked up while someone was using the line, you didn't hear anything, not even a dial tone, meaning someone was using the line..... I also thought there was an indicator light on the phone, if flashing while ringing, it was for you, a steady light meant the phone was in use by someone else... heck, I was glad we got touch-tone service in the late 70's.....the 7 digit number dialing was bad enough, then tack on the area code....at one point they added the Dial 1 first....and pray you didn't get a busy signal....lol...hang up, and start over! just stuff kids today will never understand, where we were, and to what we have advanced into... |
Post# 1023481 , Reply# 35   2/3/2019 at 11:42 (1,880 days old) by iej (.... )   |   | |
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In a lot of cases, they just added new registers to crossbars which allowed touch tone signalling. They weren't necessarily digital switches. AFAIK touch tone / DTMF was possible since the 60s. |
Post# 1023488 , Reply# 37   2/3/2019 at 13:01 (1,880 days old) by petek (Ontari ari ari O )   |   | |
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As far as I've ever experienced , the two party lines had normal rings and would only ring in the house being called.. The multi party lines was where each house had a distinct ring pattern.. My sister out in the sticks was on one with about 4 others and had their pattern..It became sort of second nature to only "hear" your own ring so she said.
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Post# 1023502 , Reply# 40   2/3/2019 at 14:40 (1,880 days old) by ea56 (Cotati, Calif.)   |   | |
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I was a telephone operator from 1976-78 in the Santa Rosa, Calif. toll office for the 707 area code. This was the same office and switchboard that serviced our 5 party line from 1963 until 1971. When I worked there we still had a few toll stations further north that had multiple party lines like my family had, and we still manually rang thru the party line calls for these numbers from the switchboard, uxing the ring key on the board, there was nothing automated about it at all.
We did get used to listening for our ring, but it was still annoying to have 4 other customers rings in our home round the clock, and we never really got used to that, it was a PITA that we just had to accept in order to have a telephone in the house. Conversely, when I had a two party line in Petaluma, Calif. from 1971-72, only the customer on the party line that was receiving a call could hear their ring in their home. I never heard the phone ring in my home for the other party line customer. Eddie |
Post# 1023503 , Reply# 41   2/3/2019 at 15:15 (1,880 days old) by Iej (.... )   |   | |
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Record some of the last generation of PSTN. It's something that we'll be looking back at in 10 years with huge nostalgia. |
Post# 1023509 , Reply# 42   2/3/2019 at 16:25 (1,880 days old) by fan-of-fans (Florida)   |   | |
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So some places don't have any dial tone when you pick up the receiver? I didn't know that. I've always heard that here. |
Post# 1023513 , Reply# 43   2/3/2019 at 17:35 (1,880 days old) by ea56 (Cotati, Calif.)   |   | |
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On our 5 party line we didn’t have a dial tone, because we couldn’t dial. When you lifted the receiver, you got the sound of a phone ringing, the operator would answer by saying “Operator”, and the caller would identify their number, and the number they wished to call and the operator made the connection from the switchboard, and manually completed the billing information on mark sense cards, like IBM cards. The numbers were filled in with a pencil. Also the time on and off for the calls were recorded by superimposing the face of a clock on the ticket when the call answered and when the caller hung up, with a machine called a Calculiograpgh, just like we did when I was an operator for all operator assisted calls.
Eddie |
Post# 1023605 , Reply# 46   2/4/2019 at 21:57 (1,879 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)   |   | |
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The millennials have really missed out on something. They have no sense of or feeling about the analog world.
Just within the past couple of weeks I activated a rotary phone on my AT&T fiber service and it worked fine, but one thing I noticed was a real throwback to the crossbar days: after dialing the first digit, I heard a brief dial tone. I've read that this used to be an indicator that five digit dialing was an option. I never knew this when we were on a crossbar switch or I would have taken advantage of it. Odd that fiber service, which runs through the U-verse gateway, would provide this archaic indicator. There must be an explanation.
I am loving the stories and tech talk here!
Much as some of us here have our horror stories about working for The Phone Company, it was an amazing operation to be a part of, and I have nothing but respect for the Bell System. |
Post# 1023608 , Reply# 47   2/4/2019 at 23:36 (1,879 days old) by DaveAMKrayoGuy (Oak Park, MI)   |   | |
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I specifically remember our phone book pointedly stating it is a crime to falsify an emergency so you can break through the party line to make a phone call, and probably shouldn't listen in on, either...
Mr. Ed did on one episode, in which Wilbur scolded him for, whereas I had a cousin who knew just about everything about the party line that you all do and are discussing here... (as did the gal who used to live across the street) -- Dave |
Post# 1023610 , Reply# 48   2/5/2019 at 01:35 (1,879 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1023611 , Reply# 49   2/5/2019 at 01:46 (1,879 days old) by Supersuds (Knoxville, Tenn.)   |   | |
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Ralph, what did you do to “activate” your rotary phone with U-verse? Mine doesn’t work and I assumed it was hopeless.
Like jeb’s, our family’s party line didn’t have a special ring and we didn’t know when the other party was getting a call. The other family, an older couple, were not heavy phone users and I don’t recall the party line as being a big annoyance, but my folks did get a private line as soon as South Central Bell made them available in our new neighborhood, about 1971 I think. It required a new phone number, with the 524 exchange rather than the 588 exchange we’d had up to then. The next year’s Yellow Pages accidentally listed our new number as being that of a large Catholic Church, and that made things rather too lively, so we had to change numbers again, this time to the then-new 693 exchange. So, three different exchanges in as many years, for one house. As Jamie said, in Tennessee you could call anywhere in your home county as a local call, I believe. |
Post# 1023612 , Reply# 50   2/5/2019 at 02:42 (1,879 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)   |   | |
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John, I have U-verse TV and internet service along with a land line. TV/internet and land line service are provided by two different divisions of AT&T, and I get two bills (dumb and wasteful on AT&T's part). I was expecting that the land line would be provided over copper, but the day that both the land line and the U-verse were installed, I was advised that the land line would be running on fiber and as a result, it relied on the U-verse fiber gateway box, which is in our basement and runs off of our 120 volt electrical service. I was bummed, but for now I'm leaving things as they are.
I think my post further up mistakenly gave the impression that if you subscribe to U-verse over fiber, you can hook up a phone, but that's not the case (except with VOIP, I guess). You need to have a separate land line service. Per the installer, the land line's fiber delivers dial tone from the switched network just like copper, but it relies on the gateway for its connection. From the gateway, it's plain old category 5 wiring to standard RJ11 jacks inside the house. I'm in the process of adding onto it for more extensions, but it's been cold in our unheated basement so for now it's on hold, so to speak.
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Post# 1023688 , Reply# 52   2/5/2019 at 16:33 (1,878 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)   |   | |
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Yes, I think our CO has been upgraded from the 1A switch it had been on since the early '80s. DMS100 or 5E would have been the likely replacement. POTS over fiber is what I'm on for the land line.
This all started when a friend of mine with U-verse VOIP lost her land line and required a technician visit. She pays extra for inside wiring coverage. She went out to an antiques co-op and bought a rotary phone because she wanted to make sure her cordless phone system wasn't the problem. I scolded her, since I have more spare rotary sets than I know what to do with.
The technician told her that a rotary phone wouldn't work on her service. Thinking U-verse was U-verse regardless of copper or fiber, I hooked up my 1950 WECo model 500 and gave her a call, which completed successfully. I haven't checked with her to see if her rotary phone does or doesn't work. I've heard reports of yes and no from people with VOIP, but it sounds like it depends on the carrier. |