Thread Number: 81225
/ Tag: Detergents and Additives
Interesting Take On Powdered Detergent Market |
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Post# 1052429   11/27/2019 at 04:29 (1,584 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1052431 , Reply# 1   11/27/2019 at 05:46 (1,584 days old) by turbokinetic (Northport, Alabama USA)   |   | |
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That is interesting; thanks. |
Post# 1052433 , Reply# 2   11/27/2019 at 05:52 (1,584 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK)   |   | |
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Good Morning Launderess, a fab read with lots of detail, there is a great comment from a Chemist which is the crux of the issue with UK & European markets apart from the Bleach issue ha ha..Thanks for posting !!
Chemist Comment.."Thanks for publishing it. I was surprised, though, that it did not include at least a small paragraph discussing the differences in these formulations' packaging. It would have been more consistent with C&EN past coverage of the global plastic waste problem to point out that a tremendous amount of plastic waste would be eliminated by converting from liquid cleaning products (detergents, hand sanitizers, etc.) to powdered or solid cleaning products. |
Post# 1052434 , Reply# 3   11/27/2019 at 06:18 (1,584 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Institutional laundry (and dish washing) suppliers has an array of solid products. Problem is dispensing, which by the way in unique to each brand. That is what works for Johnson-Diversy won't for Ecolab, and vice versa.
Domestic manufacturers tried reintroducing tablets for both laundry and dish washing with various levels of success. Pods now seem to be the next big thing as gels never caught on, and that dreadful Persil "chips" died a quick and merciful death. *LOL* Thing about pods is as they age that poly vinyl seems resistant to dissolving fully. This and or thanks to ever puny water usage the things just won't melt fully. Either way result is same, bits of plastic stuck to one's wash, and if not caught before going into dryer or whatever will prove nearly impossible to shift. |
Post# 1052441 , Reply# 4   11/27/2019 at 09:15 (1,583 days old) by tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)   |   | |
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Thank you, Launderess! The problem with tablets in their last introduction is that by then FL machines used too little water to dissolve the tablets so they had to be smushed up by hand before goiing into the drawer or drum. |
Post# 1052483 , Reply# 5   11/27/2019 at 17:51 (1,583 days old) by sarahperdue (Alabama)   |   | |
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Post# 1052497 , Reply# 6   11/27/2019 at 19:42 (1,583 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Is something you actually don't want much if any of in laundry. Besides most forms of powdered detergent contain some amount of washing soda; this will break down to leave a residue of bicarbonate. Purpose of adding acid to final rinse (or second to last) is to remove trace remaining amounts of carbonate residue (laundry sour) so things won't turn yellow when exposed to heat, and or feel hard/scratchy.
Problem with tablets at least was finding substances that would bind things together but also allow for easy dissolving in wash. If you look at difference between say tabs for automatic dishwashers, versus those for laundry you'll see a difference at once. The latter are almost rock solid, and if left long enough will become like bricks. OTOH laundry tabs will crumble easily when new, and if allowed to sit will often eventually turn to "dust" on their own. That or slightest movement and they fall apart. Once had a huge stash of Electrasol tablets. Took so long to work way through that by final canisters had to take a mallet and whack things into bits before putting into machine. Otherwise tabs didn't fully dissolve during wash. Now have some Wisk tabs of old that have sat so long in packets contents have turned into powder. Other problem with tabs is if the formula contains bleaching agents, and the things don't totally dissolve at once, there is a good chance any large enough bits remaining will leave color loss spots. Suspect as noted above this is one reason why tablets were withdrawn largely from European and North American markets. Modern front loaders use such puny amounts of water there is a risk whole tablets won't dissolve easily or totally. |
Post# 1052533 , Reply# 7   11/28/2019 at 04:37 (1,583 days old) by mrboilwash (Munich,Germany)   |   | |
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Sarah you are spot on!
Tablets that are designed to dissolve quickly in the detergent drawer use exactly the fizzy effervescent principle as the pharmaceutical industry uses for products like Alka Selzer. At least this is the most common way to go but also found in combination with others chemicals that swell on contact with water or enhance kapillar forces into the tabs. |
Post# 1052748 , Reply# 11   11/30/2019 at 03:43 (1,581 days old) by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod)   |   | |
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I have found that I have to buy detergent through Amazon.
I am a true believer in powders. For Laundry, I find that Persil Universal Powder has been a winner for me for about 12 years now. A few times I have used Persil MegaPearls and were OK, but like the powder better. Cascade Dishwashing Powder has been rapidly disappearing from the shelves at least here on the Cape Stores as well as Laundry Powders. Just don't like the idea of a plastic thing dissolving in the machine and the thoughts of invisible plastic clinging to my glasses, dishes, and flatware. Was just looking yesterday on Amazon for Cascade Complete. They seem to have some good deals but good to know you can still get it without having to start formulating your own. Thanks Laundress for the link to that read. Interesting. As Auntie Mame said... "Knowledge is Power". ; ) |
Post# 1052750 , Reply# 12   11/30/2019 at 04:31 (1,581 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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How do you find Mrs. Meyer's "clean day" detergents?
Several bottles of the concentrated lavender version (with flip top), it cleans well enough but is devil to rinse. Very frothy if one uses even slightly too much, and can leave sort of a scum. The latter might be due to high soap content, I dunno. Lavender scent doesn't remain long on air dried laundry, but product does clean well enough (packed with enzymes). Use it on dress shirts, bed linens, and even some not so dirty regular wash loads. Do add some oxygen bleach for whites and or where there are stains that need shifting. |
Post# 1052773 , Reply# 13   11/30/2019 at 13:00 (1,580 days old) by thomasortega (El Pueblo de Nuestra Señora de Los Angeles de Porciúncula)   |   | |
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Eddie As you buy DW detergent on Amazon, have you considered the Cascade Fryer Boil Out? I purchased 7 boxes recently. (57 dollars, large boxes, so it was actually very cheap) the result is beyond impressive. |
Post# 1052823 , Reply# 15   12/1/2019 at 06:15 (1,580 days old) by Iej (.... )   |   | |
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The one big issue I find with pods is the dose is too high for soft water. If I use them I get "check dose" warnings from the Miele W1 after the wash. They're clearly just using hard water dose levels as the common denominator. |
Post# 1052825 , Reply# 16   12/1/2019 at 06:33 (1,580 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK)   |   | |
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We are doing what we can to reduce plastic waste or consumption in our home, So its big box powder for all laundry I buy Sainsburys own bio for whites it has the highest bleach content in powder and a colour powder for darks etc. Nobody wears wool so that's not an issue. I use stain remover for really bad stains on whites as we use cloth napkins/serviettes.
On a side note we also went back to having milk delivered in glass bottles its a little bit more expensive but so worth it the milk tastes nicer than out the plastic container and OJ is delivered too. I see some of our supermarkets are stopping the use of plastic bags to put fresh produce in instead you buy a reusable net with a drawstring which you use over again... Good ideas to help rid the planet of plastic. |
Post# 1052904 , Reply# 18   12/2/2019 at 01:46 (1,579 days old) by bradfordwhite (central U.S.)   |   | |
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Was watching Mr. Mom from 1983. Michael Keaton was doing the shopping and what should he happen upon? |
Post# 1053305 , Reply# 19   12/6/2019 at 08:17 (1,575 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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One used Persil color gel with a scoop of oxygen bleach, other was just Persil powder.
While doing the ironing noticed things done in Persil powder were cleaner, brighter, and stain free. Load done with gel was clean enough and so forth one supposes, but traces of marks (red wine) were still slightly visible. Mind you had pre-treated all red wine stains on both loads, so it is telling that even with a dose of oxygen bleach persil gel couldn't totally shift. Used gel on one load because it was done on "delicates" and find Persil powder can be difficult to rinse. |
Post# 1053493 , Reply# 20   12/7/2019 at 23:33 (1,573 days old) by Dermacie (my forever home (Glenshaw, PA))   |   | |
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Post# 1053496 , Reply# 21   12/8/2019 at 00:42 (1,573 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1053824 , Reply# 22   12/10/2019 at 11:45 (1,570 days old) by toploader55 (Massachusetts Sand Bar, Cape Cod)   |   | |
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Hi Thomas
I do have Cascade Boil out. I think it was John L. that said that it was kind of harsh on the components of domestic machines. I use it a few times a month in my 2004 KenWhirl Power Module with the Plastic Tank. Keeps that Plastic a pure white as the driven snow. I used to love Electra-Sol and Finish powder from (OMG) 20+ years ago. |