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Thread Number: 82127
/ Tag: Detergents and Additives
New Detergent Ratings |
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Post# 1061454 2/24/2020 at 20:37 (1,512 days old) by Frigilux  (The Minnesota Prairie) |
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 The testing organization you love to hate has revamped its testing protocol for the better, listing a separate score in each of nine areas, seven being common soils/stains, the other two being how well it works as a pretreater when rubbed into fabric and allowed to sit for 5 minutes before washing, and finally, how well it works in very hard water (300 ppm).
Coffee seems to be the weak spot for all 40 brands/variations in the ratings. No pods or powders tested this time. Overall Score: 84 Cost/Load: 28 cents Dirt: Excellent Salad Dressing: Excellent Coffee: Good Chocolate Ice Cream: Excellent Grass: Very Good Blood: Very Good Pretreat: Excellent Hard Water: Very Good
Persil Plus Stain Fighter All scores the same as Tide Plus Ultra Stain Release (except as noted) Cost/Load: 21 cents Hard Water: Good
Tide Ultra Oxi Overall Score: 83 Cost/Load: 27 cents Body Oil: Excellent Dirt: Very Good Salad Dressing: Excellent Coffee: Good Chocolate Ice Cream: Excellent Grass: Very Good Blood: Good Pretreat: Excellent Hard Water: Very Good
Tide Heavy Duty 10X Overall Score: 80 Cost/Load: 44 cents Body Oil: Excellent Dirt: Very Good Salad Dressing: Excellent Coffee: Good Chocolate Ice Cream: Excellent Grass: Very Good Blood: Very Good Pretreat: Excellent Hard Water: Very Good
Persil ProClean Original Overall Score: 78 Cost/Load: 19 cents Body Oil: Excellent Dirt: Very Good Salad Dressing: Excellent Coffee: Good Chocolate Ice Cream: Excellent Grass: Good Blood: Good Pretreat: Very Good Hard Water: Good
Kirkland Signature (Costco) Overall Score: 76 Cost/Load: 11 cents Body Oil: Excellent Dirt: Very Good Salad Dressing: Excellent Coffee: Good Chocolate Ice Cream: Very Good Grass: Good Blood: Fair Pretreat: Very Good Hard Water: Very Good
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Post# 1061468 , Reply# 1 2/24/2020 at 23:25 (1,512 days old) by gansky1 (Omaha, The Home of the TV Dinner!) |
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Post# 1061470 , Reply# 2 2/24/2020 at 23:54 (1,512 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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You'll never remove coffee/tannin stains by detergent al
Marks like that want bleaching; oxygen, chlorine... something of that nature is needed.
Surfactants, enzymes and so on will get you but so far, but traces will likely still remain. CR likely didn't bother testing powdered laundry detergent because aside from Tide there are few if any around. And even finding Tide with Bleach or whatever current incarnation happens to be often is difficult. | ||
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Post# 1061481 , Reply# 3 2/25/2020 at 03:29 (1,512 days old) by mrboilwash (Munich,Germany) |
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I`ve had really bad red wine and even blueberry stains completely come out from dish towels with liquid Persil and store brand liquids. So whatever enzymes they use to make up for the lack of bleaching agents seems to work very well these days, but have to say this was on real profile washes at 95 °C which seems to help of course.
Still surprised coffee stains didn`t get better ratings. What I don`t get is why they don`t rate important things like redepositing, color care, fabric care and so on. Even the best rating in stain removal is useless if most of the dirt redeposits back on the fabric during the rinse cycle. A lot of detergents (e.g Ariel Pods) apparently do this, but it takes hundreds of more washings with real life soils (vs test stripes only) to find out. And don`t get me started on CR`s take on dishwasher detergents without testing long term damage to dishes. But thank you for posting! It is always interesting to see the results even if their testing methods can be considered somewhat disputable. | ||
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Post# 1061488 , Reply# 4 2/25/2020 at 05:58 (1,512 days old) by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie) |
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P&G Confusion Continues: According to Tide’s website, most versions of liquid Tide are now formulated for use in both HE and standard machines. The exceptions—Tide Plus Ultra Stain Release and Tide Coldwater, for instance—are available in two formulas; one for HE washers and one for standard. The formula for HE machines has the HE TurboClean icon just under the spout on the container. See photos below for both versions.
HOWEVER...the website says Tide Heavy Duty 10X is formulated for both types of washers and the jug shown has no TurboClean icon. The jug I bought around six weeks ago DOES have the TurboClean icon on it. In other words, Tide has not yet standardized their badging, apparently.
Gansky— Tide Heavy Duty 10X does have a very steep price! I didn’t realize until I got home from the store that my jug of Ultra Stain Release was 92 fluid ounces, whereas Heavy Duty 10X was only 69 fluid ounces. Both types were being sold at the same price at the HyVee grocery store I frequent.
At any rate, not planning to use the Heavy Duty 10X until current jug of Ultra Stain Release is used up. Given Heavy Duty’s test results, I’ll probably continue using Ultra Stain Release and Persil Plus Stain Fighter as the daily drivers.
Photo #1: Ultra Stain Release for use in HE machines only. Photo #2: Ultra Stain Release for use in standard machines only. Note lack of TurboClean icon. | ||
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Post# 1061506 , Reply# 5 2/25/2020 at 09:30 (1,511 days old) by Logixx (Germany) |
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FWIW | ||
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Post# 1061510 , Reply# 6 2/25/2020 at 11:14 (1,511 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.) |
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| Post# 1061525 , Reply# 7 2/25/2020 at 13:44 (1,511 days old) by nmassman44 (Brooksville Florida) | ||
Well just wait until you start using that Tide Heavy Duty 10X...the aroma is gagging unless on likes the scent of Comet. I bought the PowerPods that sported the Tide Heavy Duty 10X logo, they did quite well cleaning and fit nicely in the Electrolux dispenser for Pods. BUT after they emerged from the dryer, I didn't think anything of the scent until a day later when it started to reek. And as the week went on, the stuff I had washed like towels, jeans, shirts all were smelling like Comet...there is no other way to describe it.
I did try the Tide Coldwater Pods in the Fresh scent and they do have a scent that reminds me of Tide powder of long ago, like the Clothesline scent that they had. I do like the scent and its a clean scent on top of that. The Persil Discs have way too much whiff to them to my snout. They do well but that is about it. I did contact Henkel and asked them if they plan in toning down the scent since I dont like a scent to arrive before I do, if you know what I mean.... | ||
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Post# 1061527 , Reply# 8 2/25/2020 at 14:07 (1,511 days old) by Logixx (Germany) |
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Yes, the Persil liquid and Disks don't have bleach in them. Optical brightener for sure - but no oxygen bleach. The only liquid I know of to have oxy bleach is a dishwasher gel by Unilever that is sold in parts of Europe. Its oxygen bleach is encapsulated, thus protected from the rest of the ingredients.
smartlabel.henkel-northamerica.c... smartlabel.henkel-northamerica.c... | ||
| Post# 1061528 , Reply# 9 2/25/2020 at 14:40 (1,511 days old) by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas) | ||
Mike | ||
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Post# 1061536 , Reply# 10 2/25/2020 at 18:18 (1,511 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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"Oxi" is not a regulated name or term; as such manufactures are free to use that word anyway they wish. Clearly they are doing so in hopes consumers will make the connection between oxygen bleaching substances (such as Oxi-Clean powder), but that in no way means a product must have said chemicals.
Most laundry products with "oxi" action are loaded with enzymes and or heavy doses of optical brightening agents. These along with other properties such as high levels of surfactants, anti-redepositing properties and so forth are supposed to give the same results as if one used oxygen bleach. Don't know about that.... It all comes down to something one has mentioned many times previously; move away from powder detergents with oxygen bleaching systems to liquids/gels (that don't have) means something more is often needed. Thus every detergent manufacturer also flogs an vast and bewildering array of boosters and other wash day extras. These are really just the chemicals (oxygen bleach, washing soda, bleach activator, etc..) that were in powders, but cannot be in liquids. This and or liquid detergents loaded with advanced chemical cocktails that are supposed to give same good wash as with powdered detergent with bleach. Want to have your eyes opened just look at the often huge list of chemicals found in liquid detergents. You can have a pretty decent performing powder detergent with about ten or less ingredients; liquids are often twenty or more including large amounts of preservatives. | ||
| Post# 1061541 , Reply# 11 2/25/2020 at 19:21 (1,511 days old) by mtn1584 (USA) | ||
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Persil 2in1 Odor Remover Anyone try the Persil 2in1 liquid with Odor Remover? I left Tide for Persil. I love the smell and Tide does NOT get out laundry odors in my experience. Mike | ||
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Post# 1061547 , Reply# 12 2/25/2020 at 21:50 (1,511 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Since we're on the subject | ||
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Post# 1061607 , Reply# 14 2/26/2020 at 21:59 (1,510 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md) |
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Rinsing Of Clothing Is a function of the washing machine and has about nothing to do with what detergent you are using.
And keep in mind that you generally do not want to rinse all detergent out of clothing, detergent surfactants protect the washer and clothing, they make clothing softer, last longer and when it gets soiled again it cleans more easily.
John L. | ||
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Post# 1061619 , Reply# 17 2/27/2020 at 02:44 (1,510 days old) by mrboilwash (Munich,Germany) |
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I`m not sure that there even is such a thing like rinseability of a detergent as rinsing is just dilution and therefor the job of the washer not the detergent.
When others talk about "rinseability" I always wonder how they`d define good rinsing as most of the typical indicators don`t always tell the whole story. -Clear water for example could happen in hard water when washing with pure soap after very little rinsing. The water looks clear but the soap is still there. Rinse water also looks sooner clear when washing with liquids compared to powders which may contain insoluble stuff like zeolites. -The absence of suds after very little rinsing could also mean you used a low sudsing detergent to begin with or your washload contained a lot of greasy soils. -Residual alkalinity. This is what is usually measured when consumer organisations rate rinsing of washing machines, but even there are variables that can alter the results. For example most liquid detergents are not very alkaline so this test is better used with powders only. Then comes the fact that some higher sudsing detergents could trigger an extra rinse if the washer detects a suds lock. So I would guess it has to be low sudsing powders only to give comparable results. In my opinion the only thing that matters is how much of detergent residue a washing machine leaves on clothings after the rinsing. This is usually something between 1-2 % in an average household washing machine and AFAIK is considered a save level for the skin. My point in the previous post was that it is hard to believe that CR does not test redepositing because every laundry detergent has so to say a primary and a secondary washing action and both are equally important to tell if a detergent is good or bad. Primary is about visible stains as found on those test stripes they use. Secondary means those stains and body soils from wearing will not redeposit back on the washload resulting in a grey and smelly build up after repeated washings. Some of the redepositing happens in the wash cycle but most of it occurs in the rinse cycle when surfactants and other chemicals may be too diluted to keep remaining soils suspended. Sorry for the confusion. | ||
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Post# 1061632 , Reply# 18 2/27/2020 at 07:10 (1,510 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.) |
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Post# 1061696 , Reply# 20 2/27/2020 at 19:50 (1,509 days old) by appnut (TX) |
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 Well, I'm going to have to check out the Tide Plus Ultra Stain Release. (Neither Walmart or HEB carry it--but I can order it from Target--just gotta come up with enough stuff to meet the $35 minimum order). I just did a load of dark towels on Heavy Duty/Hot. It locked up with suds when it tried to spin and ended up doing a suds kill routine. (I'll have to see if this happens with a big load of light colored towels in about 6 weeks or so. After this bottle of Persil is gone, I have a bottle of Tide 10X Heavy Duty I got two weeks ago as it had a store coupon with it. It doesn't suds up at all like the Persil with towels (and jeans). but I love the scent of the Persil, the Tide doesn't have much of a scent to me. I found the Persil Stain Fighter cleaned a bit better than the Tide 10X Heavy Duty. That's why I wanted to try the Persil one more time. | ||
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Post# 1061707 , Reply# 21 2/27/2020 at 22:01 (1,509 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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This pretty much sums things up. | ||
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Post# 1061711 , Reply# 22 2/27/2020 at 22:13 (1,509 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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More:
cen.acs.org/articles/96/i5/encap... You see, well you see "clean rinsing" nowadays often isn't any such thing. Detergents are designed to leave various residues that impart desired properties. With some liquid detergents one can rinse and rinse but still find some suds in water, and or fragrance left on fabric. | ||
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Post# 1061720 , Reply# 23 2/28/2020 at 00:48 (1,509 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
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Persil Plus Stain Fighter 2in1 with Odor Removal
Since have several bottles lying about spare cracked one open yesterday for testing. This even though still have not finished original Persil 2 in 1 purchased last year.
Scent wise things are more like Henkel's Persil from Germany. Forth wise while things are sudsy in wash, first rinse they die down, by second and subsequent things are quite clear. Odor removal wise, did a load of dress shirts (someone around here is a bit too liberal with scent), and it removed pretty much all traces of cologne. While ironing shirts noticed a faint "Persil" scent, but once dry and after airing nothing intolerable. | ||
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Post# 1081194 , Reply# 24 7/16/2020 at 00:36 (1,370 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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tide power pods heavy-duty I just bought some heavy-duty tide power pods. I'm anxious to try them. my dad can get his clothes pretty dirty I.E. working on cars or cutting grass. | ||
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Post# 1081226 , Reply# 26 7/16/2020 at 10:11 (1,369 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK) |
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Hi Does your Miele not have the Allergy cycle option? If you are really in need of removing everything from your laundry I suggest you find a separate laundry emulsifier to remove any grease IE Fabric softener if you find some I did at a laundry suppliers they use it for table linen, You don't need much in with the detergent and you will find everything feels completely different like it did when it was new. I have great success with it and it rinses out ok but I have run an express wash afterwards if in doubt.
Also I would try giving the laundry that's next to your skin a wash only with no detergent after its finished its cycle when the wash has warmed and released any soap etc spin it out and dry while still warm. Its worth a shot to see if it helps. Austin | ||
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Post# 1081258 , Reply# 27 7/16/2020 at 13:09 (1,369 days old) by petek (Ontari ari ari O ) |
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How they test; 
LAB-TESTED FOR YOUR WASHER
We tested over 50 detergents, liquids and pods, some of which are claimed to be gentle on sensitive skin or friendly to the environment, as you’ll see in our laundry detergent ratings. First, we launder fabric swatches that are saturated with blood, body oil, chocolate, coffee, dirt, grass, and salad dressing. We use stains that are exceedingly hard to remove so that we can detect real differences among detergents. Even the best detergents can’t remove every stain completely. Today's water and energy efficient washers are designed to operate using cooler water than traditional top-loaders from the 1990s. As wash cycles got cooler, the chemistry of detergents had to change in order for them to clean effectively. That's why we test using cool water. We wash swatches in two identical washers with each detergent, then allow the swatches to air-dry. (A dryer is out of the question because the heat can alter the stains.) Testers use a colorimeter, a device that measures color intensity, to see how much of the stain remains on each dry swatch, compared with stained swatches that have been laundered using only water. The best detergents we’ve tested earn an Excellent rating in removing body oil and dirt—common stains—but they can also tackle tougher ones, such as grass and blood. Hard water, which has a high mineral content, can reduce the effectiveness of some detergents. We test for that, too, as you'll see in our ratings. The worst detergents? They're barely better than water when it comes to removing most stains. | ||
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Post# 1081261 , Reply# 28 7/16/2020 at 13:18 (1,369 days old) by petek (Ontari ari ari O ) |
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Re depositing
The test is to determine which detergent performed best in removing each of the stains after the swatches were air dried. If by chance one of those detergents "re deposited" dirt on the swatches (clothes) after the final rinse then it goes to say that it would not have scored as high as it could, or against others. It's the final result that counts.
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Post# 1081355 , Reply# 30 7/17/2020 at 07:40 (1,369 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK) |
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@gizmo
This is the emulsifier I bought its brilliant at removing all grease and oil from clothes and as I said earlier it makes them feel like new again before any FS was used.
I will look up your Miele model. Austin
View Full Size
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Post# 1081356 , Reply# 31 7/17/2020 at 07:43 (1,369 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK) |
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PS
I forgot to mention you add a small amount to the detergent, I use a ball and put 2/3 detergent and 1/3 emulsifier it works well in that dosage.
I add extra rinse to the wash the last 2 Miele I have had included an allergy cycle the new one takes too long though as it does a 60 wash and holds it for 20 minutes then it does a 40 rinse to ensure nothing left behind. Austin | ||
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