Thread Number: 82191  /  Tag: Vintage Dishwashers
Is it true KitchenAid Superba dishwasher pumps are no longer available?
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Post# 1062083   3/2/2020 at 19:51 (1,116 days old) by Amajo319 (Belvue)        

I recently came across an older Facebook thread where a commenter said that Superba pumps are no longer available anywhere as they are not manufactured anymore. I was thinking of buying a superba a few hours away but I'm thinking I might look for another brand if I can't replace the pump in the future. I'm fairly new to vintage appliances, so please be gentle 🙃

Post# 1062101 , Reply# 1   3/2/2020 at 21:06 (1,116 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Kitchenaid Superba DWs

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Were built from 1961 into the 2000s, which model are you looking at ?


All KA DWs were very popular and parts can be found for almost any one of their DWs from 1949 on.


On the older pre 1986 Hobart designed and built machines you never changed a pump, Pumps were not sold for them, you just repaired what went wrong with the pump if anything.


John L.

Post# 1062123 , Reply# 2   3/3/2020 at 03:00 (1,116 days old) by Amajo319 (Belvue)        

It is a KDS19- dw. Good to know about the durability of the pumps. This one has an impeller seal leak, but I did easily find the parts for that. My previous whirlpool dishwasher broke in less than two years and it was brand new out of the box. I'm looking forward to having something that will hopefully last longer.

Post# 1062133 , Reply# 3   3/3/2020 at 05:43 (1,116 days old) by Tomturbomatic (Beltsville, MD)        

I'm curious. How do you mean that your "previous Whirlpool dishwasher broke in less than two years and it was brand new out of the box"? Did you not have it fixed because you were so dissatisfied with it or was there some other reason? Best of luck with the 19.

Post# 1062175 , Reply# 4   3/3/2020 at 14:54 (1,115 days old) by Amajo319 (Belvue)        

we never had it fixed because it really never cleaned the dishes properly. I felt like I had to wash the dishes after they were done with their cycle. I keep hearing that the old kitchen AIDS are really powerful so I'm hoping that I will have better luck with an older model. Thanks.

Post# 1062183 , Reply# 5   3/3/2020 at 15:30 (1,115 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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It's strange that a late model Whirlpool wouldn't provide satisfactory results, but since it's history, there is one thing you should know about using a vintage dishwasher:  You will likely need to augment your modern day dishwasher detergent with an additive that contains phosphate, such as STPP, or use an industrial detergent like Cascade Fryer Boil-Out. 


This is because modern detergents are designed for super long cycles like your Whirlpool used.  Older machines run relatively short cycles that, depending on the selected option, can complete in less than an hour.  Modern detergents need more time to work, and if you use them with a vintage machine, you may not be happy with the results.


The KDS-19 doesn't offer a heated drying cycle, so keep that in mind if you find yourself having to hand-dry some items or notice water remaining in cup bottoms.

Post# 1062194 , Reply# 6   3/3/2020 at 17:49 (1,115 days old) by Ultralux88 (Denver)        

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I haven't been terribly impressed with the late model Whirlpools I've seen myself, it will give acceptable results if you use something like Bubble bandit or Cascade fryer boil, but it still takes a 4-5 hour cycle, and it really only does well when all the various options are selected. The Kitchenaid will do as well on the normal cycle with the same detergent, and give even better results on one of the more aggressive cycles. No more dish rinsing needed! I just can't for the life of me seeing why it takes an 8 HOUR sad and clean cycle to get the stupid thing to clean the dishes from manky and cooked on to clean enough for my standards, when our 2005 Whirlpool does it in an hour and 45 minutes!

Post# 1062267 , Reply# 7   3/4/2020 at 11:35 (1,115 days old) by Amajo319 (Belvue)        

Thank you so much for the heads up on the dishwashing detergent! I did not know that. Like I said, I am new to this. I have been getting into vintage appliances because I do a heck of a lot of cooking and I find, so far, they have been more durable. I have great hopes for this dishwasher. Thanks again for the tips. Not a problem on the dry cycle since I generally run a load at night without the heat cycle and they are mostly dry, morning anyways.

Post# 1062318 , Reply# 8   3/4/2020 at 22:13 (1,114 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Detergents For Vintage DWs

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Hi Andrea, we are finding the new DW detergent pods are working very well in older DWs.


But it is always important to keep water hardness in mind when selecting and using detergent in any DW. If you have fairly soft water under 5 grains , DO NOT use any phosphates in your vintage DW as it will destroy the inside finish, racks, pumps seals and on and on.


When the high phosphate detergents were common people forget that many of these wonderful DWs only lasted an average of 4-12 years and the biggest reason was damage caused by the very caustic detergents loaded with phosphates and the really too hot water that used to be recommended for homes with DWs. You should never have your homes water temp over 140F if you want long life out of a DW.


John L.

Post# 1062326 , Reply# 9   3/4/2020 at 23:28 (1,114 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

rp2813's profile picture

Andrea, my apologies for the conflicting information about phosphates.  My remarks were based on testimonials from other members here.  As John stated, water hardness is a factor to consider regarding the type of detergent that would be best for your situation.

Post# 1062327 , Reply# 10   3/5/2020 at 00:06 (1,114 days old) by marky_mark (From Liverpool. Now living in Palm Springs and Dublin)        

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I have a KDS-19.  I have a water softener and so I have no need for phosphate.  I have tried various detergents in the KDS-19 including Cascade Complete powder, Cascade Platinum pacs and also the old-style powder with chlorine and phosphate.  In my soft water, the modern detergents work great in this machine.  Cascade Complete powder is a good choice as you can add detergent to both the prewash and the main wash cups and also add some for the initial prewash.  That way you get 3 wash periods with detergent in each one.  I find that the powder with phosphate and chlorine can't remove starch residue from rice and pasta.  HOWEVER if you have hard water, then you may find that phosphate works much better for you, as Cascade Complete powder alone may leave white calcium residue on items and cause a build-up in the machine.  You will have to experiment to find what combination works best for you, as it depends on many factors.  


I find the KDS-19 to be a good dishwasher and it is extremely well-built and feels like pure quality.  However it does have some shortcomings.  It can leave "yibbles" on items in the upper rack due to the lack of a top spray above the upper rack (this can be mitigated by strategic loading).  The drying isn't as good as a machine with heated dry (when using the heated dry option) but it's ok and probably similar to many European machines.  The good thing is that it does have fan-forced drying and it leaves items cool and ready to be unloaded as soon as the cycle ends.  The loading is pretty flexible and well-designed and the upper rack is easily adjustable.  The self-cleaning filter can be overwhelmed if the load has certain food residues such as lots of chopped fresh herbs or spinach which can smother the filter.  Overall it's a good machine and it all depends on what you want and what works best for you.  Good luck!

Post# 1062346 , Reply# 11   3/5/2020 at 09:02 (1,114 days old) by peteski50 (New York)        

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My family had this model in those days it was considered a long cycle. As long as you use jetdry the drying results will be almost perfect!

Post# 1062369 , Reply# 12   3/5/2020 at 13:02 (1,113 days old) by Amajo319 (Belvue)        

That's very interesting about the water hardness. I never even considered that in choosing detergents. I grew up hand-washing, so this is all new to me. I have to say, I have been on the fence about getting a retro dishwasher. My vintage stove was an easy decision as a stoves one simple job is really just to put out heat, but dishwashers seem to be a bit trickier. We are on the fence about an older KitchenAid, or perhaps a 90s Bosch dishwasher. We do a lot of dishes around here and I don't need a lot of bells and whistles, but I do want the dishes to be clean! Thanks for all the help. this is a very knowledgeable (and opinionated 😉)group of folks on this site!

Post# 1062373 , Reply# 13   3/5/2020 at 14:12 (1,113 days old) by marky_mark (From Liverpool. Now living in Palm Springs and Dublin)        

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I find the KDS-19 drying to be perfectly acceptable but just not as good as a heated dry machine (when heated dry is selected on).  All your plates, pans, Pyrex, tableware etc. will be dry.  It's just plastics and the ridges in cups etc. that don't dry completely.  But it's fine.


The normal cycle is 88 minutes plus water heating time (in my case this adds about 20 minutes).  

The Pots & Pans cycle is 96 minutes plus water heating time (I find this adds about 30 minutes).

So the cycles are not particularly quick compared to a KDS-18 normal cycle of 66 minutes or Pot and Pans at 108 minutes.

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