Thread Number: 86853
/ Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Miele w4840 series |
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Post# 1114165 , Reply# 1   4/9/2021 at 23:52 (1,084 days old) by gizmo (Victoria, Australia)   |   | |
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Really we need to know what the problem is first. I don't mean a full diagnosis, but what is the machine doing wrong? |
Post# 1114177 , Reply# 2   4/10/2021 at 06:29 (1,083 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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In theory only place to get new parts for Miele appliances is from their North American parts department. These models were discontinued several years back, but they still may be covered by Miele's 15 year part stock guarantee.
If you know exactly what part is needed often things can be found elsewhere such as eBay, European and other sources outside of USA. You can also try looking online for service/technical manuals or other information. MieleUSA no longer provides any sort of diagnosing or tech support via telephone. You must make an appointment for a call out (and pay dearly) where a tech examine machine. |
Post# 1114181 , Reply# 3   4/10/2021 at 08:31 (1,083 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))   |   | |
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I just searched for Miele T9822 service manual, second result was the service manual. |
Post# 1114182 , Reply# 4   4/10/2021 at 09:35 (1,083 days old) by Tomdawg (Des moines)   |   | |
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It’s the dispenser controller that’s leaking in the washer. Activating the waterproof system. I’m having trouble finding parts
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Post# 1114185 , Reply# 5   4/10/2021 at 10:31 (1,083 days old) by Tomdawg (Des moines)   |   | |
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I told them I will call Monday to see if there are any parts for it. Unless you guys know where to find parts. They are thinking of buying a new set. If they do. I’m tempted to take it! Is it worth it? |
Post# 1114193 , Reply# 6   4/10/2021 at 13:46 (1,083 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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With various issues that plagued the W4XXX series washing machines, and various leaks was one.
You can read various posts in forum about issues here: www.google.com/searchQUES... Again for NOS parts first choice would be Miele USA, but also armed with proper numbers check around internet for anyone selling online. Don't believe Miele sold W4XXX washers outside of North America, thus any parts specific to these two models of washing machines may not be found say in Europe because weren't sold there for a start. As already noted service manual for W4XXX washers is found online so that's something anyway. Apparently water path unit for W4XXX was a weak spot that kept causing issues (leaking), to point Miele went back and redesigned the part with new number as you see in your picture. Some still had issues later after even after swapping out part. |
Post# 1114199 , Reply# 9   4/10/2021 at 14:34 (1,083 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Interestingly both Bosch and Miele entered North American laundry appliance market with uber sized washers about the same time (NeXXT and W4XXX respectively), and barely a decade or so afterwards withdrew all washers and matching dryers.
Bosch's NeXXT washers and dryers were at least built in USA, and one would have thought that company also did their due diligence in R&D. But alas those washers and matching dryers had issues as well. IIRC like Miele Bosch didn't sell those huge washers and dryers in Europe which meant pretty much dependent upon North American sales numbers for success. Miele has been building uber sized commercial washing machines for ages, and thus does know very well how to do so. Thus was surprised as the litany of problems that kept plaguing W4XXX series washers. The matching dryers had problems and to be fair Miele hadn't built a gas dryer for residential use (IIRC) so were operating in dark there so to speak. Thing is overall the Miele W4XXX washers like their smaller cousins of time were built to near commercial standards. These were despite their issues pretty substantial bits of kit. One thing it came down to is what it always does with Miele; people paid huge sums for those uber sized washers and dryers, only to have them have issues not long after installation. That was bad enough but given Miele's not extensive service/repair network it could be weeks or longer before a tech even came out to look at the machine. Then weeks longer before he returned to do the repair. Was considering a W4840, found a local dealer who had one at a very good price. Queried the man about known leak issues that triggered WPS. His response was "I just tell my customers to unplug machine, open drain cover, tip washer forward to drain out water... wait then reset washer". Replied at just 5'7" and 125lbs (stripped) wasn't going to be "tipping" a washer that weighs 300lbs or more forward as part of wash day period. So that was that. The W3XXX series washers were introduced at same time as W4XXX models and many the former were better built washers and represented Miele quality of old. Keep in mind despite huge size of W4XXX Miele advised only loading tub about three-quarters full for a "normal" wash. Meanwhile the W3XXX washers could be loaded as one would any other Miele washer. So you've paid more for a larger washing machine, but cannot fully ultilize capacity. Miele took a killing financially on these uber sized washers and dryers as well IIRC. Which in fact may have been one of the reasons they decided to pull the plug on both. Unlike Bosch Miele refuses to open a factory in USA. Thus those huge washers and dryers were built in Europe, then shipped to North America. That alone was a huge cost but again since these units weren't sold in Miele's normal largest market (Europe) they were totally dependent upon overseas sales. IMHO quite honestly the W1 washers are better on many levels then W4XXX series. It's like Miele went back to the drawing board and came up with a better machine addressing previous problems. The W1 has same or greater capacity than W4XXX but less issues with build quality and so forth. |
Post# 1114200 , Reply# 10   4/10/2021 at 14:39 (1,083 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Miele only pulled their W4XXX washers and matching dryers in 2016. That was just five years ago which isn't anywhere near the 15 years Miele normally guarantees will keep parts in stock for models after even after production ceases.
Yes, the W700, W10XX, W19XX series largely are NLA parts , but they are machines discontinued twenty or more years ago. blog.yaleappliance.com/bid/83143... www.reviewed.com/laundry/... |
Post# 1114206 , Reply# 12   4/10/2021 at 17:43 (1,083 days old) by Jerrod_Six (Eastern Pennsylvania, USA)   |   | |
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I have a W1 which is advertised to hold up to 18 pounds and is also sold in Europe, although perhaps not this model. I would suggest your friends go to the Miele website and look at the 860 model. They can download the user manual and see if they like what it offers. |
Post# 1114212 , Reply# 13   4/10/2021 at 20:27 (1,083 days old) by richnz (New Zealand)   |   | |
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Any photos of where it is leaking exactly? It can be taken apart and greased. Was it this machine that had leak issues with the rubber part which connects the dispenser to the tub (Underneath). |
Post# 1114220 , Reply# 14   4/10/2021 at 21:04 (1,083 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)   |   | |
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These were very well designed and built machines, but like all W&Ds there were a few problems and Miele does have serious service problems in the US.
I have had a pair of these including the gas dryer, both machines suffered from being overly complicated and difficult to service just like all Miele W&Ds and DWs and don't even get me started on their US built-in refrigerator line.
And no these were not built in Europe, the full sized W&D were built in Mexico [ with a lot of parts from all over the world like all Miele appliances ]
The full sized W&D were discontinued for one and only one reason, Miele could not even begin to compete with the rest of the world on price and as a result sales were very poor, the full sized models would have been lucky to get 1/10 of 1 % of the US market.
This is why it is so hard to have good service in the US with sales hovering around 1 or 2% of the US laundry and DW market and charging such high prices they are forced make good on problems but can not maintain the level of service people expect.
There is really only one great choice for a highly durable easy to get repaired or even fix it yourself full sized W&D in the US Speed Queen.
SQ équipement is designed to be repaired by its owners [ often laundromat owners ] or do it yourselfers.
SQs won't shut down if you oversuds it and it leaks a little, instead you get a little water on the floor, laundry appliances are designed to be installed in laundry rooms with provisions for possible leakage, they are not designed to be installed in living rooms or on hard wood floors.
John L. |
Post# 1114255 , Reply# 17   4/11/2021 at 05:37 (1,083 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Miele 4XXX washers and matching dryers were not made in Mexico, but their Unicov plant in Czech Republic. This is same place as W1215 and some other domestic laundry appliances are made as well.
Unicov factory is where Miele makes their toplader washers, and commercial laundry appliances. IIRC for some appliances however Miele produces parts in Germany, then ships things to Unicov for assemgly. www.houzz.com/discussions... www.miele.com/en/com/czech-repub... Miele does not have any sort of production in North America, and that includes Mexico. www.miele.com/en/com/prod... |
Post# 1114256 , Reply# 18   4/11/2021 at 05:46 (1,083 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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That's odd!
First thing Monday morning call Miele parts directly and try placing an order for required parts. Only thing can thing of is that part requested isn't in stock but system doesn't give that as response. Miele USA had some major changes early in 2019 from what I understand. This washer hasn't even been out of production for ten years much less fifteen. Thus Miele should keep inventory of parts. Another thing might be if parts are on order from Germany Miele like everyone else has had to deal with covid. Factories closing, quarantines... so they may be like many other businesses suffering from distribution and production problems at the moment. |
Post# 1114259 , Reply# 19   4/11/2021 at 06:54 (1,082 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)   |   | |
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I will take a picture of the model tag on next time I see one, but it said Made In Mexico. [ I scraped the washer we had when the spider broke ]
Miele also builds its BI refrigerators in New Jersey, I will take a picture of the tag on one of those.
Sometimes you have to actually get out in the real world, everything you find on line does not tell the whole story.
John L. |
Post# 1114265 , Reply# 21   4/11/2021 at 08:06 (1,082 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1114266 , Reply# 22   4/11/2021 at 08:20 (1,082 days old) by Logixx (Germany)   |   | |
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Samsung also sell a large washer over here, although you can kinda only get it on eBay.
From looking at the spare parts, the Bosch 10 kg Logixx washer only came with a 1300 watts heater and, yes, no hot-water intake. *yikes* CLICK HERE TO GO TO Logixx's LINK on eBay |
Post# 1114267 , Reply# 23   4/11/2021 at 08:26 (1,082 days old) by Logixx (Germany)   |   | |
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Post# 1114269 , Reply# 24   4/11/2021 at 09:12 (1,082 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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See W4XXX washers going for very little money all the time. If one had room and perhaps glutton for punishment might be tempted, but otherwise am waiting until someone unloads a W1 cheaply.
Just about a week ago someone close was literally giving away a W4840 washer with a non-matching dryer. Listed on CL as in their driveway you just had to go and fetch! As you might imagine listing wasn't up very long.... |
Post# 1114289 , Reply# 26   4/11/2021 at 12:12 (1,082 days old) by Tomdawg (Des moines)   |   | |
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Delivery is next Saturday for their new set. So I’m officially getting my first Miele!! |
Post# 1114292 , Reply# 27   4/11/2021 at 12:35 (1,082 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)   |   | |
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Hopefully you can get it going and get some more use out of it.
The only serious problem we have seen with these are broken [ now NLA ] spiders, if the machine was used properly [ lots of hot washes and hopefully they used the LCB dispenser that came with these machines ] if so it might last a long while yet.
And you can post a picture of the model tag that says Made In Mexico so Laundress can settle down.
John L. |
Post# 1114294 , Reply# 28   4/11/2021 at 12:51 (1,082 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)   |   | |
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Post# 1114296 , Reply# 29   4/11/2021 at 13:26 (1,082 days old) by Sgt10 (California )   |   | |
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Here’s the tag that came attached to my now defunct w4840, says made in Czech Republic.
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Post# 1114306 , Reply# 30   4/11/2021 at 14:27 (1,082 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))   |   | |
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These were sold in Mexico, yes. No idea as to why, and probably even in fewer numbers than the US. But I guess just printing a new sticker for the facia made it worth it. |
Post# 1114333 , Reply# 33   4/11/2021 at 18:26 (1,082 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Minimal discount for new machine....
That is part of Miele's standard response when they don't want to deal with an older or whatever appliance any longer. On one of service calls for my W1070 head of service in Princeton offered a slim discount if I'd take a new machine and not bother them any longer about my old one. Was then told my machine and address were put on a "don't go list" as not only was machine "old" and not worth bothering about, but they didn't like layout of my home or whatever information techs put in about the place. @Louis Recall that debate, and didn't wish to go there unless necessary. Certain Miele appliances had power ratings for Mexico, which lead some to read things as if they were manufactured in that country. Which of course is rubbish... If Miele refuses to build any sort of production plant in USA for washing machines and dryers, why would they do so in Mexico where their share of appliance market is smaller than USA? Also were Miele to have a Mexican production plant they could take advantage of NAFTA and send appliances to USA far cheaper than shipping things from Europe. In end of course we plebs know nothing, I mean we're not service persons with vast years of experience, and or "don't get out in real world"..... @SGT10 If Miele truly has ceased stocking parts for 4XXX washers and matching dryers it speaks to how much they want to get away from those machines. Consider also Miele didn't sell these units outside of North America IIRC. It likely would cost dear to keep producing parts for washers and dryers that didn't sell in large numbers (compared to other machines) that have or had greater distribution. |
Post# 1114363 , Reply# 35   4/11/2021 at 22:15 (1,082 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Manual only states "Important: Fill drum only 3/4 way. Items need room to move otherwise may get caught in door seal."
www.manualslib.com/manual... If people routinely disregarded this advice and loaded 4XXX washers like Miele's of old on Normal (drum filled loosely but with about a clenched fist worth of room at top), I do not know. Miele states 4XXX washers have a 4.0 cubic foot capacity. However IIRC many stated they could fit more into the W3XXX washers than W4XXX because the former could be loaded more fully. www.houzz.com/discussions... www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/... If had to compare would say washers SQ or even Miele W1 are rated for about 18 pounds of wash in normal/cottons, while the W4XXX more like 16 pounds. Moving H-axis washers without shipping bolts. Opinions vary on this subject. Some state emphatically machines should not be moved without them, others say long as washer kept upright and not jolted about moving without shipping bolts in place shouldn't be an issue. Much also likely will depend up on who is doing the moving and how far machines are traveling. Since all of my front loaders came quite a distance (AEG set clear from across country), opted to purchase and have installed shipping bolts. OTOH if you're doing a local move and job yourself they might not be necessary. |
Post# 1114393 , Reply# 39   4/12/2021 at 06:44 (1,081 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)   |   | |
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Thank you Louis for posting the model tag from your washer, I have talked to to other repair folks yearterday and because it says Mexico all three of us assumed it was built in Mexico.
It is an interesting way to word a model tag, US import law requires the country of manufacture, yet have never found Czech Republic on one of these washers.
Dear Laundress, I am sorry I doubted your information about the country of origin of these washers, but it is certainly not the first or likely the last time you or I have been wrong about something.
As Far As Moving This Washer, Hi Tom I would keep it Up-Right even for a short move.
Any FL washer can be moved without shipping bolts if it is kept up-right, without the shipping bolts they are actually much less likely to be damaged when in a moving vehicle as the suspension system of the washer easily soaks up the jolts etc.
Look at all the luxury motor homes causing around the country with either FL combos or FL stack or even TL stacks in them, None require you to put the shipping bolts in place to drive the vehicle.
Another point to consider is even if you have the original shipping bolts for a FL washer they are about impossible to reinstall because the inner tub assembly has to be held in place to get the rear bolts to thread into place. We have never bothered to reinstall SBs for any of the hundreds of used FL washer we have delivered and reinstalled.
John L. |
Post# 1114402 , Reply# 40   4/12/2021 at 09:25 (1,081 days old) by gizmo (Victoria, Australia)   |   | |
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without wanting to put any extra fuel on a fire, I am reminded of some good advice: always keep your words sweet in case you have to eat them. |
Post# 1114404 , Reply# 41   4/12/2021 at 09:42 (1,081 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)   |   | |
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John,
Just for the record, it isn't a picture of my machine but from a thread on the Laundry Room forum on the Gardenweb. I've been a member there for an even longer time than I'm a member here, although I hardly ever post there anymore. I remembered this was discussed there. I'm wondering too why Miele has not stuck to their rule to keep parts available. Is it an another issue with the US Miele organisation? It wouldn't surprise me considering that their attitude is much different than we are used to here in Europe. |
Post# 1114410 , Reply# 42   4/12/2021 at 10:46 (1,081 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Rang up Miele and after spending ages on hold finally reached someone in parts.
Part in question isn't in stock but "can be ordered", which was all the person spoke with could say on the matter. Cost is around $283 or something plus tax, shipping..... Person could (or would) not say if this part was going to be ordered from Germany as part of inventory, only that if wanted an order could be placed. Of course only way to find out if this is true would be by placing an order. This isn't exactly new, Miele USA long ordered parts for appliances that weren't in stock from Germany. As mentioned Miele USA had a total reshuffle last year with new management that brought changes. Many long time employees left, which means new hires. On top of that customer service seems now to have been outsourced, |
Post# 1114428 , Reply# 43   4/12/2021 at 13:05 (1,081 days old) by petek (Ontari ari ari O )   |   | |
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Post# 1114436 , Reply# 44   4/12/2021 at 14:09 (1,081 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)   |   | |
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Post# 1114439 , Reply# 45   4/12/2021 at 14:50 (1,081 days old) by Jerrod_Six (Eastern Pennsylvania, USA)   |   | |
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I called Miele service last month and thought perhaps they were working from home due to Covid-19. |
Post# 1114447 , Reply# 46   4/12/2021 at 16:21 (1,081 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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From recent dealings (trying to get that timer for my W1070), seems as if tech support part of customer service now is outsourced to some apart India or somewhere. At least each time one rang always got someone with an Indian maybe other accent.
Parts I believe were or still are working from home; you just sort of can tell by background sounds. Also years ago when rang up Miele USA parts you could hear them plonking away on what sounded like a old sort of keyboard. Don't hear that over past year with covi-19 raging. Really sad thing is now tech support will only book call outs basically. Department is no longer staffed by (sometimes very helpful) techs who will offer advice and or walk you through a repair or something. Asked one of the persons reached recently in that area and his reply was (we stopped doing that because it caused more problems than it was worth). |
Post# 1114579 , Reply# 48   4/13/2021 at 21:10 (1,080 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Miele has a call center in Georgia? That's news! *LOL*
Besides NJ knew they had one out in CA for a bit. That one closed and Miele opened another in Seattle or someplace in PNW, they still may have one there for all I know. Miss the old days when techs actually answered calls to "technical support". Was fortunate enough times to get guys who not only knew my old W1070, but worked on many a same machine. |
Post# 1114869 , Reply# 49   4/17/2021 at 11:24 (1,076 days old) by Tomdawg (Des moines)   |   | |
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Here they are! Got the dryer as well, it’s Electric. They are in rough condition internally but i definitely can clean them up pretty good |
Post# 1114878 , Reply# 50   4/17/2021 at 12:45 (1,076 days old) by appnut (TX)   |   | |
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Post# 1114890 , Reply# 51   4/17/2021 at 16:48 (1,076 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)   |   | |
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Glad you got these, they should be fun to use and play with.
The last owners sure did not know how to wash clothing, when a dryer lint screen has that much soil on it you know you are in trouble.
Unfortunately the washer spider is probably pretty corroded, was the bleach dispenser cup even in place in the dispenser drawer, it sure looks like it never saw really hot washes or LCB.
The last one of these we got was really gross, we used it for about 20-30 loads and it started to clean up pretty well but then the strange noises started and it soon became clear the spider was toast.
John L. |
Post# 1114962 , Reply# 53   4/18/2021 at 03:37 (1,076 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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When my Miele arrived had boot swapped out for new and was glad of it. When Miele tech got the thing out it was fouled with mold and God only knows what else, plus had a small hole. What you see growing in folds is only one part, there is the "outside" of boot that is often is gross as well.
Don't think Miele sold spiders as separate part for 4XXX series washers or perhaps many others before. You'd have to get an entire new tub assembly which likely would cost dear. That's even if Miele USA sells new tub assemblies or even spider directly for this machine. Used W4XXX washers pop up in various states of condition often enough from what have seen. You might want to consider putting feelers out to find a parts donor washer. This way you can harvest parts to create one good machine. If you can let washer heat water suggest running a "maintenance" cycle at highest wash temperature with dedicated cleaner or maybe something else. Letting washer heat on it's own warms up entire machine which will help dislodge crud |
Post# 1116692 , Reply# 55   5/8/2021 at 18:21 (1,055 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)   |   | |
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Post# 1123975 , Reply# 57   7/24/2021 at 07:18 (978 days old) by Logixx (Germany)   |   | |
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Post# 1123984 , Reply# 59   7/24/2021 at 09:05 (978 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)   |   | |
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Post# 1124023 , Reply# 60   7/24/2021 at 21:07 (978 days old) by Tomdawg (Des moines)   |   | |
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Turns out the Miele a smarter than we thought it was. It didn’t even hit 1400rpm on a rough load I had in there today. |