Thread Number: 87790  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Fisher&Paykel GWL11 to IWL12 Conversion gone horribly wrong.
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Post# 1123637   7/19/2021 at 11:20 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        

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I ordered a IWL12 Console P/N 420722P 420374 420374009424 ASMN Software v27. The board and the console facia and overlay P/Ns 420155 426785 arrived today. I plugged it in and hit the start button and got a fault code 9. I looked up the meaning and swapped it for a newer version. It made no difference. I then tried the other solution and reset the size to the largest size by hitting Power+Fabric Care and saved the setting. I again attempted to start the machine. Then the water turned on and the motor started to turn then the motor stalled and as a result it drew too much current and completely fried the Motor Controller (LOUD SNAP AND POP SOUND ACCOMPINED BY BURNING SMELL). The display remained lit but the rest of the machine went quiet. What the F**K did I do wrong?? Is this a faulty/defective IWL12 console or Did I plug something in the wrong part and fried the MCU as a result? Please help. Glenn/DADoES Please email me your phone number if possible. I want to do this over the phone after this incident occoured!




Post# 1123647 , Reply# 1   7/19/2021 at 12:33 (983 days old) by Repairguy (Danbury, Texas)        

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Paging Dr. Glenn!

Post# 1123649 , Reply# 2   7/19/2021 at 13:17 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Damage done

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Display is fine but the MCU has some blown transistors. My dad worked in the recording studio and has had this happen many times before. My dad knows how to fix these boards. Thank god it wasn't the Eprom. And Also thank god that F&P used plastic tops. It could have killed me if it was a metal top and not grounded. LG and F&P "Direct Drive" Motors are capable of receiving or giving out 500VDC and who knows the amperage! I attached photos for Glenn. I wonder if WATER got into the board and toasted it due to the probe being pressed by the display board. Maybe it sprayed into the motor controller and fried it. Minimal damage was done and it scared the crap out of me. Hopefully I just made an error on my end and this will work or this machine will end up going to the shredder.

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Post# 1123662 , Reply# 3   7/19/2021 at 15:54 (983 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Fault 9:  Machine size should be set or reset whenever a display board or motor board is changed to insure the programming is matched.

Probe pressed?


Post# 1123667 , Reply# 4   7/19/2021 at 16:19 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Probe Pressed?

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I am talking about the thermistor probe that senses the water temperature coming in. I wonder if when I put the console on, I had the probe pressed out of the seal and it leaked and sprayed everywhere. I feel like WATER got to somewhere it wasn't supposed to be. DADoES I can email you my phone number. I would like a list of things to check. I have no clue why my board exploded.

Post# 1123682 , Reply# 5   7/19/2021 at 18:01 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
OOPS

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I figured out that this newest board was a PH7 board and not a PH6. I fried it because of the electrical differences and the PH6 Motor struggled with it then exploded. I have no clue why it was labeled as a PH6 Board when it was toasted when I put it on the machine. I attached pictures to compare and contrast. Message to DADoES and other F&P Enthusiasts and Experts. Don't make the same mistake that I made and don't judge a board by the labels. The cover was labeled a PH6 Motor controller but the board inside that I fried was a completely wrong PH7CPE Board. I'm going to try a PH6 Board and verify it this time. I will update if that one also explodes or if it works. The original is not being used until I know it's safe.

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Post# 1123692 , Reply# 6   7/19/2021 at 19:32 (983 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Ph7 boards are sometimes reflashed/revised to Ph6.  The original label silkscreened or laser printed on the board doesn't change.  The exterior label on the shell should be correct for what is it, and there may be an additional sticker label on the board for the revision.

Did you see evidence of water in the console or on/in the motor board shell?  The thermistor is not in a location to contact the display board.

What board/shell is in Reply 5 Pic 1?


Post# 1123693 , Reply# 7   7/19/2021 at 20:48 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Board

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The board out of the shell is the one that I accidentally fried. The one in the shell is the original board.

Post# 1123694 , Reply# 8   7/19/2021 at 20:50 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Got it working

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I put in one of my other boards and it works!

Post# 1123706 , Reply# 9   7/19/2021 at 23:48 (983 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Delicate Cycle

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Is there a option to bypass auto sensing and get a delicate wash or choose the wash profile for certain delicate items like small blankets and stuffed toys?

Post# 1123710 , Reply# 10   7/20/2021 at 02:07 (982 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Fabric sensing is a primary operational feature of Intuitive Eco, so generally agitation profile cannot be directly selected ....

Changing the soil level adjusts the agitation profile slightly higher or lower on the scale around the sensed "Normal."  Soil level can be changed after sensing is done, the profile name will change on the display scroll.  Wash time is also increased/decreased slightly on each step.

Manually selecting a higher water level than the load needs softens the interaction of the load with the agitator during fabric sensing for a gentler profile.  Creasables does this automatically by sensing the "normal" fill level and profile, then filling one level higher (but of course not higher than High) and re-sensing the profile.

A few options or Lifecycles engage specific agitation profiles (also temperature and sometimes water level which can be changed per-run but not saved to Lifecycles cycles):

- Wool runs a specific Wool profile but it may not be as gentle as expected.  Wool is the only cycle that does a Warm/Cold agitated rinse to match the default Warm/Cold wash temp.  Cold can also be selected (cold rinse).  Or Warm but I don't know if it does a Warm rinse or no more than Warm/Cold.

- Handwash does not run Eco Active, agitation is *very* gentle, two deep rinses.

- Lifecycle / Comforter runs a specific Comforter agitation profile and defaults to High water level, two agitated rinses.

- Lifecycle / Sports Shoes defaults to Medium/Low water level and runs a specific Shoes profile which is reasonably gentle and includes a soak period, two deep rinses.

- Lifecycle / Max Wash runs maximum agitation profile which varies slightly per the sensed or manual-selected water level.


Post# 1123740 , Reply# 11   7/20/2021 at 13:33 (982 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA)        
cycles

What about the heavy and regular cycles?

Post# 1123750 , Reply# 12   7/20/2021 at 15:19 (982 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Jerome,

Intuitive Eco doesn't operate that way.  It doesn't have buttons or a selector for Heavy, Regular, Delicate, etc.  There's one standard cycle.  Two up-down scroll buttons for "How Dirty?" to select the soil level (six choices).  A button "Fabric Care" with choices for Auto Sensing, Creasables (with Auto Sensing), Wool, and Handwash.  Auto Sensing is the default.  Normal operation the user turns on the power, changes the soil level if desired (mid-level is the default), then presses Start.  The machine auto-senses the water level, and auto-senses the agitation speed based on how the load feels and moves against the agitator fins.

Two other up-down buttons scroll through a choice of options.  Some are typical such as Temperature, Soak, and Spin Speed.  Others are unique to this machine.  Any of the options can be set as defaults for the standard cycle if the user prefers it as such for typical loads, and still adjusted for individual loads.

Another button scrolls through a list of 13 pre-programmed cycles that run temperatures and operational sequences for specific laundry situations such as various stains, Diaper Rinse, Sweaty, Muddy, Comforter and others.  Options can be adjusted for each run of a programmed cycle but not saved to it.


Post# 1123764 , Reply# 13   7/20/2021 at 17:09 (982 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Agitation Profiles

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Glenn/DADoESofTX can you please email me and list here all possible wash actions/Agitation profiles? And the load types that might cause that wash action to occour?

Post# 1123778 , Reply# 14   7/20/2021 at 18:59 (982 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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I've not found any service or operational information that lists the agitation profiles or provides any specifics on how Intuitive calculates the wash profile for a load.  The selected/running profile is stated by a name on the display such as Soft, Caring, Easy, Medium, Active, and others.  Increasing (or decreasing) the soil level adds (or removes) a + symbol to a given profile, then next steps to a stronger (or softer) action, and increases (or decreases) the wash time.  *Stained alternates several agitation and soak periods.  A given profile varies slightly per the water level regards to larger or smaller load size needing stronger or softer action to effectively move the items.

*The Soak option inserts a 2-hr soak period (or 1-hr with Time Saver) midway into the wash with a few agitation strokes every minute for the duration and a few mins of agitation after the soak.


Post# 1123785 , Reply# 15   7/20/2021 at 19:36 (982 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA)        
so my assumption

is that the first auto sensing is the regular cycle. Correct?

Post# 1123789 , Reply# 16   7/20/2021 at 20:33 (982 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Kelly, I assume you know how to access diagnostic mode (hold Lifecycle, press Power)?  Diagnostics on Intuitive can be accessed while the machine is running a cycle.  Press Power (once, carefully to not accidentally turn off / cancel the cycle if it's running) to exit.

Warning Status (non-fatal faults), Fault Status (fatal faults), and Machine Status (includes temp thermistor reading and the temp the machine wants to attain) are the three diagnostic screens.  Press Fabric Care to turn the pump on/off.  Press Home to toggle the diverter on/off.  Machine Status says Diverter Off or Heating or On or Cooling according to its state.  How Dirty Up runs hot water, How Dirty Down runs cold water (must hold the buttons).

There are a couple more displays that require a trick.  After getting into diagnostics, press and hold Lifecycle until it beeps again.  Press Lifecycle once more to unblank the display if necessary (pressing Lifecycle in diagnostics turns the screen on/off).  The two additional displays will be in the up/down scroll sequence.

Version Status details the display and motor board software versions .. and the motor RPM.

The other screen reports the water level value (WL) I think in millimeters of depth, and some parameters related to fabric sensing.  I don't know what they mean.

These extra screens usually remain viewable in diagnostics until the machine is disconnected from power for a minute.

Blanking the screen and pressing Option Down button brings up a Control Options screen.
- Restart flag (toggled via Home) ... normally enabled (highlighted) has the machine try to restart and continue the cycle after a fault occurs that may be momentary.  It may try to continue multiple times on a fault until it gives up and actually stops with the fault.  Reason to disable Restart is to faciliate a servicer catching a fault quickly without waiting for the restarts to time-out.
- Recycle flag (toggled by Adjust) ... normally disabled.  Enabling it has the machine repeat a running cycle indefinitely until turned Off.  This is to faciliate catching a fault that occurs erratically, or testing that a repair is successful by running repeated cycles.
- Hot Tub flag ... set to on by the control board whenever the hot inlet valve is run during a wash fill and restricts spin to no more than medium speed.  Automatically resets to off after a cold rinse occurs.  Press Option Up to manually turn off Hot Tub if needed to troubleshoot a problem.


Post# 1123824 , Reply# 17   7/21/2021 at 16:20 (981 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Dryer making clicking noise

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Please don't tell me the motor controller is on it's way out. I don't have a spare and it's Not cheap!

CLICK HERE TO GO TO MaytagNeptune's LINK


Post# 1123830 , Reply# 18   7/21/2021 at 20:16 (981 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Noisy F&P Top Load Dryer

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I don't think that noise is caused by the motor controller or even the motor.

 

Open it up and see what is worn etc, these are not highly durable dryers, a regular WP 29" dryer will outlast at least 2 or 3 of these dryers.

 

John 


Post# 1124070 , Reply# 19   7/25/2021 at 11:31 (977 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
dryer durability.

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I know these are not the most durable but they are the coolest dryers ever made. The world's only large capacity top load dryer.

I'm also surprised that Glenn/DADoESofTX has not replied yet.


Post# 1124082 , Reply# 20   7/25/2021 at 12:46 (977 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Fault code recorded?

Check for loose objects in the drum, and run it empty to isolate the clicking from clothes tumbling noises.  Note that the drum baffles are not removable in case something has slipped under/into one of them.

Run it on Air Dry to check if the clicking still occurs without heat.  If so, check amperage or current on the elements to determine if relays for them are flipping on/off.

Run it with the top deck raised or the front panel removed (advise to lower the top deck into position so the side panels are stablized without the front panel) to perhaps help pinpoint the location of the noise if it's mechanical.

Edit:  If not, check amperage or current on the elements to determine if relays for them are flipping on/off.




This post was last edited 07/25/2021 at 14:26
Post# 1124855 , Reply# 21   8/3/2021 at 19:48 (968 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Replies #5 and #6

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I feel there should be a warning to swap in a PH7 Rotor and Stator. The Reflashed/Revised PH7 Board cannot handle the electrical differences between the PH7 and PH6 motor. If I would have known this, I would have swapped in a PH7 Rotor and Stator and Bought the slightly cheaper IWL16 Console. The Reflashed board cannot handle the PH6 drive. I noticed the PH6 Original board and the appearance of the reflashed PH7 board were COMPLETELY Different. It appears nothing was done to the revised board to protect it from the PH6 motor hogging more current. The PH7 Stator has larger magnets. The PH7 rotor has more magnets in most cases and they are smaller than PH6 and the PH7 Stator has Larger magnets and fewer magnets. The PH6 Rotor has larger and fewer magnets than PH7. The PH6 Stator has Smaller Magnets and many more magnets than PH7.

Post# 1124905 , Reply# 22   8/4/2021 at 16:51 (967 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Advance to 3 mins ...






Post# 1162781 , Reply# 23   10/28/2022 at 23:11 (517 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
Replies #17-19

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Fixed the Fault. Somehow a glob of Fabric Softener got onto the drum where the door is and was blocking the optical sensor on the sensor module. My Dad discovered this by slipping a piece of political Junkmail between the sensor module and the drum and the issue occurred again. After cleaning that spot on the drum throughly. The clicking noise stopped. Hope this helps someone in the future.

Post# 1162794 , Reply# 24   10/29/2022 at 09:44 (516 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Curious how that could happen.  The drum door is on the curved surface of the cylinder.  Softener could possibly drip down there when the machine lid is open.   However, the optical drum position reader is located such that it's protected from access (and drips) unless the machine's top deck is raised. The embossed dimples that the optical sensor reads are on the circular side of the drum, also protected from access unless the top deck is raised.


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Post# 1162806 , Reply# 25   10/29/2022 at 13:51 (516 days old) by MaytagNeptune (FireAlarmTechGuy4444 on YouTube. Interlochen MI)        
I was confused too

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Yeah the Glob of Detergent or Fabric softener + Lint and other debris was right in the home position gap. The debris blocked the reflection from the drum so the optical sensor couldn't see the drum rotating. When my dad slipped the piece of junkmail between the sensor module and drum, The machine shut down but when it was removed the machine started again. The glob was just in the right spot that when the topdeck was down and screwed in it clicked but with the top deck raised, It didn't. In quick succession by slipping the junkmail in and quickly pulling it back out. It did the same thing. Since the Topdeck blocks access to that area, I also am unsure how Fabric softener got there.


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