|
Thread Number: 88867
/ Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Versions of Tide Powder Detergents |
[Down to Last] |  |
|
| Post# 1134357 , Reply# 1 11/23/2021 at 21:12 (883 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas) | ||
 | ||
Post# 1134358 , Reply# 2 11/23/2021 at 21:20 (883 days old) by Launderess  (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
Have found Miele UltraWhite powder works well enough on its own. Persil liquid doesn't add much to the mix IMHO. One uses either one or the other.
OxiClean Free like all versions of their powdered products is largely washing soda with sodium percarbonate. You don't need any more washing soda since Miele Ultra White contains sufficient for normal cleaning purposes. Miele Ultrawhite contains far more sodium percarbonate (about 85%) than Oxiclean, with lower amounts of washing soda. Zeolite Sodium percarbonate (min.85%) Sodium dodecylbenzene sulfonate Sodium sulfate TAED Alcohols C10 – C18 ethoxylated Sodium carbonate Sodium C12-C18 alkyl sulfate Polycarboxylate Enzymes granules (Protease, Amylase, Lipase, Cellulase, Mannanase, Pectinase) Carboxylmethylcellulose Polyether/polyester copolymer Tetrasodium Etidronate Sodium silicate Perfume Optical brigtener DMS-X Dimethicone Colourant Moisture Here's the thing; when using activated oxygen products if more bleaching action is wanted (heavily soiled/marked laundry), then you need to increase dosage. Adding extra sodium percarbonate, sodium perborate or other substances doesn't really work. Ratio between whatever hydrogen peroxide source and bleach activator is fixed. When combined you get various versions of peracetic acid which is what actually does the work of bleaching, stain/odor removal, hygiene, etc.. Adding extra hydrogen peroxide regardless of source does nothing because after a certain point that fixed ratio between activator and oxygen bleach means excess of latter just hangs about with nothing to attach itself to. Whatever oxygen bleach used in excess likely has some benefits, but only within parameters of its natural state. This can defeat purpose of using activated oxygen bleach in first place. Since sodium percarbonate (or perborate for that matter) are quite active already at temps of 140F or above, you can just stop using Miele Ultrawhite and use either Persil ProClean and add separate oxygen bleach. Whole idea of activate bleaching systems is to obtain hot to boil wash results at lower temperatures. | ||
| Post# 1134370 , Reply# 4 11/24/2021 at 00:41 (882 days old) by powerfin64 (Yakima, Washington) | ||
@hippo
I agree with Laundress. I use all 3 of Mieles Powdered detergents, and a complete
believer in them. I don't own a Miele, but a new LG 4200 set, and have found Miele detergent is enough on its own, as Laundress said. Has proven outstanding cleaning ability time and time again with me, with low to no suds most of the time. Persil just isn't a "go to" product for me for stains. It cleans, but I wanted better and without the heavy scent it has. Oxiclean has its place, and I have a good supply of it, if and when needed, but don't use it a lot. Give Miele Ultra White a good go, see what it can and will do, with the proper cycle. I bet you'll be surprised with the results. | ||
|
Post# 1134372 , Reply# 5 11/24/2021 at 02:05 (882 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
Difference between two dominate bleach activators, TAED and NBOS largely stems from markets each were developed initially to serve.
Unilever launched activated oxygen bleach powered Skip to allow European households and other laundries to get "boil wash" results at lower temps of 40C-60C. Newer formulas today can even deliver oxygen bleaching at temps of 30C. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetraacety... OTOH P&G developed NBOS to cope with dilute laundry conditions of North American laundry done in top loading washing machines. Since these washers do not self heat water, hot is whatever comes out of taps. NBOS will give better results at 20C or 30C then often TAED. NBOS is much more soluble in water than TAED which is a good thing when you're washing in high dilution conditions such as with top loading machines. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_non... Again all this is to get around washing at 90C or 95C There are other bits as well such as pH, time, etc... Far too much for one to wrap up in a little nugget and present in this post. To be sure companies that produce oxygen bleach activators and their end customers, makers of detergents, bleaches, etc... All know what they're doing. Huge sums in money and amounts of time have gone into research and testing. Thus to get optimal use out of such product follow directions on packet. If adding a separate activated bleach product (not much sold in USA, but very common in Europe), can vary dosage as per directions to suit needs. OTOH an all in one product such as powdered detergent can only be scaled up or down in terms of dosage to suit conditions. | ||
|
Post# 1134373 , Reply# 6 11/24/2021 at 02:21 (882 days old) by lakewebsterkid (Dayton, Ohio) |
||
|
Oxygenated bleach You could always try OxiClean Laundry & Home Sanitizer! It has Sodium Percarbonate and TAED! I have used it for a little while in loads that I use liquids with. It is a decent addition. | ||
|
Post# 1134379 , Reply# 7 11/24/2021 at 04:49 (882 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
As with nearly everything else OxiClean powder wise you're still paying a lot for mostly sodium carbonate.
That "sanitizer/stain remover" is only Sodium Percarbonate…………………18.50% Tetraacetylethylenediamine…………4.44% Other ingredients…………………….…77.06% For a total of 100% Ingredient list here: churchdwight.com/ingredient-disc... Things are listed from highest concentration to lowest by regulation. Being as all this may standard industry preference is for 10%-20% by weight of total composition of sodium percarbonate. Bleach activators very between about 2% to 3% of total composition, with TAED around low of 1.5% to about 2% In both instances if too high amount of oxygen bleach and activator are used there is greater risk of fading and other color loss to textiles. This Oxiclean product uses only washing soda as water softener. Many TOL detergents and other products with activated oxygen bleaching systems use Zeolites, phosphonate, and or some other substances to deal with hard water minerals without solely relying on sodium carbonate. | ||
|
Post# 1134466 , Reply# 8 11/24/2021 at 22:25 (882 days old) by lakewebsterkid (Dayton, Ohio) |
||
|
Laundress For sure! Just as an additive to use with liquids, it is one of the few that carries both Sodium Percarb and an activator, as far as I am aware. | ||
|
Post# 1134510 , Reply# 9 11/25/2021 at 09:50 (881 days old) by Logixx (Germany) |
||
Meanwhile... | ||
|
Post# 1134622 , Reply# 12 11/26/2021 at 15:49 (880 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
Laundry detergent market in USA is "complicated" because it is rather fragmented.
Europe in large part moved over to H-axis washers with built in heaters ages ago. Americans are just now catching on but still not everyone is onboard. Thus there still are top loading washers (with or without central beaters), but without ability to self heat water. Because of above detergents here have to work across a wider range of laundry variables (water temps, dilution levels, wash time...) You can bung even badly soiled wash into any decent H-axis washing machine, and with proper cycle selection and water temps things will come out nearly perfect. This without addition of extra boosters or whatever for most part. Again makers of Ariel, Persil, and others long have figured that bit out. Piling onto this is fact just as in Europe Americans have more and more colored or dark things to wash. Even at lower temps activated bleaching systems will fade certain colors or darks. Americans historically never bothered with two, three of more different detergents. Well maybe two, one for regular wash and another for fine things, but now you also really need something that won't harm darks or colors. | ||
|
Post# 1134836 , Reply# 13 11/29/2021 at 08:43 (877 days old) by Logixx (Germany) |
||
|
Complicated
... from a German point of view, I find.
When I need new detergent, I simply walk in to Lidl, Aldi or almost any drugstore and buy their cheap store brand. Lots of enzymes, (activated) bleach - or - color transfer inhibitors and no optical brighteners. Pretty simple. No Borax, booster pacs, ammonia etc. needed. Now, I do understand that not everyone uses additives; oxy bleach helps with chlorinated water; enzymes may not work optimally with fairly short wash cycles and so forth. Still, reading on here how people scrutinize formulas does at times sound... complicated. 😁 | ||
|
Post# 1134907 , Reply# 15 11/30/2021 at 19:47 (876 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
Miele does not make Ultrawhite powdered detergent, nor any of their branded laundry products. Everything is sourced from third party under a private label agreement. Thus it is highly unlikely one version of a product is produced for Europe, and another for North America. That is unless company in question itself does so (such as the numerous versions of Persil).
EU product labeling laws are more strict and detailed than those for North America. This likely is why you're seeing more information for things sold in Europe versus North America. Shouldn't get too bothered; Miele Ultrawhite powder hasn't let me down yet. Give it a go.... | ||
| Forum Index: |
| Other Forums: |
|
|
|
|
|
Comes to the Rescue!
