Thread Number: 90295  /  Tag: Other Home Products or Autos
Dryer vents
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Post# 1148703   5/14/2022 at 10:03 (706 days old) by fan-of-fans (Florida)        

I was wondering, has anyone seen any interesting dryer vent setups? I remember there used to be a ventless device for electric dryers which was a rectangular plastic box that you filled with water. The cover had the vent hose connected to it and louvers on either side. The idea was you put water in the box which would catch the lint and then the air would come out the vents.

Some homes have the dryer vented through the roof, but these setups seem to clog. I heard of one house where the dryer vent went into the attic, but they had forgotten to actually vent it outside!

I prefer the thru the wall setup best as it seems more efficient. However, some of the caps or louvers that go on the outside wall seem quite flimsy.





Post# 1148705 , Reply# 1   5/14/2022 at 10:32 (706 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Those water trap things don't work.

Best exhaust route is shortest/straightest as possible.  Dryers should be installed on an exterior wall for a direct-shot to outdoors.  The blower wheel on F&P SmartLoad is at the exhaust port on back of the dryer.  My exhaust route is so short that I could reach through the outside exhaust hood and touch the blower if not for the angle of access caused by the hood.


Post# 1148707 , Reply# 2   5/14/2022 at 11:25 (705 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
Those various bucket filled with water devices are still on market. As noted already they are largely ineffective. You'll have lint dust all over, not to mention venting fumes from whatever your drying into your living space. This in particular chemicals from laundry products including scent/perfumes. If you use dryer sheets that just ups indoor pollution another notch.

Another strike against venting dryers indoors is it raises indoor moisture and heat levels. You may want the latter during cooler times of year, but increased moistness can lead to various health and other issues.

Have never found modern plastic traps on dryer exhaust flimsy. But then again haven't looked in ages. You can always seek out NOS things on eBay or elsewhere instead of today's largely made in China or Mexico offerings.


Post# 1148708 , Reply# 3   5/14/2022 at 11:41 (705 days old) by supersuds (Knoxville, Tenn.)        

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My dad had the bright idea of heating the garage in the winter by rigging a kind of diverter box with a flap to direct the dryer exhaust into the garage. You guessed it: So much moisture condensed there was water running down the walls and the inside of the garage doors. And of course everything was covered in lint. Didn’t last long!

Post# 1148710 , Reply# 4   5/14/2022 at 12:21 (705 days old) by fan-of-fans (Florida)        

Yeah I can definitely feel the moisture in the air if you put your hand over the exhaust flap outside. I'm sure you'd get moisture problems/mildew without it.

I forgot to mention my parents did initially have one of those ventless boxes when they first moved into their house. The previous owner did not have a dryer, so never actually installed a vent. They did not keep the ventless setup very long and soon after installed an outside vent. The dryer was near the exterior wall, but took a special sawblade to cut through the concrete block.

I sometimes like walking in the evenings, and you can tell when the dryers are going by the smell of fabric softener.

I remember seeing aluminum hoods on dryer vents but most places seem to have the plastic kind anymore. I remember in elementary school the dryer in the cafeteria vented outside and had the plastic vent with three louvers. You always knew when it was on because the louvers were open. Kids used to play with the louvers.


Post# 1148715 , Reply# 5   5/14/2022 at 17:13 (705 days old) by philcobendixduo (San Jose)        
Inside Wall

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My washer and dryer are, by necessity of house design, on an inside wall in the laundry room.
On the opposite wall is a window so at least the laundry room itself HAS an outside wall.
The dryer vent inlet is located at the bottom of the inside wall, travels up the wall, then across the ceiling to the outside where it vents above the window. The room is small so the distance doesn't affect drying time.
When I first moved into the house, the screen over the vent outlet was completely blocked up with lint.
A stupid design, really, as there was no way to easily remove the screen for cleaning.
I ended up permanently removing the screen so the vent pipe is open to the outside.
I've only had one "critter" find it's way in that way. A bird LONG ago got in there and made it's way all the way to the dryer end of the vent.
I wondered why my cat was always so fascinated with the dryer.
When I took the vent apart to clean it out, I found the lint encrusted, dried bird.
The outside vent is metal and is "stuccoed in" so it can't easily be removed or replaced so I just live with it as is.


Post# 1148718 , Reply# 6   5/14/2022 at 18:38 (705 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        

mark_wpduet's profile picture
for those of you lucky enough to live in a house where the your vent is on an outside wall..I'm happy for you...Try living in a house where the dryer vents through the roof...and the roof cap is at almost the very TOP of the roof of a very steep pitch. And this house was built in 2004.

I've said this before on here..Years ago I read a post on garden forum trying to find solutions about dryer vents getting clogged that vent through the roof. A lady responded and she said they lived in a condo and they had the same awful problem as mine...she said they use a nylon paint strainer and put it into the piece that connects the back of the dryer to the wall (sort of like lining a trash can bag)..I've been doing this for at least 7 or 8 years now..But my dryer is easy for me to get behind and it doesn't push right up against the wall..the piece that connects from wall to back of dryer pops off/on easily but is secure, I take the paint strainer that catches all the lint...vacuum it, put it back (takes me maybe a total of 5 min's) I do this after every 4 loads. The entire vent run has stayed clean for years. Clothes dry pretty fast..The first thing I said to the lady on the blog was...don't you worry about a fire? She said she was more worried about lint build up causing a fire than a paint strainer..I bought a pack of (5) 1 gallon paint strainers years ago and I think I'm on my third one..

Keep in mind I'm the only one doing the laundry and I'm careful about always keeping it clean. Having to do this is ridiculous but it's much better than dealing with an entire vent run clogged with lint and a roof cap that can't be accessed.

I can't even believe any code allows a dryer be vented through the roof. Oh Oh...and get this...when I first realized my whole vent run was clogging was about 6 mos after living here...I thought it was my dryer..two guys showed up to fix it and said my vent was probably clogged..they told me to have someone clean the dryer vent run...they started to leave and came back...I think as they were backing out of the driveway one of them decided to get up on the roof to check...I said ok...he got up there and said that not only was it clogged, but they didn't even have a proper dryer vent roof cap up there..that the builder put a bathroom exhaust cap..Got that replaced for FREE..but it doesn't even matter if you have a proper dryer roof cap...


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Post# 1148725 , Reply# 7   5/14/2022 at 20:18 (705 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Clothes dryer venting

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Dryer vents can cause a lot of problems with dryer performance, and extend drying time and cause the dryer to wear out much faster.

 

It’s actually very little fire risk with modern dryers even with bad vents.

 

The two warning signs people should be concerned about with any clothes dryer is if the dryer is gotten extremely noisy or if it’s taking two or three times as long to dry clothing the dryer needs to be repaired maybe the vent needs to be cleaned.

 

The lint in the pipes itself does not cause fires in the vent tubing lint will not burn in the vent pipe. Having a dryer vent go through the roof is no l worse than a long horizontal vent in fact it’s actually better to go straight up.

 

It’s obviously better to have a short vent going through a wall with a minimum amount of tubing.

 

If a dryer vent goes through an attic or a crawlspace the outside of the pipe must be insulated with at least a couple inches of fiberglass insulation. A vent through an attic or wall or crawlspace should never be anything but rigid metal pipe no flex metal.

 

I would not recommend putting any type of filter in the exhaust line unless it’s a large filter with a large filtering area, it just causes too much air restriction.

 

The Best thing to do if you want to keep the vent clean is to not clean the lint filter so often only clean it every 2,3 or4 loads once you have a fine layer of lint on the filter it. filters to and three times better than it does when it’s clean.

 

John L


Post# 1148737 , Reply# 8   5/14/2022 at 23:05 (705 days old) by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor, Maine)        

wayupnorth's profile picture
Being so frigid in the winter here and having experienced frozen laundry in my dryer once with an outside vent. Since I have a window beside my dryer and now I put the vent out the window with a board covering the rest of the window when on. An extra step but no cold air ever is entering the house when the dryer is not in use.

Post# 1148747 , Reply# 9   5/15/2022 at 10:01 (705 days old) by iej (.... )        

I’ve been petty happy with my Miele heat pump dryer so far. Seems to be the way forward as a technology for drying. Some of the earlier ones weren’t great but it’s maturing as a tech.

Post# 1148748 , Reply# 10   5/15/2022 at 11:56 (704 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK)        
@iej

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I agree with you, I have a Bosch although not new now it does a large load of towels in 90 mins and hardly any energy use nor a need for a vent what's not to like?

Post# 1148765 , Reply# 11   5/15/2022 at 15:13 (704 days old) by iej (.... )        

Yeah, the Miele has been impressive. I’ve had it since 2017 and its energy use is excellent and the results are as good as I was getting with a vented Miele at tiny fraction of the running costs.

It’s extremely gentle too. I could trust it with very shrink prone t-shirts.


Post# 1148773 , Reply# 12   5/15/2022 at 16:18 (704 days old) by Maytag85 (Sean A806)        

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Once upon a time Frigidaire made condenser dryers back in the 50’s and 60’s here in the US, reason why they probably went away was they got quite hot when drying, and didn’t do too well in warmer climates like the southwest. Gas and electric vented dryers with 37,000 btu burners and 8000 watt elements would run circles around Frigidaire condenser dryers and certainly run circles around modern heat pump and condenser dryers.

Post# 1148776 , Reply# 13   5/15/2022 at 16:27 (704 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK)        
@maytag85

ozzie908's profile picture
I think you may want to see what it costs these days to run an 8000 Watt dryer its why vented dryers over here are dying out as they just cost too much to run. With todays increases in energy bills I like a heat pump dryer as its gentle you dry anything in it and I manage to keep my bills down to a more manageable level as line drying is not guaranteed ... Oh and I do have a Huebsch gas dryer thats quite a few years old which I do use in the winter as it dries larger loads quickly, But it lives in the shed and depending on the weather I don't go down there.

Austin


Post# 1148777 , Reply# 14   5/15/2022 at 16:31 (704 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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My AEG condenser dryer is basically useless good part of year.

NYC weather from about late spring through summer and into autumn is either moist and damp, or warm (hot even) and muggy. Either way not sort of weather indoors conducive to running a condenser dryer. Another member who long since stopped posting would run his AC during warmer weather which solved those issues. Just prefer to use the Whirlpool vented dryer instead.

Our home economics lab at school had a matched washer and dryer set. Cannot recall brand name but dryer was water cooled condenser. Was fascinated by the thing since had never heard of much less seen such a dryer. Mother and everyone else one knew had big old gas heated vented dryers. Home eco teacher lamented having to use said dryer during water shortages, but she didn't have a choice. Way school was built home eco lab didn't have access to an outer facing wall where W&D could be installed. It's been years but wonder if that set is still there...

Over years have let several Miele heat pump dryers pass without even taking a nibble. Just don't see the point really. Do not dry many loads via machine aside from towels and some personal garments. Dress shirts along with bed or table linens are ironed either by hand on on one of my ironers.


Post# 1148785 , Reply# 15   5/15/2022 at 17:58 (704 days old) by Maytag85 (Sean A806)        
Reply #13

maytag85's profile picture
When I am referring to dryers with 37,000 btu burners and 8000 watt elements, I am referring to Whirlpool/Kenmore gas and electric dryers made from the mid 50’s to early 60’s just like the Frigidaire Filtrator dryers. A majority of gas and electric dryers from about the mid 60’s and on have been 22,000 btus and 5600 watts and that’s what most dryers are today.

Heat pump along with condenser dryers may cost less to run that a 5600 watt electric dryer but still aren’t as cheap to use as a gas dryer. Gas dryers are probably the cheapest dryers to run since they at most will only pull 500 watts which is used to turn the drive motor along with the igniter, gas valve coils, timer or control board.


Post# 1148786 , Reply# 16   5/15/2022 at 18:33 (704 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
By late 1960's between wringer washers almost dying out, and automatics getting higher final spin speeds, need for all that heat to bake (or broil if you will) diminished I shouldn't wonder.

Post# 1148812 , Reply# 17   5/16/2022 at 00:12 (704 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
Condenser vs vented

Even over here, condensers were more of a stop gap solution that just stuck.

Vented dryers are per load more efficient than condenser.
They are usually faster and gentler even in compact models.

Most of our housing stock wasn't build with dryers in mind, so no venting.
And since our small flats were usually the places you didn't want to hang clothing around, condenser quickly caught on.
Our energy labeling system actually gives a slight edge to condensers over vented ones. Idea is that the heat from the condenser heats your house compared to vented dryers sucking in cold air.

So vented dryers - even though they used slightly less per kg - got a C while condensers got a B.



Heat pump dryers turned the whole dryer conundrum on it's head.

In the beginning they were slow (about 50% longer cycles, or more), expensive (about twice the initial investment) and due to electricity rates not quickly viable.
They were kind blocking their own road to success: Those who could have gotten a quick ROI were large families with a lot to dry - but exactly these people were put off by long drying cycles.

Over the next 10 years they were optimised further and further.
BSHs blueTherm/EcoLogixx dryers were probably the most sold dryers for a long time - they were affordable, relatively quick and overall a good value.

Since the early 2010s, even more so 2015ish, something amazing happend.
Even cheap brands cracked the code to the dryer that has become more or less standard today.
The dryer has to be very well sealed (condensation efficiency class A, which means that for all moisture removed from clothing, over 90% is collected).
It uses a single speed compressor at about 500W or so.
The motor is an inverter driven design that runs both drum and fan - only using about 100W peak.
Reversing is kept minimal to none on the normal cycles. The fan wheel is optimised for one direction to improve airflow.


That gives you label drying times usually around 150min for 8kg and 90-100min for 4kg.
Efficiency class A+++.
That all means that day to day loads are usually all done below 2h with usually not more than 1kWh and at no more than 140F.
And all that for 500€ or even less if lucky if you are ok with lower end brands.

Before you needed inverter compressors and long cycle times, but just by thermodynamic optimisation, you no longer needed fancy tech to get the perfect efficiency rating in reasonable drying times.

If you are cheap, entry level machines can be had for an extra of 50-100€ over similar normal dryers.
Since even those basically cut usage in half, the usual run time until you break even is about 600-800h, a life expectancy even the cheapest machines will fullfill.




TL;DR:

Our heat pump dryers have gone from a novelty to an option for eco careing people with the hope to maybe break even to the only really viable option no matter the price point.

Over the next few years the environmentally very bad refrigerant R134a will be phased out and replaced by more reasonable alternatives makeing these dryers from start to finish the only logical solution in almost any regard.

My bet is that commercial equipment will be further developed so that the required cycle times can be reached while still being reasonably efficient and financially viable.

Once that tech is there it will be cheapend and scaled down and then US full size heat pump dryers will become an actual thing.


Post# 1148853 , Reply# 18   5/16/2022 at 18:23 (703 days old) by iej (.... )        

There’s probably less focus on them in the USA because of low energy costs. It’s very definitely a different market when it comes to that focus. Some of it is driven by cost, but also there’s a genuine awareness of the energy consumption of machines - it’s a huge part of how they’re marketed here.

Europe is also now moving towards basically the ultimate phase out of domestic natural gas anyway for both environmental and now also national / regional security reasons too because of Russia.

Heat pumps will be a big part of that and I really don’t think you’re going to be seeing any rush towards residential gas appliances again.




This post was last edited 05/16/2022 at 18:55
Post# 1148863 , Reply# 19   5/16/2022 at 20:00 (703 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA)        
dryer vent

I will occasionally sit by the dryer vent when drying clothes in my Kenmore elite by LG. It does get warm pretty quickly. I wonder how forceful it would sound if the vent was disconnected or straight piped.


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