Thread Number: 91301  /  Tag: Vintage Dishwashers
Rhode Island Rescue part 1 - The Frigidaire DW CIUK dishwasher
[Down to Last]

automaticwasher.org's exclusive eBay Watch:
scroll >>> for more items
Post# 1158109   8/28/2022 at 15:47 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

It's been a while since I've done one of my New England appliance rescue runs.... And I just could not resist two turquoise appliances that were being offered up here!   It was an easy drive and that new Honda sure can gobble stuff up... LOL  I'll post about the range in another thread. 

Naturally, I did some investigating of the dishwasher.  It is in fantastic condition!  The racks are pristine, no 'rack rot', the cutlery basket is intact, and the Super Surge wash arm and tower seem perfect.  Amazingly, the plastisol tub is clean, solid, and undamaged.  I really don't think this dishwasher has a lot of mileage on it!

 


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 7         View Full Size



Post# 1158111 , Reply# 1   8/28/2022 at 15:49 by turquoisedude (.)        
Testing time...

turquoisedude's profile picture

I added some electricity, just to see what would happen...

 

As Frank, the person who I got the dishwasher from said,  the motor seemed to start right up.  I could not tell if it was in wash or drain mode but I let the machine run for a spell but nothing else happened.  

I did a little messing around with the timer advance knob (that shaft with the slot-head screw opening that is right smack in the middle of the power cable terminals).  I could hear the timer cams turning and switches clicking.  So I tried powering the dishwasher on again.  This time, I pressed the "Rinse and Hold" button and glory be! I heard the rapid-advance timer start whirring and then the motor came on again.  However that's all that happened.  The motor ran until I cut the power.  I tried messing with the timer shaft again.  This time, I could definitely hear a timer motor running but I could not see it advancing.  While the timer motor was running, the heater in the tub was also on.  I figured I may have been in the 'dry' part of the cycle, however the blower fan motor was not turning.  Also, I felt a slight shock when I closed the door latch to start the machine...

I gave the timer shaft one last try - I turned it again and when powered back on, the motor started.  And curiously,  I got another slight shock. 

 

Given the recent bad luck I've had with rapid-advance dishwasher timers - IE: my 'holy grail' GE SU70T, I thought it might be wise to step back and see if I can dig up some service information on these models.  

If anyone might know of where I could get the manual, I'd be most grateful.

 

But, my initial theory is that there is some timer issue for sure, possibly also a wiring issue - bad connection or a damaged wire leading to the push-button and or door switches is my theory for now.  I'll do more exploration next week, but I'm not touching that timer until I read up on the way this dishwasher is supposed to behave!

 

EDIT:  Would the 1965 J-Line dishwasher be the same as this 1966 model??  I noticed there is a manual in the library for this one.... 

 

 


  View Full Size


This post was last edited 08/28/2022 at 16:08
Post# 1158126 , Reply# 2   8/28/2022 at 18:09 by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
65 and 66 Frigidaire top of the line dishwashers

combo52's profile picture
Hi Paul we have this exact same dishwasher in the museum, yours is in a little better shape but they werenít very inspiring dishwashers.

They had Kingston timers which could be troublesome like all Kingston timers,.

You should never test an appliance like that without a grounded cord we donít wanna lose you.

Do you have the service manual for this dishwasher?

John L


Post# 1158167 , Reply# 3   8/29/2022 at 05:39 by William637 (Damp pants? Not a chance. )        
Definitely a trend with these dishwashers

william637's profile picture
I have had two of these, both in pristine cosmetic condition. Both had the exact same issue. I gave one of them away, but I still have the other in a pile of stuff that I haven't gotten rid of yet.

Post# 1158186 , Reply# 4   8/29/2022 at 12:11 by rinso (Meridian Idaho)        

rinso's profile picture
When I was a teen, my parents bought this exact, turquoise, top-of-the-line dishwasher. Frigidaire had stopped making their spin tube models. There was nothing all that wrong with the spin tube dishwashers, but a whole lot of stupid by the owners not bothering to read or follow the instructions. Owners would often turn dome-shaped objects upside down on the bottom rack. The newer models had no soil separator (food particle filters) so we had to start pre-rinsing items by hand before loading, or end up with a lot of redeposited food. But hey, it was great looking!

Post# 1158249 , Reply# 5   8/30/2022 at 10:05 by RE563 (Fort Worth, Texas)        
I've always wondered......

re563's profile picture
On thses machines, in the top rack, the very outside rows, could one place glasses there, and I mean like regular drinking glasses?

Post# 1158254 , Reply# 6   8/30/2022 at 10:43 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

Robert, the upper teacup rack does swing out of the way, so I guess it's possible.  I'm going to also guess that the spray from the tower might not reach far enough into taller glasses though.   That was my experience with a newer Custom Deluxe dishwasher I used to have and which used the same wash arm and tower system.  


Post# 1158664 , Reply# 7   9/4/2022 at 16:02 by turquoisedude (.)        
Testing 1,2,3....

turquoisedude's profile picture

Did you really think I was going to wait until I found a manual for this dishwasher before I started messing around with it?

 

Hell no.... 

 

I figured that if proceed with caution and take lots of pictures all will be fine.   Famous last words... LOL 

 

I cracked the front panel to inspect the wiring, particularly to the push-button switch bank.  No signs of obvious damage there, fortunately.  

 

I proceeded to attempt to power the timer motors independently to see what, if anything, happened.  Both timer motors seemed to be getting power (they both hummed) but neither moved the timer itself.  So I tried extracting the timer motors.  First was the main timer motor.  When tested on its own, it hummed but the gear did not move at all.    Tried the same approach with the rapid-advance timer motor and I observed the same thing - motor hummed but the gear did not budge.  I was able to manually advance the gears on both timers, but when powered on they just do not want to move.  

 

I'm guessing that I'm going to need to replace the pair of them.  All I can see from the timer motor case is that they are both Kingston Model 60 - the rapid advance has a numer 6056 stamped on it, the main timer has 6054 stamped on it.  I'm guessing these are serial numbers.  

 

I'm guessing it may still be possible to find replacement motors, but I'm not sure of the specs (ie- how many rpms they are supposed to run at) and will I still be able to find one with the 11-tooth gear that meshes with the timer mechanism.  

 

Any hints, leads, sources would be greatly appreciated! 

 

Edit: further testing also revealed that the blower fan for the dry cycle is not working.  Funny how the motors on the timers and this failed, despite light use!


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 6         View Full Size
Post# 1158674 , Reply# 8   9/4/2022 at 18:25 by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
Kingston Timer Motors

combo52's profile picture

Hi Paul, there is a number stamped into the gear side of the motors that is the speed and rotation, the two motors are different.

 

These are the same motors that always go bad on MT and FD washers from the 60s into the70s, thankfully WP did not mess with these timers.

 

Replacement motors are out there, I even think someone rebuilds these.

 

The DW should work without the timer motors for testing purposes, the main motor and pump was another weak area on these early FD wash arm DWs.

 

John L.


Post# 1158690 , Reply# 9   9/4/2022 at 20:13 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

John, the last 2 places I knew of that did timer rebuilds as recently as 2 years ago are no longer interested in doing so.... 

I cannot see anything stamped on the gear side of either timer motor. Am I missing something?  I thought perhaps those stencilled number might mean something. 


Post# 1158692 , Reply# 10   9/4/2022 at 20:18 by bradfordwhite (West Coast, U.S.)        

bradfordwhite's profile picture

Paul, is there any way to oil the gears? Opening the casing and greasing or oiling I've had success with.


Post# 1158693 , Reply# 11   9/4/2022 at 20:26 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

I've found some information about the Kingston Model 60 timer motors - it seems they were used in several Frigidaire appliances including washers and dryers.  The original design used a nylon or plastic gear which had 'dogs' that would break off after a number of years.  If what I am reading is correct, there is a way to crack the timer open, replace the gear that broke with a brass one and all will be resolved.   Except I have stupid, shaky hands that I can't trust for anything anymore..... ffffffff....fiddlesticks.... 


Post# 1158694 , Reply# 12   9/4/2022 at 20:36 by bradfordwhite (West Coast, U.S.)        

bradfordwhite's profile picture

Sorry to hear that Paul.

I can't work on such things these days without magnifier and 500 watts of light shining directly on it so I know your dilemma. 

You'll get it working though.  I know you will.  


Post# 1158701 , Reply# 13   9/4/2022 at 22:13 by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        

combo52's profile picture

Paul, I think I can see the number on the left side of the motor your picture #4.

 

I have always been able to find good new or used timer motors, sometimes by buying a similar complete timer and taking the motors off it.

 

You could probably just take the motors off a Maytag A906 timer.


Post# 1158738 , Reply# 14   9/5/2022 at 13:48 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

John,  I found numbers on the gear side of the timers.  They both have the same notation:  30/11 L 60 C

 

I'm guessing '30' is the rpm rating, '11' is the number of teeth on the gear (which I counted),  no clue about the 'L', and I guess '60 C' is for use on standard North American 60 Hertz (cycle) AC power.   

 

I've found some information about this type of timer and it seems there was an internal gear that is likely to break easily.  There is a fellow in Pennsylvania who sells a replacement gear in brass, not plastic and has a procedure on how to replace it.  I'm scared like hell to open a timer... The GE SU70 timer incident did not end well and there are no longer any places that I know of who will do timer repairs.


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 1158744 , Reply# 15   9/5/2022 at 14:48 by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        

combo52's profile picture

Hi Paul, that’s the number I was talking about, it’s interesting that they’re both the same numbers usually the rapid advance motor turns much faster.

 

I’ll have to look at one of the Timer Motors I have like that over at the shop. And see what numbers are on those motors, I don't think the 30 means 30 RPMs, they do not turn that fast.

 

You could just take them off an old A906 that you’re junking. 

 

John L.


Post# 1158747 , Reply# 16   9/5/2022 at 15:07 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

Somehow if I had an A906, I don't think I'd be junking it!  LOL  

 

Please do let me know if you can find them - my PO Box in Vermont is accessible once again for easier mailing.  


Post# 1158774 , Reply# 17   9/5/2022 at 18:31 by qsd-dan (West)        

qsd-dan's profile picture
I'm 99% sure a Maytag 204663 timer motor is a direct replacement. Looks at the pictures and verify though.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115331414129QUE...


Post# 1159004 , Reply# 18   9/7/2022 at 17:37 by thatwasherguy (Kentucky)        
Oh WOW!

thatwasherguy's profile picture
Congrats on your find! They are both absolutely gorgeous machines. I do believe I'm about to turn turquoise myself with envy LOL. Good luck with both! By the way, could you please post a video to youtube of the dishwasher running? My Great Aunt has a (no longer functional, sadly) 1968 Custom DeLuxe dishmobile with the super surge wash system. Ever since I first saw hers, I've always wanted to hear one running.
Thanks,
Thatwasherguy.


Post# 1159044 , Reply# 19   9/8/2022 at 07:29 by Jetcone (Schenectady-Home of Calrods,Monitor Tops,Toroid Transformers)        
Paul

jetcone's profile picture
Get your gears and bring the timers down here. We can repair them. Oh bring the Easy while your at it too! And Ill also get all the ingredients for Chicken A La King !


Post# 1161778 , Reply# 20   10/15/2022 at 17:28 by turquoisedude (.)        
Update - The Frigidaire Custom Imperial has been revived!

turquoisedude's profile picture

I'll apologize in advance for the lack of pictures, but I cannot upload directly from my stupidphone and the picture orientation may be wrong (that effin' phone just may the first thing I run down a recently acquired NIB GE Disposall....) 

Long story short - the timers were both repaired, thanks to the help of a pair of steady hands at Steved's on the long Canadian Thanksgiving weekend.  I popped them back into the timer today and tested the dishwasher. 

Sonofathing worked fine!  I did a couple of 'dry' cycling tests to ensure the main and rapid-advance timer motors were working and they are.  

I had to try a 'bucket test' and I am pleased to report that there were no leaks or drips, amazingly, and I could most definitely hear water being moved around by the Super-Surge wash arm and tower!

Tomorrow, the tub and exterior cabinet will get a clean-up and I'll haul this beastie to the basement for a hot-water test.  If that's a pass, I think the '63 Whirlpool "Telephone Dial" dishwasher is getting early retirement in St-Liboire!  

 


  View Full Size
Post# 1161934 , Reply# 21   10/18/2022 at 15:45 by turquoisedude (.)        
More pics - details of the timer repair

turquoisedude's profile picture

I hope these pictures will work on the site; I've jiggered them to hopefully display in the correct orientation.  

 

I tried to 'document' as much as I could about how the timer motors from this 66 DWCIUK dishwasher were revived.  The issue with the machine was that when powered on, the pump motor started, but the timer did not advance to fill, wash, drain etc.   Both timer motors tested the same - it sounded as if the motor was running but the main drive gear would not advance.   I searched for replacement timer motors then stumbled upon a page from Dave's Repair Service in Pennsylvania which described the issue I had with my Kingston timer motors exactly.  

The problem was due to a broken gear (a sector gear) inside the timer - but the good news was that Dave had fabricated replacements.  In brass.  So I bought 2. 

Dave also posted a very detailed set of instructions on how to replace the gears.  I trust my shaky hands about as much as farmer would trust a starving fox in a chicken coop, but while visiting fellow collector SteveD on the Canadian Thanksgiving weekend, I had his help in cracking the timer cases, extracting the broken plastic gears, and replacing them with the brass ones.   We bench-tested them and both were now working again.  

I was itching to get back to Canada and get them back into the dishwasher timer!   


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 5         View Full Size
Post# 1161935 , Reply# 22   10/18/2022 at 15:47 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

I managed to get this short video as 'proof' the timer was now advancing, but trust me, I did several tests of the various cycles and functions, including the rapid-advance "cancel" option.  The timer was now working correctly once again! 

 




 


Post# 1161939 , Reply# 23   10/18/2022 at 15:57 by turquoisedude (.)        

turquoisedude's profile picture

This last series of pictures were taken this past Sunday afternoon when I moved the machine down to the basement in Ogden.  I had to remove the old-style copper water pipe connections to the water valve and get an adapter elbow to be able to (eventually) install it in St-Liboire.  I only got that part yesterday so the final cycle testing will only get done this weekend. 

 

I did take some time to give the tub a good wipe-down.  Under the dust accumulated from 56 years of very light use is a pristine tub and racks.  

 

I am very much looking forward to moving this to the Frigidaire-themed kitchen in St-Liboire very soon!  


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 6         View Full Size
Post# 1161942 , Reply# 24   10/18/2022 at 17:00 by Repairguy (Danbury, Texas)        

repairguy's profile picture
Good news Paul! Itís looking good.

Post# 1161947 , Reply# 25   10/18/2022 at 17:26 by Steved (Guilderland, New York)        
Yay Paul!

Never underestimate the power of a turquoise dishwasher!!

Post# 1162467 , Reply# 26   10/25/2022 at 08:02 by turquoisedude (.)        
First wash test

turquoisedude's profile picture

Hardly a Bob-Load but I selected a lot of cooking utensils, pots, pans, and bowls - the Pots and Pans cycle did an impressive job!  The main wash in this cycle runs for 32 minutes, with boosted hot water.  No dry cycle, but trust me, everything in this load was hot hot hot, so it flash-dried very quickly!

 

The only thing I didn't like was that there seemed to be some foaming going on and this caused a drip from the drying blower vent at the back of the machine.  I had observed spill rinse agent in the tub from previous transport so I guess my 'bucket tests' didn't quite wash it all out.  

 

There will be another dish-load test this coming weekend for sure!  


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size

Forum Index:       Other Forums:                      



Comes to the Rescue!

The Discuss-o-Mat has stopped, buzzer is sounding!!!
If you would like to reply to this thread please log-in...

Discuss-O-MAT Log-In



New Members
Click Here To Sign Up.



                     


automaticwasher.org home
Discuss-o-Mat Forums
Vintage Brochures, Service and Owners Manuals
Fun Vintage Washer Ephemera
See It Wash!
Video Downloads
Audio Downloads
Picture of the Day
Patent of the Day
Photos of our Collections
The Old Aberdeen Farm
Vintage Service Manuals
Vintage washer/dryer/dishwasher to sell?
Technical/service questions?
Looking for Parts?
Website related questions?
Digital Millennium Copyright Act Policy
Our Privacy Policy