Thread Number: 40212
Opinions on the early Maytag Neptunes
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Post# 595283   5/9/2012 at 12:38 (4,369 days old) by k1rod (Scottsdale, AZ)        

I don't see too much discussion on these machines here which seems a bit strange since they are such a significant part of US laundry machine history. I have an old MAH3000AWW SN# 18XXX built in Dec 1997. It was a very problematic machine for the first 7 or 8 years I owned it. I had all of the classic problems including the faulty wax motor burning up the control board, the poorly thought out switch reluctance motor and drive, the tub bearings going bad, The same faulty wax motors in the dispenser unit, top of machine rusting out under the dispenser bezel, mold build up on the tub sealing boot and a couple of bad timers. Fortunately for most of this time I had a Maytag factory service contract on the machine so all of the repairs and upgrades were covered by Maytag. It took a while but it seems that Maytag eventually effectively addressed most of these problems. For example my machine has had all three wax motors replaced so the main control board and the timer are no longer burning up. I have not heard of these new wax motors failing. I also upgraded the 400V triacs on the control board to 600V parts since this was one of the prevalent theories as to why these boards and wax motors were failing. (kind of like the chicken and the egg idea). The machine's drive motor and motor control board have both been replaced with a multi phase inverter drive system. The lousy switch reluctance motor and drive is gone. The new motor and drive seems to be very robust and I have not heard of any failures with them. The outer tub (complete with bearings) has been replaced. I don't this this design has been upgraded but there has evolved a much better understanding of the real need to use HE detergent and not excessive quantities of it. The sealed moldy boot was replaced with one that has a drain built into it. This hasn't completely cured the mold problem but it has greatly improved it and made it managable. And I replaced the machine top (easy fix) to stop the rust chunks from falling into my detergent dispenser. So as I said, this was a very problematic machine when I got it but since all of the "corrections" have been made to it, it seems to now be a very good and robust washer. I haven't had any problem at all with it for the last 6 years. I'm thinking these machines, once updated, are now very good machines now. What do you think?





Post# 595288 , Reply# 1   5/9/2012 at 13:16 (4,369 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA)        
A Neptune Fan here

swestoyz's profile picture
I did an overhaul on a 24 series MAH3000 about 3 years ago. Since then it has been my daily driver without fault. Certainly a fantastic machine once all the 'upgrades' were completed.

Thankfully the PHA upgrade had been completed prior to finding it behind Menards, and also that it was a later version with the log water valve instead of the wax motor controled water dirverter system.

The original bearings sounded great when I got it, and after 3 years of regular use, they still sound fine. Now, at the ripe old age of 14, the one thing it may need is a new pair of shocks.

Ben


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This post was last edited 05/09/2012 at 13:34
Post# 595290 , Reply# 2   5/9/2012 at 13:30 (4,369 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

yogitunes's profile picture
More like a Neptune Fanatic........Love them.......even made a demo door.....although I prefer the 5500 series....but pretty much the same inside....I have 8 of them.....

Post# 595291 , Reply# 3   5/9/2012 at 13:31 (4,369 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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Four here.......

Post# 595292 , Reply# 4   5/9/2012 at 13:32 (4,369 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

yogitunes's profile picture
AND...Four more....

Post# 595295 , Reply# 5   5/9/2012 at 13:47 (4,369 days old) by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor, Maine)        
I might be naive about this

wayupnorth's profile picture
But what is a wax motor? I just cant imagine wax and a motor together or what they accomplish. I had heard alot of horror stories about them but never dared to ask just what they were.

Post# 595300 , Reply# 6   5/9/2012 at 14:46 (4,369 days old) by joefuss1984 (Little Rock, AR)        
good question about the wax motor

joefuss1984's profile picture

I want to know as well


Post# 595302 , Reply# 7   5/9/2012 at 14:50 (4,369 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA)        
Wax Motor -

swestoyz's profile picture
Per the Wikipedia article.

They act more like a linear actuator than an actual rotating motor.

Ben


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Post# 595307 , Reply# 8   5/9/2012 at 15:07 (4,369 days old) by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor, Maine)        

wayupnorth's profile picture
After reading the article, now I understand the high failure rate. Guess I am too old school in that aspect. It did say they were used in some hydronic heating systems and that is what I have and hopefully do not have one in mine.

Post# 595319 , Reply# 9   5/9/2012 at 16:12 (4,369 days old) by AutoWasherFreak ()        

Not a bad price, if all that is wrong with it is the belt.


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Post# 595321 , Reply# 10   5/9/2012 at 16:13 (4,369 days old) by AutoWasherFreak ()        

Even cheaper yet, but how much is a new control board?

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Post# 595322 , Reply# 11   5/9/2012 at 16:17 (4,369 days old) by AutoWasherFreak ()        

And another

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Post# 595330 , Reply# 12   5/9/2012 at 16:57 (4,369 days old) by k1rod (Scottsdale, AZ)        

Even cheaper yet, but how much is a new control board?

 

Control boards can routinely be bought on Ebay for between $39 and $149.  But if you are handy with a soldering iron, they can often be fixed for about $9 worth of parts.  The high failure rate on these boards is theorized to have nothing to do with the board itself (although there is one very credible gentleman up in Washington State that believes the problem IS that there are 4 triacs on the board that were rated at too low a voltage) but rather the faulty wax motor in the door shorting out and taking the control board out with it.   This is usually easily fixed by replacing R11, which is a 3.9k ohm 1/2 watt resistor and Q6 which is a 400V, 800mA triac (I replace them with a 600V 1A triac because I think the gentleman in Washington makes a good point) and the faulty wax motor.  So often times, you don't even need to buy a control board, just fix the one you've got.  I've rescued a couple of machines from the scrap heap and put them back into service for just the cost of these three parts, $9.  The friends that I passed them on to have been and still are, very happy.


Post# 595333 , Reply# 13   5/9/2012 at 17:05 (4,369 days old) by AutoWasherFreak ()        

I would like to get a Neptune with this control panel instead of the electronic panel.

Post# 595334 , Reply# 14   5/9/2012 at 17:10 (4,369 days old) by k1rod (Scottsdale, AZ)        

That is an MAH3000AWW.  I've seen them on CL fo $30 and all they needed was the repair I mentioned  above.


Post# 595360 , Reply# 15   5/9/2012 at 18:41 (4,369 days old) by cfz2882 (Belle Fourche,SD)        

I have a may 1998 build MAH 3000-bought for $25,i had to repair the wax motor
and the control board to get it going and it has been great ever since. the
wax motors originally used in the neptune did not have any insulation around the
edge of the heat pellet and would "flash over"if they got damp,blowing out the
triac on the control board.My neptune had "dirty sneaker"odor pretty bad when i
got it,but this soon went away.


Post# 595388 , Reply# 16   5/9/2012 at 21:05 (4,369 days old) by fordtech ()        

The 4000 also has that old push button setup too. I purchased one in early 2001 when they were being replaced by the 5500. I thought I got over on the buyers who went with digital control panels and got me a genuine all push button setup like my trusty old 712 series top loader. Man was I ever wrong. The push buttons simply were switches to the electronic control board. Essentially the same thing you would be getting with digital control but no pretty lights or LCD.
I replaced that washer 5 years later with a 7500 series LCD touch screen set. They have gone for the past 7 years without a failure.
I purchased tons of replacement parts dirt cheap off Ebay over the years and have enough to do a complete ground up replacement of all the components which I intend to do when it gets 10 years of use on it. That should get me at least 10 more years. By then Ill be about 75 years old and dont know if Ill really care what Im using by then.


Post# 595391 , Reply# 17   5/9/2012 at 21:22 (4,369 days old) by fordtech ()        
addpic

Neptunes

Post# 595430 , Reply# 18   5/10/2012 at 00:39 (4,369 days old) by arbilab (Ft Worth TX (Ridglea))        

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I was set to buy one in 1998 until I found out it had no window. So I got a Frigiwhite FL which has needed no repairs and I still have it.

Seems I dodged a bullet. Until they were re-engineered the original Neptune was a DOG. Yeah warranty fixes it but somebody has to stay home from work to let the repairman in.

Sure there were reasons for the blown boards and waxmotors, failed bearings, two versions of bad motors, and the gym-sock smells. But nobody can tell me those exact problems didn't show up in prototype testing, assuming they even did that. So they either didn't test it or they did and shipped it as it was anyway.

A lifetime of credibility, blown on one model. Helluva way to run a business. If they'd fixed it before they sold it AND put a window in it, I'd love to have one. The slant tub has ergonomic and performance advantages over the Frigiwhite I ended up with.


Post# 595491 , Reply# 19   5/10/2012 at 11:06 (4,368 days old) by laundromat (Hilo, Hawaii)        

laundromat's profile picture
I hated these machines from the fist day they arrived at our store.I was lied to and told how Maytag had these in trial homes fifteen years before they were put on the market. Seeing the similarities in their nightmare combos from 1960 made me avoid selling them. About 85% of the sets I sold were either returned or constantly in for repair.I sold 200 stacked sets that were installed on the Disney ship, Magic. I had clearly explained to its captain that they should neither be installed on its lower deck nor be vented out up through the smoke stacks. He did it anyway and the ship had a severe fire a few years later ruining all the machines. The cause was lint build up from venting through the stacks.

Post# 595579 , Reply# 20   5/10/2012 at 19:20 (4,368 days old) by redcarpetdrew (Fairfield, CA)        

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I had a matched MAH4000 set for a very long time with little issues until I had a chance to jump at a MAH7500 washer. I had been wanting 7500s for a long time and had been stockpiling a 'wish stash' of parts in anticipation. Did a complete ground up rework. New bearings, boot, changed the motor and control to the new style and new struts. I also changed cabinets with a donor 4000 with a shot tub since the 7500 had a whollop in it from when the owner backed his car into it. I changed out the problematic Dayco belt with the new Hutchinson sourced belt. I love it.

 

My old 4000 washer went to a friend who is still using it with no issues. I still say that a fair amount of the issues with Neptune can be attributed to owners who can not/will not use the thing right. Wrong soap, no bleach, cold water ONLY, not wiping out the boot when done for a while, etc... Sure, there were design issues to be fixed such as the wax motor, but still the owners had a fair share...

 

Here's mine. I still have the 4000 dryer while I wait to jump on a 7500 electric dryer. As soon as one shows up, I'll overhaul it as well and switch the windowed door over.

 

RCD


Post# 595587 , Reply# 21   5/10/2012 at 19:59 (4,368 days old) by k1rod (Scottsdale, AZ)        

Hey Andrew, I'm kind of surprised. I assumed (you know what that gets you) that by the time the 7500's came out that Maytag was installing the new 3 phase motors as OEM. BTW Martin, your collection of 5500's is awesome!

Post# 595607 , Reply# 22   5/10/2012 at 21:07 (4,368 days old) by redcarpetdrew (Fairfield, CA)        

redcarpetdrew's profile picture
No, the early 7500's had the older motor then switched later.

RCD


Post# 595631 , Reply# 23   5/10/2012 at 23:47 (4,368 days old) by AutoWasherFreak ()        

I wish the Neptunes had see through doors, LOL.


Post# 595655 , Reply# 24   5/11/2012 at 01:54 (4,368 days old) by arbilab (Ft Worth TX (Ridglea))        
...See through doors.....

arbilab's profile picture
If they had, I would have bought one. Then I would have had to stay home from work a dozen times to let the repairman in.

I can't name another FL with no window. Even some DRYERS now have windows. What was Maytag thinking? "We can sell junk for $999 on the basis of our name alone, without bothering to test it"? Sure looks that way.


Post# 595737 , Reply# 25   5/11/2012 at 11:38 (4,367 days old) by mysteryclock (Franklin, TN)        

mysteryclock's profile picture
Ah, the Neptune. "The machine that killed Maytag.", as I would like to title my book about it (if I ever write one.)

We were so excited to leave our GE Profile TL W/D when we moved in 2001 and bought a brand new Neptune set for the new house (the teeny pushbutton version.) We loved the concept of a FL washer way back then, liked that it still fit in a TL-designed laundry room, admired the retro-future styling and logo, and believed that since it was a Maytag, what could possibly go wrong?? It was a great cleaning washer and sort of exciting to use, being new to FLs. But then...

First came the mold...lots of it. I'd chalk the first replacement boot up to user error, but the second and third were just bad design until they finally got to the one with the drain in it and it stopped turning black. Then came the wax motor failures, at least two. Then a control board or two (lost track.) Then the bearings started to sound more like a 707 @ takeoff. Finally in year 4, now past warranty and the very week we started potty training our oldest son (use your imagination there...) the washer completely failed AND the dryer died, within hours of each other. Seriously...what can go wrong with an electric dryer to make it completely die?!?

At that point I'd absolutely had it and vowed - as I suspect others may have too - to never own anything with Maytag on it ever again. That set was hauled away and a new Bosch Nexxt set installed, which we are still using to this day.

Adding to my irritation and anti-brand vow was the fact that Maytag never informed me of the lawsuit and subsequent settlement, in spite of having had a valid warranty registration and numerous contacts with them. I found out about it a few months after the closure.

I agree with the assessment above that the design of the washer, from a conceptual point of view, was interesting and innovative. But the implementation details showed a lack of real-world component testing and resulted in a problematic end product. By the time they fixed these individual problem spots, the damage to the brand was done and perhaps irreparable. It was during this time that they were acquired by Whirlpool, right?

If only they'd done more testing and sorted it out before a broader launch, it could have changed the landscape for W/Ds in America and FL acceptance sooner....alas.



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