Thread Number: 44235
Washer Timer Motors 		[Down to Last]

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Post# 650062   12/30/2012 at 22:42 (4,133 days old) by washer111 ()        

Are these timers 50/60Hz compatible, or are they usually "fixed" to one frequency or another?
Considering many manufacturers would've used the same design across differing voltages, one would think at least they'd use a multi-frequency timer motor.

Aside from minor things, such as fill times and such, would there be any adverse affects using a 60Hz timer motor in a 50Hz electrical area (with a step-down transformer, of course), apart from the timer running slower? Be interesting to know, as when I finally move away into my own place, I'd love to think that I could get something from the US (Yes, a dishwasher, if you must know! A GE or Kenmore at that too... Yes, I'd consider removing the heater element).




Post# 650112 , Reply# 1   12/31/2012 at 02:16 (4,133 days old) by fido ()        

Not something I had ever considered but I just found an image of one that says on it "50/60 Hz" so it looks like they are not synchronous. As you say, if it went slower on 50Hz the cycle would take longer but the machine should still work OK. If a timed fill did overfill you could get round that problem with a flow restrictor.

Post# 650129 , Reply# 2   12/31/2012 at 05:05 (4,133 days old) by fido ()        

Ooops, forgot the link. Not sure what you mean about the element, I can't see a dishwasher being much use without one!

CLICK HERE TO GO TO fido's LINK
Post# 650133 , Reply# 3   12/31/2012 at 05:18 (4,133 days old) by washer111 ()        
US Dishwashers

 Shouldn't really need the element! Especially if one has flaming hot Solar or Gas heated water, it is big savings!

Ooo! Now I just have NO excuse to get a GE Potscrubber (or a Whirlpool PowerClean style machine), though the former is definitely more desirable ;-)

Post# 650143 , Reply# 4   12/31/2012 at 06:12 (4,133 days old) by fido ()        

Do they have hot and cold fill? I've only ever seen cold fill dishwashers.

Post# 650155 , Reply# 5   12/31/2012 at 08:10 (4,133 days old) by washer111 ()        

Hot fill only. Water must enter at 120ºF to ensure good washability. The machine heats the water automatically after this (110v machines need this help). If using Energy Saver, have your water hotter, as the heating is disabled by default.

Post# 650166 , Reply# 6   12/31/2012 at 10:24 (4,133 days old) by fido ()        

Hmmmm, it would be interesting to use one of those plug in electricity watt-hour meters to see the relative cost of running a US versus a European dishwasher. The European ones could be connected to the hot water supply instead of the cold. I suppose you also need to compare water consumption.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO fido's LINK
Post# 650239 , Reply# 7   12/31/2012 at 17:10 (4,133 days old) by washer111 ()        

Errggh. That website you linked is so PC it ain't funny. Yeah, get rid of your refrigerator (older one), because we think it uses lots of energy! Well I'm paying for it, right?

I am not caring about energy consumption in this case. If I were, I might buy a Dishlex when the time comes. But knowing that I can trust a 20+ yo machine with my dishes is preferable. Besides, I have a real soft-spot for GE machines, despite never having seen one. I hope to visit the US someday in the next 5 years to experience a wash-party!

Post# 650315 , Reply# 8   1/1/2013 at 00:57 (4,132 days old) by arbilab (Ft Worth TX (Ridglea))        

arbilab's profile picture
Besides the time (speed) difference, a 60Hz coil is not happy at 50Hz because the impedances differ, thus it can overheat. A 50Hz coil works fine on 60Hz, just runs fast. Impedances still differ, but favorably.

Post# 650320 , Reply# 9   1/1/2013 at 01:37 (4,132 days old) by cfz2882 (Belle Fourche,SD)        

would have to try the motors on 50hz to see if they get hot from the impedance difference arbilab mentions-never had any trouble running 60hz motors on 50 hz myself,but could happen with some motors-to run 115v 400hz aircraft fan motors on 60hz had to reduce voltage to 24v and fans ran nicely at much lower speed.Same with 400v 200hz 3ph woodworking motor-had to test run at 115/60hz single phase with capacitor(machine had rotary inverter to get induction spindle motors to run~10,000 rpm)Once,just to see what would happen,finding the impedance was something like 800 ohms (IIRC),tried a 115v timer motor on 230v-didn't really get hot,but wouldn't run-just meekly buzzed,seemed magnetism was too strong to let rotor rotate properly.

Post# 650323 , Reply# 10   1/1/2013 at 03:02 (4,132 days old) by washer111 ()        
My Solution:

Perhaps use some sort of "timer restoration" company (if they exist!) and ask if it is possible to retrofit the existing assembly with a 50hz compatible timer. Doesn't have to be 240v, as a transformer can fix that. Whilst Rapid Advance is not necessary, it is kinda needed if you plan on saving energy (LOL). 

 

With the pump, I'm sure fitting a PSC motor for 50Hz wouldn't be too hard, again, 240v compatibility not needed. And as for the heating element, one could perhaps foray into the arena of solenoids/relays to initiate 240v for the heating (would allow hotter water too!). 

FrankenPotscrubber, here I come! (In about 3 years...)
Post# 650327 , Reply# 11   1/1/2013 at 04:28 (4,132 days old) by washer111 ()        

Oooh, maybe not coming... If using the machine at 240v, it would have to be rewired. Expensive and time consuming. Great... Cry

 

Although, provided I could find 50hz compatibility on the all stuff, it wouldn't be an issue.

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