Thread Number: 68965  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Speed Queen FL on the fritz *again*
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Post# 917509   1/25/2017 at 12:14 (242 days old) by stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Oh boy here we go. My wife said "something is wrong with the washer, and I smell something burning."
Sure enough there was a burning smell, while the 'wash' and 'rinse' lights flashed in unison.
The drum was motionless. She thought the smell was like rubber burning, I couldn't tell for sure.

I unplugged it right away and called the local service center. The service manager wanted the serial number, so I open the door and...flooded our wash room!
It was filled seemingly to the brim, at least half way up the glass in any case. Thank god for the drain in the floor.

When I told of this machine having the motor control board replaced once already, the tone turned grim.
" may have a lemon, SQ may need to swap you for a new machine, you might have to make some noise though."

A new board is no fix unless whatever contributing factor is also addressed, that is if the MCB is determined to be needing replacement...AGAIN. We shall see.
Egads, this is not good. This time the machine was plugged into the surge protector someone on this website recommended, after the last blowout. A quality surge protector whose lights are showing green as they should.

We have had no other appliance fail in this house for electrical reasons in 45 years time, and this machine was running only a half sized load of kids cloths...and probably has only run about 70ish loads thus far in it's short life.

This post was last edited 01/25/2017 at 14:30

Post# 917512 , Reply# 1   1/25/2017 at 12:40 (242 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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WOW! Another happy speed queen customer! Seem to be quite a few of you. Certainly makes me happy I DID NOT buy a speed queen. Maybe if you squawk enough, they might give your money back and you could get a good machine. It worked for someone else back a few months ago. She bought a completely different kind of machine and has no more trouble now.

Post# 917513 , Reply# 2   1/25/2017 at 12:47 (242 days old) by ea56 (Sonoma Co.,CA)        

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While I appreciate reading your post, I'm afraid that instead of sharing this with everyone on, I would be first on the phone with Alliance in Wisconsin, wanting to know just what they intended to do to make this right, especially after what the service tech said to you over the phone. For a much as you spent on this machine I certainly hope that you can get a satisfactory resolution. If Alliance is as good as so many seem to think, they will make this right for you. Good Luck!

Post# 917518 , Reply# 3   1/25/2017 at 13:59 (242 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
Opening the Door...

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Should not have flooded the laundry room.
Water level should never be that high in this machine.
What model is this?


Post# 917521 , Reply# 4   1/25/2017 at 14:27 (242 days old) by stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Let me copy and paste from the now ironic receipt:

AFN50RSP113TW01 Speed Queen 3.3 Cu. Ft. Front Load Washer with Long Lasting Durability - White

Post# 917525 , Reply# 5   1/25/2017 at 14:30 (242 days old) by washerdude (Canada )        

Filled halfway up the glass? MCU gone again? I'd say this is a definite lemon.

Post# 917529 , Reply# 6   1/25/2017 at 14:46 (242 days old) by stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Our first problem was fixed by unplugging the machine for a day or two until the service tech arrived, he plugged it in and declared nothing was wrong with the machine. I was not there and subsequently guessed my 87 year old mother wasn't used to the pausing drum motions of her first ever FL washer and wrongly figured something was I am not so sure. That was a year ago.
THEN the machine failed with all the lights flashing in unison...that was the first motor control unit.
I watched the new one get installed and was not confident the tech was very familiar with our model of Speed Queen. I think he even said he was more comfortable working on the TL machines...but that's only a guess. He was guided through the diagnosis from SQ over the phone it seemed. That was over the summer.

And now this. I chose a different SQ warranty repair outfit this time that claimed to do more SQ work than any other in the region.
Hard tellin' not knowin'...

Post# 917532 , Reply# 7   1/25/2017 at 15:02 (242 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Isn't there a way to drain a SQ washer that has stopped?

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Or maybe I shouldn't ask?

Post# 917614 , Reply# 8   1/26/2017 at 07:18 (241 days old) by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
Over Filling SQ FL Washer

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You either have a bad inlet valve  [fairly common on this series ] or the air-dome at the rear of the outer has some type of build-up in it blocking it which keeps the pressure from sensing how much water is in the washer. { a blockage here is usually related to a combination of local water conditions and poor detergent choices, usually too little for water conditions }


The other reasons could be a bad water level switch or air-dome hose that is loose or has a small hole in it.


In any event while this is disappointing it is easy to fix and will not harm the longevity of this washer, this type of thing can happen to any FL washer, we see it all the time on WP Duets.


If they want to give you the newer model of this washer I would take it, But if it was me I would really like to know what went wrong, especially if it is a blockage problem in the air-dome [ your fault ]


After 40+ years of servicing major home appliances I have seen almost NO LEMONS it is really highly unlikely that nearly every machine can come off the assembly line in perfect condition and then one comes off the line with multiple problems. Most so called Lemons are a combination of shipping damage, poor installation, and poor service. For many years we would buy back appliances exchanges from WP where they had exchanged an appliance and we would fix and resell them with a full factory warranty and we almost never had another problem with the appliance.


John L.

Post# 917651 , Reply# 9   1/26/2017 at 10:34 (241 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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Funny thing that we hear about so many lemons of speed queen on here, isn't it? I mean for such a fine machine that has no lemons.

Post# 917653 , Reply# 10   1/26/2017 at 11:25 (241 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Two lights flashing in unison is the door lock error code...
a replacement part has been ordered and will be on the truck when the tech arrives.

Post# 917654 , Reply# 11   1/26/2017 at 11:38 (241 days old) by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
Over Filling SQ FL Washer

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A bad door lock will not cause the machine to fill 1/2 way up with water, be sure that the tech checks for causes of overfilling.

Post# 917656 , Reply# 12   1/26/2017 at 11:50 (241 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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anything that is built, today as well as in the past, your never going to find something that is 100% on the money, without a dud in there somewhere....

as in first thoughts, NEVER buy the first generation, or first off the assembly line....thats just common sense....theres always going to be glitches until they work out the bugs....

of the millions of machines built, if a few hundred end up being duds for one reason or another, from a company stand point, their doing pretty good...

oddly enough, Alliance has been supportive with customer service to fix or replace.....

then again, you have companies like LG with their exploding machines, telling their customers where to go.....

its just a chance you take with any purchase you make for anything....

Post# 917658 , Reply# 13   1/26/2017 at 11:56 (241 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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And don't forget the burning smell too.

Post# 917676 , Reply# 14   1/26/2017 at 13:28 (241 days old) by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

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+1 to what Martin said. Any product made (that we all can afford) will have a percentage of failures that must be accounted for.

The Speed Queen machines are generally well designed and heavily constructed although a bit crude. Their quality control is very likely not as good as the Asian companies (this is true of MANY American made products). But in the long run the SQ machines are going to well out last the lightly made import machines. Especially since those companies are likely to discontinue part support earlier then Alliance will.

I don't like the word Lemon either as it tends to be just a catch phrase that people use when they don't see the whole picture. Problems stem from bad design, construction or inferior/defective parts. Assuming the machine is reasonably well made, seeing the same problem repeat is more likely bad service. Obviously seeing the same part fail frequently would hopefully have the company make an engineering revision.

Years ago I worked with a woman that had a little Dodge Omni 024 that apparently ate front brakes like they were going out of style. She had replaced the rotors a few times and the calipers twice. One day she pulled into work and the rotors were glowing red. She was bitching about how she had a 'lemon' and I pointed out that she likely just had bad service. I asked if they have ever replaced the master cylinder (they hadn't). It was clear that the brakes were staying engaged. She took it to the dealer and they replaced the master cylinder and voila the problem never returned. Bad service isn't a lemon.

Post# 917678 , Reply# 15   1/26/2017 at 13:34 (241 days old) by washman (Butler, PA)        

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Funny thing that we hear about so many lemons of speed queen on here, isn't it? I mean for such a fine machine that has no lemons


Even funnier is how many on here have raved about switching from an over hyped over engineered HE algore pleasing machine to a crude, SQ TL and have never looked back.


I guess it depends on how one defines " many lemons......"

Post# 917682 , Reply# 16   1/26/2017 at 13:40 (241 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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What you are comparing a speed queen top loader to, is a piece of crap that was NEVER meant to work like a traditional top loader and could not POSSIBLY do even a decent job at anything! Not a fair comparison. In THAT comparison, of course the speed queen top loader comes out FAR above all others! Compare them to a front load machine and they will lose in every category except how quickly they get the job done. Front load machines are the best now and save water too. If all I could have was a top load washer, speed queen would definitely be the clear choice.

Post# 917705 , Reply# 17   1/26/2017 at 16:37 (241 days old) by jp10558 (Southern Tier, NY, USA)        

It's also generally accepted that you'll get far more people to voluntarily talk about things that they had a negative experience or problem with than people who have no problems at all or had a positive experience. Think about it, if everything is working fine, and you're not a fanboy or the like, you're not likely to go to any trouble to find out about or join or even and leave a review. But whoo boy - if it broke, especially more than once? You're far more likely to go looking to see if everyone else had a problem, and if so comment.

So given the ratio of positive to negative reviews? Speed Queen is probably amazing IMO. I've seen 2 or 3 posts, one of which was a cross post, of a SQ failure and return. That's just not unexpected, especially as you start to see them get into the market.

I will say these failure modes of FL don't really make me in any hurry to want to switch to FL. It would take an explosion style failure in most cases for me to flood the floor from a TL - opening the lid to see the serial# isn't going to flood the floor for instance!

Post# 917793 , Reply# 18   1/27/2017 at 04:16 (240 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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All of that about negative experiences is quite true, there are many more positive experiences than negative ones. However, trying to make speed queen machines out as the ONLY front loader one should EVER buy is ridiculous. They may be built as a more heavy duty machine is some ways, but they lack capacity and features that are important to many people and they clearly have issues. Their front load machine doesn't seem to be any better for home use than any other machine is as far as dependability goes. The top loader is a completely different story. It is very easy to be the best top loader when you are the ONLY top loader that washes clothes like a traditional washing machine. Doesn't make you the BEST, just makes you the ONLY choice. If there were still other machines around like Maytag or Whirlpool belt drive machines, they would NOT be either the BEST or the ONLY choice in top loaders. They NEVER have been the BEST machine since automatics started being manufactured or the most heavy duty.

Post# 917795 , Reply# 19   1/27/2017 at 05:06 (240 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

" may have a lemon, SQ may need to swap you for a new machine, you might have to make some noise though."

I love to work in a company that replaces the product immediately at no cost for the customer before the customer has the chance to start describing the problem.


Post# 917806 , Reply# 20   1/27/2017 at 07:32 (240 days old) by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
Speed Queen Is The Best Full Sized Front Load Washer

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Ever sold in North America for home use.


It is the only full size machine with a Stainless Steel outer tub.


It is the only FSFL washer where the main bearings and seal can be replaced easily without total disassembly.


It is the only FL washer that is used by the tens of thousands in commercial settings.


It is the only FL washer sold to home owners with a full 5 year parts and labor warranty.


Yes we are all washer nuts here and some of the features on WP, MT, FD, Samsung and LG FL washers are fun, but 90% of Americans do not give a F... about that they just want reliable washing and drying performance.


Hi Bruce, I find it very funny that you constantly recommend Korean-Chinese washers and dryers and yet supported DT.


Hi Thomas Comparing a Speed Queen FL washer to the little plastic washers your company is selling is like comparing a portable vacuum cleaner to a pickup truck and while both can technically be repaired one is always repaired, when you have a problem with the PUT they don't give you a new one and crush the first one, LOL. Even if this SQ FLW were to get exchanged it will be repaired and go on to live a long happy life.

Post# 917816 , Reply# 21   1/27/2017 at 08:58 (240 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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First of all, I have NEVER been or said that I was a Trump supporter. Secondly, sometimes you can make something so heavy duty and commercially sound that you forget some of the important attributes it might need to appeal to people and function easily. Besides that, I cannot see that speed queen's front loader is so head and shoulders over anyone else's. I also fail to see what possible difference it makes whether the outer tub is metal or plastic. Metal does rust, the many top load speed queen washers I saw and worked on proved that to me. Those outer tubs rusted out exactly where the seal is and had to be tossed. Many of them suffered this fate early in their existence. I have only had my LG made machine for over 3 years now, so I cannot really tell you how long it will last. But I do know that it has already outlasted at least a couple of speed queen machines so far by some of the posts in here. I don't expect it to last forever or probably over 10 years, very little ever does these days. I also bet that it is a LOT less expensive to buy a plastic outer tub than it is a metal outer tub should you need to.

This post was last edited 01/27/2017 at 09:34
Post# 917818 , Reply# 22   1/27/2017 at 09:00 (240 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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This machine has left me high and dry without washing ability in the house for over two weeks so far (and counting), for 2 non-operator error failures, and it's only been in use for a year and a half.
I have 5 and 7 year old boys and an incontinent 88 year old to contend with and paid a huge premium NOT to have this kind of thing happen.
We had a working 27 year-old DD Whirlpool that only broke once in that time (water inlet) and when it did so it managed to not spill a drop, that we gave away to make room for this SQ...oops. Shoulda made room some place in the garage and we would be washing dirty laundry now instead of looking at another week of being unable to do so.
What you are missing here John is that my trust of this machine is nearly shot, and depending on the outcome of this go round, I may never feel comfortable that it can work reliably again...which is the opposite of what I paid for in the first place.
This is why the "lemon" or "dud" reference came up. The motor control unit is a cripplingly expensive part, over $600 plus install if not under warranty.
I may ask for a warranty extension at least, no matter what happens, because this seems clearly an "early production-we-are-still-working-the-kinks-out-bear-with-us" situation.
This remember is the newly designed 3.3 drum model, ordered just weeks after they were released, that took months to deliver as the factory was behind on orders.
SQ should encourage it's service centers to have all these typically defective parts on hand so repair turn-around times are lessened.
In another post I made here, just a day or two before this incident, I suspected some people just have bad luck with some brands and should move on...I hate to say it but I think SQ is on the brink with ME in this regard.
In other news our (older than this SQ FL) Samsung French dooor refrigerator soldiers on with nary a complaint, as does our even older Bosch Dishwasher and our nearly 20 year old Sony TOL tube TV.

This post was last edited 01/27/2017 at 12:30
Post# 917819 , Reply# 23   1/27/2017 at 09:11 (240 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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Sorry, but for the price people pay for a speed queen machine, I would expect much better than the service it seems that they provide and expect not to have a lot of trouble with it in the first place. From seeing the posts in here, it seems they have a lot of sales/service places that either do not know what they are doing or are dishonest and try to sell new ones when the old one can be repaired. I also think they have very poor quality control which is typical with manufacturing companies in the USA now. That is also the reason I drive a Toyota. I might also add that I have had my LG made machine for over 3 years now washing what sounds like the same kind of stuff you are without a single problem. The incontinent pads are hard on it I am sure, but so far so good. I too have an 88 y/o and lots of laundry.

This post was last edited 01/27/2017 at 09:42
Post# 917823 , Reply# 24   1/27/2017 at 09:51 (240 days old) by peteski50 (New York)        
Speed Queen!

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From my observations on FL washers this newer Speed Queen unit is one that seems just right. On the previous models their was just not enough settings. Now you have the ability to adjust the soil level (wash time) plus get a prewash and 2 extra rinses. The only thing I think that should be added is a heater! Otherwise what else do we need to do laundry?? Keep It Simple! And the capicity is large enough. These other big monsters out their are totatly ridiculous. And I wouldnt be so opposed to them if they were combos. Most of these machines should have a drying fuction. (that would make more sense) - I have a LG 24" combo and am happy with the washing performance. And you take your chances on anything you are going to buy! I recommend that all take a extended warranty on anything you buy!! Instead of all this energy saving control. Their should be strict Quality control. Aside from these newer Speed Queen machines I feel the Frigmores were the best in terms of simplicity and fuction, it is to bad they stopped making them.

Post# 917826 , Reply# 25   1/27/2017 at 10:36 (240 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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The capacity is NOT ridiculous if you have a king size down filled comforter that has to be washed on a regular basis. It saves a trip and the expense of going to the laundromat. That is a great savings indeed! Having a cycle that will heat the water to help in sanitizing and cleaning is also a great help too. I have nothing at all against speed queen machines, I just don't think they are all that and a bag of chips.

Post# 917828 , Reply# 26   1/27/2017 at 11:10 (240 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

stricklybojack's profile picture
Thinking I may get these for back-ups to give me confidence I won't have to go through this again.
Sadly that decisively kicks the SQ into the, 'fancy but unreliable' territory, like say a French or Italian sports car...if you know cars. A lot of 60's and 70's Dad's caught tooling around in Mom's old reliable while his foreign job was in the shop I recall as a kid here in California. Back in Minnesota, where we moved from, given the weather conditions, such cars were virtually unknown at that time.

Perhaps the Range Rover is the best auto analogy. Something with tough "heritage" but rings up eye popping service charges from jump street...until they are towed to the crusher with not a lot of the miles on the clock. While a Toyota Land Cruiser in the same circumstance would have been trouble free and just getting broken in, being a third of the way through it's typical usable life span.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO Stricklybojack's LINK on San Diego Craigslist

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This post was last edited 01/27/2017 at 11:40
Post# 917834 , Reply# 27   1/27/2017 at 12:03 (240 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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And to answer Laundress:

I opened the door to get the serial number unaware the machine had bizarrely filled up with water.
There were no suds in this water so I DID'T SEE IT IN THE GLASS. But as Malcolm pointed out, this shouldn't happen at at all in any case.
Then Combo John damned with faint praise by stating that was a COMMON issue, not to worry, easy fix. But what about the burning?
I digress...I still wait for the tech to makes his FIRST appearance because the other commonly failing part, the now apparently toasted door latch switch, is enroute down from Los Angeles...I guess.

Oh and I was told over the phone, "do not drain the machine"...cuz I asked already.
Thanks for your interest everyone, a team of experts is on the case 24/7 and I no doubt believe the machine is fixable after a full tear down in the shop as Combo John has also informed us.
That said, i no longer have the pleasure of simply thinking the van will roll up, and after some tinkering we will be good to go. It's possible but experience tells me this will take at least two trips given "unexpected further issues" resulting in the need for other parts "we don't normally stock blah blah blah"...which is the new normal when you design digital electronics into a metal box full of water and early adopting customers do the lion share of your beta testing.

This post was last edited 01/27/2017 at 12:32
Post# 917836 , Reply# 28   1/27/2017 at 12:16 (240 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Those machines of sale above ... the washer is a Catalyst model.  Has some very nice features for a direct-drive agitator toploader.  But there are a few model-specific parts that have gone NLA for the Catalyst when I checked recently.

Post# 917840 , Reply# 29   1/27/2017 at 12:54 (240 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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Looks to be a pretty good deal! Bound to beat what you got now.

Post# 917846 , Reply# 30   1/27/2017 at 13:40 (240 days old) by runematic (southcentral pa)        
works well but the dryer timer will sometimes activate or (b

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Sounds like the electronic control is going out on the dryer.  We've seen MULTIPLE failures of these controls on the washers & dryers.  Buyer beware.

Post# 917850 , Reply# 31   1/27/2017 at 14:50 (240 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Price vs. Service

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Have news for you, what is happening to OP is pretty much the norm these days for appliance service regardless of price points; high or low, it really doesn't matter.

Miele is a prime example of this, just ask anyone (including)myself about getting anything serviced from that lot.

Everything is the same; telephone call to say "what is wrong"; appointment to send someone to "diagnose" the issue. If part isn't on tech's truck or not in stock has to be ordered. There may be a second visit to do the repair if tech cannot do it (for a host of reasons) on first visit, and there you are.

Pointing out to Miele that you've paid $$$ for something that is supposed to last decades but has broken within less than a year won't get you far either. Whatever the German equal of "stuff happens" seems to fit the usual response. That and or "what did you do to the machine"? Because the machine "cannot be doing that", so the inference is you the user are to blame.

Of course when tech finally does show up (a week, two or more later) it turns out yes, the machine *is* doing what you said and that something is truly broken/wrong.

Post# 917851 , Reply# 32   1/27/2017 at 14:57 (240 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
It is to laugh

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What SQ says about their electronic controls:

But seriously folks, having compared my fully computer controlled Lavamat to the "electronic/mechanical" older Miele, would take the former over latter any day of the week, at least for front loaders.

The Lavamat is able to full control drum motions in a way the Miele cannot. This results in far less banging, clanging and whatever due to unbalanced loads. In it's defence the Miele is built like a brick chicken house and designed to withstand a certain amount of "abuse". OTOH the Lavamat goes more towards avoiding the stress caused by unbalanced loads by trying to eliminate where possible.

Have watched the large new SQ washers at local laundryette, and they also cope much easier with unbalanced loads than the previous mechanical versions. IIRC one of the top complaints about the older domestic SQ models was that they vibrated excessively.

Post# 917852 , Reply# 33   1/27/2017 at 14:59 (240 days old) by runematic (southcentral pa)        

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Just for clarity's sake, I was referring to the craigslist ad for the Catalyst machines.   I was just going over this thread again, and I realized the craigslist text wasn't on the thread, just on the ad.

Post# 917853 , Reply# 34   1/27/2017 at 15:13 (240 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Laundress, like you said...the SQ in question is the "with knobs" version of the Fl machine. No touch screen and less wash options, but the same computer running the same mechanicals.
Runematic, yes I caught that too and have better options already teed up.
Even found a FL PANASONIC washer...'cept it was mislabeled and was actually a dryer. Straight from Taiwan, 120 volt.

Post# 917854 , Reply# 35   1/27/2017 at 15:21 (240 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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I think just about anything would beat what you got now.

Post# 917910 , Reply# 36   1/27/2017 at 23:02 (239 days old) by stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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This a contender for backup duty? I suspect some of you will say yes...just a hunch.
The gent in question has the matching dryer, $75/each

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Post# 917921 , Reply# 37   1/28/2017 at 06:06 (239 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        
If I had the room....

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I'd certainly have an old orbital Maytag like MIL's and Mom's.  Both are still chugging along after 23-24 years. 


"Sadly that decisively kicks the SQ into the, 'fancy but unreliable' territory, like say a French or Italian sports car...if you know cars."

reminds me of an old joke....

"You know why Italians make such comfortable shoes?   Because their cars are always in the shop"


I don't want to jinx my computerized Miele w1986 but it is a phenomenal machine.  I didn't buy SQ because it doesn't have a heater and I like using 240V to power one.  But I would consider SQ.  I really hope they sort this out for you and that it goes many years without further problems.

Post# 917935 , Reply# 38   1/28/2017 at 08:30 (239 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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I can tell you from experience those Maytag machines would probably be a good choice as back up. They are very much like the one's I had before I bought my front load set. They were bought new by my brother, were passed to my parents when he remarried and then passed to me when my parents went to a retirement home. None of us ever had a moments problem with them. I would never have gotten rid of them and only did so for the extra capacity. Someone else has them and is using them daily now.

Post# 918157 , Reply# 39   1/29/2017 at 20:15 (237 days old) by stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Waiting for my dinner to be served at a family Thai place in San Diego.
In the wagon (tight squeeze!) is the Maytag gas dryer, and it's washer mate is already in my garage from my earlier trip.
The dryer just had $180 of service done. They are clean and were installed high and dry inside a condo, meaning used only by the one resident. The washer does have some denting on the front but that is all, it weighed a ton considering it's size.
Oh and i got them BOTH for $100 total, yee ha!
pics to come.

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This post was last edited 01/29/2017 at 23:21
Post# 918163 , Reply# 40   1/29/2017 at 20:42 (237 days old) by dartman (Portland Oregon)        

Sounds like the kind of deals we used to get as a family when I was a kid. When I moved to my first house family gave me the beat Whirlpool we had used for years and I got a cheap dryer eventually that all barely made it a year. Then I found a new Hot Point bol washer and dryer set from a shady acquaintance and somehow managed to get 10 years out of them.
That set should get you down the road and you can stash or sell them and break even at least. Hope they fix the Speed Queen and you don't have any more issues.

Post# 918167 , Reply# 41   1/29/2017 at 20:54 (237 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

All this shows one thing I've been saying for years...

Speed Queen is an excellent washer? Yes, sir. It is.

A Machine entirely build of plastic is a piece of garbage? No or Yes, there are several factors like design, engineering, even the type of plastic and how the washer is used and where the washer is installed that will say if a washer made of plastic is good or not.

Are all the other washers in the world pure garbage if they're not Speed Queen? (Like some people here love to say). No, they're not.

There are machines and machines. There are people and people.

If i get the worst "Chinese crap" washer and put in a house where the used has "common sense" built in the way the washer is used, the poor quality will continue being a relevant factor but surely even the crappiest washer will last much longer than exactly the same product put in a house where a millenial jackass will use it.

Oh, so you're saying this Speed Queen broke because of the user? No, I'm not saying that at all. Several factors may have caused the malfunction, Speed Queen is an excellent brand, they have excellent engineers but they can make mistakes. Maybe this unit only had a mistake, who knows? Maybe during the production one of the workers made a mistake almost irrelevant and the result is appearing only now, the washer may have suffered shipping damage or a power surge... who knows? There are thousands of factors that can make a washer stop working.

One thing is obvious. It's ridiculous when somebody says "Oh, only Speed Queen is good, only speed queen is worth. speed queen is the best of the best and you're an idiot if you choose whatever other brand in the world."

No, guys, some of you are wrong! Speed Queen is an excellent washer, i agree. It's among the best washer in the world. I also agree, but it is a piece of metal with a motor, like all machines in the world. It's not immaculate, it's not a machine that will last forever. And (i know it will hurt some people) Yes, machines break. All machines. it can be a washer, a dryer, a car, whatever... machines break and all the Speed Queen units will break too, someday. A machine that lasts forever does not exist.

I've watched people here having serious discussions and even fighting because of Speed Queen. Do we really need that? How boring the world would be if we had only Speed Queen.

Honestly, i hope Speed Queen can solve the issue with this customer. The machines I design are really far from being a "Speed Queen", but my company and I do what we can. And when something goes wrong, we try to solve the problem immediately. Speed Queen has an amazing engineering and design team, but they need to improve their after sales. Making a good machine isn't enough. The manufacturer needs to be there, on the background, ready to help the customers ASAP. They have a technical service network all over the country, it's much easier for them. My company doesn't have a technical service network and we never took more than 9 days to have a customer using his washer normally again because when a customer calls or emails me, as soon as I get the first contact, i know i have a 60-minute deadline to process everything and ship the replacement unit otherwise my boss will be really unhappy and almost strangle me (not literally, of course).

The thing is... Why do companies in the US are always making things difficult for the customers? Oh, you have a warranty, to use it you must submit the warranty card, copy of your DL, a copy of the last three bank statements from your grandparents, you neighbor's dog vaccination card, then wait 3 months, until one of our authorized co-workers analize the case and we will decide if you deserve a chance to have the problem solved in less than 15 years.

Come on! The washer broke under warranty, so let's fix it ASAP to make the customer happy. Everybody knows that mistakes happen and machines break, but if we react fast and give a decent solution for the customer, that's gorgeous!

It is so ridiculous nowadays that I feel really ashamed to use our warranty as a "feature". Everybody should have a similar after sales service focused on efficiency. F-word de profit, the milk is already spilled, cry won't do anything, so let's move our asses and clean the mess asap to make the customer happy.

i'm really sure that if on the first call Speed Queen said "Oh, I'm sorry this happened, please don't worry, we're sending somebody to replace your washer in 24 or 48 hours", this thread would be titled "Wow, my Speed Queen broke and they were awesome" and the member who created it would be very, very happy with Speed Queen, trusting the company much more and recommending Speed Queen to his friends.

Post# 918177 , Reply# 42   1/29/2017 at 22:06 (237 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Well said, thanks for taking the time to write and post it.

Post# 918207 , Reply# 43   1/30/2017 at 03:54 (237 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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I think you made the right choice for machines to use as back up till your's is repaired again. Those look close to the same machines I had when I got my front load set. They are still going strong for someone else I gave them to. My dryer was gas also.

Post# 918275 , Reply# 44   1/30/2017 at 13:53 (237 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

stricklybojack's profile picture
Well the saga continues, until "Thursday at the earliest."
The tech was here and able to recreate the circumstances we experienced. electrical burning smell, and an over filled tub. The motor board was throwing off all sorts of codes but then the tech did a smart thing, he put his hand on the pump and said the it was very hot and shouldn't be. A quick test confirmed the pump is toast.
He has to get a new pump ("those rarely fail") sent out and speak to SQ to decode the board codes it was giving, to see if it too needs replacing ("those do fail").
My hope is the board in the machine is good and this machine only needs a pump.
Given the earlier board failure and now the pump I still will wonder if this machine has a gremlin lurking in the electrical system. The tech, who did impress me as more than a simple r & r guy, said the board has a fault diagnosis system which would alert us to any shorting in the harness.
OTOH the machine showed the code for a door switch failure. And the tech, who brought the unit we have been waiting to arrive with him, said the old one was working fine and didn't need to be touched.
Will keep ya posted..

Post# 918276 , Reply# 45   1/30/2017 at 13:57 (237 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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So, how is the back up set working for ya?

Post# 918348 , Reply# 46   1/30/2017 at 21:36 (236 days old) by combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
Over Filling SQ FL Washer

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Hi Robert, I feel your pain with this washer and as a Speed Queen dealer if this washer had come from us and we could not fix it within a few days of your contacting us you would at least have a loaner machine. [ why aren't you dealing with the local dealer that sold you this machine ? ]


That said after reading what happened on the last tech visit I don't think they have a clue as to what is wrong. What your were told by the company when called the first time { you may have a lemon } would be reason enough for them to lose their service franchise with SQ.


A drain pump is either bad or not, they are as simple to test as a light bulb, they do get hot to the touch.


The tech should have attempted to find out why the washer filled 1/2 way up the door, a bad drain pump will not cause a washer to over fill, normally this would be caused by a bad inlet valve or a problem in the water level sensing system.


I hope these guys can fix this great washer, we have sold over 50 of the new style FL washers and not replaced a single part yet.


I was excited today to have a warranty call on the electric FL stack version of this machine that we had sold and installed last April, the customer said that the dryer went completely dead, when I got there the dryer worked just fine, but stopped working about ten minutes later and after I looked behind the machine I found the 240 cord had worked its way out of the outlet, LOL.


We also do warranty for a local dealer that buys SQs in orders of 250 machines at a time, over 1000 per year and the only problems we have had is with a few TL washers, mostly bad timers.



Post# 918359 , Reply# 47   1/30/2017 at 22:41 (236 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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This tech is from the nearest SQ dealer as determined by the SQ website dealer locator. I originally bought it online from an authorized dealer there, as I didn't know it would be breaking so often. I was also in Manhattan and wanted it delivered and ready for me to install when I arrived here in San Diego that summer. And that's what indeed happened chronicaled in another thread right here on AW. So this machine has actually not even seen much use yet, and still all these issues.
The inlet valve seems to be working as he was able to run the rinse cycle. The tub way over filled and then we smell the burning again. The burning smell was coming from the pump...which tested as bad...
Repeat, he test the pump and found it faulty. He also determined it was the source of the burning smell, perhaps it burned him?
He was also considering the water level sensing mechanism and that may still come into play.
First thing to to get this machine pumped out as it is sitting there way over filled with water waiting for him to return...and Thursday is his first available slot.
He knew I had been a week already on this go round, and I told him about the previous board failure and the week we waited for that part.
SQ needs to find out about FedEx, yes...but this tech is so busy fixing other BROKEN Speed Queens it wouldn't matter anyway.
I digress. The next visit will be last visit wherein if I am still in limbo, I will call SQ and ask for a new unit be sent out or our money refunded.
Now I have the 20 year old Maytags that are ready to clean cloths and an SQ that is apparently allergic to dirty laundry, so I am no longer as attached to my dream of joining the SQ for life fraternity, seems it may just not be in the cards for us.
Btw both techs out have spoken of fixing these FL SQ's. So I guess I'm not the only one.

This post was last edited 01/30/2017 at 23:08
Post# 918378 , Reply# 48   1/31/2017 at 02:27 (236 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

If you need a washer to help you while the situation with Speed Queen is unsolved, please send me your shipping address via private message here or at email and I'll ship you a Miniwash Blue and a Mini Countertop Spin Dryer as a gift. There will be absolutely no cost for you.
Let me know if your dryer is working, otherwise I'll also send a Solaris Dryer and the Over-the-Door Bracket.

They're small, but much better than nothing.

Post# 918379 , Reply# 49   1/31/2017 at 02:29 (236 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

Wait! I can ship a Superpop! It's better, at least it has an "almost full size" capacity.

Post# 918704 , Reply# 50   2/1/2017 at 22:41 (234 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        

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Glad you got those Maytags!  Mom's dryer is gas too and has always done a great job.  I watched a video once about the orbital transmission and was fascinated that it has so few moving parts.

Post# 918787 , Reply# 51   2/2/2017 at 15:16 (234 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Well apparently the machine was giving the code for "needs new control board" and one has yet to be located....none to be found for some REASON. The service manager explained this is the course SQ wants to take DESPITE the fact this is the second board replacement in less than six months...and thus the third board in this machines short working life.
I have to believe they are getting A LOT of board failures to eat another board without special instruction on looking for a contributing factor. In better news at least a replacement pump is now on hand.
I will give it a whirl when a new board is finally located, but if it fails yet AGAIN I will do everything I can to replace BOTH SQ's with machines that parts are readily available...FL Maytags likely. I have the TL Maytag Dependable Cares but would have to add a gas line and live with the small capacity.

This post was last edited 02/02/2017 at 18:17
Post# 918874 , Reply# 52   2/3/2017 at 06:03 (233 days old) by foraloysius (Groningen, the Netherlands)        

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Perhaps these boards are sensitive to changes in the voltage? Have you considered putting it on a surch protector?

Post# 918894 , Reply# 53   2/3/2017 at 08:47 (233 days old) by yoblount (TX)        
Surge protector

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OP says they have had it plugged into a surge protector.

Post# 918899 , Reply# 54   2/3/2017 at 09:10 (233 days old) by foraloysius (Groningen, the Netherlands)        

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Sorry, missed that one. Next question then. There is nothing wrong with the surge protector?

Post# 918950 , Reply# 55   2/3/2017 at 12:41 (233 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

stricklybojack's profile picture
It is a new high quality surge protector. We have numerous electronic devices, computers, smart phones modems etc. and other gear: TV's, refrigerators, and the problems.

Just checked the paper work on this machine and was surprised to see the last new board was put in just before *Thanksgiving*.
Less than 2.5 months ago...much more recently than I had originally recalled.
Called SQ this morning and was put on hold for a while, then sent to voicemail. I'll try again.

Post# 918969 , Reply# 56   2/3/2017 at 13:45 (233 days old) by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        

All electronic control speed queen units have built in surge protectors. In fact, all speed queens except the awn432 have built in surge protectors

Post# 918979 , Reply# 57   2/3/2017 at 15:14 (233 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

I still want to know why Speed Queen didn't replace the washer yet.

Post# 919189 , Reply# 58   2/4/2017 at 12:42 (232 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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I was told i would have to "make some noise" for that to happen and have yet to do so. I have been giving the repair guy time enough to properly diagnose the problem and the required parts to be found/shipped.
In the mean time we needed to run a couple loads and there is no way in H-E-DOUBLE HOCKEY STICKS i am going down to the SQ equiped landromat and pay to run an effin' load.
Besides i got something that kicks my SQ's ass all day long and twice on Sunday...


This post was last edited 02/04/2017 at 16:51
Post# 919197 , Reply# 59   2/4/2017 at 13:34 (232 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Yes the heavy-duty-super-capacity Dependable Care Plus saved the day.
I decided to marry my two favorite hobbies and vacuum the dryer, although i have no need or plans to use it just yet.
I removed a vent on the back an found a rug of lint needing removal.
In the pics you see a before and after look behind the control panel.
Do repair persons EVER vacuum a dryer? This one just apparently had $180 of servicing but that clearly didn't involve the strenuous back breaking task of a quick vacuum.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 919205 , Reply# 60   2/4/2017 at 13:52 (232 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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That is very sad and unfortunate. I would be furious, if this happened to me. I know I was when it happened to my LG made refrigerator and I am working with the second one like the first one I had, only a newer model. Appliances are only as good as the service you can get on them. Right now I think the fridge is going to be ok, but who knows about tomorrow? I would NEVER recommend an LG refrigerator. This one has been services 3 times for freezing up. The last time they replaced the entire back panel with the blower and the computer control board. The time before that they replaced the ice maker. It seems to be operating correctly TODAY. I really think we have government regulations to thank for a lot of this, trying to cut energy cost. Certainly that is what behind top load HE washers. Depending on the shape your Maytag is in, it will probably give you many years of use. The main thing I have seen commonly fail on those is the siphon break going from the fill spout and sometimes the water valves will stick and need to be either replaced or serviced. Maytag really was the DEPENDABILITY company you could rely on. Shame they make them no more.

Post# 919685 , Reply# 61   2/6/2017 at 13:31 (230 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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It's Monday morning, the sun is up, and my washer is still broken and filled with water and no replacement part or end of my ordeal in sight...yes I own a Speed Queen.
I paid an extrodinary premium for the pleasure of working the phone with regularity hoping to get this POS operational again, even if for just a matter of months cause that's all it has been able to muster at this point, and my expectations are now that low.

So I called my service guy, no part, no eta, no status at all whatsoever.
So I called and waited out the hold and talked to SQ HQ. They were only to happy to inform me I needed to call my authorized service center back and explain to them about the "SQD" program. Really? You guys aren't worried YOUR BIGGEST REPAIR OUTLET IN THE COUNTRY's FOURTH LARGEST CITY doesn't know about *your* program...ya want me to handle it? O-k-a-y...anything else I can do?
Then I let him know about the waiting, the previous board failure, and all the rest, and he came back with "SQD"...
Then I pleaded with him to at least assure me if this part also fails like it did just recently SQ will make it right..."SQD"
...his only response, and his repeated reminder *to me* to do what some other person BESIDES THE CUSTOMER should have already done.
But they got ya by the short hairs don't they?
So I sucked it up and called the service manager and educated him on SQD..."huh, never heard of it."

Don't get suckered, don't get a FL SQ unless you are ready to pay AGAIN with your time, inconvenience, and peace of mind.

And take what professionals on internet message boards say whilst opining with great authority, with copious amounts of salt...ahem, imo.

And to the person who offered to send me a new portable machine, THANK YOU and please email me again.

This post was last edited 02/06/2017 at 18:01
Post# 919732 , Reply# 62   2/6/2017 at 16:39 (230 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
So that we are all in the know...

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What is the SQD program?


Post# 919737 , Reply# 63   2/6/2017 at 17:02 (229 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

stricklybojack's profile picture
Good question Malcom.
Apparently it's a means whereby a dealer and/or parts suppliers can order a specific part directly from SQ and avoid various minimum order reqs, and standard shipping speeds...I assume.
The part is meant to be headed to where it is needed much more quickly than a part ordered through the usual proceedure likely would. Perhaps this is for warranty work only, I do not know.
In my case the dealer has now scavenged a part somewhere and is scheduled to be installed tomorrow.
So next time I will be at least somewhat better prepared to negotiate repair work having heretofore labored with the ignorance of not knowing SQ has outsourced it's dealer information desemination to it's customer base...doh!
Or this dealer, and the last one too, are a little slow on the many years slow.

This post was last edited 02/06/2017 at 18:13
Post# 919740 , Reply# 64   2/6/2017 at 17:10 (229 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
Your ordeal almost

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sounds like my ordeal with during the 2nd year of ownership with my Duet!

Error code FDL- called service - service guy comes (orders door latch), a few days later returns to put new door latch in -(didn't fix the problem). He tinkered with the wires with the to cover removed...that fixed it for a month, then F11, called for service - they replaced the CCU or MCU (I can't remember) and it's worked flawlessly going on 12 years now with never another problem. LOL

The saving grace was that I was actually able to do laundry during all of this. You could literally hit the top back right of the machine with your fist, and it would start working for a few more cycles.

Anyway - just thought I'd share that. Sorry you're having to go through all the unnecessary drama. They should send you a new washer and take the old one back ASAP if anything to improve whatever they find keeps causing your current machine to malfunction.

Post# 919744 , Reply# 65   2/6/2017 at 17:18 (229 days old) by ea56 (Sonoma Co.,CA)        

This post has been removed by the member who posted it.

Post# 919853 , Reply# 66   2/7/2017 at 07:08 (229 days old) by mrb627 (Buford, GA)        
It has been my experience...

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The better trained service personnel work on the commercial side and not the domestic line. Might be a good plan to seek out one that might be willing to do both.


Post# 919859 , Reply# 67   2/7/2017 at 07:53 (229 days old) by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        

Sqd is speed queen direct. Basically your servicer can get any part for your machine direct from speed queen with overnight shipping. All the more proof they are a bunch of idiots over there.

I seriously went to ONE training and I know about spd.

Post# 919895 , Reply# 68   2/7/2017 at 11:27 (229 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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Which is sad because an appliance is only as good as the service you can get, should you need it. No matter how well built a machine it is, if it doesn't work it is no good at all.

Post# 919911 , Reply# 69   2/7/2017 at 13:23 (229 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Well I have a working washer again...hopefully it will stay working longer this time.
In this repair session I learned a lot, best summed up with the statement, "should've got the TL Speed Queen."
Really, that is it in a nutshell. I almost did too, but at the last minute went for the FL thinking they made more sense, cleaner dryer cloths while using less water.
What I didn't factor in was the greater complexity to the FL machines leaves them more susceptible to major failures than their TL brethren. And the appliance repair eco-system knows the TL machine like the back of their hand while the FL machine is seen as exotic-trouble-prone fruit. When I asked the parts manager how it could be he didn't know about Speed Queen Direct he said, "never came up before, we always had the needed parts in stock." In other words he wasn't replacing boards on FL machines but standard items on the TL machine.

As far as we can tell the pump choked on a sock and failed, which inturn likely caused the motor board to fail. Now what happened last time I don't know, the board failed on it's own. In both cases the board was collected for shipment back to Wisconsin, presumably for fault diagnosis and perhaps a reboot.
The tech said repair personnel used to be able to perform firmware upgrades in the field on a SQ but that is no longer the case. "Planned obsolescence?" I asked, "you got it" the tech replied. The repair tech also said Samsung and LG were far worse than SQ in that area though.

So a pox on both our houses. FL SQ users like me need to be ultra careful about pocket contents and the use of a garment bag. And I think SQ needs to beef up the motor control board protections and provide a training DVD or YouTube video to every tech to clarify the whys and wherefores of the FL product. Suffice it to say this tech had some seriously mistaken ideas on their use. "You should never wash a sheet bigger than a twin, you will overload the machine and wear out the suspension"...was one clearly highly mistaken gem of misinformation. "You should see lots of water splashing or you are overloading the machine"...was another moment he was clearly in need of some retraining. Very nice guy though, and good at what he did know.

Nonetheless he did convince me, along with my own experience, these machines are not family friendly.
Kids socks end up everywhere, stuck in pant legs etc. so even with judicious use of a garment bag we will no doubt miss one here or there and this machine will choke on it every time...which apparently also puts the board at great risk of failing as well.
So to the users of SQ TL machines, thumbs up, you made the right choice. All the good things said about those machines likely hold true...for *that* machine; FL buyers, caveat emptor.

This post was last edited 02/07/2017 at 17:42
Post# 919917 , Reply# 70   2/7/2017 at 14:10 (229 days old) by Lorainfurniture (Cleveland )        
Let's look at the clues

Initial failure, sock in pump. The speed queens will attempt to fill again despite not draining until it hits the flood switch. This is why you had so much water in it the first go around. Somehow the "tech" didn't catch that and assumed the board was bad?

He then removed your good board, and likely put in another board that they took off another machine. I would bet at no time he was wearing an anti static bracelet? Was the board in a pink anti static bag?

So by not properly handling the board he almost certainly static shocked it and ruined it. Static related failure doesn't always happen immediately, but it's only a matter of time.

Board # 2 finally goes bad.

He installed a "new?" Board? Was he wearing an anti static bracelet? You would know because he would have connected himself to a cold water pipe or the ground part of your receptacle via a wire.

If he didn't you will have another board failure in the coming months.

Did the guy ever call the speed queen tech line while he was there?

All of your hardships could have been avoided.

I'm not saying that sq is the best washer, but from a reliability standpoint there is nothing better out there than the fl. Your "tech" made a mess of a very simple issue that really is no fault of the machine.

Post# 919918 , Reply# 71   2/7/2017 at 14:14 (229 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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I can't imagine how the sock got into the pump. The LG made front loader I have has a sort of trap that protects against anything like that happening. So that is very bizarre if speed queen does not have a protection against that. Only washer I know of that used to do that was an old GE FF and even it would pump the sock down the drain. The whole experience certainly does not make me wish I had bought a speed queen.
And as far as "exotic trouble prone fruit" that could be said of many and not just machines.

Post# 919920 , Reply# 72   2/7/2017 at 14:40 (229 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Eugene, the first board failure, 2.5 months ago and was not in conjunction with any other issue.
This board failure was in conjunction with the pump failure and water overfill.

BOTH times they replaced the board because that was the code is was giving.
He specifically chose to replace both items at once rather than one than the other with a test between.
He gave a reason for this "based on experience", but I am not completely clear on what it was.
I do recall him speculating that the board likely had actual components burned out and thus a simple reboot would not suffice, even if he could do it, which apparently he could not. And this somehow related to his choosing NOT TO replace one component first and run the machine before replacing the second.
So I repeat, the board was giving the "needs new board" code on both occasions it was replaced, and that is why it was replaced.
I don't recall a bracelet being worn. I see people tear into their computers all the time on the web doing up grades and never wear such a bracelet. However if that is the proper procedure I again repeat my remarks from above: SQ needs better and easier access to training for this machine...and these damn boards are finicky, and trouble prone in the real world, imo. Not to mention, if you are out of the warranty period the board is simply cost prohibitive to replace. I see them as time bombs...insuring the fact that although most of this machine will last for decades, a critical part of it will not, sucks to be you. Or, if you buy a SQ, simply get the TL machine and sleep soundly. And that, as I said before, is what I now wish I had done.

This post was last edited 02/07/2017 at 16:11
Post# 919922 , Reply# 73   2/7/2017 at 15:02 (229 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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I sure do hope this does it for a while. Shame you are having so much trouble.

Post# 919946 , Reply# 74   2/7/2017 at 17:28 (228 days old) by washman (Butler, PA)        

washman's profile picture

After reading this thread, doesn't it sort of remind us that oftentimes simpler is better?


Control boards?


all other assorted electronic thingamajigs?


I'm not suggesting we go back to beating stuff on a rock or mammaws wringer washer but yeeeeeeesh...............this mentality of throw a comm board on a washing machine just to say hey, lookee, we have state of the art! is beginning to wear thin.


If you really want some adventure and/or depression, search on youtube for HVAC repairs.  There's a guy in LA that is always out on service calls changing boards on pretty much EVERY Brand out there. Nothing wrong with the fan motor, the compressor or even the capacitor. But the super duper "hi tech" control board goes south and the condensing unit goes with it.


Ok customer, you paid 900 for the unit.  The board is $600/$200 service call/$100 hr labor, 2 hr minimum...........hmm lets see, how about we just junk the darn thing and get a new one?


Et cetera.


My AWN542 might be "crude' but it works, never needs rebooted, BIOS flashed, firmware update installed or crap like that. It just does the job I expect it to.  No error codes to decipher in fact, I never read the owner's manual. Didn't need to. Neither did my dearly departed father. And he was about an anti tech guy as you'd ever meet. 

Post# 919949 , Reply# 75   2/7/2017 at 17:40 (228 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Washerman you nailed it.
It's well known the tire industry almost put itself out of business designing tires that last much longer.
Manufacturers of appliances realize they can sell more new stuff if the old stuff doesn't last as long.
Electronics achieve this end beautifully and help sell the product in the first place, "smart wash system blah blah blah..."

This post was last edited 02/07/2017 at 18:30
Post# 919952 , Reply# 76   2/7/2017 at 18:04 (228 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Methinks Alliance went with fully computer/electronic

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Controls for their domestic washing machines to deal with the complaints regarding vibrations and other issues. Those things dinged SQ front loaders in many reviews including from customers.

Having used my fully computer controlled Lavamat versus the partial Miele w1070, vastly prefer fully electronic controls. It simply allows for a better fine tuning of drum movements in washing, distribution, spinning and unbalanced load detection.

The Miele will make only "X" number of attempts to balance a load, if it cannot too bad as it is off to the races; one loud "bang" and perhaps a jump then the machine goes into spinning banging and clanging away. Have never allowed the machine to continue so cannot say what happens next.

Small items in front loader pumps? Ohh yes; happens all the time and has ever since H-Axis washers came along.

Ask any owner of a commercial laundromat or laundry about what they find in the drain troughs and drains from their machines. Socks, coins, tokens, bra wires, small handkerchiefs, small baby or lady's bits of clothing... Standard practice then and still is that small items go into a mesh bag or are washed another way.

Nearly every owners manual for a domestic front loader have seen tells that small items should go into a mesh bag. You can also read repair/review sites to find many instances of people pulling socks, bra wire, coins and other bits from jammed and or now inoperative pumps. The "filter" on my Miele and Lavamat washers is more to catch and keep things from getting to the pump than any sort of real filtering of water.

Years ago came upon case of Woolite zipper mesh "bra" washing bags, so am good for the duration. Have only used two and the rest sit stashed away.

Post# 919960 , Reply# 77   2/7/2017 at 19:26 (228 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

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How can a sock get out of the washer drum and into the pump? I have a Kenmore He4t FL and don't see how this could happen.


Post# 919987 , Reply# 78   2/7/2017 at 21:31 (228 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
From the gap around tub and door boot/seal

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I shouldn't wonder.

H-axis washing machines are nothing more than a cage/cylinder suspended inside a tub. Depending upon the movements of the cage/cylinder in relation to the boot/door seal small items can slip between the two. If left long enough eventually item will likely get pulled down into the outer tub then work its way into the sump/pump system.

Consider also when the machine begins to spin the same forces that extract water will likely also pull anything already caught between further if not fully between the tubs. Once that happens subsequent cycles will cause item to work its way down into the sump.

My AEG like other European front loaders has one or more removable vanes in tub. This acts as a way to get between the tubs and retrieve any small item before it works its way down into the sump/drain.

Again this isn't a new phenomena, has been happening almost ever since h-axis washers were invented. Early commercial laundries were often instructed to have the machine drain visible leading to the trough or whatever so workers could spot small items and retrieve.

Post# 919988 , Reply# 79   2/7/2017 at 21:40 (228 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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Exactly, Laundress nailed it.
It is the biggest downside to the FL design. One of my wife's small thin socks made it's way around the boot, was torn in at least two pieces by the drum action, and then probably were rolled into slinky, slithery, cigarette like pump stoppers.

I also think the point about computers used for load balancing is right too, but it doesn't negate that it also conveniently functions as a built in Trojan Horse self destruct mechanism.

Post# 919991 , Reply# 80   2/7/2017 at 21:48 (228 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Have not seen these domestic SQ washers personally

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But if they are like the commercial/launromat versions the boot isn't like Miele and other domestic front loaders. Rather more like Asko and most all commercial machines; the seal is around the door window. This means there is often just enough space for small items to work their way between tubs.

Again this is why commercial washer makers for years advised placing small items into mesh nets.

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Post# 919993 , Reply# 81   2/7/2017 at 21:55 (228 days old) by earthling177 (Boston, MA)        

Robert: I'm sorry to hear all of this is happening to you. Here's hoping it gets better soon.

All: I would love all of us to take a look around and watch what we are doing.

We are much more knowledgeable than most average users.

Just take a look around threads here -- there are *plenty* of threads about machines dumping the contents of the outer drum on the floor (right now there's a current thread about a top loading FilterFlo) and there are people all the time asking for help with pumps that broke and/or got jammed by socks, underwear, underwires etc. Notice I did not specify which kind of washers, because it happens to both top loading and front loading washers. If we look dispassionately at it, it happens "more" to toploaders than to frontloaders simply because (a) as a rule, most washers in USA do not have an easily accessible pump clean-out port like Euro machines and (b) because so far, the percentage of frontloaders installed base is dwarfed by the installed base of toploaders, although frontloaders seem to be slowly gaining ground in US.

Either way, take a look at this thread, and the number of things like "frontloaders are more complex" etc that even people who are technicians and should know better are saying is discouraging.

Frontloaders, particularly nowadays, are basically motor, belt(s) and pulleys (and that's if they don't have just a direct-drive stepping motor). If we forget for a second the Fisher&Paykel-based designs that also have a direct-drive motor toploader, the vast majority of toploaders have much more complicated transmissions and suspensions than the frontloaders. We are just *much* more familiar with toploaders, and a transmission appears as a "simple" blob of metal hiding many gears and complicated stuff inside that needs lubrication (and often fails/dumps oil all over the floor and/or the clothes to be cleaned).

"Electronics" is not an excuse. Sure, they've made a bunch of things more more easily accessible to frontloaders, but they are doing the same job for most of the toploaders for sale currently. Even machines that have a round knob often just have that as a selector and the actual timer is a computer board hidden somewhere.

As for "good ol' times" reliability, LOL, I betcha you don't want that. Most of those machines used to fail more often than the newer ones. Don't take me wrong, I love the old stuff and they are interesting in all kinds of ways *including* what engineers came up with to avoid being sued by patent holders of competing machines, but those mechanical timers are more failure-prone than the computers we now have.

I have a washer and dryer set here that is almost 14 years old, gets used a lot and has not failed yet, despite the heavy use. Don't take me wrong, the *first* time it fails (either washer or dryer) I will *toss* it on the curb. I've been waiting for the darned things to break practically since day one because the manufacturer (which shall remain undisclosed if you don't know us) was one of the "big" ones in America that, instead of investing in R&D and staying ahead of the competition (Europe), chose to badmouth frontloaders with all kinds of things like "leak prone", "too complicated" etc and then, when they found themselves cornered they released crap for nearly a decade. Mine is the second or third "iteration" and, despite that, is jam-packed with bugs, both mechanical and in software, and most of them were to shave off a buck or two in the design/manufacturing. Which leads me to distrust the manufacturer now, but I doubt they care. The *only* reason I have not replaced the set yet is because the vast majority of the newer stuff has dumbed down temps and it's hard to know which manufacturer/model has decent temps like a 140F hot wash.

Don't kid yourself. No matter *which* washer/dryer you have, American, Asian or Euro, or if it's "traditional" or HE, or if it's top loading or front loading, you are at the mercy of seals that can fail and flood your laundry area and small items ending up at the pump. Careful loading can help avoid some of the problem but you are not guaranteed to avoid it completely.

A severely underloaded or overloaded horizontal axis washer can push small stuff like baby socks thru the boot and into the outer tub. It's harder to have it happen in toploaders, but sometimes small items get pushed between the top of the basket and the outer tub thus ending up in the pump -- that often happens when people are not paying attention loading/unloading or the machine is severely overloaded.

Another thing I'd like to put out there is that quality is way harder to define than you think. An awful lot of Euro frontloaders look flimsy but are better engineered where it counts, including electronic boards, but also the door shuts firmly and securely, while you often see American and Asian machines with flimsy doors and fronts that flex when the machine is working, thus making it easier to land socks in the pump area.

If SpeedQueen makes a frontloader that *looks* massive and overbuilt but lets the door flex, it will cause trouble despite the price and appearance. I have not *used* one of their newer machines in ages -- the last time I used one was over 10 years ago (possibly more) when they just introduced them to laundromats and they were not sold to consumers back then. I was not impressed. Unless they changed the machines *a lot*, I would not spend the money on one.

As for the toploaders, sorry, I have bad news too. I used to have an Amana toploader in the early 90's. I got rid of the set (washer and dryer) *before* the warranty wore out so I had no trouble getting buyers to take the set off my hand. That set did not perform well and did not seem like it would last.

Why should you care? Because if you look on the web in general or even search for threads here, there are *plenty* of complaints about those machines, and they seem to still be exactly the same machines that SpeedQueen is now selling. SpeedQueen and Amana used to belong to Raytheon back then. Unless the newer SpeedQueens from 5 years ago or so have been extensively redesigned, particularly the seals, I wouldn't invest in one either.

Remember, what laundromats (or commercial laundries in any case) are looking for is not the same a regular consumer that has only *one* washer+dryer set are looking for. Commercial laundries have many sets and they are looking for stuff that is (cheap + easy) to fix. A lot of laundromats 20 years ago used the GE FilterFlos because the transmissions were a dime a dozen and took next to no time to replace. SpeedQueen and Maytags were also quick, easy and cheap to fix. But almost anyone that has been to laundromats in the last 30 years can remember that most of the frontloaders kept chugging along while a fraction of the toploaders were always "out of service" either because the pump was clogged, the timer was broken or something more serious was going on.

If you have only one washer and one dryer, the equation changes. Unless access to a laundromat is easy and you think it's not expensive, waiting for people to come fix your set can be at the very least annoying.

But looking *just* at frequency of repair is not a panacea either. I have a set that is not the best at anything, it does not clean particularly well, it does not rinse as well as other frontloaders, it takes forever and a day to spin (and many times does not spin at the advertised fast spin, and more than once a year it has "finished" the cycle without spinning). But *hey!*, nearly 14 years and not a *single* repair call.

If you want ideal, you want at the very least two or three sets of washer/dryer, and you want the one with the absolutely *best* performance: put clothes in, press a few buttons, go away, come back, put the clothes in the dryer, press a few buttons, go away, come back to clean dry clothes ready to fold/hang, no stains, no dirt, no missing buttons, no tears or excessive wear. Sure, they may need repair, hopefully simple/cheap ones, once or twice in 15 years or so, but they should make you happy and looking forward to doing laundry as a relaxing experience instead of dreading it.

Attitude does help: friends of mine that wanted to try my equipment before they bought it fell sharply into two neat groups, the group that loaded the washer and had dinner, transferred the stuff to the dryer and had dessert (that group *loved* the set, bought one for themselves and still like them), and the group that watched the things work and how the algorithms failed in different and (not so) interesting ways. That group hated the set and ended up with other brands and models.

   -- Paulo.

Post# 920000 , Reply# 82   2/7/2017 at 22:45 (228 days old) by stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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I agree Paulo with much if not all of what you said.
My concern about the electronics is this throws a monkey wrench into the rebuild-ability of seemingly anything it becomes a significant part of.
That is the complexity issue. Yes there are less parts in the overall machine but the motor control board takes things to another level that i, or most can't follow.
When electronics are mass marketed enough, hacks, work arounds, special tools etc all become available to escape the clutches of planned obsolescence the manufacturer has baked into the device...Apple is the obvious example. I can keep our old laptops running no matter what breaks. Youtube is full of videos and Ebay has the parts.
SQ FL washing machines will never be popular enough for someone to create a way to hack the onboard computer to upgrade the firmware or anything like that.
We will have to go to SQ which is already cost prohibitive to rebuilding efforts. What does a main bearing, a door boot, motor brushes and assorted rubber hosing run? Okay you have almost renewed an old machine... now add a new motor control board, Bam! Forget about recycling that one, get another.

I can do all of the work my long out of warranty Maytag Dependable Care will ever require, maybe will have to buy a spanner wrench and a couple of other things like that on Ebay. I can do everything the repair gent did here today when this machine goes out of warranty EXCEPT work on or replace the board...unfeasible and/or too expensive.
This machine has a ways to go until it has done its 100th's on it's third board...WTF?

This post was last edited 02/07/2017 at 23:07
Post# 920004 , Reply# 83   2/7/2017 at 23:28 (228 days old) by earthling177 (Boston, MA)        

Robert, I agree with you. And it sucks. I'm sorry you are in this situation at all.

My beef is not that you are wrong or right or anywhere in between.

The problem, from my perspective, is that we are going thru a transition and also the manufacturers feel like the economy is not in a place they understand.

So, on one hand, we have people like our webmaster, that got some kind of kit (Arduino? I don't remember) and wrote his own software to completely control a Frigidaire Unimatic. That gives me some hope that others are out there tinkering and possibly coming up with replacement boards that will be less expensive than OEM parts. Because frankly, most of our manufacturers hung way too long onto obsolete tech so they didn't have to invest in R&D and now they are nearly 30-50 years behind the Euro high-tech standard for laundry equipment. They can probably catch up given that they have ties to their Euro subsidiaries, but I won't hold my breath. Currently, whether I like Electrolux or not is something I will need to wait and see what I think (the only Electrolux equipment I have have nothing to do with laundry, for example), but I'm thankful that they landed here and gave our local industry a giant quick in the butt to start releasing "more current" stuff even if quicking and screaming, because previously Asko and Miele only sold in very small quantities and even Bosch opening a factory in South Carolina was not enough incentive.

On the other hand, given that timers are not only mechanical things, but *delicate* mechanical things (remember when a high-tech country was a country that made good watches and/or sewing machines, instead of computers?) and delicate mechanical things, even when made by the millions, cost more than simple electronics. So, the problem we have now is that timers are not made in as large a volume as they used to in say, 1980's or 1990's. We've seen in places like ThatHomeSite (now GardenWeb/Houzz) and even here, people are beginning to have difficulties locating timers for machines made more than 5 or 10 years ago, and when they find them, it costs an arm and a leg too.

Things like that happen, unfortunately. For the longest time, one could still keep an old Bendix or Westinghouse Laundromat working, because the Pyrex window and the door boots were basically in 2 or 3 standard sizes, so newer machines kept using the same parts and belts too, for example, so they were easy to come by. As machines started changing in the 90's to be bigger and abandoned the old boots and windows, things got more complicated.

If enough people start discarding their current equipment and getting new ones, we might end up in a situation where only laundromats are using electro-mechanical timers and other parts (transmissions for toploaders, for example), which will make those machines harder/more expensive to fix, and the manufacturers will not care much, laundromat owners are in a difficult spot and will have no choice but repair or replace with new stuff, both of which are lucrative to manufacturers.

Anyway, I guess I've rambled quite enough already.

Best of luck!
   -- Paulo.

Post# 920020 , Reply# 84   2/8/2017 at 05:51 (228 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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I dunno, after reading ALL of this from the top to bottom, it makes me think perhaps I was right in thinking that speed queen really has some major problems. I mean, most front loaders now days have safeguards to prevent socks or anything else making it's way to the pump and I would be livid if I had this much trouble with a machine I had paid so much for! I don't really know exactly what makes speed queen so heavy duty and supposed to last for years, but if there are weak spots to cause failure what good is being a heavy duty machine? A few service calls and doing without the machine for periods of time and the aggravation would kill any good points about having a speed queen machine, to say nothing of the costs of all this once the warranty is up. LG might be a cheap china made machine, but the front loaders seem to hold up pretty well. Mine certainly has so far in the last 3+ years and I use it all the time. There have been several HORROR stories about experiences with speed queen machines on this site and the servicing that was done on them. I really don't see that speed queen lasts any longer than any other machine. A good case in point is the guy with the 8 y/o top loader who is looking to replace it now after having 2 separate service companies tell him it has multiple problems. 8 years is about average now for a washer I think, depending on how much it is used.

Post# 920110 , Reply# 85   2/8/2017 at 16:41 (228 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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SQ's owners manual for front loading washers like nearly every other such machine domestic or commercial clearly states that small items like infant socks can become stuck in door/should go into a mesh bag. Now if persons choose to ignore that advice (am not slamming anyone), that that is their own affair. Hardly think it comes down to any fault of SQ design of machine or otherwise.

The washer did what it was supposed to do; something got into the sump, worked its way into the pump which caused it to jam then motor failed. Am by no means an expert but am fairly certain this is what happens to any motor that is prevented from turning.

We do not know how long the errant sock was in machine/took to work its way down into the sump. Front loading washers with user accessible pumps advise in owners manual that the pump area should be checked routinely and often for small items that may have worked their way down. Again if users fail to follow this advice that is their own affair.

It does seem a bit harsh and IMHO rather unfair to ill informed to slam SQ or any appliance maker based upon a few published reports of issues. No one screams their innocence louder than the guilty, and no one reams appliances publicly more than those with issues they feel were not resolved to their satisfaction. This even when you look at things a good part of those issues can be traced to user errors and or simply expecting something from an appliance it was not designed to do.

Again am not slamming the original poster, but some of the subsequent comments are just off the wall.

In order to brand SQ front loaders a "failure" , having bad design or whatever the scientific way would demand knowing total units sold of a particular model and then number of complaints/issues reported.

It is like Maytag's early Neptune washing machines; yes there were issues with mold but even a stopped clock is right twice a day, many consumers also refused to wipe the door boot and leave the machine open after use.

As for H-Axis washing machines being more technically "difficult" by deign; well yes, that is true and has been for decades. It is one of the reasons behind why such machines cost more than top loaders with central beaters.

Repairs and service; things are what they are, and tough all over. Miele and everyone else is having difficulty finding (and retaining) qualified domestic appliance repair/service persons. That is a reflection on the American job market and education system (among other things) than any fault of individual company.

Not everyone is temperamentally suited to dealing with consumers, especially going into their homes. Adding to this often in a majority of cases the issue involves dealing with the Lad of the House who can be anything from patient and understanding to a dragon or monster.

Not everyone a has the necessary aptitude either to learn and apply that knowledge. Having watched two Miele repairmen replace the suspension springs on my washer in the tight confines of the cubby where located, am here to tell you have a new appreciation for the job. I certainly couldn't have managed the job and going by what others have told me relating to their own experiences with non Miele approved techs neither would many others.

The rot started when appliances went from being "major" white goods to something that was replaced instead of repaired. Outside of warranty work many places don't have much "repair" calls because so many appliances today simply cannot be repaired easily and or the cost is equal to or at least half of buying a new machine.

We here are a special group so it seems hardly fair to judge SQ or other appliance makers based upon our demands/expectations. I personally have put enough money into my "old" Miele washer to have made a substantaial payment towards a new machine. But that is my lot and I've chosen to accept.

Post# 920119 , Reply# 86   2/8/2017 at 17:26 (227 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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My upset is entirely with the computer board failures.
I fully accept the fault of the pump failure as likely, though not certainly, ours.
The repair man never said that, nor did he even say where he found the sock fragments.
He just said to be careful about "these little rags" not knowing what the pieces of cloth were.
That said it does seem likely to have been the obvious culprit.

But the two failing motor control boards is a far greater concern and where I felt most let down by customer service. I wanted to hear something like, "oh boy two boards ALREADY? Left me check with my manager that is almost unheard of and we need to get to the bottom of it."
Or even, "hold on, who do you have working on this, let me get them on the blower and give them a heads up on the way things are done around here, S-Q-D...sorry about that, they will know what's what after I straighten them out."
Instead I was made to feel the one who had done something wrong, as I have felt in the past when calling SQ, and as others have now that I poke around on the internet.
So I did his job for him in regards to informing the out of the loop dealer, and was verbally sneered at for my trouble.
They don't seem to want to gather information and make things right, they simply act like they already know it's your fault. Simply put they do the opposite of "customer service", it's a dis-service to the customer. They sounded like jaded flak catchers in two of my three experiences with them.

This post was last edited 02/08/2017 at 19:01
Post# 920121 , Reply# 87   2/8/2017 at 17:47 (227 days old) by duke ()        

Where are those boards made & assembled for SQ ?I am seeing more & more simple components failing on circuit boards in my industry (HVAC).Capacitors and relays incorporated into the boards melting,swelling and causing failures.

Post# 920130 , Reply# 88   2/8/2017 at 18:17 (227 days old) by Stricklybojack (San Diego, CA)        

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The boards are made in Mexico. I snapped a pic of one and posted it here in another thread (see link) when the first board went out a few months ago.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO Stricklybojack's LINK

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Post# 920133 , Reply# 89   2/8/2017 at 18:24 (227 days old) by duke ()        

Sorry brother,Sounds like an internal corporate issue with hands covering their ears.

Post# 920175 , Reply# 90   2/8/2017 at 20:01 (227 days old) by washman (Butler, PA)        

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The boards are made in Mexico. I snapped a pic of one and posted it here in another thread (see link) when the first board went out a few months ago.

boooo hiissssssssss.

Post# 920202 , Reply# 91   2/8/2017 at 21:31 (227 days old) by Combo52 (Beltsville,Md)        
Oh my where to begin

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First of all Robert I'm sorry you had so much trouble, but there was really only one problem here you got a really bad service company.


When you called them up and they acted like you had a serious problem right away they have no idea what they were doing, the only problem this washer had this time was a small sock caught in the pump.


The water pump had not failed the motor board was not bad.


If the guys knew what they were doing they would've taken the obstruction out of the pump and the machine would've worked fine.


These water pumps are designed to be jammed the fact that it was hot did not mean it was bad the fact that it was not running did not mean that it was bad the fact that it was hot meant the motor board was still good. Eugene is correct this machine will fill up higher if it goes to the safety level I was wrong about that, and I was also wrong about the fact these newer design machine have not had inlet valve problems I was thinking initially you still have the older style machine which did have a lot of inlet valve failures.


Hi Ben, there is nothing wrong with things made in Mexico, these parts are made by American companies to standards at least as good as we build, The motor is in both your Speed Queen top load washer and your dryer were made in Mexico along with the timer, inlet valve and probability many other parts as well.


John L.

Post# 920204 , Reply# 92   2/8/2017 at 21:42 (227 days old) by duke ()        


Post# 920209 , Reply# 93   2/8/2017 at 22:15 (227 days old) by repair-man (Pittsburgh PA)        

Made in Mexico or not those motor control boards are failing at a alarming rate. I have changed 8 out of 10 in my 1.5 year old coin op machines.

Post# 920212 , Reply# 94   2/8/2017 at 22:28 (227 days old) by duke ()        

Exactly.Made to american standards? Made to barely reach warranty period I find.Read the sides of those square power relays and the round capacitors.Usually china,vietnam etc.Trash

Post# 920225 , Reply# 95   2/9/2017 at 02:42 (227 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

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If the machines are made in Mexico that sort of shoots the theory of buying something made in the USA. I just can see no advantage to buying speed queen AT ALL now. You pay a premium price, reliability is questionable at best and service is terrible unless you happen to luck out with someone who knows how to repair them! What is the advantage? It is all very disillusioning.

This post was last edited 02/09/2017 at 05:19
Post# 920238 , Reply# 96   2/9/2017 at 06:05 (227 days old) by washman (Butler, PA)        
Some clarification bruce

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First, the machines are not made in Mexico. Like combo52 stated, various parts are made there. Like the Nidec motor for instance.  If you put google to work, you'll find a facility in Ripon Wisc where over 1400 union brothers and sisters work putting these machines together.


Truth be told, you won't find anything as complex as a home appliance "100 per cent" made in the good old US of A.  There simply aren't many companies left making control boards, motors and the like here stateside. It is simply not cost effective. When you combine the manic drive for shareholder value along with the American ethos of "cheaper is better", you cannot make a product entirely stateside and put a price tag on it that the typical American moron will pay. Ain't gonna happen.

And therein lies the rub; We want to pay each other top wages and benefits, but then we trudge off to whatever local BIG BOX resides in our community and buy the cheapest of the cheap. Something is out of whack there if you ask me.  In a perfect world, we'd all sign up with company X, work there for 35 years, collect a pension and ride off into the sunset. We'd all buy american, we'd all buy local, we'd all recycle, we'd all practice thrift, we'd pay as we go, we'd pay cash by saving up instead of signing up for a 0 per cent interest card for 90 days at our local BIG BOX, et cetera.


But we don't do that now do we?


IIRC, Obama some years ago asked Steve Jobs what could be done to get Apple to make Iphones, Ipods, etc in the US. Steve Jobs replied "those jobs aren't coming back".  And he was right. Our manufacturing base has been gutted to the point that the infrastructure to make the bits and pieces simply no longer exists.   Take Element electronics. Sure they can advertise assembled in US of A, but are you aware that all they do is remove a cover on the back of the Chinese made TV and put a memory chip in there, run some tests, then box it up?   Who is going to invest the tens of millions of dollars in capital to start up a plant to make the TFT screens? You? Me? Answer, nobody.


One day at work, I was partaking of a habit which makes me a 2nd class citizen. I was out back, puffing on a freshly lit marlboro when the Buffalo and Erie train went by. It slowed down, stopped for a while. I walked over and looked at the massive bogie assembly on one of the boxcars.  The huge casting that holds the wheels said CHINA in big letters.  I did a little research and found out we no longer have the foundries stateside to cast those parts.  Imagine that. The once mighty arsenal of democracy and here's a freight train box car with made in china bogie assemblies.


Some years back, our SVP of merchandising responded to our stores complaints about more and more plumbing fittings (galvanized, black pipe etc) were coming from China and Brazil.  He replied that the imported fittings outsold the domestic ones by a 20-1 margin. He went on to say that while there is a lot of "demand" for US products, there aren't a lot of customers willing to pay the price.


I could not have put it better myself.


Here's  your assignment if you have the time. Google Gitman. They make men's dress shirts in Ashland, PA. Go look at the price. Get back to me if you are willing to pay that price for a cotton dress shirt. Or are you content with buying whatever is cheapest at the mall?

Post# 920266 , Reply# 97   2/9/2017 at 08:51 (227 days old) by mtn1584 (USA)        

We all know you have a Kenmore/LG set made in Mexico for a Korean company!
It works for you great!!
Have you ever heard the expression 'Don't throw the baby out with the bath water" an entire company does not go to shit just because of a batch of bad boards!! The boards are being replaced under warranty!! ONE top load washer out of many needs replacing after 8 years, so what!!! The overwhelming customer reviews on SQ products are outstanding with a FEW EXCEPTIONS!


Alliance has issues with qualified techs, and some electronic boards, so do other companies, but at least ALLIANCE AND WHIRLPOOL EMPLOY AMERICANS AND THE MONEY SPENT ON THEIR PRODUCTS GO BACK TO AMERICANS!

I would still by a SQ front loader any day because as COMBO52 says they are the BEST MACHINES ON THE MARKET!!!
At least they can be repaired!

You need to find a new topic to talk about!
I'm trying to be nice, but enough already.
I am sure others feel the same way!!!

Post# 920270 , Reply# 98   2/9/2017 at 09:18 (227 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

brucelucenta's profile picture
Then we should boycott for Whirlpool to make the old belt drive machines!!!! And if speed queen machines are the best made in the market, this country is in a lotta trouble.

Post# 920276 , Reply# 99   2/9/2017 at 09:38 (227 days old) by mtn1584 (USA)        

Since you have to have the last word, I'll let you, but know this, there are BIGGER problems in the USA than who makes the best washer.
Your annoying beat the dead horse posts over.

Post# 920278 , Reply# 100   2/9/2017 at 09:48 (227 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

brucelucenta's profile picture

Post# 920281 , Reply# 101   2/9/2017 at 10:17 (227 days old) by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        
Forgive him

iheartmaytag's profile picture

He's a little "touched" don't you know.

Post# 920286 , Reply# 102   2/9/2017 at 10:34 (227 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

brucelucenta's profile picture
LOL Not too touched, I at least bought a washer and dryer that doesn't break down constantly! Don't know about you though.....

Post# 920307 , Reply# 103   2/9/2017 at 12:16 (227 days old) by glomain (tuscarawas cnty. (eastern ohio))        

glomain's profile picture
God give Bruce something else too do besides beat a dead horse,I should call PETA. DANG GIVE IT A REST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post# 920446 , Reply# 104   2/9/2017 at 23:05 (226 days old) by MattL (Flushing, MI)        

Not sure I really want to wade into this mess, but how is Bruce different that the chorus of folks that shout Speed Queen! whenever a new poster asks what machine to buy?  Personally I get very tired of that chant, there are other quality machines out there, and for the price of a SQ I can replace a machine twice in the 15 years a SQ might last and still be ahead.

Post# 920461 , Reply# 105   2/10/2017 at 04:43 (226 days old) by brucelucenta (tulsa, oklahoma)        

brucelucenta's profile picture
I thank you! All I have really done is point out that there are several who have posted on here about bad experiences with sq and the service results and it has shaken what little faith I had left in sq machines, which was precious little I admit. The claims of others stating an sq machine will last 25 years or more is absurd to say the least. And the chant or rant really is quite annoying too. It seems to be a roll of the dice with speed queen, some folks have very good luck and minimal problems and others have nothing but problems. That's why I stay out of casinos, too risky.

Post# 920469 , Reply# 106   2/10/2017 at 06:15 (226 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
"If the machines are made in Mexico "

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Post# 920473 , Reply# 107   2/10/2017 at 06:30 (226 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Furthermore, motherboard production largely if not totally

launderess's profile picture
Has been abandoned within the United States, IIRC there isn't a single factory producing motherboards in the country.

In fact IIRC the United States long ago ceded much or all manufacturing of consumer electronics to Mexico or various offshore countries. When was the last time you saw a television, microwave oven, audio equipment and so forth stamped "Made in America". It might be "assembled" in the USA, but that is a different matter.

IIRC Miele is one of the few appliance makers that produces most of their own parts internally. They have factories located in Gutersloh (Germany) and Braşov (Romania), that produce electronics. Have seen packaging for Miele motherboards and other electronics and they all say "made in Germany".

Besides there isn't anything inherently wrong with motherboards or anything else produced in Mexico, China or elsewhere. It comes down to quality controls put in place by whoever is placing the orders. That is factories will make what they are told to/ordered. If quality isn't there and customer threatens to cancel business things either change or that action is carried out.

Post# 920578 , Reply# 108   2/10/2017 at 19:24 (225 days old) by duke ()        

Launderess is correct .The standards of quality,amperage,metallurgy,coatings,thickness,weight and warranty is placed by the company ordering it.I believe everyone has a point on this Speed Queen issue,but Bruce is winning it.

If you charge me that kind of money you'd better have a cracker jack Tech system, A warranty above all others,Positive reviews galore and the corporate balls to back it all up. So--Speedqueen of the past? or Present?

Post# 920645 , Reply# 109   2/11/2017 at 02:07 (225 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

Right at this moment i have exactly the same problem...

Ok, our company will bring the production back to the US.

Ok, we will make the machines here

Not so OK: we can't find components. We can't find electronics, We can't find lots of stuff.

Our control boards will be made in Brazil because we simply can't find whatever company that can produce them in the US. We are not considering China or Mexico because of the political scenario.

Even to find a silly drain pump it's a PITA. (by PITA understand that we will have to change our design, I'll spend over 100 hours in front of the computer redesigning everything almost from scratch, make new molds and spend over 100 thousand dollars because of a 2mm discrepancy that the american supplier can't make or is too lazy to make). The american supplier won't accept our specs, we need to adapt our product to their specs. (arrogant, isn't it?) The solution, guess what... Pumps made in Brazil. Motors made in Brazil, control panels made in Brazil. Even silly spring loaded timers made in Brazil because the american suppliers don't want to make under our specs.

If we want our electronic boards made in USA with the exact specs we want, we would need something near 300 million dollars to build the mecatronics shop, hire at least 5 highly skilled employees (almost 1 million per year each if they accept working for us because they all moved to china because the salaries are much higher and chinese companies can pay) and other 100 blue collar employees only to have our own mecatronics shop in our plant. for what? to produce 50 thousand pieces per year? Our supplier can produce in 20 minutes what we use in one year.

If we produce 100% in the USA, our TOL model would have an electromechanical timer and would look almost like a vintage washer. Here at AWO we would love it, but we're not enough to keep a plant working and people out there don't want that. they want their washers with Wi-Fi and as much bells and whistles it is possible and every year they want more. Soon they will demand a washer that walks around the house almost like a robot vacuum cleaner picking up the dirty clothes and after the cycle is done the washer puts the clothes starched and perfectly ironed and folded in the closet, all that with a single voice command on a smartphone.

Steve Jobs was right. It's IMPOSSIBLE nowadays.

The only way, maybe for us to have USA made electronics and mecatronics is if all companies (appliances, tvs, computers, etc) create a huge joint venture to build only one factory to supply to all. And of course something like that will never happen.

Post# 920646 , Reply# 110   2/11/2017 at 02:22 (225 days old) by thomasortega (Los Angeles - CA)        

I forgot to include....

Have i mentioned about the cost?

Super Compact Automatic Washer: Our TOL model, mini top load washer, impeller type, electronic control panel, designed and engineered in the USA, made in china in our own plant with a rigit quality control... retail price $199

Exactly the same washer made in USA, with the same quality control, drain pump and PCB made in Brazil, 100% designed and engineered here in the USA, 98% made in USA, 100% assembled in the USA: Retail price $799

When everybody brings the production back to the USA and people arrive at Home Depot and see a BOL Amana top load washer costing $2000 and the matching dryer costing $1500 and a TOL Whirlpool costing $5000 only the washer, then people will say we (manufacturers) are stealing them.

Bot of course somebody will say "oh, but all those american jobs. blah, blah, blah" BULLSHIT! Guess what will happen with "those american jobs" when the manufacturers stop selling because people don't have the money to afford a new washer. Trump is trying to simply ban China, but he forgets that thanks to China people can afford cheap washers. He's not moving a finger to make it sustainable for the companies. Companies need to have profit, that is obvious, nobody will pay to work. As the production cost is much higher, it will reflect on the retail price. Is the country ready to pay this price? Soon this country will be like cuba, with washers rusted and fixed with duct tape because people can't afford a new one. Welcome to Soviet Union of America!

Post# 920655 , Reply# 111   2/11/2017 at 05:00 (225 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN)        

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"Besides there isn't anything inherently wrong with motherboards or anything else produced in Mexico, China or elsewhere. It comes down to quality controls put in place by whoever is placing the orders. That is factories will make what they are told to/ordered."


This is Volkswagen Beetle was made in Mexico.  It has over 237k miles on it and still going strong with little more than routine maintenance. 


When I worked for Goldstar in Alabama (LG now) back in 1991 all our parts were pre-assembled in Korea, shipped to us, and we stuck them together in the cases to form a television set.

Post# 920730 , Reply# 112   2/11/2017 at 13:08 (225 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
There was some sort of "environmental" aspect to why much of electronic manufacturing left the USA. Lord knows there are plenty of "super fund" sites that are former electronics factory sites. Chemicals like polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs) and chlorinated organic solvents come to mind.

Post# 920740 , Reply# 113   2/11/2017 at 14:05 (225 days old) by kb0nes (Burnsville, MN)        

kb0nes's profile picture
Even if the PC boards were made in the US, almost every part on them is made in Asia. There isn't much component level electronics manufacturing still done here. Only low volume specialty stuff is still in the US for the most part.

Where something is made really has little impact on the overall quality as long as the company cares. The idea that American made is automatically superior was trashed years ago. In my industry, machining, America lost the lead in machine tools in the 70-80's, probably because Americans were too intellectually weak to adopt to the simpler and better metric system. Used to be that the best precision measuring tools were Starrett, but today Mitutoyo is just SO much better.

A while back we had a salesman sell us a new air compressor. I asked him where it was made, and he was timid at saying Belgium. I told him that I actually thought that was good. And man that Atlas Copco compressor has been one of the best investments we ever made. Silent, efficient and not one repair in 8+ years!

Overall I feel like American quality control is often lacking and far too often the employees seem to only be working for a paycheck. I'd much rather buy something from the US, but I won't do it if the product isn't as good. The thing Alliance/Speed Queen has going for them is that they still build heavy, commercial quality like machines. But they do seem to be a bit crude and their QC isn't up to the Asian products (remember the TL tub problems for instance). But in the long run they should have better durability and I'd bet that parts availability will be WELL longer then a Samsung or LG product.

Post# 920784 , Reply# 114   2/11/2017 at 18:50 (224 days old) by washman (Butler, PA)        

washman's profile picture

Ain't no party like a Speed Queen party 'cause a Speed Queen party don't stop.


Hi Frig!

Post# 920785 , Reply# 115   2/11/2017 at 19:01 (224 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

launderess's profile picture
It is going to take some time I shouldn't wonder for SQ to build up a decent service/support group. Unlike Whirlpool and the other major appliance makers Alliance as only just really entered that market in a big way.

Am also guessing those on the commercial side (repair) may not want much or anything to do with domestic repair. They probably have more than enough on their plate dealing with commercial and route repairs. Know when a SQ washer or dryer goes out at local launderette it can be weeks or months before the thing is repaired.

Post# 920871 , Reply# 116   2/12/2017 at 00:42 (224 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)        

Semiconductor manufacturing-The main chemical hazards were acids used for cleaning and etching-and small amounts of arsenic for doping junctions.PCB's were used before the early 70's when they were banned. PCB's were used as dielectric insulating heat conducting fluids in transformers,some types of "wet" MV switches and circuit breakers.also used in capacitors.There are sites where those items were made that are still being cleaned up.Makers in those days weren't especially careful in the use of PCB.There are some PCB caps still in some of our transmitters-still in use over 50 yrs from when they were made!There used to be a "wet" 4160 3Ph switch that was used to switch in the sites older genset-no longer with us.It blew a cylinder during hurricane Floyd.It was an old Chicago Pneumatic that dated back to the early 50s!No parts were available.The engine and generator got scrapped a few years ago and the old gen building used for storage now.Our new Cat generator uses vacuum switches for switching in or out of the power circuits.It can be used in parallel with the line-load management or separate-emergency power,another situation-if the Progress Energy folks are working on our feeder lines-the generator is isolated from them.We had to do that a couple years ago when our substation was refurbished.

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