|
Thread Number: 69661
/ Tag: Detergents and Additives
Laundry detergent enzymes & skin irritation |
[Down to Last] |  |
| Post# 925804 3/9/2017 at 03:34 (2,605 days old) by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room) | ||
 Can the enzymes used in modern laundry detergents cause skin trouble? I haven't noticed any difference between enzyme and non-enzyme detergents on own skin, but I've wondered.
I realize, of course, that enzymes (as I understand) don't survive high temperatures. So presumably with a hot dryer it would be "goodbye." But...there is line drying (particularly indoors), and the possibility of dryers that don't get particularly hot (flaw/bad design/a low temperature cycle). | ||
|
Post# 925808 , Reply# 1 3/9/2017 at 05:03 (2,605 days old) by Launderess  (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
No, they cannot.
www.medscape.com/viewarticle/5758... www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1283... www.nhs.uk/news/2008/05May/Pages/... What can cause skin irritation are the various other chemicals including scent used in laundry detergents. This and or irritation caused by "harsh deposits" left by certain powdered detergents. If you are worried about your nice lingerie irritating your skin, best seek out some Ivory Snow. *LOL* | ||
| Post# 925929 , Reply# 2 3/10/2017 at 02:27 (2,604 days old) by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room) | ||
|
| ||
|
Post# 925935 , Reply# 3 3/10/2017 at 03:12 (2,604 days old) by Frigilux (The Minnesota Prairie) |
||
 | ||
| Post# 925938 , Reply# 4 3/10/2017 at 03:57 (2,604 days old) by LordKenmore (The Laundry Room) | ||
|
99-44/100% Pure And don't forget that the bar soap was advertised to float!
Cartoon on this topic. Click on cartoon to enlarge:
www.condenaststore.com/-sp/Indust... | ||
|
Post# 925952 , Reply# 5 3/10/2017 at 06:06 (2,604 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK) |
||
Skin Irritation...
Dont blame the detergents - Blame lack of Poor Rinsing. Detergents as first made 90yrs ago where much harsher, perhaps not as perfumed and it MAY be that synthetic perfumes today could be an issue with certain peoples sensitivities, but surely if its rinsed as good as its washed then all residues should be swished away...
Personally I think what doesn't help is the EXTRA stuff that's around the detergent such as slimey gelatine that's around liquipods (that can form a slime again in cool water and soaking) and the heavy dosing of fabric conditioner, I discussed with the techies at P & G that fab con ( in our wonderful world of FL wendy weshers) should be available in the 3rd rinse (or programmable in one before the last) and then you have the option of a final clean water rinse having had the benefit of conditioner - which is more of a problem with eczema than detergents !! | ||
|
Post# 925966 , Reply# 6 3/10/2017 at 07:08 (2,604 days old) by askolover (South of Nash Vegas, TN) |
||
rinsing | ||
|
Post# 926091 , Reply# 9 3/10/2017 at 19:17 (2,603 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
Procter and Gamble detergents are not the easiest to rinse
No, they aren't even on this side of the Pond. Which is why one tends to avoid.
Liquids are slightly better than the powders, but there you are then. Whenever have used powdered Tide, Cheer or other P&G detergents it dulls the surface of the stainless steel laundry sink. It took only one wash with Cheer powder to dull the NIB finish of my Hoover TT; so that was that. | ||
| Post# 926099 , Reply# 10 3/10/2017 at 19:57 (2,603 days old) by Rolls_rapide (.) | ||
|
That's interesting - I found the opposite. I haven't used P&G detergents to handwash for some years, but when I did, Ariel always caused the stainless steel sink to positively gleam. | ||
| Post# 926187 , Reply# 12 3/11/2017 at 06:45 (2,603 days old) by Paulc (Edinburgh, Scotland) | ||
Rolls_Rapide | ||
| Post# 926192 , Reply# 14 3/11/2017 at 07:45 (2,603 days old) by Rolls_rapide (.) | ||
|
Paulc That's true, but I find that the sink gleams even with liquid detergents. Maybe it's down to the quality of the steel finish? | ||
|
Post# 926193 , Reply# 15 3/11/2017 at 07:51 (2,603 days old) by panthera (Rocky Mountains) |
||
Well, what do people expect? Modern machines in the US use too cold of water to clean clothes. They deposit all sorts of molds and bacteria on the clothes. The detergents don't clean in cold water, they contain far too much perfume to cover the stench. Finally, rinsing is a joke in the modern machines.
All these problems would go away if people were to: Use hot water to wash clothes clean. Use enough phosphates, enzymes and good detergents to clean. Wash in clean machines. Rinse thoroughly. Stay away from those horrid fabric softeners and extremely scented detergents.
Problem solved. | ||
|
Post# 926221 , Reply# 18 3/11/2017 at 11:47 (2,603 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK) |
||
|
Detergents...
Interesting comments, for me Ariel always rinses clear no probs at all, latest formulation even more, perhaps manufacturers are getting the message that
"ya dont need suds to clean" Ariel UK is a different formulation to P & G equivalent Tide, when Ive used it in twintubs wringers etc it always leaves the washtub coated in a fine powder something I`ve never encountered with Ariel ...I was told it would never be sold here as it wouldnt pass muster due to the high metalergic content which is prob what dulls the tubs n sinks !! And here we go again about Persil Non bio and The Housewives of GB, you are right Ariel launched with enzymes then Persil followed suit (they did have a problem with a manganese accelerator) but also it co-incieded with manufacturers making the powder concentrated and they didnt do a good enough education & selling job...and also at the same time Washing Machine manufacturers with new eco rules to abide by drastically reduced wash water levels, again without educating the poor consumer....so new concentrated powder, new low water levels = customer disaster !! Nowthen The Great Housewives of the UK rose up about their beloved Persil of old being phased out, you know the one with all that soapy goodness and our own bleachy bleaching whitening system which had housewives had come to use and love for decades - and one thing you dont do is "Mess with women who Wesh" ... 
| ||
|
Post# 926277 , Reply# 20 3/11/2017 at 19:27 (2,602 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
"majority of US powders don't have oxygen bleach in like Ariel does. "
P&G has had a lock on patented activated oxygen bleaching systems going back to Oxydol & Biz. That technology was transferred to Tide with Bleach and remained in only TOL offerings from P&G until rather recently. Gain and a few other P&G powdered detergents finally got some or part of same. Later P&G came out with various Tide "boosters" such as pods, and in wash stain release powders. Because P&G has the lock on NBOS activator patent, few if any other laundry detergents bothered trying to come up with their own. That being said Ecover, Bi-o-kleen, Sears, Amway and other powdered detergents sold in USA do have oxygen bleach (usually sodium percarbonate, but some still use sodium perborate IIRC. Of course Tide is being challenged now by Henkel's Persil "megaperls" sold in the North American market, and it contains a pretty advanced oxygen bleaching system. Reason for American detergents not including oxygen bleach is simple; housewives here and anyone else doing laundry (commercial and professional included) nearly universally chose chlorine for bleaching over oxygen based systems. There is no sense putting oxygen bleach in a detergent if you know consumers are going to use chlorine; the two will simply cancel each other out. The other reason is time and heat. Hydrogen peroxide based bleaches work best with moderate to high water temperatures (100F to > 140F) and long contact time. This varies by which type is used (liquid hydrogen peroxide, sodium perborate or sodium percarbonate), but still. Sodium percarbonate will bleach in cooler water temps, but really needs increased contact time to be truly effective. H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide liquid), and sodium perborate will also bleach in cooler water, but require a much longer contact time. This is why the original activated oxygen bleach "detergent" (Biz) was marketed as a pre-soak. The long contact time gave enzymes and bleaching action better results. When P&G began using NBOS activated oxygen bleach and perfected that system Tide With Bleach and what followed were able to deliver good to excellent results in the short wash times found with American top loaders, dilute (high) water levels (compared to front loaders), and often cooler water temps (tap hot being 120F to 140F, but not sustained by an onboard heating system). | ||
| Post# 926324 , Reply# 21 3/12/2017 at 01:22 (2,602 days old) by iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas) | ||
Thank you Laundress | ||
|
Post# 926357 , Reply# 23 3/12/2017 at 07:24 (2,602 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage) |
||
|
All things considered
If extraction is done between cycles you don't need that many rinses.
When wash isn't extracted, wrung, or whatever after the main wash soils and chemicals carry over into the first rinse. This will continue to happen as subsequent rinses "dilute" that residue. However if the laundry is extracted after wash and before each rinse said residues are squeezed and or otherwise removed from wash. Thus there is less to carry over for subsequent rinsing. My Oko-Lavamat has two rinse programmes for "Normal Cottons/Linens"; regular and sensitive. The normal rinse is four rinses with an option to add an extra rinse, but with spins after the wash and after each rinse. These spins are somewhat violent as the ones between third, fourth and perhaps fifth rev up to very high rpms. If sensitive is chosen the washer will rinse two or three times (forget which) then spin. A spin follows each subsequent rinse including those violent speeds for the last few. My guess is this programme mimics rinsing of old in that lots of water is used to dilute as much residue out of the wash, then strong spins send it down the drain. In the days of wringers if hot or boiling water was used (and if often was), washing could not be sent through the mangle at once; the heat would harm the rubber rollers. So wash was moved through the first and perhaps second rinses of hot water (if using soap for washing), before cool then cold rinse; then things were mangled. Early commercial washing machines which were just that; washers as they didn't extract; did several changes of water usually at hot or very, then more still in cold, then laundry was finally extracted. If wash was extracted while still being hot it would lead to deeply set in creases that would take ages to iron out, if at all. Here is wash program from an old hospital laundry, think it was for linens: (1) Five-minute cold rinse; (2) 10-minute soak in hot suds; (3) 10-minute soak in hot suds; (4) 10-minute soak in hot suds, with bleach; (5) five hot rinses with live steam; (6) six cold rinses, and a germicide solution is used in the third cold rinse; (7) water is extracted Washer was just that, with things moved to an extractor for spin drying. As you can see it is a very water intensive program. This post was last edited 03/12/2017 at 07:39 | ||
| Post# 927207 , Reply# 26 3/16/2017 at 15:05 (2,598 days old) by Liberatordeluxe (UK) | ||
|
@Chestermike Is the Aries you say that rinses well the powder or liquid version? I am using up a big box of Dan and have to say the cleaning is poor and it foams too much so won't buy again. | ||
| Post# 927915 , Reply# 27 3/20/2017 at 10:51 (2,594 days old) by AquaCycle (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
Mike, correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to remember that the biological/enzyme hysteria also stems from staff at the Lever Bros factory reacting badly to exposure to high levels of different enzymes - respiratory problems, skin complaints etc. The press got hold of it and made a big song and dance over it, but as we know exposure to certain products in a factory is very different to what actually ends up in detergents in the home.
Paul C remembers this as his Dad was working there at the time IIRC. | ||
|
Post# 927922 , Reply# 28 3/20/2017 at 11:36 (2,594 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK) |
||
|
Enzymes | ||
|
Post# 927925 , Reply# 29 3/20/2017 at 11:39 (2,594 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK) |
||
|
Ariel | ||
| Post# 927955 , Reply# 30 3/20/2017 at 18:35 (2,593 days old) by optima (Cumbria England) | ||
DAZ
Daz was & still is the best Washing Powder by far.
View Full Size
| ||
|
Post# 927968 , Reply# 31 3/20/2017 at 19:22 (2,593 days old) by jamiel (Detroit, Michigan and Palm Springs, CA) |
||
 | ||
| Post# 928031 , Reply# 32 3/21/2017 at 05:41 (2,593 days old) by AquaCycle (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
|
Well Mike, I guess ultimately people just don't like change!
As for Daz being the best powder, I beg to differ - I was never overly impressed with it's cleaning abilities. Sure, it's packed full of bleaching agents but only 1 enzyme and a lower concentration of surfactants than TOL Ariel & Persil (hence the cheaper price). Fine for whites, not so great at actually shifting dirt. | ||
| Forum Index: |
| Other Forums: |
|
|
|
|
|
Comes to the Rescue!
