Thread Number: 32333
your views on the whirpool duet washers
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Post# 487574   1/9/2011 at 14:51 (4,936 days old) by maypool ()        

i'm thinkin' of buyin one this washer but i want your veiws on it. First of all it worth buyin r there any complains about them? the brands of washers being sold in jamaica r alot like the more common ones Maytag, Whirlpool, Frigidaire, Speedqueen,ge, and not so common blacklpoint, matrix etc.
please give your advice on to buy i love the speedqueen but i'm open to any ideas. thanks in advance.





Post# 487672 , Reply# 1   1/9/2011 at 18:05 (4,935 days old) by brastemp (Brazil)        

I highly recommend Duet Washer and Maytag.. My washer is EpicZ from Maytag and i really love. Look my video about automatic high level from towels and intermtent spin:




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I did not recommend frigidaire and electrolux. I had the Affinity and the washer was a bad dream.. See on the video a keyboard fail:




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Post# 487712 , Reply# 2   1/9/2011 at 19:49 (4,935 days old) by jlbrazil (brazil)        
EPICz....

I really love this machine , I'm not that into in American machines as they have shorter programes , take ages to balance the load.
But this machine really surprised me , when I first saw brastemp's videos and the machine on the web cam, I was really shocked.
I couldn't believe it rinsed so well , and gave no balance trash.
That was AMAZING , and BTW , it has perfect cycles.
Not 20 minutes , but not 3 hours.
The Heavy or Whites programes are awesome , within 1:30 the clothes are amazingly clean and SUPER rinsed :)


Post# 487761 , Reply# 3   1/9/2011 at 21:31 (4,935 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)        

pierreandreply4's profile picture
me i have a whirpool duet washer that dates back from 2004 but its has a very good cleaning power here is a small vid of my washer starting its cycle

v7.tinypic.com/player.swfQUESTION...">


Post# 487910 , Reply# 4   1/10/2011 at 12:22 (4,935 days old) by Iheartmaytag (Wichita, Kansas)        

iheartmaytag's profile picture
I have the Maytag twin to the Duet. And as I have said before, I am not a big Whirlpoo fan, but I do like (maybe love) this machine and it's matching dryer.

When shopping for a new machine I had several criteria:
1: Larger capacity
2: I wanted steam
3: Put dirty clothes in, take clean clothes out
4: Low(er) water usage
5: Be relitively quiet
6: Be reliable

So far my assessment would be that there are probably better, and I am sure worse machines on the market.

1: The machine is large, it will do a King Size comforter (I happy

2: The steam function does work and I do see steam. (Clothes come out clean I happy)
3: See 2 above, though I don't use steam all the time, I do use it fairly often. Clean clothes emerge including old under arm stains are gone (I happy)
4: In comparing water bills from the same period the previous year I am using about 3,000 gal per month less. (I happy)
5: The machine is very quiet except when spinning, then it sounds like a Jet taking off. It's in the basement, not too bothersom. They are on pedistals and on concrete floor so little vibration is transmitted. (Happy)
6: I am only a year into it's life, so can't say anything about reliablilty except no repairs yet. Ask me again in a few years, but so far HAPPY.

I did shop other machines when I was looking for a new washer. I was not impressed with Bosch from reading reviews. I wanted an E-lux in the worst way, but couldn't afford it. The GE with the toliet seat door was a turn off. Same with LG, too many bad stories.
I looked at the Speed Queen FL, and was very impressed, except. I was told that it did not sense the water level,only a metered fill, so if you put a large item in to wash possibly not soaking the clothes. Also the one I was shown did not have an on-board heater and no steam.

So the bottom line, the Maytag/Whirlpool machine is doing the job it was intended to do, but I bought an extended warranty Just in case.


Post# 487935 , Reply# 5   1/10/2011 at 13:49 (4,935 days old) by whirlcool (Just North Of Houston, Texas)        

Look at all that water in the original video to this thread! Now if our FL machines here in the US would use that kind of water......

Post# 487947 , Reply# 6   1/10/2011 at 14:44 (4,935 days old) by georgect (Fairfield, CT)        
I know...right?

georgect's profile picture
Look at all that actual water in that washer!
I thought the same thing...I was like hey, where is this poster from and then I saw it was out of the USA (ahh no wonder).
I'm jealous. Every other country uses more water than the US does.


Post# 487973 , Reply# 7   1/10/2011 at 15:32 (4,935 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
I know rite!

mark_wpduet's profile picture
Funny how environmentally friendly Europeans are yet their washers still use plenty of water.....I wonder if the machines are designed exactly the same as our front load washers, with the only difference being that their cycles (or programms as they call it) simply use more water.........I've seen comments made that adjusting water up in a US front loader may cause damage because they are not designed to be used with more water, yet that machine looks like a US front loader, only it has European programming on it, thus it uses more water

Post# 488015 , Reply# 8   1/10/2011 at 17:31 (4,934 days old) by appnut (TX)        
Water usage in videos

appnut's profile picture
I was noticing the same thing!!! But, I wonder if the machines are connected to power that's higher than 110V like we have (especially the machine in Brazil--but Canada too). If that's the case (220V or 240v), then the machine owuld be able to handle the larger amount of water and using the onboard heater to maintain temperature.

Post# 488143 , Reply# 9   1/11/2011 at 08:56 (4,934 days old) by brastemp (Brazil)        

Hey Appnut , this machine just use this high water level when it is rinsing on the Whitest Whites and Heavy cycle.
But it doesn't rinse all the times like this.
It just increase the water level when there is a big load , or heavy things , like Towels.
If you want to see it with low water level there is somw videos on my youtube account.


Post# 488198 , Reply# 10   1/11/2011 at 12:51 (4,934 days old) by 3beltwesty ()        
The overseas machines are often just 24" wide versus 27

Since they are smaller they also tend to have a higher spin/extract RPM speed too.

A European machine has a spin basket/drum that is about 19 inches in diameter, versus a 22" diameter one on a USA 27" frame machine.

Most non USA machines are smaller in size.

If one figured the cubic foot size, my USA LG here is about 3.7 actual and marketed as a IEC 4.2. My old 1976 Westy FL is actually about 2.4 to 2.5 cubic feet actual.

My 1976 machine with its 2.5 cubic foot drum is considered to be obsolete since it is so small, the non USA machines that are just 24" wide have a smaller size than my 1976 machine.

Thus one is comnparing 1/4" drills versus 1/2" ones!


Post# 488199 , Reply# 11   1/11/2011 at 12:55 (4,934 days old) by 3beltwesty ()        

The smaller 24" machine is probably better than a 27" machine to wash just 3 pairs of blue jeans. With my new FL machine here its water level load bar goes from 1 to 4 bars. In about all loads it is at 1 bar, it has been on 2 every dozen washes and hit 3 once in say 50 washes.

Post# 488200 , Reply# 12   1/11/2011 at 13:11 (4,934 days old) by 3beltwesty ()        
aluminum spider

Here with my new LG FL washer I got in 2010 I just plan on the the aluminum spider will break like most other FL washers do in 5 years.





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Post# 488215 , Reply# 13   1/11/2011 at 14:10 (4,934 days old) by pierreandreply4 (St-Bruno de montarville (province of quebec) canada)        

pierreandreply4's profile picture
me my whirlpool duet the only time it hads more water is when i use the normal cycle to cool down the clothe before the first spin

Post# 488239 , Reply# 14   1/11/2011 at 15:54 (4,934 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
3beltwesty

mark_wpduet's profile picture
That's the EXACT same machine that I have. It's at six years old and still pumping out clean clothes. I do about 18 to 20 loads of wash per month.....give or take.........

As we all know by now, all the US front load washers use the aluminum spider (for the most part)........Yet some are still going twelve years later.........But how I wonder?


Post# 488250 , Reply# 15   1/11/2011 at 16:47 (4,934 days old) by 3beltwesty ()        
The aluminum spider issue seems like a giant bag of variable

Here too I will read how one guy has a bad Acme FL washer in a few years and another has no issues and it is 2 to 3 times older.




Post# 488338 , Reply# 16   1/11/2011 at 21:41 (4,933 days old) by appnut (TX)        
Stupid question

appnut's profile picture
How much added cost would be involved if manufacturers used a stainless steel spider instead of the cast aluminum that involves the two types of metals being incompatible with each other?

Post# 488447 , Reply# 17   1/12/2011 at 12:37 (4,933 days old) by 3beltwesty ()        
Probably 50 to 70 bucks max

The 201 series stainless basket is made from polished rolled sheet stock. The spider is cast aluminum with a steel shaft.

A welded stainless exhaust manifold for my on car that is rather complex costs about 96 bucks on the aftermarket parts arena, my guess is it cost maybe 50 to make.

With the casting they can make the spider and machine/clean off the 3 mounting pads/surfaces after the shaft is in place to have low runout.

With a stainless spider, it would be poorer to machine and thus they would want to get it correct when welded..

The LG aluminum spider I have seen on the internet as low as 49 bucks with the shaft, it normaly is about 69 to 79. My guess is it cost 20 to 35 bucks max to make.


The far bigger issue is the development cost to make a better design and the settup for an entirely new way a part is made. The bean counters will just say nobody will sense that the machine is worth 50 bucks more. To make a go of it would require a good solid design and marketing is so a end user like me really believes that the added 100 buck washers cost bought me a better longer lasting product. What seems to sell is every new washer has a different "program" set. The same mechanics are used and the thrust is the front panel gizmos.

Here I would prefer buying a simpler machine and would pay 100 to 150 extra for stainless spider that lasted decades, but I am an engineer, not a marketing chap.

Today the thrust is ones stuff is disposed of and repairs not done as much anymore> The bulk of folks in my neighborhood who bought new washers after Katrina in 2005 are often getting new ones already!


Post# 488456 , Reply# 18   1/12/2011 at 13:27 (4,933 days old) by neptunebob (Pittsburgh, PA)        

neptunebob's profile picture
Would it be possible for the manufacturers to coat the aluminum spider with some kind of a plastic or a "powder coat" like they use on American Chopper? I saw a PCN Tour for Chop Rite meat grinders where they use some kind of FDA approved coating on the metal for the meat grinders, I would think something like that would last at least a few years, so that by the time it wore away, maybe the machine would be 15 years old. If you look at the grinder in the link, there is some kind of a coating on it.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO neptunebob's LINK


Post# 488496 , Reply# 19   1/12/2011 at 15:25 (4,933 days old) by mark_wpduet (Lexington KY)        
Good Idea NeptuneBob

mark_wpduet's profile picture
But they probably don't "want" to do that unfortunately.

I do have a question......I see on the Frigidaire's that have the spider issues that in order to repair it, you have to buy the entire tub.....Is this the same case with the Duet's or do they just sell the spider alone? Not that I would even ATTEMPT to repair it....Just wondering


Post# 488525 , Reply# 20   1/12/2011 at 17:46 (4,932 days old) by 3beltwesty ()        
To see if the spider is available as a single item

Mark,

To see if the spider is available as a single item; find your target FL washer model number and then search for the drum and spider parts at repairclinic, sears, and the zoo of other parts vendors. Many times the spider is sold separately, the LG spider is. In some few brands it is not and models it is not, thus one has to buy they entire assembly of spider and basket.

To actually replace the spider is really a big task, ie 4 to say 8 man hours. Once the spider starts to go the seal often leaks, then the front bearing goes too. Thus normally one has to replace the two ball bearings and seal too. In some web documented failures, some machines further have screws on the basket the puncture the plastic tub too.

It is such a devil of a job that the labor cost causes many to just scrap their bad FL washer once the spider breaks.

Bob;
a coating adds cost. If any part comes off sometimes a coating can be actually worse too, ie one traps in moisture if the coating peels any. At the several high volume consumer items places I once worked ; one considers costs down to cents or less. Thus if one makes 1 million parts, a 1/3 cent matters since it is 3333 dollars. If the coating cost 1 dollar it is 1 million bucks.

Maybe if enough FL spider failures of all brands is shown on the web, the general public might get a better product via a better design.

The sad thing is about every home FL brand in the USA has seen these aluminum spider failures and some are over a decade old. The high mucky mucks in the ivory towers of the washer makers know about these failures and are just "hoping they go away"; thus they payoff the sqweaky wheel customer with a discount on another washer, or parts about cost, etc.

One wonders if the chaps in the engineering depts are whusses, or do not care, or are beholden to a core tenet of a product with a spider that dissolves with time.

In the USA many design engineers do not touch sustaining engineering, it is a death sentence in some industries. Thus the same golden boy designs in the same fundamental flaws in newer designs an there is no learning, ie eating ones own cooking it is really manure.

In Japan engineers often live with a product its *entire lifetime*, if you screw up a design or it has field failures your butt is the one that fixes the issues. It works well, there is a sense of pride too and since one has to resolve ones screwups.

At one consumer place I worked at I found a flaw on another's design and made the required change order. A year later it was still not in place and the cost was nill. Since production waned they just order more flawed parts. The purchasing guys would get qet a kick back from the suppliers and make 250K parts versus the order of 100,000.

The same golden boy designed in the same flaw into two other NEWER products and these had field failures too, even with a design review done 1 year ago showing the design flaws . It took 4 years for the betterment to get into a new design and it was not something that had much tooling cost or risk either.

In this case the issue was one of egos, one had some folks way up in engineering who were fakes, plus purchasing on the take.



Post# 488619 , Reply# 21   1/13/2011 at 04:43 (4,932 days old) by roscoe62 (Canada)        
Spider

Why doesn't one of these manufacturers get it together and do the right thing and be more environmentally conscious and make a machine that is repairable not disposable and be an industry leader??
Since these machines are suppose to be more energy efficient the manufacturing process sounds like it was left behind, it contradicts one's boasting about energy and environment when the land fill is covered with their logos .



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