Thread Number: 33981
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|Post# 510528   4/9/2011 at 22:32 (4,626 days old) by cfz2882 (Belle Fourche,SD)  || |
what do you guys think of all the different wash motions offered with many
recent direct-drive FL washers?-rocking,slow rolling,lift and drop,tumbling,
ETC.Have really noticed this feature advertized a lot lately....
|Post# 510542 , Reply# 1   4/10/2011 at 03:20 (4,626 days old) by dj-gabriele ()  || |
Sure it's all about gimmicks!
A washing machine of 30 years ago didn't clean any worse than a modern one, given the proper operating conditions.
The only real improvement is the ability to wash very delicate garments in the machine instead of hand washing.
|Post# 510583 , Reply# 2   4/10/2011 at 07:56 (4,626 days old) by 3beltwesty ()  || |
The modern USA washer is designed to grab the tax credits of several hundred dollars per washer; a credit to the washer maker.
Thus the water usage is little by design, often really a water shower, sprinkle, tinkle.
The water usage allowed to get that tax kickback is so low;
the only thing left is:
(1) all these weird motions
(2) and time to allow the palty sprays to contact all the clothes.
The washer also resprays water it has returned to the tub bottom too during the wash cycle.
Many new FL washers if the load is sensed small the drum never even touches the tubs water level, The items are really showered, never under a level of water.
My 1976 Westy FL washer uses a max of 30 gallons; maybe 22 to 25 if I set the water level control for a small load. Since there is no tax kickback for a machine that uses 30 gallons; they design one that uses 11 gallons and thus the time is twice to wash and one has gobs of weird motions to allow the clothes to be washed.
Thus the government discourages a washer that uses 15 cents more water and washes way through social engineering, via giant tax breaks to sell water shower machines.
Washers are not like lawn tractors; where I can buy a mower with a higher HP engine to cut the yard quicker. The trend in the USA has been that washers take longer to wash. Once they were marketed to save time; now they are designed to get that 200 to 500 dollar tax . If it was mowers and the government decided all riding mowers under 8 HP get a 200 to 500 dollar tax credit too; the market would be distorted with gobs of whimpy riding mowers. BUT then folks would just rebuild their older mower more with 20HP engines; since time matters to so folks.
Whatever us laws are done; folks will look for loopholes. The old station wagon was a great car, but folks went to trucks and SUV's since at first these were loopholes; not really cars and thus had a lessor crash and rollover requirements and cost way less to build.
|Post# 510626 , Reply# 3   4/10/2011 at 13:33 (4,626 days old) by AZREOspecialist ()  || |
But isn't this how washers have been in Europe for the last 20 years? Front loaders take longer to wash and use very little water. This has been true in Europe for decades. This is not a USA phenomenon.
|Post# 510638 , Reply# 4   4/10/2011 at 14:06 (4,626 days old) by 3beltwesty ()  || |
Here both our 1947 and 1976 Westinghouse FL washers washed in the sub hour range.
The 1976 that I still own max time is 42 minutes. If stuff is not too dirty the time can be less say 32 to 37 minutes total.
Americas usage of FL washers is not new; it is 70 years.
American Front Loaders today take longer than in past eras. The whole time I grew up it was totally unheard of to have a front load wash cycle over an hour. Today wityh my newer LG that had some dirty stuff; the added prewash and extra time for a dirtier load gave a cycle time of 1 hour and 45 minutes; that is a bit longer than the 1976 westy's max of 42 miniutes.
Some folks really do not care if a wash load takes a few hours. Here having used American frontloaders for 50 years that are only 37 to 42 minutes; I find it odd that now cycle times that are twice as long are worshiped and good.
|Post# 510646 , Reply# 5   4/10/2011 at 15:17 (4,626 days old) by rapunzel (Sydney)  || |
They actually cleaned and rinsed better. They were also more durable.
|Post# 510980 , Reply# 6   4/12/2011 at 03:36 (4,624 days old) by tolivac (greenville nc)  || |
I would guess these motions are there for engineers to show off what they can make DD motors do-and to entertain washer spectators.Set up the couch or even bleachers in front of the washer-its going to put on its show tonight-heck they should have an audio input to the motors drive board-then you can have the washer drum move to your favorite music!And have multicolored LED lights shine in the drum as it does its thing-heck I might buy one then!!The washer is then an ENTERTAINMENT appliance as well as one to take care of your clothes.
|Post# 510984 , Reply# 7   4/12/2011 at 04:56 (4,624 days old) by aquarius1984 (Planet earth)  || |
"The only real improvement is the ability to wash very delicate garments in the machine instead of hand washing."
That MAY have been the case on Italian machines and/or various european models/makes.
However for over 30 years here we have had British designed and made machines that have been able to cope with handwash only items with 30 degree very gentle washes (PROGRAMME NUMBER 8).
Even these 30 degree washes could be made cooler by using the Economy and temperature features that machines had.
3 British Models spring to mind from as early as 1978 with the TOL Square Door Creda.
Late 70s production and design saw these introduced in 1980.
Creda Electronic 1000 (Round Door)
Servis Quartz 600
Then followed in the early 80s with the
All capable of processing handwash only garments and maintaining the fabric qualities.
|Post# 510986 , Reply# 8   4/12/2011 at 05:07 (4,624 days old) by Haxisfan (Europe - UK / Italy)  || |
It's not the case with all Italians models: my grandparents early 70's and my parents mid 70's front loaders had several programmes for delicate items, synthetics, acrylics and wool: the sturdiest of the delicates cycles had a 40 degree main wash with a biological prewash; then a less sturdy 40 degree delicate wash for woolen items and a delicate wash cycle with a cold prewash. There was also a 35 degree universal cycle for delicate colours.
They washers in question were both Zerowatt, this brand became part of the Candy group in 1985. Cheerio.
|Post# 511054 , Reply# 9   4/12/2011 at 13:58 (4,624 days old) by laundromat (Hilo, Hawaii)  || |
I think what these companies are trying to do is the same as the top loading washer manufacturers did back in the 50's and 60's with their "lint filters".Lint will always be there and will wash right down the drain. No washers ever keep that from happening whether they have the filters or not.It was just a way of upgrading customers for another $10 to $100.The steam feature is another way to make a few more dollars.I would be leery about that due to the painted instead of porcelain finish appliances have on them now. I am sure there are already owners out there who are experiencing rust on their steam clean washers.
The motion feature however is not that much of a joke.It makes the washers that have it able to truly have a hand wash feature and really does get stains out better as well as thoroughly rinsing them out.Remember,these newer brands all have see through windows and can become quite a hypnotic experience. Especially to those who never watched them before.So,with more different movements than just a clockwise 15 second/counter clockwise 15 second move,they become a lot more fun to watch.I know that ,I myself,got into loving washers because,back then,there were so many different independent brands with many different types of movements.Frigidaire,Apex,kelvinator,Westinghouse,Philco and Whirlpool. Five different brands with 5 different types of movements.I never really cared for the oscillating agitators. I liked the Frigidaire and Kelvinator top loaders and loved the Westinghouse Laundromat slant front units from the 50's and the Bendixes from start to finish. The Bendixes had four different paddles that were perforated and had a great sound during operation especially their two step final spin!!!
|Post# 511252 , Reply# 10   4/13/2011 at 10:19 (4,623 days old) by logixx (Germany)  || |
As I understand, some motions are used for specific purposes.
Filtration (spinning) - to force detergent solution through the clothes
Stepping (rapid start/stop motion) - to loosen clothes after the spin cycle
Rolling (slow tumble) - for extra quiet wash action
Fast-forward to 4:50 min.
CLICK HERE TO GO TO logixx's LINK
|Post# 511370 , Reply# 11   4/13/2011 at 22:05 (4,622 days old) by powerfin64 (Yakima, Washington)  || |
The LG Washer I have, has 2 of the the half-dozen motions. Stepping- which occurs shortly after the main wash starts(10 seconds clock-wise and 10 seconds counter clock-wise), not after the spin. then goes into the rolling motion for a couple of minutes, the resumes normal tumbling action. The stepping seems to be in the cotton/normal cycle, and does not go into the stepping and rolling motions if it is a full load(4 bars)
Generally, my wash loads are about 2 bars(half full).
I have really no idea what these motions are suppost to accomplish, but are fun to watch.