Thread Number: 78085  /  Tag: Modern Automatic Washers
Miele W1 in US software limitations vs. W1 sold in Europe?
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Post# 1021018   1/13/2019 at 11:59 by SGT10 (California )        

Anyone who purchased a W1 in the U.S. notice that our machines cannot do a few standard things that W1’s elsewhere in the world can? Specifically, if you want to use the Heavy soil icon to select a prewash, and happen to have any other option selected, the W1 will NOT execute its heavy soil programming (it will not add a prewash and goes right to main wash)? Also, if you try to select more than one extra option at the same time, you cannot do it (the check mark will be added to only one option in a cycle. Selecting a second option will de-select the first option you chose.)

Post# 1021102 , Reply# 1   1/14/2019 at 00:35 by Moon1234 (Wisconsin)        

Yes, I posted about this a while back. All of the options work properly when using the app. This seems to either be a bug or a deliberate choice. My guess is this is a bug.

I have noticed the the heavy soiling button does not add a specific prewash, but it does extend the initial wash and does increases the amount of detergent used.

The only way to do a prewash and have any other options enabled at the same time is to use mobile control program and set the options in the app.

I would suggest lodging a complaint with Miele. Could also request a feature enhancement vs a complaint. Depends how strongly you feel about the issue.


Post# 1021168 , Reply# 2   1/14/2019 at 15:00 by SGT10 (California )        

Thank you, Moon.

I know some people feel differently, but I am not eager to connect my machine to the internet. If I were better at tech, I could figure out how to put on a separate VLAN to protect the security of my wireless network, but haven’t been able to do it so far.

I spoke to Miele tech support this morning. After consulting with his colleagues, he told me that “there is no solution at this time.” That was his final answer with no more explanation, so I think I hit an immovable wall.


Post# 1021170 , Reply# 3   1/14/2019 at 15:32 by moon1234 (Wisconsin)        

I would not be worried in the least. I am a network engineer by trade and have been for over 20 years. I work for a company that has offices around the world and has thousands of devices online.

There is virtually zero at risk from connecting a Miele washer to the internet via your wireless network. It is significantly more likely your PC, firewall and other commonly used devices are at risk.


Post# 1021175 , Reply# 4   1/14/2019 at 15:54 by brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

We've found the same thing with the Miele induction cooktops. On our Australian model, you turn the power on and then touch the power setting you want. On the exact same model on a friends in the US you turn the power on, touch zero for the burner you want to use and then touch the power setting.

He asked that question of Miele when we were there and the answer was basically that its just because and there is nothing they will do about it.


Post# 1021186 , Reply# 5   1/14/2019 at 16:54 by aamassther (Hendersonville, NC )        

aamassther's profile picture
From reading the Quick Refence Guide, I’m wondering if “Chorination” is selected in “settings”. When selected, it sounds like the machine goes straight into main wash instead of doing a prewash, dispensing bleach towards the end of the wash as well as extending the wash time.
On our Diamond dishwasher, using the app does override settings selected in the dishwasher menus.
HTH, Todd


Post# 1021190 , Reply# 6   1/14/2019 at 17:10 by SGT10 (California )        

Moon— I have heard many people express concern that the “internet of things” could potentially introduce a “wormhole” by which outsiders could view/intercept network traffic. Do you think this concern is misplaced, or is it more that Miele’s installed base is so low that it is not worth exploiting any security failures, or have I mis-interpreted what you are saying?

Post# 1021214 , Reply# 7   1/14/2019 at 20:43 by henene4 (Germany)        

Anything connected COULD be hacked in theory.

But why? Why would you?




What use do you have of it? Turning off and on my lights? Interupting a wash cycle?

As soon as there is some form of encryption (https-basing a system would probably surfice, or - if you want to be super safe - use SSL on that system) on the data traffic and your passwords are somewhat secure the work going into hacking that is so insane that a single user would never be an economicaly viable hacking target.

IMO it takes a lot of ignorance of basic principles and\or a lot of self-centered thinking to assume you would get hacked that way.



Same with biometrics. Sure, tricking my Windows Hello face recognition or my phones finger print sensor is a theoreticly viably doable.
But who would put that work in? Why? And how would you get my device in your hands to use that? Or - even less feasable - how can you unlock my device with that remotely?
There is a reason why such things as TPMs and secure enclaves exist or why CPUs are central parts of PC security.

Same with people who say "Once your biometrics get out you are screwed!"
Yeah, sure, but when ever you leave a fastfood restaurant, I could get ALL your fingerprints WITHOUT you having a clue.
So, do you secure that?



And then some such people still use the remote garage opener from the 60s...


Post# 1021316 , Reply# 8   1/15/2019 at 23:21 by moon1234 (Wisconsin)        

@SGT10
The threat that is most talked about is the machine being used to host malicious code. Not that someone is looking to steal your personal secrets, but rather you machine being used to launch attacks against others. If you have heard of denial of service attacks, basically millions of devices trying to connect to the web/mail/etc server of another person with the end result being to deny any legitimate traffic from getting through.

The attacker would demand money from the target and if they don't pay the infected devices would be used to launch an denial of service attack.

In order for any of these devices to be infected they need to be exposed to the internet and not behind a firewall. Virtually every device is now behind a firewall. These devices do not initiate connections to websites other than their manufacturer. They are not going to become infected.

Miele devices don't talk directly to anything other than Miele's servers. When you send commands to the washer/dryer/etc. they are not sent directly. They go to Miele's servers. The washer/dryer/etc then are sent commands by Miele's servers. This means ALL commands are inspected before being relayed. This is also what allows you to poll the status of your machines when not at home.

This is the reason why I am not worried in the least. I actually wish Miele would do more with this technology than they are. I would love a running total of how many cycles have been run, broken down by cycle (Normal: 32, Sanitize: 10, etc.) Maybe a running total of hours in use, water used, electricity used, detergent used, etc. How many cycles per week, what days we do the most, maybe a complete log. The same for the dryer.

I think they don't do this yet as it would really point out how well the device is holding up. Imagine they put in a life expectancy of 10,000 hours and then had a "life remaining" picture or image. You could put in the amount you paid along with your cost of electricity and detergent. You could then see how much you have spent in total and how much each load cost averaged over time.

These are all wishful thinking, but I think these would all be EASY for Miele and would provide lots of useful information for owners.

Instead of giving end users textual instructions, use the app to walk customers through how to perform minor repairs with pictures and using sensors to confirm things are done properly, etc.





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