Thread Number: 82069  /  Tag: Vintage Automatic Washers
Miele Top Electronic W716
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Post# 1060895   2/18/2020 at 17:41 (1,463 days old) by bellalaundry (St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada)        

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I've never seen this model before! Any ideas what era it's from? The ad says "direct from Germany". Makes me wonder if the electronics would work on 60htz?

It seems I can't download pictures with my new Chromebook...


CLICK HERE TO GO TO bellalaundry's LINK





Post# 1060920 , Reply# 1   2/19/2020 at 00:00 (1,463 days old) by Revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        
Bad link

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Your link is no good. Where did you see it?


Post# 1060965 , Reply# 2   2/19/2020 at 13:10 (1,462 days old) by bellalaundry (St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada)        
OK

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I'm using a Windows computer now..should work?

CLICK HERE TO GO TO bellalaundry's LINK


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Post# 1060968 , Reply# 3   2/19/2020 at 13:30 (1,462 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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That is a Miele from 1988 - 1990 or there about. It's a model just before the introduction of the Novotronic models. It's partly electronic, but the timer is still a rapid advance one. The dark control panel with the light controls is rare but I've seen it before. This machine was also available with a white on white and a grey on grey control panel. It's rather flexible because it has a separate temperature selector.

Post# 1060973 , Reply# 4   2/19/2020 at 14:03 (1,462 days old) by Revvinkevin (Tinseltown - Shakey Town - La-La Land)        
Neat!

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Very nice looking machine! That one would be fun to have.

I have scooped up a few Miele’s lately. My oldest (a W1926) is 10 years newer than this one. I would guess it was made for the North American market as it’s in Canada, but who knows until you ask. They are all built in Germany., even my most recent thats 6 years old.

Kevin

PS, my cousin-in-law and her family now live in Niagra Falls, ON


Post# 1060984 , Reply# 5   2/19/2020 at 15:37 (1,462 days old) by brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

Mum has a variant of this one that I got from Rodney. Louis is right, its incredibley flexible, Mum's also has an additional knob to select spin speeds from 400 - 1300. When I got it, it just needed a new Heater relay and new motor brushes.

The only issue with that timer, is if you cancel during the wash, the time it takes to click back to the start, so that you can select another cycle. you have to do a full cancel and reset before you can pick another option, even if you were to go from a wash program to a drain. It gets cranky if you dont let it do its thing.



Post# 1061031 , Reply# 6   2/19/2020 at 21:56 (1,462 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Go for it, you're just what that washer needs.

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Besides you know you want it! *LOL*

Hardly used could mean someone got it to North America, found it didn't operate well on 60hz power and thus it has sat sitting ever since.

To best of my knowledge Miele North America (USA and Canada at least) only began importing with the W770 washer and matching dryer. Then came W1065/W1070 models, all of which obviously are younger than machine pictured above.

We both have AEG Lavamat washers that somehow made it across the pond but otherwise were never sold in North America. In fact we also both have ironers and other goodies that came from Europe, so what's another washer? *LOL*

Contact Miele Canada in morning to see if they can give any information on washer. Things like if it ever was sold in North America, technical specs, etc..

You want to find out if this washer is 50hz/60hz or 50hz only. That and if it is bothered by running on 60hz.


The AEG Lavamat I lost out on was older than this machine, or maybe same age, but owner claimed his ex-wife used it all the time and it wasn't bothered by frequency difference.

Unlike modern Electrolux AEG washers there likely isn't a pesky motherboard in this washer refusing to let it operate if it senses incorrect frequency.

Worse that can happen is timer, motor and maybe some other bits would run 10% faster on 60hz power.


Post# 1061033 , Reply# 7   2/19/2020 at 21:58 (1,462 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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One should always check Maturasigma's YT uploads when question is about Miele or other German washers; he's got a million of them! *LOL*






Post# 1061042 , Reply# 8   2/20/2020 at 02:43 (1,462 days old) by chestermikeuk (Rainhill *Home of the RailwayTrials* Merseyside,UK)        
Miele

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Looks a great find amd the usual Miele flexibility regarding programmes, love those rapid advance timer indicators, thats not a model that Ive seen here, so even better as it makes it rarer !!

Hope you get it Guy, look forward to the reports !!


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Post# 1061107 , Reply# 9   2/20/2020 at 14:31 (1,461 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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Here's a picture of an almost identical control panel.



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Post# 1061143 , Reply# 10   2/20/2020 at 19:33 (1,461 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Direct From Germany

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Means just that, washer was made in Germany and somehow made it over to North America.

Again reaching out to Miele Canada will tell if machine was ever sold on this side of pond. Having never seen anything other than than W770/W765 washers was told those were first imported to these shores. But have been known to be wrong before....

Your only main worry about this machine is Miele Canada won't have some or any parts nor can (or will) order them from Germany.

The W700 series washers predates W1070/W1065 and Miele USA (and one assumes Canada) long has stopped importing spares from Germany as machines are past 20 year life cycle spares guarantee period.

Of course if spares are needed you've only to find proper part number then plug into internet to see if can be had from Europe or elsewhere.

Would recommend if going to collect in person check/listen to motor. Am almost sure that machine has same huge cast iron double motor as in our 1070. Long as it is good should give you years of not decades of service without issues. Replacing brushes is a bear of job but doable.


Post# 1061166 , Reply# 11   2/21/2020 at 01:40 (1,461 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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I'm sorry Launderess, but the W716 is of a newer series than the W1070/W1065 series. I don't know why Miele used the W1000 numbering, I know them as W770 and W765 as they were named in Europe. But the higher numbered W700 series is older than the lower numbered W 700 series. (I know, not everything Miele is logic). The W765 is part of the New Miele Class that was introduced in 1982. The W716 looks like an early model of the generation next to that, introduced in 1987, at least that is the oldest brochure I have of that generation in my collection.

Post# 1061210 , Reply# 12   2/21/2020 at 13:36 (1,460 days old) by Brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

Louis is correct. This generation of machine will have a modern motor rather than the old cast iron bohemeth.

Post# 1061211 , Reply# 13   2/21/2020 at 13:48 (1,460 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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Actually I'm not totally sure about the motor. Some of the early models still might have the older motor(s). I don't know exactly when those were totally gone.

Post# 1061213 , Reply# 14   2/21/2020 at 14:53 (1,460 days old) by Brisnat81 (Brisbane Australia)        

I’ve got two in this range. An entry level and a w723 1300rpm model with speed increments of 100rpm

Both have the modern square motor, the difference is more sound insulation on the higher end model.

I have a W784 which is similar to the 400 series from the 70s

Edit

Looking at parts lists, it seems to be that the 700-719 models are a hybrid of the high 7xx models vs the mid 7xx models. Anything could’ve slipped in, depending on what was left around.


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This post was last edited 02/21/2020 at 15:10
Post# 1061228 , Reply# 15   2/21/2020 at 19:40 (1,460 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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Price has dropped, so maybe seller is motivated. *LOL*

If were in one's neck of woods might be tempted, but only if could find a safe bolt hole for Miele W1070.


Post# 1069912 , Reply# 16   4/29/2020 at 16:18 (1,392 days old) by princey (Sutton Ontario Canada)        
lucky/unlucky owner of the W716 referred to in post

Hi all,
I actually purchased the unit being discussed above. Unfortunately, it did not run at all on 240 V. My husband switched it to 120 and it started filling - and promptly stopped. It is now stuck in the on position! I was sooooo lucking forward to using this machine, not only because it comes from my parents homeland, but because I love the idea of a machine that actually washed clothes properly. Any ideas who I can call to find out if it's possible to fix it?
Peg


Post# 1069998 , Reply# 17   4/30/2020 at 04:25 (1,392 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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Unless something is different that machine should require 220v/16 amp circuit at 50hz. Max draw is 3.2kW (for heater), something you are not going to get from 120v.

Some older Miele washers aren't to picky about frequency; that is they will run on either stated 50hz, or 60hz (latter with or without issues), but switching from 220v to 120v normally isn't possible except in certain instances.

Here in North America early some early 700 and 1000 series washers could be switched to run on 120v from 220v. Miele supplied a power cord kit that either their tech or yourself (if handy with electrics) installed.

It could very well be that certain bits inside washer work well enough on 120v, but others need the required 220v. Your best bet would be to examine the electrical schematics for washer. This bit of paper should be just inside service panel in front of washer.

You can also use schematics to diagnose why washer may have had issues with 240v power.


Post# 1070006 , Reply# 18   4/30/2020 at 06:40 (1,391 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands)        

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There should be a tag on the machine with information about voltage. Perhaps it's behind the lint trap door on the front.

Post# 1070293 , Reply# 19   5/1/2020 at 14:37 (1,390 days old) by princey (Sutton Ontario Canada)        
Definitely 220v / 50hrz

dropping to 110v was to check the electronics. which all worked. it is currently wired on a 240V circuit, 3 -wire with two hot and one neutral. the blue and brown wires are hot and the yellow/green wire is neutral. there is power to all wires, HOWEVER the power light does not come on and none of the settings work. Miele professional was not able to assist on a 32 year old machine


Post# 1070298 , Reply# 20   5/1/2020 at 15:51 (1,390 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
Uhm

Not sure

But green yellow will most likely NOT be a phase.

Green Yellow is the earth connection color over here.

Brown is phase, blue is neutral over here.



Given you want to get 240V out of 2 phases you will have to put both phases on the terminals, no neutral there, right?

So your phases on brown and blue, green yellow on the earth.



My best advice is to disconnect the machine IMMEDIATELY and to NOT PLUG IT BACK IT until you fixed that.

Maybe send a picture of the connections plus what kind of supply exactly you want to connect it to.


Post# 1070300 , Reply# 21   5/1/2020 at 16:08 (1,390 days old) by princey (Sutton Ontario Canada)        
A couple of pics of the wires

Thank you for responding.
I have unplugged the machine. Here are a few pics of the wiring box


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Post# 1070306 , Reply# 22   5/1/2020 at 16:41 (1,390 days old) by princey (Sutton Ontario Canada)        
Better Picture

So if I understood,
Yellow Green Stripe goes to Ground (copper)
Brown goes to Hot (Black)
Blue goes to neutral (white)

Our home is 100 amp
The Breaker is 2 X 30 AMP

Gosh - with self Isolation, I could really use from fresh laundry...any help you can provide would be so greatly appreciated! :)


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Post# 1070328 , Reply# 23   5/1/2020 at 18:48 (1,390 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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As machine was never sold in North America Miele North America (USA, Canada, and Mexico) likely have no information other than what can be pulled up in their systems. It is likely certain you won't find a tech or customer support person who even knows what this machine is much less ever worked on one.

Sometimes you luck out and get an old school tech or support person who is up for the challenge and will work things out, others cannot and will not be bothered.

Last time one inquired to Miele about appliances brought here from Europe, but never sold on this side of pond response was "Miele will provide worldwide support for their products, but if you want repair work done it is not guaranteed or carries any sort of warranty".

This can understand as it is a bit much to ask people to fix a machine they've never clapped eyes upon. That being said usually there are only subtle differences between what is offered in North America and Miele appliances say in Germany.

In general however Miele North America is washing their hands of appliances that are thirty or so years old. They no longer import parts for W700, W1070, W1065, and even some early W19XX series washing machines. Good luck getting a tech that even knows what these early machines are. Miele stopped training new techs on "older" appliances years ago.

It looks as if your washer was hardwired, something common enough in Europe, but on this side of pond we are used to plugs already on cords. You might want to consult a qualified electrician to assist sorting out how to either put a plug on this washer or how to hard wire it into what you've got.

While assume it is possible but haven't heard of a washer that would only run on say 240v, but not 208v or 220v. Looking at Miele washer internal parts and or electrical plates normally they read "208v-240v" power range.


Post# 1070329 , Reply# 24   5/1/2020 at 18:48 (1,390 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

For the Canadian side of things I can't really help you.

For the machine side I can tell you that it needs voltage between brown and blue, something in the range of 200-250V AC.

Yellow Green is ground.



What that matches up to on the supply side I have no idea.


Post# 1070337 , Reply# 25   5/1/2020 at 19:34 (1,390 days old) by stricklybojack (South Hams Devon UK)        

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.
I had a Miele washer that had a water sensor flood protector on the bottom which would disable the machine. I unknowingly triggered it once when I tipped the machine on it’s side for transport and some residual water migrated to it. The machine failed to work until the water on the sensor was dried, then it was good to go.




This post was last edited 05/01/2020 at 20:11
Post# 1070339 , Reply# 26   5/1/2020 at 19:40 (1,390 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
Had same thought as well

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That maybe some internal protection system is tripped that needs resetting. However looking at owners manual for this machine there is no mention of any such thing.

Post# 1070412 , Reply# 27   5/2/2020 at 05:26 (1,390 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        

The first generations with the WPS system that had the float switch were the fully electronic machines (Novotronic I think and onwards).


This one has no water leak protection to speak off.


Post# 1070421 , Reply# 28   5/2/2020 at 06:38 (1,389 days old) by princey (Sutton Ontario Canada)        
Alone for the weekend

So I am on my own for the weekend. I have limited experience with wiring, but have built lamps from scratch and attached wall and ceiling light fixtures and such. Is there any harm in connecting the wires and flipping the switch. I just checked the following sequence:
Yellow Green Stripe goes to Ground (copper)
Brown goes to Hot (Black)
Blue goes to neutral (white).
Not even a power light. So disapointed, although I'm guessing my husband would have tried this the first time he plugged it in. Interesting how the power light comes on at a lower voltage.
Thanks everyone for your support.


Post# 1070458 , Reply# 29   5/2/2020 at 11:34 (1,389 days old) by henene4 (Heidenheim a.d. Brenz (Germany))        
OK I read a bit into some stuff

So if I am not mistaken, each phase (so each hot) is 120V to neutral.

So to get anywhere close to 240V you have to go phase to phase, no neutral.

So you have to take 2 DIFFERENT phases and put one on blue and one on brown.
They can't be the same phase twice.


Post# 1070546 , Reply# 30   5/2/2020 at 23:18 (1,389 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        
May not be a popular suggestion....

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But suggest you just call in an electrician to hard wire the connection properly. That or just put a proper plug on the thing to match whatever outlet you have.

This and pull the electrical schematic (should be just behind front door of cabinet) so you and or the electrician can see what is supposed to be what.

Other solution is to have Miele make a service call (which will cost dear for what it is, but maybe less than electrician) to do same (hard wire connection or attach proper plug or even cord.

At least one member here has a European Miele washer that operates perfectly (IIRC) on North American 220v/60hz power, so it can be done.

While you likely won't find a Miele tech familiar with your washer, they ought to know enough on how to wire/attach a power cord as things are almost basically same. Or at least were until Miele stopped importing 220v washing machines to North America. Wait I take that back, the Miele professional washers, dryers and ironers all still run on 208v-240v power.

Keep harping on about schematic because it might very well be that problem lies not with how you are hooking up unit, but something traceable further up the line. For that you need to look at certain things and perhaps get out a multi meter to determine if power is going where it should.


Post# 1070583 , Reply# 31   5/3/2020 at 06:58 (1,388 days old) by princey (Sutton Ontario Canada)        
Running on 240 Amps

Machine is now running on 240 Amps of power. It starts, fills with water, then runs through the cycles (click,click, click) without spinning or draining:)


Post# 1070585 , Reply# 32   5/3/2020 at 07:10 (1,388 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK)        
Its possible it either wants resetting or....

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It may need checking to see if any internal fuse has blown when connected the wrong way round as in your picture, Its also possible a wire has burnt that goes to the motor and possibly the pump, Have you tried turning the selector dial to stop allow the machine to click round to stop then choose a spin only cycle see what happens then?

Am sure there are many people on here with a lot more knowledge than myself and of course its easier to diagnose a problem if the machine was in front of you.

Good luck


Post# 1070595 , Reply# 33   5/3/2020 at 08:05 (1,388 days old) by Launderess (Quiet Please, There´s a Lady on Stage)        

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Again not to keep harping on about that schematic.....

If washer now has power so timer will work, but pump and motor don't, it is time to trace those circuits/wiring to see if power is reaching those parts.

What does washer do if set properly to "spin" or "drain" cycle?

If washer is dead quiet, then something is wrong somewhere.

With the more modern square motor if washer tumbles it should spin. That is unless something is preventing like worn motor brushes. OTOH if washer does have the old two piece cast iron motor it will wash perfectly fine but not spin for various reasons.

One small correction; your washer is connected to 240 *volts* of power, not amps. Total amp draw for this washer is about 16; 240 would cause some very interesting things to happen I shouldn't wonder.

There is at least one Facebook page where many European appliance hobbyists hang out, plus a few others. Maybe one of our international members can post your query there to see what there is.



Post# 1070656 , Reply# 34   5/3/2020 at 16:59 (1,388 days old) by ozzie908 (Lincoln UK)        
Facebook has a page dedicated to appliance repairs

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its called Service engineers there is also a Facebook page for washer fiends such as myself and its called service wash now if anyone wants to join up am sure the admin won't hesitate to accept you if anyone wants to check it out go to my home page Austin Crump Lincoln UK and have a nosey about.

It may be helpful to some of you with European machines :)

Austin



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