Thread Number: 85403  /  Tag: Vintage Automatic Washers
Maytag 712 Nearly Stops During Spray Rinse (Revisited)
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Post# 1099448   12/5/2020 at 18:32 (1,176 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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I've provided a link to a thread I launched about this a year ago for reference.  The subject machine is one of the last to roll off the line with a Pitman transmission in May of 1987.

 

I've been cautious about running heavy loads over the past year, but today something happened that I really didn't expect.  The machine was washing one cotton/poly blend king size flat sheet and a lightweight cotton/poly Italian pull-over shirt, with water level a little more than half full.  It spun fine going into the spray rinse.  Suds were low (less than half a scoop of Gain powder), but about halfway through the spraying, the tub slowed way down, slower than during other incidents with a full load of towels.  It was just barely able to recover to full speed after the spraying stopped and before the timer clicked over to the deep rinse fill sequence. 

 

Since the contents were well-balanced and lightweight, why would this have happened?  I really don't want to have to babysit this machine every time I use it, but that appears to be necessary after today's experience.

 

The real puzzler is, just prior to washing the solo sheet, I ran a full load of bed linens with two king size sheets, two heavy cotton king size pillow cases, four standard pillow cases and four zippered pillow covers.  The machine did a spray rinse without slowing at all, even though it had to drain a full tub of water first, which provided less time for it to get up to top speed before the spray began. 

 

I'm at a loss trying to come up with an explanation for this slowing situation and why it's intermittent.  It clearly has nothing to do with load size or weight, and I'm pretty sure we can rule out suds, too.  Any suggestions in addition to those provided in the linked thread would be appreciated.



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Post# 1099456 , Reply# 1   12/5/2020 at 19:36 (1,176 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

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Drain/pump obstruction would cause that due to water accumulation in the tub, so investigate that angle.


Post# 1099464 , Reply# 2   12/5/2020 at 20:25 (1,175 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks for the suggestion, but . . .

 

The washer drains into a utility sink.  Water shoots out with good pressure and at high volume during the spin drain sequence.  I remember checking with other vintage large tub Maytag owners here about whether the pump might have an issue by describing the spin speed before the spraying starts -- nearly top speed but not quite -- and they indicated that their machines behaved the same way.

 

However, with final spin well underway, I notice that the steady small stream of water exiting the hose will sometimes increase with a surging action and associated whooshing noise from the pump.  I'm curious as to why this happens, because it seems strange that with everything else fairly constant, the pump would put out a brief spurt of a larger volume a time or two before the final spin cycle is over. 


Post# 1099467 , Reply# 3   12/5/2020 at 21:01 (1,175 days old) by appnut (TX)        

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Ralph, I apologize for not keeping up closely, but is this the original pump? What you described regarding the final spin, sounds like the pump is weak. I've never known a washer to do a couple of emphatic wooshes well into final spin. the majority of water should be expelled by the time it reaches full spin and there should only be trickles until the end of the final spin. Just my observation for over 50 years. I remember Maytags as they gradually ramped up to the final spin speed, it would woosh once for a final purge as it get to top spin speed. After that just trickles.

Post# 1099476 , Reply# 4   12/5/2020 at 21:40 (1,175 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks Bob, I'll keep an eye on it and make sure my description was accurate.

 

The pump that was on this machine when I got it a few years ago made a squeaking/squealing sound and it didn't turn easily.  Its rubber impeller was bloated and rubbing against the housing.  During a visit to Tucson, Roger gave me a replacement pump that turned freely and was silent.  That's the pump that's on the machine now.

 

It just seems weird to me that the pump can exhibit impressively powerful action during the spin drain, which is pushing a huge volume of water through it, but the relatively light flow of water from the cold-only spray rinse can bog it down.  Maybe there's a law or two of physics that explains this, but I wasn't much into the science curriculum in school.


Post# 1099481 , Reply# 5   12/5/2020 at 21:46 (1,175 days old) by Unimatic1140 (Minneapolis)        

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Hi Ralph, when the machine slows down after the spray rinse stops in the last increment of the 1st spin do you hear any sloshing of water in the outer tub at all? That would be a clue that pump is weak. If you hear no water what so ever I wonder if the belt is slipping too much? Is there any leaking that could be causing the belt to get wet, either belt that is?

Post# 1099486 , Reply# 6   12/5/2020 at 22:18 (1,175 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Hi Robert, and thanks for your reply!

 

There is no sloshing sound and there are no leaks that I'm aware of, but I'll take a look.   Since the pump's belt was replaced just a few years ago and the machine has been used on average only about once or twice a month since, the main drive belt may be the source of the trouble.  It looked to be in satisfactory condition when I got the machine, but it certainly could be slipping more than it should. 

 

When I ordered the pump belt, I also ordered a non-Newton replacement drive belt that I decided not to use, but I can slap it on and then see what happens.  I think that's worth a try.  If it solves the problem I can start watching for a genuine NOS Maytag belt.  I don't trust the modern replacements that aren't designed to slip as Maytag intended.

 

Thanks again!


Post# 1099489 , Reply# 7   12/5/2020 at 22:46 (1,175 days old) by combo52 (50 Year Repair Tech Beltsville,Md)        
MT DC slowing Down In The Spray Rinse

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I am going to guess Suds-Lock, the next time this happens lift the lid as soon as it slows down and pull the clothing away from the tub and see if you see any suds at all coming through the basket holes. 

 

[ often on MT DC washers you don't see a SL because the basket holes are so small that the suds don't come back through the basket holes ]

 

If you don't see any suds let the washer sit for 10-15 minutes then close the lid and let it restart, if a burst of water comes out of the drain hose the machine was either SLed or the pump is air locking from an obstruction in the outer tub or you just have another bad pump.

 

John L.


Post# 1099513 , Reply# 8   12/6/2020 at 02:20 (1,175 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Hi John,

 

I actually had the lid open and was watching the spin already when it began to slow down, but I didn't know to stop the machine and pull things away from the sides of the tub, so I'll try that with the next incident.  There was no evidence of over-sudsing during the wash cycle with aggressive (for Maytag, anyway) agitation, nor was there much suds created in the laundry sink by the force of the expelled wash water. 

 

I have some other stuff that can be run through this machine so if the problem arises again I'll do what you instructed and see if waiting 10-15 minutes reveals a possible obstruction or pump problem.  So would an obstruction be something like a sock in between the tubs?  That's a plausible scenario since the slowing occurs randomly and apparently isn't related to load size or weight, but as I said in my reply to Robert, there's no sloshing sound either.

 

This machine belonged to a retired couple, and I suspect that they were already empty nesters when they bought it in 1987.  I can't imagine they'd have overloaded it enough to send something up and over the tub, but if in later years they had help coming in, all bets would have been off.


Post# 1099571 , Reply# 9   12/6/2020 at 13:49 (1,175 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        

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My A606 will do that sometimes.  I still haven't figured out if the belt is slipping or if it's suds lock.  With these new HE detergents, I'm never quite sure how much to use in a top loader.  I've been wondering too if the rollers on the motor carriage have enough lubricant.  I'll fire it up in the Spring and see if I can't figure that all out! 


Post# 1099577 , Reply# 10   12/6/2020 at 14:37 (1,175 days old) by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor, Maine)        

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My 511 will slow during the spray rinse with a large load, like towels, but ramps back up when the spray stops.

Post# 1099581 , Reply# 11   12/6/2020 at 15:00 (1,175 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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I can get that sudslock issue without warning.....

proper detergent amount used....didn't seem like any sort of excessive sudsing during agitation...but that one chance that the clothing was not quite dirty enough for amount used....then goes into first spin, and you have a suds cake galore...

found beltdrive Kenmore/Whirlpools can be a fine line between right amount for cleaning, yet not suds lock the machine......

you would think this sort of thing would be almost impossible since most all detergents are listed as HE low sudsing.....

Sears Ultra Plus was considered low to no suds....even with major overdoses....I never hads a suds lock issue, but others said it was possible....


Post# 1099596 , Reply# 12   12/6/2020 at 16:50 (1,175 days old) by Good-Shepherd (New Jersey)        
My 511 will slow during the spray rinse

My A712 powers through the spray rinse no matter the load size or any other variable.

Of course it had a recent tub bearing/boot seal replacement, pump oiled and motor glides lubed.


Post# 1099598 , Reply# 13   12/6/2020 at 17:03 (1,175 days old) by Kenmoreguy89 (Valenza Piemonte, Italy- Soon to be US immigrant.)        

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I used to get a few suds lock with the DD whirlpool and ge.
Next time try to pour half a bucket of water and fabric softener as it slows if it starts pumping water and kicks into spin then it means you had a sudslock. (Softener kills suds)
But maybe is due to a coin in the outer tub.


Post# 1099602 , Reply# 14   12/6/2020 at 17:19 (1,175 days old) by qsd-dan (West)        

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"My A712 powers through the spray rinse no matter the load size or any other variable."

That's how all Maytags behave when everything is properly adjusted and functioning correctly.


Post# 1099603 , Reply# 15   12/6/2020 at 17:24 (1,175 days old) by bajaespuma (Connecticut)        

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I had a 712 that slowed to almost a halt regularly during the first spin. There was no suds-lock, no sloshing audible in the outer tub and it didn't happen so much when the water temp was COLD. I think that the motor simply was overloaded when the temp choice was WARM and the volume of water going into the tub right after the throw was too heavy to handle. I notice that on the later DEPENDABLE CARE Tag's the spray interval was drastically reduced from 1 minute on the 712 generation and the Center Dials to 15 seconds. I think the Newton boys knew that this was happening.


Post# 1099623 , Reply# 16   12/6/2020 at 18:54 (1,175 days old) by qsd-dan (West)        

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It's interesting to hear about draining problems on the 11 an 12 series machines. Before the 806 became the daily driver I used an A490 (which got upgraded to an an A712 using a console and 2 speed motor from a parts machine). It was always up to speed before the spray rinse started and had no problems powering through the spray rinse regardless of wash washer temperature and detergent used.....and that includes being connected to temper valve which allows a higher volume of water to enter the tub. It can't be dumb luck.

Post# 1099639 , Reply# 17   12/6/2020 at 21:49 (1,174 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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It appears I have a lot of company dealing with this same issue.

Since this seems to be a more common problem than I expected, I'm hoping that means it's not likely being caused by something between the tubs. I'm not at all inclined to tear things apart to find out.

The motor glides easily so I don't think it's that. This week I'll switch out the drive belt and see what happens. Since there's no rhyme or reason to the slowdowns, it may take a few loads to produce the problem. I have a load of towels to do, though. That's seems to be a reliable way to effect the spray rinse slowdown, so that's what I'll run for the first load with the new belt.



Post# 1099723 , Reply# 18   12/7/2020 at 16:43 (1,174 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        
Much Better

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I installed the new belt and started a load of towels with maximum fill level.   When agitation kicked in, it was super sloooooow and the machine was producing a low pitched hum.  I advanced the timer to drain some water and see if it would even attempt to spin.  Again, movement was slow, but it was trying and did slowly gain speed. 

 

Not wanting to waste a tub full of wash water, I started the wash cycle again to give things another try, let it fill to replace what had drained, and like magic it kicked in and agitated beautifully.  Smoother, quieter, and I think a little faster with the new Whirlpool-sourced belt.  It was like a new machine.    

 

The spin drain was flawless, with a smoother, quieter spin that was up to full RPM before the spray rinse began.  Once the spraying started, there wasn't a noticeable slowdown.  The machine had passed the acid test with the new belt.

 

I had tried this same new belt at our previous home where the machine lived outside on the covered patio.  Due to its location, I didn't notice any difference in the noise level, so I put the more OEM-like belt back on.  Now that the machine is in the basement, it's easy to hear the difference.

 

I followed the load of towels with a set of queen size flannel sheets and pillow cases.  Again, beautiful smooth, quiet agitation and a quick ramp up to full spin speed before the spray rinse.  This time, about halfway through the spray rinse there was some minor slowing along with a mild sloshing sound.  This lasted maybe 15 or 20 seconds and then the sloshing stopped and the tub quickly regained speed, easily reaching full RPM again in a matter of 10 seconds or so.

 

So, while the new belt has effected a huge improvement, there might still be something else going on.  I'll be running more test loads in the coming days. 

 

I've attached pictures of the old belt (sorry they're sideways -- taken with my iPhone).  It's pretty shiny and has what appears to be the beginnings of fraying.  I'll start watching for a NOS genuine Maytag belt, as the Whirlpool belt is somewhat thinner and isn't designed to slip, so could presumably develop its own issues sooner rather than later.


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 1099725 , Reply# 19   12/7/2020 at 16:52 (1,174 days old) by qsd-dan (West)        
Ralph

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Replacing either one of the pump or transmission belts will throw the pump belt adjustment off a bit. Did you check to make sure pump belt tension is still correct with a new installed transmission belt?

Post# 1099734 , Reply# 20   12/7/2020 at 18:21 (1,174 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks Dan.  No, I did not check the pump belt but I will because the situation you described makes perfect common sense.  It seems to pump out with the same force that it did before I installed the new belt, but I definitely want that belt tensioned per Maytag's guidelines so will hold the motor back and give it the squeeze check, and will adjust if necessary.


Post# 1099738 , Reply# 21   12/7/2020 at 19:55 (1,174 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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something to consider as well......drain hose length...the shortest straight run is usually best....

Post# 1099742 , Reply# 22   12/7/2020 at 20:51 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks Martin.  The drain hose is the original.  Since the laundry sink is to the left of the machine and the left-front corner of the machine and the corner of the laundry sink are almost touching, I have the hose routed across the top rear of the cabinet and around the the side to the sink.  I had to add an aluminum gooseneck fitting to get it to hook over the corner of the sink, so that's only a few inches of extra length.  

 

Again, the picture is configured differently here from the way I shot it with my iPhone.  A.I. is grossly overrated.


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Post# 1099745 , Reply# 23   12/7/2020 at 21:19 (1,173 days old) by robbinsandmyers (Conn)        

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I have this same problem 7 out of 10 times with my A407 when doing laundry, it will suds lock. Drove me crazy for the longest time and I tried new belts, less detergent, etc and finally came to the conclusion my stand pipe is simply too high. So I had a friend make me a 12" tall wood base to mount the machine on. But I have to wait until I do the major overhaul so we can hump it on there and forget it. The issue is so bad each time I do clothes I set an egg timer for 11 mins so Im in the basement when it goes into rinse/spin mode to prepare for suds lock should it happen.

Post# 1099754 , Reply# 24   12/7/2020 at 22:38 (1,173 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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I see and understand your configuration.....may not be a big issue, but you do have sort of a "S" trap using that metal hook...during full force pump out you wouldn't see a problem, but nearing the end when the pump froths up suds...there can be a chance of an air lock...

in any event, you can take two machines, and get two different reactions from the same situation...

speaking of suds froth....keep in mind the pump is running during agitation, frothing up suds into the outter tub, more than the agitation alone.....ie, if you ever had the front off of a direct drive machine with the plastic outter tub....amazing what you will see that pump stirring up...


Post# 1099755 , Reply# 25   12/7/2020 at 23:03 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Yeah, there was no way to use the hooked end of the hose over the side of the sink as I had hoped.  I can see how an air pocket could form.  I like the beefy original drain hose, but I suppose a more flexible aftermarket replacement hose might be easier to hook onto the sink and eliminate the S curve arrangement.


Post# 1099816 , Reply# 26   12/8/2020 at 12:04 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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I found a Newton belt on ebay.  Is there any reason to think it's not as genuine as it appears?



CLICK HERE TO GO TO RP2813's LINK on eBay

Post# 1099820 , Reply# 27   12/8/2020 at 12:31 (1,173 days old) by qsd-dan (West)        

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The belt has a "6" in front of the part#, which I believe Whirlpool started after the takeover.

Post# 1099823 , Reply# 28   12/8/2020 at 12:48 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks Dan.  Even though the belt resembles a true Maytag part, my tendency is not to trust anything that was branded as "Maytag" after Whirlpool took over.  I'll keep looking for something that's older stock.


Post# 1099830 , Reply# 29   12/8/2020 at 13:27 (1,173 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.)        

This post has been removed by the member who posted it.



Post# 1099843 , Reply# 30   12/8/2020 at 14:29 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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I checked the pump belt and it's properly adjusted.

 

I just finished running the flannel sheet set through another full cycle without any detergent as a means to eliminate suds as the culprit.  The slowing and sloshing sound happened again during the spray rinse, but it was again fairly brief and again slowing was minimal -- nothing so pronounced as it was before installing the new drive belt.  I noticed that the flow out of the drain hose was reduced when the slowing and sloshing began.  After about ten seconds, there was a surge out of the drain hose, the sloshing sound stopped and the spin quickly recovered to maximum speed.

 

Also, I have the cold tap adjusted to less than fully open in order to get a truly warm mixture instead of barely tepid, so the always-cold spray rinse isn't even producing maximum volume for the pump to handle.

 

Since both spin drain sequences have always executed perfectly, I think we can eliminate the possibility of a foreign item being stuck between the two tubs.  I also tend to think this has little or nothing to do with sudsing.  There were hardly any suds other than the small amount that didn't get completely rinsed out of the sheets yesterday, and for extra measure I had also used fabric softener when I washed them yesterday.

 

I don't think the "S" curve at the end of the drain hose is compromising the flow.  What I don't understand is why the pump performs as it should during both of the spin drain sequences and only slows during the spray rinse, which generates a far smaller volume of water for the pump to move.  

 

I'm a little skeptical about a new pump resolving the problem.  If this bit of slowing is as bad as it gets, I think I can live with it, but welcome any additional troubleshooting suggestions. 

 

 


Post# 1099846 , Reply# 31   12/8/2020 at 14:59 (1,173 days old) by swestoyz (Cedar Falls, IA)        

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Ralph - can you confirm if you are using the original, rigid drain hose that would have come with the A712? If so, and seeing how the drain hose terminates with the added gooseneck on the left side of the machine, level to about where the syphon break is fastened to the back righthand side of the cabinet, I suspect John's thoughts about an air pocket causing issues could be one of the root causes of the slowdown during the spray rinse.

Ben


Post# 1099847 , Reply# 32   12/8/2020 at 15:11 (1,173 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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may be unwarranted, but I think I would swap out a pump to see if there is a difference, you checked everything else, what have you got to lose at this point....


I had a FilterFlo years ago, not so much of a suds lock issue, or even spray rinse....but once the tub was empty, and it ramped to full speed, now your getting the excess water from the clothes, for some odd reason the pumping stopped, water would slosh around....you had to stop the machine, and then restart to get the rest of the water to pump out....

I was checking and changing everything to no avail of change.....finally I installed a new pump, and all worked like it should......

there didn't seem to be anything wrong with the original pump....how or why it started to act up, who knows....just a wonky thing to happen....

I could have investigated further, as either re-installing the old pump, or onto another machine to see if the issue returned.....but at this point, the new one worked, and just tossed the old one...


your machine should also have that built in airgap....wonder if that is not sealing/opening properly, causing an airlock issue, then the pump has to build up enough water to push that air through...anything is possible at this point


Post# 1099876 , Reply# 33   12/8/2020 at 18:19 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Hi Ben, yes you've sized up the drain hose arrangement precisely.  It's the original rigid hose, which is why it can't be coaxed to hang over the side of the sink.  Routing it across the back and around the side causes the hook in the end of the hose to aim in an upward direction, which necessitates the extra aluminum piece.

 

It hadn't occurred to me that it would make any difference if the hose was routed in a way that it would remain at the same height as the siphon break, but it's making more sense than ever now.  At our previous home, I had installed a standpipe for the hose to empty into, the hose was properly configured, and there was no need for the aluminum fitting.  Coincidentally, I don't recall ever having this issue with slowing during spray rinse then, or ever having to babysit the machine.  I think it's time to locate an aftermarket drain hose that's longer than average in order to facilitate the drop below the siphon break.

 

Martin, I'm still not sure about the pump being the problem.  I ran a couple of rubber-backed throw rugs through the machine a little while ago.  I used Oxy-clean HE liquid conservatively, and just the process of filling the tub created a decent suds cake, which I attribute to detergent residue in the rugs from prior washings.   I had selected slow wash/fast spin so there was no visible oversudsing during the wash cycle.   I was prepared for problems when the spin drain/spray rinse sequence launched, but instead the spray rinse completed without any slowdown or sloshing despite the evidence of potential for a suds lock.   I don't think this is a suds issue or a pump issue.  It's sounding like a drain hose issue.  An aftermarket hose shouldn't be too hard to find and would cost less than a pump, so that's what I'll try next.


Post# 1099880 , Reply# 34   12/8/2020 at 18:45 (1,173 days old) by qsd-dan (West)        

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I faintly remember reading somewhere in my Maytag material about allowing washers with a siphon valve extra time for a full spin out during testing purposes, which all 11 series through early LAT machines were equipped with from the factory. Not sure if it's the function of the valve or the valve itself that causes a restriction. It may be a good idea to bypass it completely and run a hose directly from the pump outlet port straight out the the back of the machine like the older models did (you'll have to remove the rear access panel cover to feed the hose through). Just a thought.

Post# 1099886 , Reply# 35   12/8/2020 at 19:33 (1,173 days old) by Sudster ()        
SIPHON VALVE

I'll bet a quarter Dan is right. My 87 A310 had this issue. I gutted the siphon valve since my drain entry was 8 inches above the tub height. Drains like a jet .

Post# 1099889 , Reply# 36   12/8/2020 at 19:50 (1,173 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks for sharing that option Dan.  This would for sure require a longer hose, as exiting out the bottom of the machine would add about three more feet to the distance the hose would need to cover.  Seems like a longer hose is the next thing to try, with or without bypassing the siphon valve.

 

I guess other manufacturers were using these valves long before Maytag.  My mom's '74 Kenmore had one -- or I assume it did since the drain hose connected at top left on the back of the machine.


Post# 1099891 , Reply# 37   12/8/2020 at 20:17 (1,173 days old) by wayupnorth (On a lake between Bangor and Bar Harbor, Maine)        

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Just remember if by some chance the hose falls to floor level after siphon valve is removed that it will gravity drain everywhere.

Post# 1099892 , Reply# 38   12/8/2020 at 20:41 (1,172 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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how about capping off the siphon valve to seal it off ?.....

just use a rubber tip for a cane in the proper size and a worm drive clamp....


Post# 1099894 , Reply# 39   12/8/2020 at 20:42 (1,172 days old) by Sudster ()        

Your valve is the actual elbow at 31 inches high on this machine. Pull it off,gut it and clamp it back together. It is simply removing a check valve from the fitting itself. Afterwards make sure your highest drainage point is at least 4 inches higher than your washer lid.

I used to siphon gas STRAIGHT out of my dads 1970 Ford truck truck into my Honda sl70. I never could get it to work from my mom's 69 Cadillac.


Post# 1099896 , Reply# 40   12/8/2020 at 21:13 (1,172 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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if you gut the insides of an anti-siphon valve, water will shoot out the top 4 holes during draining....the internals are there to keep this from happening during pump out, and to allow air to enter once pressure is released....

heres a vid for you Ralph as to what this valve looks like.....actually you could disconnect the hose from the siphon valve, and pull that hose through the bottom access port and connect your drain hose to that with a simple fitting and two clamps...direct from the pump.....easy as pie







Post# 1099897 , Reply# 41   12/8/2020 at 21:21 (1,172 days old) by Unimatic1140 (Minneapolis)        
Remove the siphon break and

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Yes just go to the hardware store or home depot and get a hose barb and 3 screw clamps, either straight or 90 degree angle hose barb will work. The Maytag hose is large either 3/4" or 1" barb size I believe.

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Post# 1099900 , Reply# 42   12/8/2020 at 21:39 (1,172 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks for all of the helpful suggestions!

So just to clarify, if I substitute a PVC fitting for the valve, I can leave the drain hose arrangement as is?

I'll take off the back and have a look at things first. I think the ID of the drain hose is 3/4" based on the size of the aluminum hook I'm using, but will double check.


Post# 1099906 , Reply# 43   12/8/2020 at 22:46 (1,172 days old) by Good-Shepherd (New Jersey)        
Quick belt/motor carriage test

Drain hose issues aside.

To test for belt or motor carriage problems remove the front panel and apply outward pressure to the motor carriage with you foot when washer has one of its slow downs. (Be careful of the spinning transmission).

If the speed picks up when pressure is applied you've isolated at least one of the problems; belt slippage, weak or broken slide springs or a binding slide.

Some people put an extra third spring on the motor slide. Also, check for belt glaze on the pulley.


Post# 1101095 , Reply# 44   12/18/2020 at 18:09 (1,163 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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OK, so I got a 1" barbed elbow but hit a snag.

 

The section of the drain hose that the anti-siphon valve fits into points straight up.  This means that when the barbed elbow is installed, it points straight out the back, which creates an issue with the exterior portion of the drain hose because it doesn't have a bend molded into it where it fits onto the protruding end of the elbow.  I would need to add another elbow in order to facilitate aiming the exterior section of the drain hose either down or sideways.

 

 So, for now I've put things back the way they were so I can at least still use the machine.  I would need to fit an additional elbow off the inside drain hose, maybe by clamping on a stub of drain hose to connect both elbows.  I don't know if there's enough clearance inside the cabinet to hide all of that rigging.  Might that be worth trying or would I just be creating another reason for the spinning to slow down?  Any other suggestions?

 

Another point of concern is that I was surprised to find that where the valve fits into the inside hose, there is no adjustable clamp.  There's a band around the hose less than an inch from the end, but the valve just shoves into the hose and that's that.  It's a tight fit, and that seems to be enough to prevent any leakage.  That's fine if the valve is used, but the barbed elbow is a very loose fit.  I presume adding a clamp might resolve that issue, but I'm a little skeptical because the elbow fits snugly into the exterior portion of the hose.  Do the two hose segments have different inside diameters?


Post# 1101098 , Reply# 45   12/18/2020 at 18:47 (1,163 days old) by Sudster ()        

Can you post some pictures of your machine & drain hose setup ? That original drain loop line picture is confusing .



This post was last edited 12/18/2020 at 19:23
Post# 1101119 , Reply# 46   12/18/2020 at 22:40 (1,162 days old) by qsd-dan (West)        

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I'd still recommend finding and cannibalizing a drain hose setup from an older machine. Too many dips, valleys, twists, turns, and right angles will affect pump out performance. The previous hose routing simply runs straight back from the pump and up, which ideal and probably the reason Maytag went back to that design by the mid to late 90's. The older drain hose is also considerably longer than the siphon valve design you currently have and should work with you awkward setup without any lengthening modifications.

  View Full Size
Post# 1101126 , Reply# 47   12/19/2020 at 01:11 (1,162 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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Thanks for the picture Dan.  I've been considering that option from the beginning but thought I could get away with an after market hose.  Then I saw the picture and realized my lower access plate doesn't have the oblong cutout.  This means I'll have to find a donor machine for both the hose and the plate.

 

In the meantime, I'll keep using the factory arrangement.  The new belt has helped with that.


Post# 1101154 , Reply# 48   12/19/2020 at 10:01 (1,162 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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keep it simple.....

remove and toss that pinch clamp at the anti-siphon valve connection.....

remove the lower panel.....tape it off to the side, you dont actually need it, or find a slotted replacement....if you want, just cut a hole in it....

in any case, slide the hose from the pump out that bottom hole....using a straight connector and a few clamps, slide your current drain hose on there....and done!...

you really dont have to cut anything....but there is the option of cutting the hose close to the cabinet and attaching the "L" you already have....or find another piece of hose to make this connection.....and continue from there....

it can be done a number of different ways....best to keep it simple....


Post# 1101171 , Reply# 49   12/19/2020 at 12:19 (1,162 days old) by RP2813 (Sannazay)        

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That's another good suggestion Martin!  I think the key factor is whether the bend in the inside hose section would end up outside of the machine.  It might require an extension at the pump, so that would mean two straight connectors.  I'll take a look at things and decide how to go at this. 


Post# 1101184 , Reply# 50   12/19/2020 at 13:52 (1,162 days old) by Yogitunes (New Jersey)        

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or you could purchase a piece of hose to connect from the pump to outside the machine, and then connect the "L", and the drain hose....

note too, there may be a chance you might here some cavitation from the drain hose with a straight run...some units did it, some did not....could be how the hose is laying...

keep us posted



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