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Thread Number: 93823
/ Tag: Detergents and Additives
Here we go again... |
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| Post# 1184740 , Reply# 1 7/12/2023 at 12:53 (311 days old) by panasonicvac (Northern Utah) | ||
Actually, I do agree with this guy. I've never used fabric softener before but shortly after I've discovered his YouTube channel, I did a little more research and found out that fabric softener can do more harm than good. They are flammable, they can trigger asthma and skin allergies, they are toxic to wildlife in the water, they can build up in both the washer and the plumbing, etc. I've also read that the more amount of times you use fabric softner, the laundry would become less absorbent like towels for example. I could see some states like Idaho and Colorado outlawing them because I know they're very strict with what goes into their water. I've used vinegar in my washer before and they DON'T smell like vinegar afterwards. I've also tried baking soda before and it works. And I use dryer sheets which helps for removing lint out of the traps afterwards. I will never use fabric softener in my lifetime, not even if somebody paid me to.
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Post# 1184741 , Reply# 2 7/12/2023 at 13:02 (311 days old) by GELaundry4ever  (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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use of fabric softener To each their own, but I have yet to have any issues using it, let alone plumbing or clothes on fire. I have yet to have an Asthma attack from using it. I don't trust what this guy is saying and I completely disagree with him. | ||
| Post# 1184743 , Reply# 4 7/12/2023 at 13:14 (311 days old) by Aquarius1984 (Planet earth) | ||
Oh dear 
You’ve declared on two threads now that you use fabric softener to kill suds. This alone shows what a total bag of shite that your washing machine is. If it can’t rinse cleanly without relying on fabric softener then the machine isn’t capable of cleaning your clothes properly.
Funny how it’s also a top loader too. We’ve always known in Europe that topload American machines were f*cking useless but this just adds extra evidence to this. | ||
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Post# 1184745 , Reply# 5 7/12/2023 at 13:17 (311 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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2 tablespoons of detergent in addition to vinegar Using 2 tablespoons of detergent and vinegar doesn't work. There's no way it will make your clothes fresh. I swear, I have yet to have Asthma from fabric softener use. CLICK HERE TO GO TO GELaundry4ever's LINK | ||
| Post# 1184746 , Reply# 6 7/12/2023 at 13:30 (311 days old) by Maytag85 (Sean A806) | ||
I’ve been using fabric softener for years in my machines, never had any issues with buildup etc. I think what causes build up in machines is when you don’t use a quality detergent like Tide powdered combined with only using cold water. Rinsing in cold is fine, but only using cold water will cause issues down the road.
Reply #4, are you sure American top loading machines are useless? Been using for years and never had a issue, always use warm or hot (very rare for me to use cold), use quality detergent like Tide powdered, separate clothes by soil level, and set the correct time for that particular load of clothes. It’s usually user error that gets top loading machines a bad wrap. | ||
| Post# 1184748 , Reply# 8 7/12/2023 at 13:48 (311 days old) by panasonicvac (Northern Utah) | ||
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I disagree that top loaders are useless. Sure they use more water, electricity, and have lesser capacity but they do in fact work. The only ones that I don't personally care about are the HE top loaders with an impeller instead of an agitator. But if I had very small loads like socks, impellers can still work for me.
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Post# 1184753 , Reply# 11 7/12/2023 at 14:35 (311 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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downy ball I'm gonna try filling the downy ball halfway to the line for typical sized loads. I have found, however, that less is more. But then again, I have to do experiments. I do like the various scents available. | ||
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Post# 1184755 , Reply# 12 7/12/2023 at 14:45 (311 days old) by foraloysius (Leeuwarden, Friesland, the Netherlands) |
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Post# 1184757 , Reply# 13 7/12/2023 at 15:18 (311 days old) by Sudsomatic (Indiana) |
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Never had issues with liquid fabric softener either, personally. Whether in pipes or asthmatic irritation or infernos.
But... I do agree we're all welcome to our own opinions on it, both for and against, I know plenty of people that never use it and just as many that do.
Vinegar odor is fully dissipated with heat. Whether or not it works as a softener as suggested, I don't know, but it won't leave your clothes smelling like it. The heat of the dryer or the hot summer sun, out on the line, will remove any traces of smell, if there even is any fresh out of the washer, if one tries that route.
I'm all for being environmentally friendly definitely, but the argument that it messes up the earth is weak in this case if you just cut out the softener but still use detergent and stain products, because we know that just like softener, detergents, even eco friendly types, are similarly harmful to wildlife, there have been studies that show the big three alternatives Baking Soda, Vinegar, and Lemon Juice are still harmful to aquatic life. There's also the carbon footprint's associated with mining Soda Bicarbonate, and growing/processing Apples and Lemons.
It's crazy because try as you might to be better at being environmentally smarter there's always someone saying "But what about this aspect" so if someone cuts out softener for that reason they should go full turkey and just not use anything... but then there's that whole water debate, or energy consumption, so maybe just go down to the creek with some rocks.. haha.
No but seriously, baby steps are better than nothing, definitely, and do help, but it's a cop out to mention you're avoiding using it for environmental reasons and not mention the whole laundry process in that regard, if you're going to go there I mean.
On that note: Dryer sheets contain the same chemical makeup as the liquid stuff, it's literally the liquid infused into a fiber cloth, that's why it feels tacky like that. Yes it might spare pipes from possible harm and all that, but it's still going on the clothes. So if flammable, it's just as likely to go up in flames as if it were the liquid in the rinse cycle. Similarly it's still being breathed in by you when you're folding it or wearing it on your body, so the asthmatic possibilities still exist, plus, it's still pumped out into the air through your dryer vent, and then moldering away in a landfill when it's been used up via the environmental argument.
Years ago I read something about towels becoming less and less absorbent with every wash when you use fabric softener, so I bought some of those wool ball things to dry my newly purchased towels and washcloths with. To be perfectly honest I didn't notice any difference between the older, fabric softener washed towels and the new untainted ones. I mean yes they were less threadbare and had a fuller pile, but that was age related, there was no real difference as far as being able to dry off with after a shower or mop up a mess.
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| Post# 1184772 , Reply# 15 7/12/2023 at 18:10 (311 days old) by Maytag85 (Sean A806) | ||
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Reply #14 | ||
| Post# 1184778 , Reply# 18 7/12/2023 at 21:10 (311 days old) by qsd-dan (West) | ||
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Post# 1184780 , Reply# 19 7/12/2023 at 21:33 (310 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.) |
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Post# 1184782 , Reply# 20 7/12/2023 at 22:11 (310 days old) by Ultramatic (New York City) |
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I agree with Glenn
Fabric softener does build-up. I've have cleaned up quite a few of top loaders with blue gunk residue. I still have nightmares after cleaning my current machine (Speed Queen). Even though I use fabric softener sparingly and always diluted, I still have to remove the dispenser for a cleaning on a regular bases. | ||
| Post# 1184787 , Reply# 22 7/12/2023 at 22:43 (310 days old) by Maytag85 (Sean A806) | ||
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Reply #6
I haven’t seen too many of his videos but as soon as I heard “fabric softener destroys machines”, I clicked off. Yes, it can indeed buildup overtime but as mentioned, I mainly use hot or warm and never have any issues with any buildup etc. I’ve been rinsing in cold since it’s been warmer out here in the southwest (usually rinse in cold in the spring, summer and in parts of the fall where it’s still warm but as soon as it begins to get cold out, I rinse in warm) and haven’t had any issues so far. The only complaint I have about rinsing in cold is the machine takes a little longer to fill compared to doing a warm wash warm rinse cycle but that’s the only gripe I have about rising in cold.
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Post# 1184792 , Reply# 23 7/13/2023 at 00:00 (310 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.) |
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I use softener on sheets, occasionally on shirts, nothing else. The AquaSmart's dispenser flushes five times. Residue accumulates and needs cleaning surprisingly quickly. Same on the Neppy TL which flushes for the duration of the top-up from low to deep level on the final rinse. The Calypso's dispenser also needed regularly needed cleaning when I was using it as the daily driver. Washing in uber-hot or even normal-hot water is fine for those who are in-the-know on workarounds for machines that otherwise restrict it but the man/woman-in-the-typical-home doesnt't do that. | ||
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Post# 1184806 , Reply# 27 7/13/2023 at 09:35 (310 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.) |
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Laundry detergent is alkaline. Vinegar is acidic. It has function to counteract residual alkalinity which can cause fabrics to feel harsh/scratchy to the touch ... particularly if the detergent forumula is high in sodium carbonate (washing soda). Vinegar doesn't have the waxes and lubricants that are in fabric softener products so cannot soften fabric on that level. Regards to clothing left with the scent of vinegar, that's unlikely after spin extraction and drying. The couple/few ounces of vinegar diluted in several gallons of water in the machine is a negligible amount. | ||
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Post# 1184810 , Reply# 29 7/13/2023 at 10:43 (310 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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fabric softener and clothes damage If fabric softener truly damages and tears up your clothes, why do I have many that still last? | ||
| Post# 1184812 , Reply# 30 7/13/2023 at 10:55 (310 days old) by Awooff (Peoria, Illinois) | ||
Softner/water quality
Fabric softner is made from petroleum byproducts (cheap and plentiful for manufacturers to keep your money) and does not biodegrade easily.
Another issue not pointed out is water quality plays huge with detergent usage. Excess detergent/calcium makes stiff garments. Mechanically softned water - 2 tablespoons of detergent is plenty and negates a need for FS because less detergent is used. Detergents work better in soft water therby keeping stinky clothes at bay w/o perfums masking bacteria/odors. Many people "think" they have soft water naturally from public water supplies which is a clueless statement. Harder water will need the works to mask odors. | ||
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Post# 1184813 , Reply# 31 7/13/2023 at 11:08 (310 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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water quality I've used fabric softener in various water qualities, and I've yet to have an issue. I remember when my GE would slow down during spin due to suds lock, it would disipate and speed back up when it dispensed. You could clearly smell the softener all over the house. It was a pleasant smell. | ||
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Post# 1184817 , Reply# 32 7/13/2023 at 11:27 (310 days old) by DADoES (TX, U.S. of A.) |
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Jerome, where do you find a reference, preferably from a testing laboratory, that fabric softener physically damages fabric? The waxes and lubricants can interfere with moisture absorption which makes bath towels and dish towels and such items less effective for their intended purpose but that doesn't involve physical damage. It also interferes with flame-retardent items such as kids' pajamas and shouldn't be used on those types of clothing. Softener kills suds via the waxes and oils in it that counteract the surfactants in the detergent, which is also the source of scrud (waxy sludge build-up) in washers. That's why softener shouldn't be added until the final rinse when residual detergent hopefully is minimal. | ||
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Post# 1184828 , Reply# 33 7/13/2023 at 12:59 (310 days old) by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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firsthand experience I've had firsthand experience. | ||
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Post# 1184832 , Reply# 34 7/13/2023 at 14:35 (310 days old) by mrboilwash (Munich,Germany) |
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According to "Stiftung Warentest" most fabric softeners had a negative impact on colors and fibers compared to textiles not treated with FS.
Still does not keep me from using the stuff at least in small doses. From my personal observation FS has a tendency to precipitate or coagulate in the rinse water which in turn might lead to a build up in the washer but only if clothes are not 100% clean. The smallest trace amounts of residual body oils in clothes + FS = trouble! But even then as long as you use enough detergent and hot enough water in the next wash again there shouldn`t be much of a problem. CLICK HERE TO GO TO mrboilwash's LINK | ||
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Post# 1184834 , Reply# 35 7/13/2023 at 14:53 (310 days old) by ea56 (Cotati, Calif.) |
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Oy Vey!
Some people are masters at beating a dead horse! For cryin’ out loud if you like liquid fabric softener, USE IT, no ones stopping you! And if you don’t like it, then DON’T USE it! Different strokes for different folks. Trust our own experience and let the endless debate go. No matter what side you’re on in this argument you will NEVER change the minds of your opposition. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results. Eddie | ||
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Post# 1184835 , Reply# 36 7/13/2023 at 15:59 (310 days old) by mrboilwash (Munich,Germany) |
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No Eddie, I think AW would be a very sad and quiet place if we weren`t allowed to have the same discussions again and again.
If I find the subject of a thread not interesting enough for me then I don`t follow it, but I think there is no such thing as a dead horse if at least two members still are having fun in a thread. It may be their party then, not mine but I`d respect it. And I believe if we had another top vs frontloader, hot or cold water, Democrats vs Republicans or whatever thread the outcome wouldn`t be the same either as always someone new shows up or someone old changed their opinion. | ||
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Post# 1200699 , Reply# 38 3/3/2024 at 16:51 by GELaundry4ever (Nacogdoches, TX, USA) |
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snuggle blue sparkle I'm currently using Snuggle blue sparkle which does smells luxurious, and it kills suds during final rinse. I also use the intense fresh discs. I first started using Snuggle in 2008, but Wisk was out back then. | ||
| Post# 1200734 , Reply# 39 3/4/2024 at 12:37 by bpetersxx (laf in on the banks of the Wabash River) | ||
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